My H revealed me 5/13 that he "can't live that that" ( I assume double life) that he found happiness with his online friend and she's in love with him too. And that he does not know what to do and that if I say stop he might try continue living unhappily with me.
We talked ( I have to sincerely admit that this woman while being a friend helped our conversation a lot) and right now I do not have anger towerds her either but I told him it's devastating to me but I have no right to refuse him having his happiness since I do believe he is a good man and my 15+ years of trying obviously failed. But whatever HIS choice I will wait for him.<p>Since we knew he'll be gone till Memorial Day with opportunity to be with her again in person, we agreed that he tries to be happy during those days, think a lot, I try to stay calm, he gets back and then we talk again. I told him that I am stronger know but it hurts a lot. I also promised that I will refrain from calling and emailing him, but he encouraged me to call if I need it.
Well I am into the 4th day, I called him twice.
Tried to remain calm just asking to think and that I wait for him and that he's very valuable person and this pain does not change that. And the fact that he did tell me makes him even more worthy to me.<p>I need some support to get me through those 9 days plus whatever is in the future for me.
Have nobody to talk to nor I want anybody close to realize what we are going through.<p>It's been hard for me. In case I won't be able to be calm I told kids I have ongoing stress at work but I was able to avoid abnormal behaviour in front of them. <p>I love him very much. I also do believe he deserves happines.I met her too. She probably just discovered the first person, friend in her life that makes her feel happy. She is a great conversation partner.She went thru a lot in her life but I do not know too many details. She's younger than us - I think 25. I hate hurting her too because thanks to her I received the most kind and loving words from my husband ever in Dec/January. That's why I am so confused and crushed beacuse I felt we are going to better our marriage, not this. So from the moment I could sense hin getting distant aagin, I tried to talk.<p>For the past three months I 've been asking him what I am doing wrong, how should I improve but he says either I do not do anything wrong or he does not know. So I feel crushed because the outcome seems to sooo beyond my control.
Since so many of you went through similar time please share your thoughts. <p>I know that my wishes and actions do not control all of this world, just myself. It took me a long and painful time to realize that. I am not sure if I accept the above true too my heart yet.

Your husband is having an EA(emotional affair). All extra marital affairs are nothing but fantasy because they are based on illusion and not reality. The sad thing is that he does not appreciate what he is risking (you and your daughters) by having this EA with this young woman, and once he does it may be too late for him to get it back.<p>If he has been a good man and husband before falling in love with this other woman, and if you still love him very much, then you owe it to yourself to read the Harley books 'Surviving an affair' 'Love busters' and 'His needs her needs'. They are not only very comforting in what they reveal but also have plans of action (A and B) that can help you deal with this ordeal in the most constructive ways.<p>You are not alone, I and the vast majority of betrayed and wayward spouses have gone thru what you are going thru at this moment. There is hope but first you have to work at changing yourself and then, if your husband comes back to you, changing himself in order for your marriage to recover.<p>I would also suggest you keep on posting as much as you need because it not only serves to vent your feelings but also because the advice you get may keep you on track with your plan to rebuild your marriage.<p>God bless you and your family.<p>Joe

I too have recently found out that my H was having an online addiction. Unlike you my H hadn't met her in person, but he had ran a personal ad --"Married, but looking". That hurt.He had also been visiting some 'not-so-nice' web sites, and had emails from several females. I wont say ladies because the content declared them otherwise. I believe he had planned a get-a-way with one of them, but it ended up cancelled when I got wise to what was happening.<p>We are working through it, but the trust has been severely mutilated. We have been able to do some indept talking. The passion and affection is what he said had led him to do this. I was a single mother for 17 years and had learned to hold my feelings, problems, and emotions inside. I also suffer from depression,anxiety, and am stress anorexic. Being treated for depression had robbed me of any sex drive and I believe passionate feelings. This drove me back to my Dr. (physc) and he put me on Zanax for the anxiety, which in return made it easier for me to communicate my feelings with H. It also helped me to eat, I would go 5-7 days without even thinking of eating--DONT tell me how wonderful that would be or I'll scream, until someone has been in those shoes that cant imagine what it is like.<p>I have to strongly agree with Joe, Harley's book "His needs,Her needs" is excellent. It is sitting on the table beside me now, and he hits the nail on the head so often. H is currently reading John Gray's Men/Venus,Women/Mars. He has been very amazed at the insights he has gained by reading this. H is going to read His/Her needs next. This is the second copy of that I have had to buy.<p>My suggestion to you is that you also read HIS/HER Needs. I had to tell H that it did me little good to read these books if he also did not read them. Make sure you are filling your spiritual needs first, remember that the Lord knows and cares what you are going through. He hasnt left you and he is working for you. Lean on His promises. We dont know the future with these email foes but often we are victums of other peoples mistakes and bad choices. I will disagree with you on telling your children that you are under alot of stress at work. You are taking the blame, when that is not where the ball should fall. I would probably tell the that my H was dealing with alot of stress, unhappy, and had to get away for awhile, which makes me very sad and a little down. Children can help in ways you never guess. But leave the ball in his park, not yours. You wouldnt necessarily be saying anything bad about him to them but you would be being honest.<p>My prayers are with you, and I here if you ever want to chat.<p>Darla

Thank You both Joe and Darla.
I know I need to change, the problem is since my communication skills are so bad I really do need to know where to start. I am getting the recommended books, I also have been reading website material for two months, since I first realized I am loosing my improved contact with H again.<p>I approached H with an idea of EN questionnaire a month ago he was not interested then. I tried to communicate more in writing since in person I am full of LB like interrupting and demanding.<p>We did talk about a month ago and it ended up being a horrible conversation because I got too emotional. I did learn though that what I always thought were my biggest failures (personal appearance and sex) were not.<p>What made things harder he was away on business trips (2-3 weeks at a time) more then home. I missed him sorely and did let him know that. I also did not hide my anxiety about his online friend and their meeting in person. He did address my issues sensitively and truthfully - I believe he felt this way abut her back then in January.<p>But soon after - sometime in February we started to drift apart again.<p>I was cought in anguish of seeing loosing what so unexpectedly improved and not acting in a wrong way. My physical loneliness did not help either.
I let him know in writing how I felt. I tried to follow Plan A just in case, just because of my "gut feelings".
I knew I would not spy on him since it was a major mistake on my part 13 years ago which lead I believe to his loosing any interest in expressing his feelings. I also knew I better keep our problems to the two of us. This the first time I share it, but it is fair because he advised me to get somebody to talk to ( strangers) - he knows I rely only on him to share my thoughts.<p>I know he does not me to hurt - as much as I do not want to keep him unhappy and deprive him of hapiness in his life.<p>And Darla, hadn't be for the OW, I would not find this site and start to improve myself. And yes she is nice and not mean, she just fulfills his EN so much better than me.<p>I wish it was only the matters among the three of us. So far it is.<p>I do try praying but those are not good either.
Thank you for yours.

forbetterorworse <p>I just wanted to add that you too are very vulnerable to an affair. In order to avoid one, you must avoid any friendship with a man because that will translate into a confidant and a supplier of your most important emotional needs.<p>I would also suggest that you start taking care of yourself in the form of individual counseling because a professional can show you ways to cope during this trying time. <p>In times of stress, I have found that exercise greatly increases my sense of wellbeign and that has made the difference in how I deal with life's little missile attacks. It's fun too because I can go to an aerobic class and enjoy the company of other people doing something positive and constructive. I have met many good people while going to the gym and they have a great outlook on life that is very contagious. If you can afford it, I would suggest that you enroll in a woman's only gym, and not only would you be getting a great exercise workout but you would also be meeting lots of other women that could become your new friends.<p>God bless you and your family.<p>Joe

Welcome forbetterorworse...<p>There is a post of general welcome I wish to share with you... [img]images/icons/cool.gif" border="0[/img] <p>It has a lot of quick links to many of the most important MB sites...
Click here ==> General Welcome for All New Builders(Newbies)<p>About your post...<p>I think you've missed some of the basics of Plan A...<p>Plan A is NOT about conceding that the marriage is over...
...it is just the opposite...
...it is to confirm and reaffirm that marriage is alive... and you are willing to work towards its healing!!!<p>Plan A is NOT about finding the good in the OP(OW)...
...but placing the vow of marriage above... feelings.<p>Love is a choice!<p>Your statement "I have no right to refuse him having his happiness..."... is bunk...
...your vows (no matter how convoluted they may have been)... means your working more than for his happpiness... for his... and your life... beyond life!<p>You may have read alot here about "happiness"...
...and it is overreated... and short lived...
THINK JOY...
Working for Jesus... (God for the non-christian)
Working for Others... and then...
Working for Yourself... that's Plan A!!!<p>The happiness you talk of (and what others maybe including your H)... is temporal... and too often a lie... a very sad lie.<p>Your statement... "But whatever HIS choice I will wait for him."...
...is right... if you know the HIS is in "HIS choice"...
...and it's not the person living in the fog of an imperfect human passion.<p>I strongly suggest you rethink... "we agreed that he tries to be happy during those days, "...
...because is contadicts the The Policy of Joint Agreement(POJA)... in your heart...
...simply leaving the decision to your H!<p>Call him... and straighten him out...
Tell him you are married...
...tell him he is married!
Tell him the truth will set everyone free!<p>Evaluating the OP(OW)... or her relationship to others of to you H... is meaningless...
It validates that your marriage is insignificant!!!<p>For him to be "worthy"... is for him to accept that what he is doing is wrong...
...and it is now time for him to realize this!<p>Don't ask him waht you've been doing wrong...
...if necessary... through trial and error... show him that you can meet his Emotional Needs.<p>The outcome (your JOYfulness) is not out of your control...
...the only thing that is out of your control... is his decision to do wrong!<p>You've gotten emotional... you've LB-ed....
...it happens....
...you're learning... to build your marriage!
It's not going to happen overnight!<p>For your depression...
...consider seeing your doctor... and getting some anti-depressant medication... (the stigma of mediction of this type is fading)<p>It wasn't the OW who led you here...
...it was God's providence!
...don't thank the OW... thank God!<p>Reread.... Plan A...
Check out the post Plan A - 101 (2nd ed.).<p>Prayers and love to you... and your H!<p> [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Jim / NSR

Thank you, Jim.
I have at least 9 days of reading and thinking to do. I need to slowly read your post, I am not sure I understand all of it.<p>For instance you write:
"Don't ask him waht you've been doing wrong...
...if necessary... through trial and error... show him that you can meet his Emotional Needs."<p>What if I have no clue ( other than the need for conversation)about his EN. I am sure I am also mistaken with what I am LBing him most with ( I know grouchines, demanding and interrupting for sure). There were 13 years of little communication, you see.
I used to try and err ( err mostly) for quite a few years.
This short time in Dec/Jan when the communication opened up was so blissful. That's why I appreciate him approaching me now with honesty and trusting me despite the painful subject of our talk.

When you don't know what his ENs are...
...pick one from the "list"...
...each day...
...and do something... (not just say you will do it.)
...Admiration...
...Sexual Fulfillment... (if stds are not possible?)...
...Physical Attractiveness....
...and so on...<p>Conversation need not just be ... vocal conversation...
...write him notes...
...e-mails if necessary...
...cards...
...etc.<p>Plan A... without honesty... isn't going to show your H anything.
He must know... in your honesty... that without contributions to your needs... your love for him will also drain... because you are human... because a marriage is a commitment of 2... and a work of three (if you know what I mean).<p>In as loving is possible way...
...be honest...
...even if it risks him excellerating the affair.<p>LB-ing is always a tough one.
Again... anti-depressant medication can have a very positive affect.<p>Whether you know it or not...
...talking about the affair... will turn into a LB.
Avoid it like the plague.<p>Do everything to let him know...
...you are married... to him!<p> [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Jim

Dear MBrs,
I woke up a little calmer now. I will be careful and implement Plan A better.
It is difficult though because he is not here and I do not want to call or email him now since this is what I promised. I think if I emailed him a love note he would see that as artificial and pushy since in the past when I did that, I did not receive much feedback. He is deeply in fog now. I think even he realizes that.
I already told him how I feel about him before he left.
I will prepare for his return. Will not ask about the A unless he starts talking.Will stop conversation to avoid LBing per Jim's remark Will try to remain calm.
I will offer everything I usually do when he comes back from business trips - ride home from the airport, clean house, my hair done, no asking about "did you enjoy your trip" unless he shares.
One part will be awkward for me - I want to hug and kiss him as usual , but I am afraid he does not want that.
Thanks for your posts and prayers.

I have a question. Why is he going to be away for 9 days and have time to spend with her? I'm sorry, but if he's still spending time with her and not with you, then he's not worth being with. The ones that are worth being with are the ones who come back very sorry and wanting to work things out. Good luck. [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img]

It's a business trip he does not control. She lives far away. He is able to see her while there.<p>He is worthy. I just hope he'll see the difference with immediate happines and the one you really work hard for. I am also sure that he believes OW will give him the long term JOY not just temporary happiness. And he is aware of all the pain for the three of us so far.

I feel weirdly calm and numb compared to just two days ago. I am not sure if this is coming from the decision I made (no LB, take care of myself so I am at my best, Plan A) which I know I won't regret no matter what the outcome of all of this be. This forum is helping for sure. Venting in a secure environment does relieve some stress.
Thank you. For your thoughts and prayers.

ForBetter,
If you have decided that you want to save your marriage then keep working dilligently on your Plan A. NO LB'S!!! Reminder LB's are Judgements, Demands & Angry Outbursts.
Whether you want to save your marriage is your decision alone....make that choice on your own. Don't listen to advice like Hurricane's it is negative and works against the philosophy of SH.

I keep coming back and reading posts. They help me when my heart gets heavy with despair again.
Remind me to stay true to my resolutions. And that I am not the first nor the last nor the most hurt one either.
Thank you.

He is coming back the day after tomorrow. I miss him and then I keep remembering that he will miss HER no matter what he decides do do. It hurts so much. I look better physically and I made my resolution to stick to plan A. My emotions are hard to control though. I am sad and hurt I wish I looked for real help many years ago. How to find out his needs in a gentle way other than guessing and trial and error? I am scared to talk since I do not converse well and as warned here this may lead to LBing. At the same time I am happy we do talk now. When willing and eager becomes pushy and demanding?
I recognized my own need for praise and fear of criticism and failure.
I tried hard to have normal family life as usual when he's gone in business. I do fairly well alone but before I always knew the separation, however long, was temporary and due to "outside force", not his decision.<p>Please keep praying.

He's home. I'm calm. Not much conversation, not even small talk, tired, asleep. Kids are so happy he's home. My heart is in shreds. Doing laundry. Preparing for the next hour and next day.
Maybe ironing will keep me busy.

For no apparent reason I am having a terrible day today. I feel hurt and sad even more if that's possible. My gut feeling tells me that maybe my H is sparing me truth or details which makes my mind wander through the most painful and devastating scenarios.
I cannot talk in fear of LBing. I do my best with Plan A. I come here to vent my anxiety if it builds too high to handle alone.
I know I should not expect anything in return.
I miss him sexually. I look at him and one part would just hug and caress him and then I am afraid thad it was for my inability to satisfy SN that pushed him into this A so I would ruin whatever if anything got better since the D-day.
He did not declare anything this way or another yet which in my hopes I take as good sign.
I believe that if he goes thru similar turmoil right now I do need to stay strong and nice and open.
Is there a safe way to share my feeling without LBing or is it way to early?

Seems this thread became my private venting board...
I wish it would help me more by expressing my pain and frustration here rather than being weepy wimpy unhappy person in my life while I am attempting my best behavior and looks.<p> I know it helps at least somewhat. Anyway, weekends are the worst for me. I try in the gentlest way ( at least known to me) encourage any conversation so I could understand, not guess, what I could do better, where I am failing 100% and why. About foods, movies, nothing too personal. No avail.
I am afraid to reach out in fear of this being a LB for him, yet I need his touch and talk so badly. He is kind and nice to kids they will spend time together today I am afraid to ask to be included in order to avoid ruining their good time.
I have a project to work on today, this might be the one he'll like to get from me. I hope so, but at the same time I am almost sure it will not be up to his expectations, I will get criticized and hurt or will get no comments at all.
How any of you after D-day but with no resolution regarding the A deal with these feeling of love, pain, helplessness, other than living hour to hour till next day waiting for something to happen.
I better get my project started.

((((((((((((((((Forbetterorworse)))))))))))))<p>You are NEVER alone... It's veryyyy hard trying to get back on track with your marriage when you have alot of deep emotions to deal with. To answer your question about <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>How any of you after D-day but with no resolution regarding the A deal with these feeling of love, pain, helplessness, other than living hour to hour till next day waiting for something to happen.
<hr></blockquote> I know it's HARD.. What got me through the first month was taking a long look in the mirror and figuring out what it was that I wanted to improve on myself... I had a major list.. but that's because I am my worst critic. I don't know.. worked for me if I focused on myself and not the A.. I worked on MY weaknesses and told myself I was going to Improve myself.. some way, some how.. for myself.. not my H.. I went to the gym, worked out.. lost 50 lbs, Read self improvement books, got back into my cross stitching.. made myself BUSY so I wouldn't think of being soooo damn depressed. My H on the other hand, complimented me on my achievements.. I made him a beautiful cross stitch for his office.. he loved it because he knew how hard I worked on it. Work on yourself.. FIND something within yourself to Improve.. not because your H had an A.. but because it will make you feel great about yourself.<p>Just my opinion...<p>Hang in there [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Robin

Robin, thank you a lot.
I figured this about two weeks ago. Since I really can't make things happen my way let at least my actions improve myself no matter what the outcome. Yes I have a lot to improve.
I tried to fix the obvious features that I got teased on in the past. I bleached my teeth. I lost 10# which put me now in my last year's never achieved goal weight(but upper limit) when I was a WW. More will probaly come off with no particular effort unless I return to chocolate. I put makeup on almost every day (I am definetely not a flashy girl).
At work I got a small raise plus lots of good words.
I try to be on my best mom, much more patience, less controlling but it is hard especially since I have to do it with my turmoil inside and feeling so protective. I would hate if I did anything that would hurt my kids so my pain is no excuse.
Cooked dinners from scratch almost every day of last week.
Finished the prototype of my little project yesterday.
I use St John's worth if I get worse I will see a doctor.
I'd love to get an unsolicited nice comment from him. Well after reading other posts I know I better not bet on any reaction.
Still did not share our situation with anybody outside this forum.
What really scares me is that I never was a pre-planned person, but now even thinking few days ahead seems impossible. Never had "high energy" so my lack of sleep tires me.
Next weekend will be hard. Our 15th anniversary.
Then he's gone for yet another business trip.
There is plenty to do around the house, I guess I will do it even though right now it seems so meaningless to me.
I do not snoop but it is hard not to notice several hour long phone conversations with OW.
I am not angry because he did not declare his choice. I know they miss each other and comfort each other, it just makes my feeling of loneliness and loss unbearable. As they say here probably in his fog he does not realize how much it hurts me. That's why I lurk at night at MB site to confirm again and again that I am not the only faulty and struggling one, and feel happy for people with uplifting signatures.
I will pray and ask for a blessing today- it's Sunday. For patience and strenght.