Hi FBOW,
I'm just checking in again.

From reading what you have said, I believe you have a good idea of your own state of mind and what you need to do about it.

I believe our spouse can do more good, or more harm to our self image than anyone else in the world. We think we are loved and respected and then find out it is a sham. When we find out that part of our life is not true, we tend to carry that over to all other parts of our life.

After reading your posts through a few months ago, I was convinced that you were a strong person and that you could get through this and be happy someday. My problem has been finding out how to show you that this is true. You are still being told by the actions of the person you love and value that you don't measure up. In reality, it is he that doesn't measure up, but he wants to shift the blame, so he tries to give it to you.

It's hard not to take it, isn't it, but you don't need to, and you can find ways of leaving it with him, and not accepting it when he tries to give it to you.

Keep working on your successes, but you will come to know that your value is inherent and a part of you, and that it doesn't come from what others think of you. You are a daughter of God, and he values you, as do we that post to you. I know the things we do contribute to who we become, and I hope you know that this is something you can succeed at. I can't explain all the reasons I believe this, but YOU WILL SUCCEED.

When you have bad days, when it seems that nothing will ever go right, remember that there are others that know better and that we have faith in you.

Once you asked me to remind you not to take refuge in chocolate. How are you doing?
To be fair, it's a problem for me, and I am not doing so well ( with that) this afternoon. That's why I thought of it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />
SS

<small>[ February 12, 2003, 03:21 PM: Message edited by: still seeking ]</small>

Hi FBOW,

Just wanted to say Hi, I've been really busy lately, so not much time for MB.

Hello SS and Sue,
first of all, SS, thank you for your post, especially since you were taking care of your household while your W faced her surgery. I wish her fast recovery and good health and spirits for both of you and all your children.
Sue, as you can tell, I did not lurk too much recently either.

SS, thanks for the choco update. I dislike all this pre-Valentine hoopla, not just because of OW situation, but also that all those yummy chocolatey images make my cravings unbereable... I really think I should write a NC letter to all milk chocolate bars to make my commitment lasting and serious.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
Anyway, SS, I slip now and then, recently more than last year. Thank you for keeping me in check. Cold and wet weather makes me hungry all the time.
Also, re Valentines, I had mixed feelings what should I do. Well, I have a blank card in which I am going to thank for the memories of happiness past and express hope for more sometime in the future. And I'll attach small token which should bring back memories of one particularly great vacation we had as a couple just 2 years ago. Short message, true from my heart and not too Hallmarky overall. I hope it will be accepted.
If not, I am prepared not to be surprised, can't help the feeling of rejection though if that happens.

I don't feel comfortable sharing specific details, but I did complete refi deal good for our still joint finances and also a small contracted out home improvement project. Both of them I consulted with H beforehand and during, which was many a time frustrating experience, I am sure, for both of us. So I am glad those are done. And in addition both of them built up my self-confidence and let me exercise some negotiating and boundaries and enforcement skills. I also learned hard lesson re being patient, making sure both sides get the same meaning out of said statements ( making communication clear), letting go of details and fighting for important stuff, giving thanks where they are due, and asking to have my needs met. And also that nothing happens as fast as initially promised or expected...

Have a good day tomorrow,
FBOW

Hi FBOW,

Just wanted to say thanks. My mood is better. It is just everytime I find a lie from the past, I boil over. Holding back, is not one of my stronger points, but this situation has tested my limits time and time again. One thing I have to keep in mind, is that most of what I have is speculation. Sure, some things are confirmed, they are also, from the time frame that I suspected anyway. So, I should just be prepared for anything from that time frame, and I need to keep in mind that this is the present, and in the present, things do appear to be going much better, so, I should not let the past hurt the present state of things.

There is one thing I have an issue with, in regards to the protection stuff. When it comes to H's affair, I don't feel I should shout it from roof tops and take out a front page ad in the paper exposing him, but I don't feel it is my job to protect him from himself. If anyone asks, I will not lie or cover up for him, I will be honest. To lie, cover up in the name of protection, to me is enabling him. He should be prepared to face the consequences of his actions, if that includes embarrassed, critisism, from friends and family, then so be it.

Oh MY-
I just noticed something. H has never displayed a card I gave him. In the past, he always said thanks and tossed it aside. The card I gave him yesterday, is siting on top of his computer. He also called me at work to thank me. He has never done that before. He knew I went and got it yesterday. He also knew that this was a very busy week for me and that Yesterday was the only time I had time.

I have to keep myself focused on the present and the future. The past will have to be resolved at some point in time. Stay focused.

By the way, I used to be the same as you. Never tackled the challanging stuff, never had enough self-confidence to keep going when it got rough. It took time to become who I am. It did not help me any to have bosses who were dysfuntional. As one former coworker puts it, her boss she has at a new company calls her poor abused girl, because she is bright, person, who had no self-confidence in her ability. It all came from working at my work. From the day you are hired, if you are labeled to succeed you will, if not, then you won't. It took one day of evaluating my life as to where it is, and where I want it to be for me to make the decisions I had to and to go forward.

It takes time to make progress, once you get to a point where you can start making decisions that you are confident in, then nothing stops you.

Hi Sue,
I agree with you that it is better to bless the present if there is progress viible, and I am happy for you that presently things are nicer.

I gave my card in the morning yesterday. H took it but did not say anything so I am not even sure he opened it or just tossed it away.

Oh well. He did not say or give me anything yesterday. We went out for dinner with kids and he was talking with our D only.

I am getting ready to handle his next trip overseas whenever it comes.
I will ask him to tell the girls before he leaves what I asked him for in case he will not return. Then I will be free to talk about separation wit whoever asks. But I doubt I will answer any qustions why - I think I will direct whoever asks to H - especially if those will be his parents.

I wonder how long advance notice H gives me before the trip.

I noticed he does not care about being gentle and considerate in anything to me anymore.

FBOW

Hi FBOW,
I don't have much time right now( and you probably know why) but I wanted to say one thing.

I really meant what I said about you having strength. Sometimes that means we acomplish fantastic things, but sometimes it just means we don't quit even when we don't know how we can continue.

You continually look at your own state of mind and make adjustments. You are able to see that you can do some things and you do them. You know you have limits, and you work within them and continue to do what you can do. You find good things and focus on them so the bad doesn't overwhelm you. You handle problems by your self if needed but continue to try and share things with H to keep him in the loop.

Yes, I do feel you have strength. I commend you for it. I wanted to comment on some things you said over the last week or so, but I don't have time to do it properly, so this will have to do for today.

Continue to take care of yourself. Your family needs you and your friends here care too.

SS

<small>[ February 19, 2003, 11:04 PM: Message edited by: still seeking ]</small>

FBOW,

I can only reinforce SS, you do have alot of strength within you.

I'm at work, so I have to be short and sweet right now. I'll catch up later.

SS and S,
thank you guys for those so much needed words of faith in me. H told me today he goes overseas in about a week. I asked him if he's going to see OW and that if he does I never within past 14 months said I would be willing or able to share him with her. And that it was him who initially encouraged me to speak my heart when I felt uncomfortable or endangered and it was him to decide to proceed the way he did. I reminded him that I did tell him his phone, email amd mail contact with her hurts me a lot and as much as I still have faith that we can build good future in our M, I cannot continue like this him present by body not soul. I told him I still love him. That I am waiting for his decision as I promised not talking to anybody too close to him. I was for me very calm, I did not cry nor raise my voice, though I am afraid I still sounded very emotional but I am only human and in deep stress too.

He declined to answer any of my questions. He was very disinterested an unwilling to talk and did tell me so. Nor that we talk tomorrow instead of right away. He did not want to set time for any other talk before he leaves. I mentioned that the one thing I learned from the last year events that avoiding the problem does not solve it. I also told him I am ready to acompany him for this trip ( I am sure my friend would stay with our kids even on a moments notice).
So my plan for the next week is to keep Plan A and give him plan B letter IF i can force myself to write one. I have sample copies from here in my car. Is there anything else BEFORE he leaves for me to DO? ( I'd rather not to SAY anything more).
Sorry guys I am not as strong as you think.
I feel very down and would appreciate prayers and thoughts but there is no need to worry or answer immediately.

I know that my kids and myself have to be the priority now. I hope someday they'll learn and understand and forgive me for actions I will take. I hope I will be able to deal with the resentment and anger I might face. I pray for the right choices.

I was calm and "normal" for the rest of the evening, and intend to continue to do so.

FBOW

Hi,
I have been thinking Plan B letter and still cannot figure out how to deal with physical separation IF my H still lives with us.
I strongly feel asking him to move out would destroy any Plan A results. I also don't want to move out myself with kids to an apartment as why to disrupt their lives. Me leaving by myself is out of the question.
I have to say I am becoming less and less attached to our beloved home and I am ready to moving into smaller house in the same school zone if I have to provide for us financially when I find it. I did my background preparation to do it.
Praying for guidance.
FBOW

Hi FBOW,

You are stronger than you give yourself credit for. It takes a very strong person to stay in this type of R, and try to make it work.

The time will come when you will be ready to make the decision to go to Plan B if that is what you need to do for yourself. When that time comes, if it comes, Plan B will be easy for you to impliment. It sounds to me that you are near that point, but keep hoping that he will respond to your requests.

It is possible that he thinks you will tolerate this situation for the kids. I truly believe that the WS believe that we will do this for our children. Our love for the WS and love for our Children is what gives us the courage and energy to do Plan A, our love for ourself is what gives us the courage to know when to move on to Plan B if Plan B becomes necessary. You will know when and if you need to move to Plan B.

Take care

While my W continues to improve, looks like FBOW is kind of "worse" right now.

It sounds to me like you did all you could do. I think you need to get ready for plan B.

I can't tell you how to make the arangements but if he continues as he is now, he will need a taste of what it will be like to loose his family. He may never pull out of this without it.

Remember that it may mean the end, but if he continues as he is, it does anyway. You can't live like you have been for ever. I still worry about your health, both physical, and emotional, and I still pray for you. After living 47 years, I feel prayer is one of the best ways to get the help we all need in our lives.

As I read your posts, I feel you are looking at your options properly, and that your decisions are made with care. If you continue to be thoughtful and to pray, I believe you will make the correct choices. I also believe ideas will come into your mind so that you will know how to proceed. When you have the correct outline in your mind, you will be at peace, even though you may still fear.

I know you are afraid, and I don't know if it can be any other way. Courage does not mean absense of fear, it means we press on in spite of it. I believe in your ability to do this. I believe God will put this same feeling in your heart, that you can do this, and that you will do it right.

SS

<small>[ February 25, 2003, 10:23 PM: Message edited by: still seeking ]</small>

Hi FBOW,

Just looking in on you. How is it going?

Hi FBOW,

SS, asked me to let you know he is thinking of you if I got on to your post. So, I'm passing it along.

I hope all is well?

FBOW,

In response to your answer on my post, - your welcome.

Post when you feel ready. We will keep looking in

Hi FBOW,

I admit that I can't really tell you what to do now. I believe you are at the point where you can't go on with plan A without some kind of sign from H that there is a chance for your M.

I want to say a lot more but it is speculation and the words won't come to me.

Probably I should leave well enough alone and just encourage you.

Once I said you seem brave - to me at least. You have a lot more ability than you know, and you will continue to get help when you need it.

Don't get the feeling like there is no hope, for there is always hope when you know God is there, and he is there. Let us know how things are when you get time, but take all the time you need. Like Sue said.................. when you are ready.

SS

Hi SS,

My H is back. Earlier than planned. I don't know if he met OW or not, possibly not since he came back earlier, but he did not say and I don't feel like asking. He still wants to be distant physically and emotionally from me. I will not push but boy I am out of fuel almost.
Anyway, I showed my H the outside of a house I made an offer on, also to the kids, as "an investment property". I am now full speed into loan/escrow business. I also told kids we might move into this home while renting out the current one if it makes sense financially. Which is not a lie, as I don't know how the situation develops. It is a big struggle to me to remain calm and businesslike while I want to just curl into a fetal position and cry and wail and wait for consolation. I want to protect the kids. It feels though my stress causes more trouble than my mitigating skills and willingness can repair. H is very nice to our kids and they are so happy to have daddy back. I am happy to see him too, it just hurts so much he wants little to do with me, although he was more patient while I attempted to talk to him about his trip and my real estate adventures.
I approach him with love, knowing that he might me in withdrawal at best, or undecided and still in love and in A with OW at worst. I am afraid he does not see it as love, just clinginess and pushiness, I have to stop, and stay busy with my own affairs which right is quite easy since I have a lot of paperwork, appointments and phone calls to deal with.

The bottom line is I am not ashamed of anything I've done in the past year.
Again, I won't probably be posting too often, I still lurk almost daily, if you stop by Sue, please let her know I admire her focus and resolve and ability to control herself while dealing with current discoveries. She knows that practical stuff in life, like reliable joband housing, are very important and have to be earned, they are not freely granted, and until you tried to achieve that , you don't know how dedicated, focused and determined you have to become and constantly remain so.
Hope your W is doing well, and you are having a nice weekend.
FBOW

I wish I could be more help for you, but really there is plan A, or plan B. I can see from what you have posted to seahorse that you wish to stay in A a little longer.

I see you give credit to Sue because she is doing a great job in a difficult situation. Remember that you are too. It looks like you are looking at everything you need to do in case things don't work and he continues to chase OW. I think you are doing well in those things.

I continue to pray for your health, your well being, and for the success of your M.

Only post when you feel like posting, it's your thread. We offer support as best we can.

SS

Hi FBOW,

yesterday my middle S was sick with the flu. I think I have it now. Layed around the house all day. I called in sick at work, feeling a little more energetic. I'm glad there is no class this week. I have to get a paper written. Now I have all week to do it.

Thank you for your compliment. I have to say, if I had not gone through this before, I would not be able to be so focused. Also, I have an important goal to accomplish.

You are also doing what you need to do. It shows that you are preparing for a potential situation. Either way, it works out. I call that smart planning

Hi FBOW, I see you are hanging in there. I agree with SS, you are very tough on yourself. Of course you are clingy and want to be with him, that's how it always worked, that is what is comfortable. Its hard to train yourself out of that, but it happens slowly over time.

You are moving forward and gaining new strength everyday. You will one day look back and say 'wow'.

With or Without your H, you will be fine. I hope that it will be with.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

<small>[ March 13, 2003, 03:21 AM: Message edited by: Seahorse ]</small>

Since Sue came over before I posted, I never did say anything to her, but she saw it here.

I have been thinking tonight about some of you gals and I worry about you. I know there is nothing I can do directly for you, but I still worry. I hope you are doing as well as you can knowing what is going on in your life.

I wish your H would respond. I hope he does. Remember that others care about you, and are praying for you. You have a Heavenly Father that loves you and he will help you. I also know that sometimes it seems like no one is there, but I know there is. I hope you know that too.

Take care of yourself.

SS