Dear 3,
I am in a similar situation to you. I am worried by your state of health and think that you have been given a lot of good advice about looking afer yourself-I understand about the anger too-but you have to take control,you hold the cards. Be strong. You are more likely to lose the kids by falling apart and developing an eating disorder than by admitting you need help and having treatment for depression.

Your H has been absolutely playing you and OW off and no doubt she feels she is competing with you as you do. Don't forget he will be lying to her almost as much as you.

Pull together the shreds of your self esteem and don't let him call the shots anymore. I think everyone who said a separation is in order is right-big step but do you really want this situation to continue?

Good luck and don't stop posting,there is a lot of accumulated wisdom here.

Deluded

(((((((((((((((((3))))))))))))))))
i'm so sorry you are having to go through all this.
hopefully someone who has been around here longer can give you some good advice--i can only offer my POV and internet hugs.
at this point i don't think anyone would blame you for ending your marriage. however, make sure that it is a decision that you have put a lot of thoughtful consideration into and not one made out of temporary anger. i am by no means telling you not to--that is totally your decision--jst make sure that it is best for you and your children.

3, i know things are extremely tough for you right now, but please don't give up on God. No matter how bad things are now, He has not given up on you and He never will. in my own personal experiences, when hope is gone, faith is the one thing you have to hold on to.

i will be praying for you.

<small>[ December 06, 2002, 11:32 AM: Message edited by: lostbuthopeful ]</small>

Thank U all for supportand HUGS-

I am still not in best state of mind so ndon't no if I will keep posting.

Thank ALL- LOU

I here you loud ad clear on the get edecated thing and self-estem and I will I'm sure .

AND I hope your health is well now we all are good people and don't deserve to have this done to us and espieally KILL us.

I know my posts are long so sometimes peole may miss some things .

I was separated and I KNOW IT IS IN ORER AGAIN

point is ,is that he says he don't want to leave . I also think the biggest thing I AM DOING is always trying to give him support so that he would know it is OK to have fallen in Love with another women . (am I making any sense)

The part about me telling him she is an adult and made this choice .
Well he says thats not true he lied to her and said he was separeated and hated me . Even after I called her he says he made more lies to convince her I was lieing . Point is I know they where together before he left house but niether will admit that .

I can't write until late tonight or monday cause he is around . and alot to say about our talk fri.night and what happened on SAT.

I think I am just going to stay with him and OW in our lives until one of them grows up . In the mean time just go about my life . If I can find the energy to ignore something that is so in MY FACE .

LIKE him calling her cause he has to . Or coming home late cause she says to stop by. Or him taking her christmas and food shopping . And waiting for her furnoture delivaies . THE LIST IS well U see one excuse after another and it frustrates me cause WHY wouldn't U leave.

BY FOR NOW

hey 3--just checkin on you to see how you're doing. i don't really know what advice i can give you--just want to let you know that i'm thinkin about you and wishin you the best. take care.

When u have talked till your blue in the face and have done every thing humanly possiable is it exceptable to

TAKE A BRICK AND HIT THAEM OVER THE

HEAD TO SEE IF THERE IS ANY ONE THERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL If I do not laugh I mite try the brick thing WOW thick is my H . I sat him down fri. gave him a ultimatume and 1 week to make his decision stayed my feeling about him working on marriage if he can't put time in get out and bekore u can put time in u must STOP SEEING OW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He needs to feel as bad for me as he does her . AM I missing something aren't I the wife the BETRAYED ONE , why is he acting as if she is the BS and making up to her , feeling guilty herand how he hurt her is this FOG TO if so it is so thick thatI can't even through the brick trew it.
WE talked fri . SAT . he calls her to check in so she wouldn't call him while we where out.(OK got a bridge to sell ya to)

Then calls her when we get home so she won't call him for not calling her back all day (are u liking the bridge yet)

AND here is the best even though he is telling me the truth I am not ALLOWED to here there phone calls cause it makes him uncomfortable!!!!!!!!!!

my BODY MUST BE TATOOED STUPID,& JACK A$$

AND TONIGHT MONDAY HE IS THERE AGAIN

Personally i happen to like the brick idea <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> lol

i do think youre right--the fog is so thick even if you did hit him with a brick he still wouldn't get the picture. IMO, the best thing for you to do is look out for yourself. do some things that you enjoy. go to a movie, or go shopping (but if you're like me (broke!) go window shopping). try to do some things (and i don't mean chores) to take your mind off of things, if only for a little while. don't let him make you completely miserable!

HEY LOst-

thanks for reply hope all is still on that same track for U as it was for the past couple of days . well I think I realize that I am doing to much LB and trying to hard to make him see through his own fog and trying to hard to make him communicate.

So now I am just going toTRY VERY hard to go about my buisness and live for me and my kids and be there for him if he should decied to talk to me . And try not to think the only time he talks to me is setting me up in another scam for him to be with this OW(slut).

I hate the holidays now !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> U see I have kids and if his temper ever gets crazy and he really is trying to scam me to leave then he mite attempt to use it againt me for there costedy. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">A valid point, but wouldn't the same thing apply if you don't seek help for depression?

Anyway, I am glad to see your posting. That in itself along with all the great people here helps alot, I know! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I sat him down fri. gave him a ultimatume and 1 week to make his decision stayed my feeling about him working on marriage if he can't put time in get out and bekore u can put time in u must STOP SEEING OW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Careful there. As I have learned, you might as well be dealing with a space alien when they are in the fog. Ultimatums can be terribly mis-interpreted by the foggy alien.

It's probably better to vent the ultimatums off here and get some advice on how to reword them so as to avoid a LB.

Take care of yourself.

hey Luki-

Yes I here U loud and clear about the LB . and no I didn't come across like that . I was sincer about his needs but explained that I have needs to and I do not feel he is making much of an atempt to meet them , and that I no I deserve respect . There was some honesty like" he does not care how much he is hurting me because he can't take the time because he is is just over whelemed with guilt for what he did to OW" also because of the holidays she is crying every day to him about how she thought that they would be a family by now and her daughter is upset and they have no money and she mite night be able to buy gifts for her and has to tell child that there is no SANTA .

I was sensative I told him it must be hard on hard and that it is a very sad situation. But in the same respect he did not support her when they where together and he did take them off street and give them a furnished apartment and a very good start and for that he should feel good about himself .But the only thing he says she wants is to understand why he is not with her and why they can't be together .

That I can not help him with other then advise him to tell truth. He won't it would hurt her worse and ruin her world

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> he does not care how much he is hurting me because he can't take the time because he is is just over whelemed with guilt for what he did to OW" </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Remember when you say these things to your H, preface them with "I feel that...", "I think that.." etc.

Some very wise MB posters here helped me realize that, by saying that's how you feel, your WS cannot tell you that you're wrong. Your feelings can't be told that their wrong. See what I'm geting at?

This OW sounds like a real piece of work and it seems to me that she will probably ultimatum herself out of the picture. Let's hope so.

Sounds like you have found a foot hold and stopped the downward slide. Good for you! Keep up the good work.

HEY ALL -

H called at 4pm is going to see ow , I just asked if he would be late said don't know I hope not I am tired withch useually mean 12pm or 1 am so I said ok I'll see ya if I am up be safe and take it easy, he then was silent for a minute and started talking about ow. SAID I don't know why she is in such a bad mood and why is she still got so much energy to fight with him. I said well its the holidays and it makes people really think about there life I guess well I love u and see ya when u get home . said love ya to and miss u .

That took alot out of me I wanted to screem all over and yell .

Wanted to say U spineless jelly fish if your sleepy come home if your not in mood for her tell her to scratch he would say it to me .

but I kept it in , better for him to think nice thoughts about me when he is with her .

LUKI- I do think she will ultimate him and think she has already .

But my only problem is not knowing if this whole thing is the truth ( the way she is ) OR is he still telling her he lvoes her (he says no way )
AND does she know he is home (HE says no way ) thats the reason for this hole story .

so I will continue this and hopefully vent here not on him.

Also regain some of my stregnth back and if this whole thing ends up to just be his way of leaving me again then I can be more clear in my head.

HOPE all is moving in good direction for U .

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> he then was silent for a minute and started talking about ow. SAID I don't know why she is in such a bad mood and why is she still got so much energy to fight with him. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">IMHO you don't have to listen to him talk about the OW. That is the difference between Plan A and being a doormat. I would say "It hurts me when you talk about her." That is a boundary you should set.

Anyone else want to chime in on this?

This is one of my conditions I want to no all convosations between them and every thing he feels about them .

I know may sound strang but the more my H talks , the better for me . U see he is and always was a terrible lier and I on the other hand have a great memory I hang on his every word and the is how he trips himself up . IF he doesn't talk then I know he is hidding even more and doesn't want to get caught up in a lie .

So yes it is pain full but sometimes it comes back to bite him in the [censored] . Yes I do say when he says things about how hurt he is for her I ask him to stop and be alittle more considerate of what he is saying .

But rihgt now I need to get into this plan a and not LB . I am known to do that lately.

Sometimes I still wonder is it really FOG or is it love . Can one person really be in love with someone so much and no that it can work? Or am I the one in the FOG (denial) ?

He won my heart he made me belive in love , the fair tale telling me all of that was true .

I already know that if this ends I WILL NEVER OPEN MY HEART UP AGAIN.

OK enough of me going off track . It is 9:30 pm and I am getting depressed he won't be home until late I know it and now is when all these images come into my head .

Them holding one another and making promises to each other . I know I am killing every one things all are trying not to think about . but I feel so sad and lost .I won't say alone because I know there are pleople here going through the same .

sorry for spelling not a strong suit .

hey 3--i'm the same way about wanting to know everything (as if they're really going to tell us). can't help it--i can't stand not knowing, even tho i know that everything he says about him and her is going to hurt.

i think you handled the phone convo with him great. keep up the good work!

if what he's telling you about hin and OW is true (i know that's a BIG if), sounds like she is just trying to get sympathy and wants him to pity her (especially about telling the kids there's no santa). or maybe she's just a gold-diggin ho <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> even if this is only half the truth, it sounds to me like it's getting old--it may be just a matter of time before he sees who the REAL woman in his life is. Hang in there! Hope you have a good day! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

oh btw everything is still pretty much ok with me--am heading over to update on my thread now.

HEY LOST-

Well barely survived last noight H got home 1:30am . (so much for him being tired) I woke up 1:50am ( was pretending to be sleeping )

Talked about his day at work and I sat there waiting for him to say what they did all night .
About 3am ( he on computer reading news on sports the whole time) I could see he wasn't going to say anything . useually this gets a LB from me right about then . So instead I kissed him goodnight and he said, " be up in a minute"

Came up about 5min later and weht to bed.

OK I was up all night( continplating the BRICK THING) lol.

MORNIG and we all slept thruogh alarms kids missed school and he was running to get to work .

WOW I was pissed this is so not responsiable!!!!!!

I did start to say something . I said, " I really feel that U need to take a look at this situation better and see how unhealthy it is in all our lives being with OW and keeping up this pace is not benifting anyone "

Maybe it is time for U to handle her differently
or take my ultimatums serious and leave at the end of week .

I am late and we will talk tonight. (yeh right)
I asked did U make love to her , H respond are U kidding me that would make situation worse.

OK so now I am really sure they played cards all night .lol lol.

WANT TO BUY THAT BRIDGE YET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!????

I have been dealing with this all over again for 11mons. I think to my self I never stick to one plan for to long maybe .This is it I decided plan for now maybe till after chritmas then if she is still hanging on strong and he is still hanging on to her , then thats it .

If h won't leave willingly then I call her and piss him off right out the door cause I KNOW that he will leave if I contact her .

I wanted so much for it to be his choice but he is not man ehough and I need to move on and face it they are in love .

NO ONES FOG IS THIS THICK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I want to call her get my closer or as close as I can come to it and let the chips fall where they may.

Going over to your thread to here your update.
I can still keep an open mind for others and do think marriages can be saved . I will always be a cheerleader for love . ( for others)Everyones situation is different .

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I want to call her get my closer or as close as I can come to it and let the chips fall where they may. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You are dealing with some very asinine behaviour and I don't blame you for wanting to contact the OW. And there may be some benefits to that, but also some very negative things as well. Depends on the situation.

I think I posted this link earlier:

On contacting the OP

I highly recommend reading it, if you have not already, and post a question there if you have one. Your H is on the fence and definitely needs a nudge to get him off of it. Just be sure which side of the fence you want him to land on in the end.

Take care of yourself.

can't tell ya how many times we have all overslept since d-day. never thought i could get my kids dressed and with hair and teeth somewhat brushed and them out the door in 10 minutes--found out it is possible. not fun tho. all the stress and turmoil is taking it's toll on our ability to sleep.

i think you did very well controlling yourself when he came home last night.

whether or not you contact OW is up to you--just make sure you are prepared to deal with whatever outcome there may be before you decide.

take care! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Well go another wonderful one . I will be posting alittle later .

Yesterday was my sons chritmas play H left waork for a while to come( he always does) also needed to pick up suit for chrts. Party ( company NO spouses)

soI got to see him from 9am till 1045am

will con. in 15 min.

Ok that is the start . OW lives close to where c. party is .

H gets here to pick me up for play and starts off acting all depressed and as if wants to talk.

So I wait and H begins "wow I am I having a bad mornig ow hasn't stoped calling all morning I think I am in for a bad night".
I waited he continued. She wants me to sleep over there tonight ," becuase after all why drive home when your right here and it is close to job so u can sleep here u have no one to go home to,"she said.

well he told her I have no cloths and am tired .
ow continues to flip out thats not a good enough reson .

AND then tells me she is insisting that saturday he brings his kids over and they all go christmas shopping . H says, I don't know how to get out of this one she is really coming down hard on me.

Well without not lbing , I said , very sternly, MY CHILDREN are not porns in your life or any one elses and forget DO NOT GO THERE WITH ME they are not getting involved in your lie.

He said , I am going to have a problem it I don't .I told him it is not up for debait .

He said , he had to tell her he is in a meeting now so he won't answer his phone. But she tried calling any way , he did not answer.

Then after play over came home to pick up suit for party . still saying about what a problem he has for tonight and how she is insisting about being there tonight.
I asked him to please stop with the BS and just say it already . Your going there after u go to party. H says well not unless she calls all night and bothers me , I laughed and said , again be a man I can see thruogh the line of BS .
He listen I am not lieing I am going if she harsses me but if she stops calling I will be home early.

I looked at him and said, this desion will not be yours forever I am in this to and I am not going to stand here and try and save this marriage by myself u need to grow up and come back to reality some time . I am not your punching bag and am not going to alow this situation control mine and my kids life. ( not yelling) Everyone makes chioces and u choose to lie to this women and to me but most of all to yourself. I LOVE U very much and want our marriage to work . I am will to work very hard , but I am not waiting around for u to destroy our children or comprimise ther we being in any way . I do and always will feel we stand a chance if OW was not in your life , but the piont is that she is there and I have no control of that , but U most sertinly do .

He said , u need to just understand that she is in a bad way and I feel some what responsiable for that . I am hoping she will think that I am such a looser and can't make up my mind about anything that she will go away.

I said, did U for one minute think that she sees a confused man and thinks she is helping u see the light?Also your wanting to help her with every thing is hurting her worse cause she is in love with u and U are not(ye right) in love with her? How can she get over u if your always there giving her mixed signals?

He said , she don't except that as an excuse.
Well maybe the truth would be the only thing she excepts or if U just cut her off she might get the hint.

Anyway at 10pm I got the call going to see OW .
I said , well theres nothing I can do about that , see ya when I see u. He said , I LOVE U and MISS U . TRANSLATION I am going to get laid .

I said , love u BYE.
came home 3 am .

said, they fought all night and she hit him and spit at him . He called her low life and she wantrd an I am sorry before he left or he could not go . they fought some more and that what they did all night . TRANSLATION got laid .

I said, well good night .

Today she called 6x's already . I am going nuts about to crack again I just wish he could here how stupid he sounds .