Sitting here with tears rolling down my face, friend just come back from drink with H ,, not good but then not bad, he hasn't decided what to do as yet but OW still around. Talking about getting married quarters so he can have the boys...long term planning is that part of the fog?Asked about me and the boys and village life, says he's had a hard time from the blokes at work and his mum, friend gave him a print out from this site .....a letter from a man who had an affair and what he stood to loose...so i hope he reads that. Must go and get some sleep as it's late over here.Thanks for ALL your support. <img src="graemlins/teary.gif" border="0" alt="[Teary]" />

Very confused and angry night with thoughts whizzing around my head. Just had tarty highlights in the hair so i feel better, taking the boys to the seaside in 3 hours for a great weekend, totally focusing on them and spending his money!!!
Why can't they just give the marriage a second go?Any WH please answer if you can...... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Hi Uk-er. Offer to email or message still there if you want to 'talk'. Enjoy your weekend and forget H for a few days and concentrate on yourself and children.
jante

jante
WE're back from the seaside we had a lovely time, I did text h to say that we all missed him, but i got no reply.I had my palm read whilst there it was very accurate,and she said i would be strong and have a better life but could not answer about H coming back...... so who cares, I trying to stretch my new size 10(uk measurements)so i can sit an hour in counselling tomorrow with H. I'm not expecting much that way so i can't be too disappointed .ALL weekend i have been trying to think of ways to put points across in counselling that i feel i want to be heard ....like
1.affairs are all based on lies and deceit
2.At present he and i just have to repair our relationship and not the 3 boys as they are unaware.
3.Losing friendships, family life, dog, wife etc for a quick buzz twice a week
4. 9 out of 10 people that attend counselling have workable problems ie sex promblems and communication... so why can't we!
My head is just swimming at present . All will be revealed this time tomorrow.. keep praying for all on this site that they get what they want..

Dear uk-er,
Glad you had a good day at the seaside - it's always great when its a sunny day here! I spent yesterday working in my garden - I've let it go this year - it was good to be paying attention to something other than my thoughts and feelings.

I know you have a lot you want to say to H in MC tomorrow - but sit back and take a deep breath - he is not in a place where he can listen to you and everything you want to say to him all in one go. A lot of what you want to say to him are things the counselor needs to say to him - he needs to hear these things from someone else, not just from you - that affairs are based on lies, deceit, etc - all the general principles.

It might be more beneficial to sit down and write a list of all the things you still love and admire about him - all the things you appreciate about him, all the pluses and positives you still see in your marriage - you have to have these clear in your head in order to be able to present your case that you still have the basis for a good marriage - that what is missing is something you can work on and add to all the good things you still have together.

If you nail him with all the reasons why what he is doing is so wrong, he is more likely to run even farther away. The fact that he is even coming to a MC appt with you shows some willing to try to address the problem - so let him know in concrete ways why you think your marriage can still work, and that you are willing to listen to his side of it - and let him tell you what he wants and what he thinks is missing. This will be very hard for you, but neccessary to get this process off the ground. If he is able to reveal any of his thoughts about the EN's which he is trying to fill outside the home, this would be good. It's more important to build bridges of communication between you than to get him to understand that what he is doing is wrong. He already knows that what he is doing is wrong. Getting him to make a commitment to continue MC should be the first priority.

There's also a good website called www.divorcebusting.com - I think that's what it's called - gives a lot of good advice about what NOT to do. Remember that it's not over until the fat lady sings!

Gotta go make dinner now!
Take care,
Odile

I NEED ALL YOUR WISDOM NOW.Odile .thanks for your kind words i took heed of them and only had 2 little love busts!!i thought of you throughtout counselling yesterday...the first time we had met for 2 weeks well his relationship is stronger with the ow and doesn't love me so whilst pinching myself for an hour so i wouldn't cry we talked about separation. He cracked up when the counsellor said he couldn't dip into family life when he pleases as it wasn't fair on me or the children as they would see him as always coming back.She also said he wouldn't be detaching from family life. THIS led to when do we tell the children the 8 yr old is at a new school today so i didn't want that to marr that, today they are at a birthday party from school, tomorrow it's induction evening at the new school ... which he wants to come to, friday they go to cub camp for 3 days so h is now home until next week ..what a **** up!!
He commented on my new hair style and weight loss... he asked what diet i was following... i nearly said the affair diet!!!I told him i had refound myself and i 'm doing a 180 on him. then it got to the bedroom he saw me making up the spare bed but stopped at our bedroom door i gave him the alarm clock and told to tell the children his back was playing( ironic really cos that's how he met ow whilst having back therapy in london1!)as he wanted the children not be concerned why he was sleepin in spare room

Please help me what to i do this week ? and when he tells ow he's back home for the week please pray that she has a strop and calls it off...I can but hope , although my feelings are turning more hateful towards him.

I know on july4th you have big celebrations us Brits hope you all enjoy them with the people you love so on thursday there'll be only brits posting... please advice asap THANKS

wise MBers please reply........

Hi Uk-er
Sorry to hear that things are still so rough for you. As long as he is at home, you have the opportunity to choose the right time to talk. Have you tried sitting down together when the kids are in bed? My H struggles with long, drawn out conversations - he hates them and feels that we go round and round without much prospect of it ending! I get upset if he tries to cut it short, because I need some time to get going! Maybe if you can encourage him to just talk to you ... just about how he feels about being at home, how he feels about the kids, how he feels about you, everything. II know how hurtful this can be. My H also agreed to read this site - we have posted things independently and it has helped me to see things that I was blind to. I think the advice given to him has also helped him to realise how it feels to be the spouse who has been cheated on. Keep looking after yourself - let him see that you are a strong person and that you choose to be with him - you don't need him to survive. I do admire the way you have carried on being a great mother to your kids - it is so hard to hold it together when all you can think about is him and the pain and the future. Good luck this week - be happy and normal - help him to remember how precious a happy family is.
Fishwife

Thanks fishwife,I do love my family so i hope this week never ends.....

Dear uk-er,
I don't know if I qualify as a "wise" MB - I can only share from my own experience and from what I've learned from reading on this board -

First of all, you did very well to hold back in MC and not "let him have it" even though you are very angry right now. Believe me, this will NOT help and will just drive him out into the arms of the OW. Whatever you do, do NOT give him any reason to fault your behaviour towards him - no screaming, no accusations, no angry scenes, no punching him (I did this), no attempts to manipulate him or the OW.

I found out about my H's 2nd EA with one of his 21-yr-old piano pupils 2 weeks before I found MB - I hacked into his e-mail account, confronted him with the evidence, then e-mailed the OW demanding an explanation. She, of course, insisted they were "just friends" - well, they were, but they were "special friends" let's put it that way - I e-mailed my H telling him I couldn't stand the sight of him, and asked him to leave me alone while I sorted my head out - when I came home from work that night, he taunted me into an argument which then turned physical, ending when I punched him and cut his eyebrow with the ring his mother gave me for our wedding! The upshot of this is that he trawls up that one time I was ever violent with him as justification for his behaviour - the OW accused me of manipulating her into promising not to see him again and of threatening to ruin her reputation, and he now accuses me of being pathologically jealous and invasive of his privacy!

Well - what I am saying to you is don't make the mistakes I made. Your H is hurting right now, too - and he is very confused - he knows that what he is doing is wrong - he may seek justification for his actions by trying to goad you into arguing with him - DON'T give in to this - tell him you love him, that you still love him even though what he is doing is hurting you, and if you have to, just turn and walk away. Whenever you encounter him, leave him with the memory of you at your best. This will be the hardest thing you ever have to do, but it is the only thing that will help you both in the long run. Tell yourself that no matter what happens, you will behave with dignity - you want to be able to look back on this time and be able to say you tried your best, and be someone your children will be able to be look up to and be proud of. Remember that your children will look back on this time and remember you as you are now. I know - my parent divorced when I was 12 and I remember well the week that my father left us.

You say your H "cracked up" when the MC told him he can't dip into family life - this shows his family is very important to him. He is probably not thinking about any of the implications of what he is considering - that is only just starting to register with him. Unfortunately you are having a "plan B" thrust upon you right now. Plan B says that once you separate you have no contact with WS until they separate from OP - period. Try to avoid letting them use the children as a way to worm their way back into your home whenever they feel like it. If they call and want to talk and chat, you are busy and gotta go - the message you give is that you are not waiting around moping for them - you are getting on with your life. And you will. You know that you will - your children will need you to be strong now more than ever.

I think you should also make him be the one to tell the children - don't let him foist this job on to you - make him be the one to look into their eyes and tell them he is leaving - this is his responsibility.

And don't give up home - I will look for Lostva's thread for you - it is very inspiring - and Lor(lor) also - she and her H separated 6 times, recovery began after he came home 7th time - and you can look at BrambleRose's new thread over on GQII "It's been one year".

It's raining today - it could be sunny tomorrow. Hang in there - ((((uk-er))) - that's a hug.

BTW - I will be having tea on the vicarage lawn on the 4th of July - my last day at work for the summer - but I will be wearing my tiny rhinestone American flag pin!

Take care,
Odile

I still don't know yet how to make links on this - so here is the title -

For Encouragement - Lostva's Success Story - or just type in Lostva to the Search engine and look in General Questions II.

And I meant "don't give up HOPE" not "don't give up HOME" - freudian slip there?

Also - has he given you any idea yet of what needs he may have that you have not been meeting? This would be a start.

Take care,
Odile

UK-er, I don't have any suggestions or ideas for you because I am in almost the same boat, but you have my thoughts and prayers....My WH's OW is in Farnham. He is here in the US. UK'er and those of you in the UK who are posting, what resources are available for finding out more about the OW? I know her maiden name and think I know her married name (she was divorced 4 years ago). I also know her phone number and where she works. There is alot about her that does not sound on the up and up and my WH is so trusting that he refuses to see the inconsistencies in her story....Knowing her actual background would be very helpful.... Any help would be appreciated. Please post your response here - I can't give my e-mail because WH has access to my e-mail accounts.... Thanks.

uk-er:

Sorry to hear about your pain! This is all new to you, both your knowledge of the A and the A itself. You have a ways to go before your H can even begin to see the light. You can also expect that not LBing will be very hard for the first couple of months. I've found that I LB'd right and left for at least the first 2 months after D-day, and then a little every other week or so for a month or two after that, then not at all. Well, except for one big one last weekend! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> (but that was in self-defense! - seriously, I managed to regain composure and turn an argument around after my W LB'd ME for a good half hour on Saturday).

Anyway, the upshot of all that rambing is that you are really still in plan A. I know you said at one point you are in B, but it's too soon for that. As you continue to work on yourself, you will find that you will have little trouble avoiding major LBs (at least), and eventually you'll feel very good about yourself and your future (whoever is in that future, too!). In the past month, I would probably say that my plan A has been very good, and it's made me FEEL amazing.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that you can continue plan Aing even if your H is living with OW. You want to do this so that you can communicate with him, show him that you love him, and show him that you and the kids are doing well. At some point, perhaps several months from now, if this A is still going on, you will be in a much better position to do a very effective plan B.

I agree with you and others on this thread: This site has been an amazing help to me in the past 6 months. I honestly think that, if I hadn't found this site and applied its principles, I would have gotten a very sloppy DV by now, and would set myself up for repeating the things I did during our M that led to my W's dissatisfaction with it. Then, I'd go through the same thing again with my new partner. Now, I know I'll survive, and I'll be a much better H for the experience. Either with my W (I hope so!) or with someone else later on.

all my best,

we had the counselling h noticed and commented on the hair and weight loss,, During counselling h sobbed uncontrollable when the counsellor said he couldn't dip in to family life as and when, as the children would hold on to the fact that he is coming back. I'm know plan A and i'm in it whilst we wait a week at home doing family life until he tells the children next week, as he's military he had the option to just come home in the evening, but H chose to come back home...so confusing will he actually go through with it and has he told the ow where he is?? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Dear uk-er,
Just to say am checking up on you. It's a good sign that H noticed your new hair and weight loss - this shows he is still interested in any changes you make - have you looked at the EN's questionaire and the LB questionaire on this site? Even if he is not in a place where he can do them right now, if you do them for yourself, this should give you an idea of where you can start to make changes that may have affected your R - in the long term, these changes have to be consistent - yes, like 2long said, you can still plan A while you are not living together - sometimes it takes the WS living apart to realize what they are losing in you - and facing reality with the OP. Fantasies don't last long under the cold light of day.

He obviously loves his family very much, and the fact that he has chosen to stay this week shows he is still undecided - even if he might state otherwise -

Hang in there -

Odile

H has just come back for something and i gave him the speeding fine that came this am ,coming back early from her house last week!! he was angry and then said that after we have dropped the boys at cub camp he won't be around for the weekend, he was not the h he was last night so he must of been in contact with ow and she didn't like it that he was back home and fired him up again with sh** so i'm on the big dipper rollercoaster again...Nevermind keep planAAing....

Still no talk about how to tell the children....will he do it?.. I went to bed early as i had a migraine woke up later to go and get water to take tablets and he was sat using his new mobile phone ( which i don't know about!!) talking to her , it's as if he wants me to get mad and take the decision out of hands and kick him out which i'm not going to do cos i'm plan a ing , thank heavens for this web site ,friends and MY boys.
happy july 4th there should be brits, aussies, and that chap in thailand hope god looks after us all. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Uk-er,
Even though I'm an American, I'm living in Sweden and can't take the day off like the rest of my countymen and women.
By skimming through your posts, all of this sounds like it is very hard on you. Take it from someone who has been down this road before numerous times, it gets easier...hang in there!
Yes, Plan A your butt off. I sense by your posts that there is a lot of focus still on your WH. Try to change that and focus on yourself; that's a good Plan A. Your not going to change him, so don't try. Your H doesn't know what he's doing presently, and it might take some time before he does. Don't let his stupidity get in your way of your own personal development. You want to be in the best shape possible for when he snaps out of it!
You are right, you have found a good support group here at MB--even though there is the time delay and the responders often spell words a little strangely...

Hang in there!

Sweden

uk-er,
Can't write now - H out for 10 minutes - hang in there and DON'T take the bait by getting mad, kicking him out or fighting. This is exactly what he wants by being surly and uncommunicative and showing you stuff he thinks might make you mad.

Don't do it. Walk away. You are stronger than you think you are and you can do it.

You will be glad later that you didn't hand him to the OW on a silver platter. Remember that.

Odile

Dear Uk-er

I have been in a very similar place to where you are now, where my WH said terribly cruel things and did his best to hurt me. He later admitted that it was partially to provoke me into throwing him out and then he could get on with his life, thinking that I had made the decision! We are in a better place now - where there is talking and bridge-building (to some extent), so I can promise you that time will change things. Keep busy, keep writing here - the support and advice does help you to plan where you can go next, and hopefully your WH will see what a great wife and family he already has. Be strong - you don't deserve this.
Fishwife