I have been on this board since Novemeber 1999. I know many of you have been on longer and I have no right to stomp on toes. But I m sorry to say that I am very offended by a remark made to me on a previous post about losing custody.<P>Okay...I am not a perfect person....I have done wrong......I did attempt suicide in Nov 98 which most of you know who have read my posts. I was arrested for harassing communications by the OW. Which most of you who read my posts know. <P>Okay....so I guess I am a bad mother. I was so depressed from his betrayal.....from the emotional abuse....that I didn't know how to stop the severe pain I felt. I did not want to die.....I simply wanted my wayward H to understand the pain he had caused me. I was hurting so bad. So suicide attempt. I am not proud....I can not change that it happened. Second....yes I did call the OW. Talked twice to her and once to her H. Was arrested for that. No one will/can tell me that they had not either done that or wanted to. Or for that matter...wanted to do worse. I simply called her to see whose number it was....then called her again at my H urging. I loved my H. I loved my family. It pained me to hear that she was distrupting it. I felt like a lion defending my cubs.<P>I guess I deserve to lose custody. <P>So now I guess one of you feels that there has to be more. There is no more.

Hey--<BR> I don't think you deserve to lose custody. I do not know you or your H personally, so would not presume to judge such an important issue from afar.<BR> You do have my deepestcompassion...I cannot imagine anything worse than being faced with the loss of my children..<BR> Hugs and prayers--<BR>Kathi

Nancy,<BR>I know the comment you were hurt by and if you noticed my post, I myself was completely offended by it. I thought it was spiteful and hurtful and completely uncalled for. <P>Please don't think that that one comment was shared by everyone here. It is one person's opinion that obviously just set out to be cruel. <P>Take care,<BR>Mitzi

{{{{{Mental}}}}<P>I have been away this weekend, so haven't been on much lately. I have only been on for a few weeks, but I know some of your situation. <P>I am SO SORRY you feel upset today. I don't know which post this is about, but I want to say that I know your pain. I wanted to commit suicide too. The pain felt when you are betrayed, is just devastating. <P>I wish you were not losing your kids, I am not sure of the whole scenario, but I know you replied to me once about losing them. Is there any way you can get them back?<P>Please don't leave, we are all here to support one another. You feel free to email me at MrsDMBrown@mail.com if you ever need a shoulder to cry on. <P>I know sometimes we all get "chewed out" by some replies. We should all try to be extra cautious with each others feelings. We all are going through pain. I know I will be chewed out this week for a decision I made. Hopefully people will just tell me their opinion and let me think about it but i fear the responses I will get .<P>My prayers are going out to you today, Dana<BR>

Mitzi,<BR>I read your comment on the other post. I tried two times to post back and I got booted off because someone was calling my house. Thank you though...I am glad to see that someone knows of a similar situation....it somehow makes me realize that is wasn't happening to just me. <P>Thank goodness I was booted off....I had twice typed out something to the other post. People like that really make by blood boil. It is ignorance like that, that make people think badly of someone who has lost custody.<P>Dana..<BR>Thank you I am very emotional today. Both girls are home sick from school and reading that one post hurt. Plus my attorney called this morning and just didn't sound like he really cared. Hurts...hurts alot. It is not that I will not post replies anymore.....but this person just plain was way off the mark. You do lose custody of your children now adays for next to nothing. It all depends on the size of your pocket book and who you know.<P>Cam,<BR>Thank you for your concern....I am just a wreck about all of this. I am a great mother. I know it and so do the girls....that helps alittle. They will always love me no matter what, so that helps ease the pain a little. I hope I can turn this around.<P><p>[This message has been edited by MENTAL (edited February 28, 2000).]

I am sorry that I have never replyed your post, buy I always read them.<P>Under no circumstances should you lose your children. I wanted to drive off a cliff and thought about it when I found out about my H and O/W. I wanted to call and scream at her and tell her to leave him the f%%k alone. I have wanted to smash the car windows of my H new car (a cadi sports car) when I heard he had drove O/W to airport.<P>We have all had vindictive things we have wanted to do to the O/W.<P>I truly bevlieve your H has set you up to lose your children. I also believe that he does not want them and when he sees how time comsumming kids are, and that they need feed, and that they are fighting, and that they need help with home work, ect ect and the biggest thing is that it will cramp their style, he will reconsider.<P>I do not believe all is lost for you. You still have them now. Take each precious day with them and show them who loves them, and who will always be there for them.<P>Hang in there!!!!!

Hi Nancy,<P>I think I saw the title of the post you are referring to but didn't read it.<P>Well you haven't lost the kids yet and it may not happen. Second I agree with the post above, I don't think he really wants them, it's just some more turning of the screws.<P>If the worst does happen and he does get custody then do your homework, make sure you do everything possible to minimize the damage to them. Never miss a teacher conference, dental appt, etc, etc. and<BR>document, document, document. I suspect that he will quickly decide that this revenge is nowhere near as sweet as he expected.<P>Hey, what's one person's opinion?<P>Take care.

Nancy<BR>I am so sorry at this turn of events. too often the courts aren't interested in the truth. Just what they see.<BR>Hang in there.<BR>Please don't let one poster get you down too much. I know that is easy to say. I have been offended a few times.<BR>Sometimes people forget about compassion. Many times they are people who have been on the receiving end of that compassion.<BR>Just remember all the people who care and have been there for you. They are the ones that count!<BR>My prayers are with you.<BR>

Thanks, <BR>I plan on hanging in there. I know that if the events happen that this is not what he truly wants. In fact, I'm not sure he knows what he wants. It is another way of hurting me.....but can't he think of the pain and confusion that it is causing the girls. Probably not.....he can't think. I don't plan on letting one persons inconsiderate reply hurt me. They have no clue what it feels like to go through this. Compassion is what it is all about. Most of us still have that<BR>Nancy

Nancy,<P>Been were you are done that. I pretty much did all the things you did, I actually ended up in the hospital a couple times. It was deep, deep depression. I was lucky and never ended up in jail, but i remember leaving the OW a flaming message that said stay away from my children, when I found out she was emailing my son and offering to buy liquor for him.<P>I think that the others are right. Your h wants revenge but when it comes down to the nitty gritty he is going to want help. You just need to stay on the straight and narrow and be the best mom you can be while you have visitation. My h never did the revenge thing, but he didn't want any responsibility so I guess I got lucky there too. Take one day at a time, don't let others judge your situation. Be strong.<P>Gerri

Nancy,<P>One poster writes a thoughtless comment (and if you know their history, you would know that she doesn't have a clue about your type of custody case - could have ended up herself very easily in the same situation but didn't)....<P>One poster, and you think the board is against you. WRONG.<P>Now, it is the same in your custody case. ONE person, (GAL) and you think that is the last word, the final judgement. WRONG <P>Now, I want you to get to the point that you are CONFIDENT in your mothering, and your ability to be a wonderful "co-parent", and a woman who finds the resources she needs to help herself and her children through difficult times, not a quitter.<P>You have to adopt an attitude that is sort of flippant, but respectful.... kinda like this: "And this person thinks their opinion counts".... ha ha ha....<P>You know what I mean? Start looking at yourself and your situation from a perspective of strength! You must not allow yourself to be beat up so easily!<P>One person's opinion, DOESN'T count, in my book. MY OPINION in my book is what REALLY counts.<P>YOUR opinion in YOUR book is what counts.<P>BELIEVE IN YOURSELF, and you know what? Other people will too.<P>God bless you.<BR>TNT

Please don't say that you are a bad mother. I don't believe that. I have read most of your posts and feel that you were very unjustly arrested. The things that have happened in your life are not fair. No one who hasn't been through this could know how it feels or how they would react. Take care of yourself and don't beat yourself up. <P>You are in my thoughts and prayers.

Hey Mental, <P>Probably the best advice I could offer to you from my perspective is to do what you can to feel better about yourself. You sound really really depressed. (It's normal, but it makes my own blood boil that a thoughtless act could cause so much pain.) These maneuvers are a way for him to maintain control of your emotions and keep you off balance. He wants you off balance because it puts him in a better position with the courts. You know you have the skills to be a good mother. You will not fall apart. You have strength, and that strength will carry you through this.

Mental: I am so sorry for your hurt. I have been so involved in my own world that I forget that others are hurting just as well. I can relate to what you're feeling and fully understand if you want to vent your feelings to the OW and your spouse. I am a betrayer and if you want to vent, you can vent at me. I am sure I deserve to hear the pain and anger that the betrayed have felt. One thing that you need to remember though, all of us are human and despite that we do things that we know we shouldn't, most of us learn from our errors. Our faults, pains, anger, frustrations does not make us any less of a person. We struggle to get through the rough areas of life(as many of us are currently doing)and when we make it through, we find the beauty of the real joys of life like our children. My prayers are with you and I am here ready to listen.

<BR>MENTAL,<P>Oh, the child custody issue is such a nightmare! My heart tells me we should, as NSR suggested in the other thread, go back to a system where committing infidelity basically means that you will lose custody. But I know that isn't going to happen, and I think those days are probably over for good.<P>The trouble with the current system is that it is set up as a "winner take all" fight to the death. And perversely, the big push to standardize child support payments, and to develop a streamlined collection system, has magnified the importance of this fight. The reason for this is that the notorious "income shares" awards for child support routinely exceed actual costs, and the excess amounts to a tax-free living subsidy for the recipient.<P>I mean, what a better way to *really* scr$w your spouse than to have an affair on them, win custody, and then use part of the child support money to subsidize the new boyfriend or girlfriend, right?<P>The fact is, this system is just sick. I believe we need to take the financial incentives out of custody, and at the same time destroy the "winner take all" mentality. The way to do this is to move to a default (not a guarantee, but a default) of 50/50 joint physical custody with no money changing hands. This position draws me a lot of fire, but it is, in my view, the best possible solution available.<P>Betraying mothers shouldn't get a tax-free living subsidy off of the backs of their cuckolded husbands, nor should betraying husbands get a living subsidy off of the backs of the their cuckolded wives. And a move to a 50/50 joint physical custody means that there aren't any "winners" at all, besides the children. And that's who we're supposedly concerned about here anyhow.<P>Btw, I'm arguing for a 50/50 joint physical custody, with no money changing hands, as a default. I realize that some parents don't want their children, some are truly unfit, and so on. But MENTAL seems like a perfectly fit mother, and she shouldn't lose custody - and neither should her husband.<P>Bystander

Mental,<BR>I don't know if you were inadvertedly offended by a remark that I made on a post (not yours, someone else's) that I said something about how in New York they don't take away the children from the Mother unless there is a really good reason. I must stress that I said this about New York law, only because I've worked in a law office part time for about 4 years....not intending to remark anything about you or your personal life, it didn't occur to me that you might take offense since I wasn't talking about your state or your state of affairs. <BR>I am sorry that you feel you don't contribute well to this board because there has been several times you have given me very good advice.<BR>Again, I don't know if my comment was the one that hurt your feelings, if so it is I am sorry I didn't clarify my statement well enough. I hope I am not the one that hurt your feelings because that isn't my intention. Bless you....<P>------------------<BR>Chick's <BR>Bren<P>You won't see things until your ready to not be blind!

No you were not the one who offended me. I have never been offended by any of your remarks. I have no problem with people that post "constructive" remarks. It is your opinion and everyone is entitled to their very own opinion. It is when people feel that they know everything. About law and children and the way everything should be. Nothing in this world is the way "it" should be. There are plenty of bad things that happen to people for no good reason. It is just someone seems to feel that I am not telling everything. That I have left out factors and such. I almost felt like maybe my stbx was this person. It is almost like someone telling you how you should act or feel about something. I don't like to be told that I am a liar. I know liars....and I am not one of them. Again....I am not perfect...wouldn't that just be wonderful if I could be. I have made mistakes....many that I can't take back. But I have always been a good person with a good heart.

Nancy,<P>Haven't really posted that much in the past few days but I must say this: I have kept up with your story and my heart and prayers go out to you. Keep fighting for your kids. It's not over!! <BR>Ignore the ignorant comments made to you on the other thread, and I'll add this. As a law enforcement officer, I must admit that the system is not always right and can screw over even the innocent as well. Once again my heart goes out to you. You are a good women. Your are strong. I know, you might not feel as though you are, but look what you've made it through so far. And guess what , you're still standing!! Sending a huge HUG your way....<P>{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{NANCY}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}<P>------------------<BR>"If you can learn from the mistakes of others, you won't have to make them youself."<P>lady_divine77@yahoo.com

Thanks for the hugs....I guess maybe I needed one tonight. I am strong....I know that now....and I remember being that way a long time ago. Slowly but surely I am the Nancy that I used to be. I know that these are bad times for me and so many others here. I am so blessed to have people so supportive of my problems and I feel so good to help others. I wish all of you guys the best in your quest for the "perfect" marraige. One day we will find it.

Bystander,<BR>We could go round and round on the 50/50 thing. I don't like it at all.