Your story is absolutely amazing. You have been married only two years and you state that your wife has had several sexaul affairs in the past couple of months putting your health at risk for STD's. She then totally humiliates and disrespects you by sitting and drinking wine with the OM while making you have to sit and watch.
Weeks later she now tells you she a male buddy that she has "dates with" and leaves you at home to go to a bar to have drinks with him.

You have got to be crazy to put up with this. She should be doing everything to regain your trust and faith in her and she seems to be content to do just the opposite. My friend your wife is a "cakewoman" who enjoys acting single and engaging in single activities while also having the security of husband and a marriage.
This will be an ongoing drama with you. She will push you and disrespect you to the limit and then beg you to stay when you are going to leave.
Your wife does not act like a married woman and seemingly does not care how much she degrades your manhood and self-esteem. It really seems she is sadistic in her activities towards you. I think you really need to contact a lawyer since you have no children and try to find someone in the future who you can admire and respect and who believes in the concept of a marriage and committment. This woman is absolutely toxic to you and your mental and physical health. After all of her sexual affairs she has to hook up with a new male friend to do things with? How come she does not hook up with a female friend? She is playing you for a fool. Do you really need to have a piano fall on your head to understand what kind of person she is? I wish you luck because God knows you will need it if you stay with her.

Hi M, sorry I haven't been around, I've been on the downward of the rollercoaster myself and will be going to plan B today. While I have an inch of strength I am offering it to you.

I have plan A'd for almost six months. It was hard at first and I did things (LB's) I regret. But then I worked out it was about getting your own life and working through the ISSUES that lead you to this siutation. Yes your wife is being disrespectful and yes you will need help if you stay - plan A is not for wimps, its ****ing hard work and when you go to B (like I am) you wonder why you failed. But I can see plan A had a purpose. I know what went wrong in our relationship and can work on it.

Yes I feel like a failure today, but everyone around me is telling me I am the winner. I'm pretty sure that once today is over and I start my next stage of my life I will see it too. I hope I do, I don't want to be this down on myself for too long My self esteem has taken a battering, but then again, I learnt to deal with two major life crises. And I've learnt that my self esteem has been reliant on my H, now I have to learn to love myself.

My H may never come back to me now. There is nothing to hold us together really, only love, and its up to him to decide that.

At least your wife is willing to go to counselling. Its a good start and you should at least try it, IMHO

Madnav, I spent a lot of time during my marriage doing a lot of Plan A (I still do). When a man works his Plan A it not only shows your WS what kind of man you are, -it also reminds YOU of the kind of man you are.

And that's as important for you to recover from the hurt. It reminds you that you are desirable and have qualities that good women will want to experience in knowing you.

Be strong. Plan A is difficult. Don't view it as throwing away effort, regardless of your W's response. Do it for yourself as much as her.

I hope things work out for you.

Dont worry .. I am plan A'ing out my hoohaa. I owe it to myself that I try all avenues to salvage what is left of the wreckage of my marriage. That way if things turn for the worse then I know I did all I could.

Seahorse- hang in there you have been strong enough to stick to your guns for the last 6 months. You are definately strong enough to do it on your own until he figures out that you were the best thing. Or he stays in his own fog and never figures it out. No matter what way it goes you win. If he comes back to you then you win by getting him back like you want. If he doesnt, then you win because he was not worthy of you and you can get your life back and stop living to his whims. You can do it.

good luck and keep in touch.

Mad

Started counseling last night. First sesson went ok. I know not much can be expected from the first time. The MC wants to see us individualy. He seems to think that she has some deep rooted issues to work out. (Not like I disagree with him) I am kind of jelous because I want to be there to hear what she has to say. One thing that upset me that the counselor said is that she might feel bad for hurting me but not feel bad about having the A. I find that if that is true it is a selfish, inconsiderate, and disrespectful way to feel.

The W and I did talk on our own after the session, and we had a good talk. She stated that she thinks it is a good idea to have individual sessions. She said there are things she is feeling or has not told a soul and needs to work them out before she can discuss anything with me. Now I dont know if she is talking about her life (i.e. childhood, family, ect.) or her ONSx2 and A. Maybe both. The MC said that in essence we are actually divorced right now emotionally and we need to find out if we would marry each other again. She stated she did not know if she wanted to be married. I told her and the MC that it felt unfair for me to have to put my feelings on hold until she pulls her hear out of her A$$ and figures out what the heck she wants. The MC said I was right but there is no other option if I want to make it work. All in all I felt like the MC was justifying what she did even though he said it was wrong for her to do it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I am not sure what to do. We had some time away from each other last night to ponder what we had discussed. I think that helped. When we went to bed we actually had a great time holdingeach other and kissing. Today she has called me several times at work and was very upbeat and affectionate to me. I guess I should just ride this out and see where it goes.

Here I go then... (holding my breath) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Not feeling to good about life today. W went out last night with her friends for a girls night. She called and checked in like she said she would when she said she would. About 2am she called and said she was on her way home and had to drop of one of her friends on the way home. Her friend lives with in 3 miles from us. She told me 30min and she would be home. An hour later she was still not home. I called her cell and it was busy. I decided to go looking for her. I retraced the route to her friends house and did not see her. By the time I got to her friends house she was calling me on my cell. She was wondering where I was. Apparently she was driving around our neighborhood talking to another friend on the phone about her friends problems in her marriage. My W assumed that I was asleep and did not want to come home and wake me up. I have told her over and over and over that when she is out I CAN NOT sleep. I can not rest until I feel everything is in its place in the house. I get up at 5am to go to work and by the time she was home it was 3:30. We argued untill 4 I finally fell asleep about 4:30 to get up at 5 to go to work. So I guess I am just strung out today. I just am pissed that she did not do what she said she was going to do. Also it seems that her friends marriage problems take precidence over ours. I just needed to vent a little.

MAdnav, it is understandable that you need to vent. You may find that your wife does a lot of things she said she wouldn't and dosen't do things she said she would. OF course, she will be able to justify all of it somehow, usually at your expense. Be strong, be patient and try not to react. She is holding all the cards right now and you need to detach a little and hold a few of your own. Its not about being secretive or getting back at her, its about reclaiming your own power.

Do you have hobbies? How 'bout that motorbike you mentioned. Now I am on my way to getting my learners permit (and a bike I hope), and I'd be joining a club that rides. Do you do that? Get that smile dial moving Madnav!!

Its good you're going to counselling. If and when she's ready, she'll tell you what the counsellor said. Its true what the counsellor said though, this is about her now, not you. Let her work out her issues and you work out yours. Hopefully, somewhere in time you will find each other again and work on the Marriage.

SH

Thanks for the words of encouragement SeaHorse. I dohave a couple of hobbies. Yes I do have my "scooter", but the temp are here lately is in the 100's and it is not really all that fun. I do use it to commute back and forth to work. Another problem I find with my bike is that I tend to ride pretty aggresively when I am upset. This is not really a good thing with a bike that is capable of speeds over 150mph. Trust me.. I have been there. After I found out about her A's I took a ride on my bike. I live in a high desert mountian region. There are a lot of wonderful twisty roads to ride around here. The best (I think) is on the way to the local ski hill. It is real windy and fun, but it still has the sand from last winter on it. They sand the road after plowing for traction. Well.... this particular evening I rode real aggresively up it. I guess I was in a state that I did not care if I flung my self and bike off the mountian. I didnt hurt my self (obviously or I would not be writing here), but I wanted to. I was not going to go out of my way to hurt my self, but if it happened I would not have cared. I made it back down the mountian and wound up at a local biker bar. I had a few too many drinks and was "smart" enough to get on my bike and ride home. (again back to the not caring part)

I do have a couple of safer hobbies that I have been doing. I wish it was winter though. I could pass the time snowboarding.

One thing I do have is a job promotion I start tomorrow. It will keep me busy for a while learning all the new stuff, this is a good thing. I was lucky to get in to the R&D department at work. Junior engineer... ya... Exactly where I want to be. So there have been some blessings lately to go with all the crap. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I had a couple of "moments" today where I needed to be alone. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> I did not take it out on her. I just excused my self and went in to the bedroom. Things are getting better though. I dont have them quite as frequently now.

I still have my doubts about weather I want to work things out now. I guess it stems back to if I can ever trust her or not. Right now... I dont think so. But who knows in time. I get these thoughts that she does not deserve me, and that there is someone out there who does. Is that a normal reaction? I think it might be.

Well gotta run... time for bed...

Mad

MadNav !. Well I can write your story. I know how it feels to leave your house in the wee hours looking for your wife and not believing the whole situation. But we create the world around us, don't we?. Dear Friend Its time . Concider yourself much better off then most here...No Children. In short you married the wrong person, fold your cards and leave the table. I might sound a bit cold but you do not have a plan A here you have major life issues that at some point will kill you and your image of who you are as a man and a person. Your wife needs to grow up and you need to move on. Not easy I know but I told you last time to get ready for this. She is troubled and not yet mature enough or possibly never will be mature enough to be married.
ultimatly she loses. But you end up the winner. I told you this last time and I will tell again , it's time. Leave and don't look back.

Wow Madnav, you gotta control those emotions!!! When it gets to you, you start doing things that risk your life? I know I've been there too, drinking and driving, going SCUBA diving (to me that was certain death because I didn't really believe you could breath underwater!) diving with sharks (twice) and of course the motorbike thing - though I wouldn't trust myself going over 40kms (I'm from DownUnder) right now!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> I'm just a learner!!!

My point is, everything your feeling, including feeling she dosen't deserve you is normal. You will feel a whole range of emotions that you didn't think you could - strong emotions, scary emotions - all in the space of about 10 minutes <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> - but yep, its normal.

Remember, you are in counselling, so you've got a good chance. You have many options Madnav, you can work on it, you can walk away, its your choice, but I think we know where your headed - the rollercoaster. Even though I'm in B, I'm glad I did it - I've learnt a lot. Gosh, she should think herself lucky to have a guy who would put in such an effort for her!!

Is 100 hot? I think that would be about 40oC here, so yep it is!!! How about horseriding, I've just rediscovered my passion for that, no actually, then again, the horse might have a heartattack - best to stick to the steel one for now!!!

Hang in there mate, we're all praying for ya! Concentrate on the new promotion, that will keep your mind distracted for a while.

I'm staying off of my scooter... it's too tempting to open up full throttle and close my eyes...

Found out that one of her close friends is going through a divorce also. I think that she is being influenced (not directly) by her friends actions. I asked her last night if she was thinking about divorce. She said no and hugged me tight. I still think that it is in her mind. She did have a pow wow with her mom last night. I dont think that was pretty. I do see glimpses of the person that she used to be. Maybe she is snapping out of the daze (fog). I dont know.. time will tell.

Hi Madnav, whats happening? Anything wonderful???

not much going on lately. We are going to couseling. the Doc wants to see me every couple of weeks, but he wants to see her every week. she went out of town this weekend with some old friends and family. I stayed home and tried to keep myself occupied. I did go out fri and sat nights with friends. That helped alot. She called from her trip and told me that she missed me alot. I belive her on that. Although (LOL) last night I was out with friends at a bar and ran into the woman who told me about my wifes A's. My W thinks that this woman has alterior motives. I realy dont think so. Any ways... I called my W to let her know that I ran into her. Needless to say my W was not real pleased. After I hung up with her I went about my business, I did not talk to that woman for the rest of the night. Well my wife called me several times through out the night to check to see if the woman had talked to me. I told her no , but I dont think that she belives me. I can just picture her sitting there stewing about it 200mi away and not being able to do anything about it. I guess life does have its sweet little moments. I know that is a immature way to think... but it feels so good.

Other than that I am hanging in there. How about yourself??

Yep I would second the talking to the Harley's because they have practically seen every infidelity situation.

Madnav your W is definetely in denial of the magnitude of damage she has caused her M, you and even herself. But it's understandable because none of us wants to be the 'bad guy' in any situation.

If your W had so many ONS it may be a sign of sexual addiction which is something that she herself will have to acknowledge and actively seek help for. She is doomed to fail in any relationship if she does not seek counseling and possible treatment. Right now her reputation with the people that know about her sexual escapades is that of a whore.

Do not give her ultimatums that you are not willing to follow thru. If you threaten her with going to an attorney to start divorce proceedings, then you must be willing to do so because otherwise she will realize that your threats amount to nothing more than blowing off steam and thus she can continue with her cheating lifestyle while rubbing your nose in it.

And I would suggest that you give yourself some time - maybe 6 months - before proceeding with any actions to possibly terminate your M, just to see if she is really working her way back to you and the M. You want to make sure that you do not have second thoughts about terminating your M - if that is your decision months hence - that will haunt you later on and sabotage any future relationship with another woman.

Another excellent Harley book is 'Love Busters' because it shows how destructive behaviors kill romantic love. If you have a chance, buy it and read it.

Good luck and God bless.

<small>[ July 21, 2002, 03:07 PM: Message edited by: TooMuchCoffeeMan ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Madnav:
<strong>not much going on lately. We are going to couseling. the Doc wants to see me every couple of weeks, but he wants to see her every week.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is good, really good.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>I called my W to let her know that I ran into her. Needless to say my W was not real pleased. After I hung up with her I went about my business, I did not talk to that woman for the rest of the night. Well my wife called me several times through out the night to check to see if the woman had talked to me. I told her no , but I dont think that she belives me. I can just picture her sitting there stewing about it 200mi away and not being able to do anything about it. I guess life does have its sweet little moments. I know that is a immature way to think... but it feels so good.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hmmmmm I wonder if she fears that this woman will reveal some new info on her that just might push you to say to yourself 'enough, I've had it, I want out of this'. The next time your W calls you, you might consider telling her that if any new info comes from other people instead of her, that the chances of you wanting to stay married to her, will go significantly down the toilet. So it is to her benefit if she comes clean once and for all with you. Her credibility is shot and if she wants to rebuild it, she'd better start by beign totally honest with you.

<small>[ July 21, 2002, 03:21 PM: Message edited by: TooMuchCoffeeMan ]</small>

tmcm,
I have pondered the thought that there might be more info out there and that the W is worried about me finding out. I also think that her "friend" who told me (by the way she was there for one of the ONS.. she was with a different guy who is engaged to one of our good friends while all were in a hot tub together.) has told me everything she knows. She was sick of the W actions and how she was treating our marriage and decided to tell me after I grilled her for facts. Not like the "friend" is real innocent in all of this. And if she was a real friend she would not have let my W get in to a situation where this would have happened.

I dont think that she is a sex addict. She does not act that way with me and she has claimed repeatedly that I am the one man in her life that has given her an orgasm almost every time. so dont think that that is the problem.

the one thing I see is that she has been a heavy woman all her life. When we met she was around 240 odd lbs. In the last year she has dropped 117lbs through diet and exersize. She attends Weight Watchers meetings religiously and has trained to be a Weight watchers leader. Well all of a sudden she is getting noticed by guys who in the past would have ignored her. She has stated that it excites her that she is getting flirted with. Well I guess the flirting coupled with large amounts of alcohol contributed to her A's. I know that is not an excuse for her actions, but I think it is one of the symptoms.

None the less she is in counseling and I see her starting to hang out with the true friends that she had before. I think she might be coming around. Time will tell and I will not close my eyes to any of her actions.

Thanks for the advice on everything though. It has helped tremendously. I will keep posting on My/our progress each day. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Mad

Madnav, have you and you wife ever spoken about the EN's that she needs? Do you know if you are fulfilling those for her? Its could be that she's needs words of love from you or attention that she is not getting. Could also be she has a low self esteem (actually thats a guarantee) and that's why she needs assurance from other men that she is attractive.

Try HNHN and the five love languages by Chapman, they are both very good.

Other than that, just be wary, don't take anything too personally and keep plan Aing.

Seahorse,

I have tried repeatedly to find out if I am meeting her EM's. She chooses not to talk about it everytime I bring up our situation. Here patent response is " I know I made a mistake and I am putting it be hind me so we can go on with our lives." What type of avoidance crap is that? I have told her that this just does not magically go away. It is not like "oops sorry I broke your wine glass... I'll clean it up." This is a major issue that will not just be forgotten about.

Yesterday she came home from her weekend with her friends. We had to go to a BBQ that afternoon with the same friends that she was out of town with. She proceeded to get drunk off her butt (which she knows drives me crazy and is a major stem of our problems) and start smoking like crazy (another pet peeve of mine). I looked at her all night thinking how disgusting she looked with a cigarette in one hand and a drink in another. My beautiful flower that I married has turned in to a weed.

I guess my issues with her drinking and smoking stems from my child hood and watching my mother do that same think all the time. I used to get so embarrased of my mother the way she acted when she was partying it up. I see the same actions in my W lately and am embarrased to even call her my W.

Now to top off my evening I left the party early for a couple of reasons. One was because my W's behavior, and two was that my dogs were at home and it was about 3-4 hours past their dinner time. Well the W decided to stay later and I was originally ok with that. I trusted the people she was with and knew that they would not let her get out of control. I figured that later was about 10:30ish. Well due to transportational problems she called and had me fetch her from that party at about 11:45. When I pulled up I heard her cell phone ringing, but she did not answer it. I was able to get her out of there just after midnight. As we were walking to the car I checked the last call on her phone and it was this "buddie" (i.e. male) calling her. I flipped.. I wanted to know what the hell he was doing calling her at 11-12pm on a Sunday night. She stressed that she did not know, but that did not help my feelings. After everything that we have been through I dont trust her to tell me the truth yet.

Needless to say I freaked out and by the time I got home. I called the guy back and got his answering machine. I left a pretty nasty message about it being inappropriate to call at midnight and that I wanted to trust him to be a friend to her but I don now. hell called back and we got in to it on the phone and he clained innocence and that all he wanted to do was see if she got back from her trip safely. I told him that she was back at 1pm that afternoon and he should have called then. He stated that he was out of town and just got back in. My responce was that he should have saved it for the morning then.

Well she and I got in to a big arguement and she wound up leaving to sleep at her sisters. She did wind up coming home an hour later and went to bed. We did not talk this morning.

She has e-mailed me this morning to see if my drive to work was good. Kinda like nothing is wrong. Christ! when will this insanity stop????

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>She has e-mailed me this morning to see if my drive to work was good. Kinda like nothing is wrong. Christ! when will this insanity stop????</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It will stop when you and/or her decide it will stop. Right now there is a battle of wills in which each wants the other to change or accept the present situation.

The problem I see with us BS's is that we want to change our spouses to the people we 'beleive' they were when we fell in love with, knowing full well that the change must come from the WS because the WS 'wants' the change. This is much a denial of reality like the WS's fog. Tell me what incentive does your W have - not what you beleive she should have - to change her ways?

Now I think it's great that you are giving it your all to save your marriage but you must be willing to accept the possibility that you and her may end up getting divorced because both want different things in life. You want a real marriage based on honesty and committment while she wants an open marriage where she has you and whatever lover she is hot for at the time. And frankly the fact that she has a male 'friend' - after all her ONS - is not only a sign of disrespect towards you but of how much she really DOES NOT love you.

It seems that the reason why she hasn't been bolder with her flings is because she is AFRAID to loose you and be left with guys that will only want her as a hot f***. But if she realizes that your blows up amount to nothing more than barks with no bites, then just stand back and watch how wanton she's going to become. I know because my xWW started just like yours.

The more disrespect your willing to put up, the more she will be convinced that she is winning the battle in having her cake and eating it.

I really hope I'm full of crap on this one <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

<small>[ July 22, 2002, 01:12 PM: Message edited by: TooMuchCoffeeMan ]</small>