Well I am such a fool even more so now.

After opening this thread Going to try again... I really thought that I might have a chance at dating my W, repairing my M and her coming home. Yes she needed support and therapy but I was seriously having second thoughts.

2.5 years ago my W's best friend went through a hard divorce. My W was a huge support to her as her husband of many years had left for a younger woman. Turns out to be an A of many years. My W called him the Scum of the earth and how could he leave her and their 4 kids one of whom is very close to my own.

Now I find that my W and him (yes you read that right) are an EA/PA. So here I am on OM4, the "scum of the earth"...

Of course she sat in front of me Tuesday whilst I begged her to work on us knowing all this. Yet did she have the honesty to say?

What a fool I am. Neil.

and to cap it all my Death Threat Phone calls to my phone and cell are back again. They stopped when OM2 was around and I told her. But back they are <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Neil,
Your not a fool, you are in love.

I feel really bad for you, but don' know how to help. You want so badly to make this work. I wish it could, but I don't believe it could unless she gets lots of help.

She's not a rational girl, and you keep trying to reason with her. Again, I am sorry for the pain.

SS

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Porsche 911 996C2:
<strong>and to cap it all my Death Threat Phone calls to my phone and cell are back again. They stopped when OM2 was around and I told her. But back they are <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Is she the one that's making them? If the answer is yes, then how on Earth can you trust this woman with your girls wellbeing? Please enlighten me Neil.

No she is not the one making them. I don't know who is. They stopped when it got to OM2 that the Police were involved but it was from a stolen mobile. They stopped until the New Year but have started again. The Police are again looking at it.

This story gets worse.

It turns out that my D (10) had caught my W and OM4 at it on Boxing Day. My W told her to not tell me, that they weren't doing anything. He was naked because she spilled tea on him and she was naked because she had a shower. Of course my D knew her Mum had had no shower because she had been awake all night.

So many things slot into place now because of this. My D has been hell these last two weeks crying, nervous, quiet, not sleeping. I have even had therapy arranged for her because I could not figure out what was going on.

Last night after I found out from the Girl living with my W about OM4 it all came out from my D. In her words she was "petrified to let out her secret because bad things would happen to us".

I have gone from ferocious anger to absolutely sickness with how I feel about this. I shouldn't be hammered like this over and over but I do.

I LB'ed enormously. I told her to look at all the cutting scars the next time these men are on top of her and know that their pleasure was bought with my pain and my kids pain. OM1 referred to her as his **** buddy so these are her **** buddy scars.

I told her to get help before it destroys her, not for my sake cos I have hurt her so much but for the sake of our children. Only then will she be a wonderful woman again. She is her adulterer mother and abusive father rolled into one now, sex on a plate and lies, and verbal and emotional abuse alongside. I tried so hard to support her yet this is just such painful rejection. How did I become the bad guy in such a short time?

She said that I was a nasty piece of work for saying such and no doubt I am, but it was sent before I had time to think, and I have not retaliated so little before, its like she thinks she can do this stuff to us with no consequences. She said she would never forgive me for this and never to text again.

Thats ironic as she hasn't forgiven herself whilst I forgave and forgot everything, even now the sex whilst painful is irrelevant to how I feel, but the damage done to my daughter is not. That was low. One day she will realise that I accepted, loved and cared so much and that its her and her abuse not me that is why she is as she is now.

I took my kids away for the weekend, I have spent the last two days crying, there is just so much to grieve and I am so exhausted.

I have told her to not contact me now. No calls, no texts, no visits. If she needs to tell me when she is seeing the girls she can do so in a letter in an envelope given to the girls. I know I have got to get away from this person. The Wife I loved is gone somewhere I know not. I do not this person who would treat us in such a way.

I am constantly having to reassure my little ones over and over, they are already realising the lies and deceipt that she is doing to them.

I am sorry about this post but I am alone and need to vent. Neil.

Neil, as a fellow Brit I have been following your story. I just wanted you to know that I think you are very courageous and I admire you for coping with your children and all the stuff your W has hit you with. My eldest dtr is nearly 10- I can understand how awful it must be trying to deal with her distress whilst enduring such pain yourself. I am so sorry that all this is happening to you. So sorry.

Deluded

Neil, my heart goes out to your daughters (and to you) for the ordeal that their mother is putting them thru. Oh, how I know what it's like to have lived with a screwed up headcase that saw herself as the inocent victim while blaming everybody else for her own extremely selfish choices. And I also know the turmoil that my daughters experienced every time she brought different men to our home while I was away at work.

I can certainly agree that no more contact between you and her is wise, considering that it has not resulted in her to accept that she needs serious psychological attention. Is there somebody you trust that can serve as intermediary between you and her regarding the girls?

Neil I commend you for having had the love and fortitude to have given her one more chance to rebuild the M, but as you finally have seen (now that she is on OM#4), the woman that you married is no longer residing inside the body of the woman your girls go visit with.

Your WW's constant comments of 'I'll never forgive you...' is almost exactly what my xWW used to say to me every time I brought forth evidence of her latest betrayal. I guess that she felt that because I had not divorced, it meant that she could do whatever she wanted and I would put up with it because I loved her. Well, just like with all living things, love also dies if it's not fed and taken care of, and my love for her began to die every single day I lived with her until it was finally gone. My love for her didn't totally die after I got divorced from her but it did die nonetheless. So I totally understand where you are coming from when I see that you still have love for her.

You know what the sad thing in all this is Neil? Just when I finally put my love for her to rest, she finally crashed and burned, almost died from a suicide attempt and had to be institutionalized for a time, went thru psychiatric treatment and counseling, and finally emerged as a much more healthier woman in control of her demons. But I had no longer the desire to have anything more to do with her, even if she was now light years healthier than the nightmare she was before her meltdown. Had this have happened months earlier, you can't bet that I would have jumped at the chance for marital reconciliation (even though we had been divorced) but alas it was too little too late for me.

I'm sorry for ranting so much about my past, but I just wanted you to know that I do understand where you are coming from.

Neil -- You are one amazing man that is clearly a committed, devoted and loving father. I am so sorry that your WW is so mentally disturbed that she would expose your D to all of this in this way, lie to her and then ask for her silence.

Your love for your WW must be very deep for you to have endured all that you have. I can only re-emphasize what other wise posters such as TMCM have said. Your WW is not looking out for the well-being and happiness of your three daughters and you are going to have to put them first.

I know how painful it is when you see someone you love doing damage to themselves and not being willing to get help. I know you feel somewhere deep down as if you are abadoning that person in their time of need. You have to let go completely with the hope that she will eventually get the help she needs. You are not, unfortunately, going to be the influence that gets her to change. That is a hard thing to face on top of everything else. You've been her mainstay and her support for so long that it is difficult for you NOT to help her. You have to stop.

God bless you and your daughters Neil.

Niel,

I don't know the laws in the UK, but let me express my feelings to you. Get out of the marriage and seek a legal means to keep your children away from her.

What she did to your daughter will haunt your daughter for the rest of her life. You children need to be keep away from this woman. Have you figured out that her actions are becoming more and more bizarre? They are. She is now jumping from man to man.

YOU must protect your children and end this mess now, or they are likely to have problems similar to your W's.

Please think about this. It is too late to be worrying about yourself here, it is time to worry about your children. Neil, your marriage is over and has been. Your W is very very sick.

I am sorry this is soo harsh, but I think it needs to be. You cannot help her, she cannot help herself, and the OM in her life will only make it worse. Those are the facts that prevail. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

God Bless,

JL

Thank you for all your kind words of support. I have been very ill this past weekend, thankfully I was at my Mum's for support.

One D is now saying she does not want to see her Mum so I have to take that onboard. I really wish my W would get her act together and get help before it destroys her but she isn't.

I am staying away from her now and doing what I can for the children. I am seeing what the Solicitor says about this latest matter as I want to do what is right for the kids.

This should have turned out so very different.

Many Thanks Neil.

Girls were in a state last night, had to sit them all down and reassure them that I and their Mum love them very much. 1 x D does not want to stay with her Mum on weekends so I am going to have to see how that pans out. Going to be hard to explain that one to WW in Plan B and getting her to understand.

The Solicitor is coming back to me on these things but has suggested that I do whatever the children want. Doesn't think that it would get to a court fight. I shall see how they progress this week and also hope that my W will give them a little breathing space to get their heads together.

On that note I have also managed to get them into some Child's Therapy next week on the 21st (one day before the first part of Divorce process <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> ). Its an assessment meeting to see where we go next. They have all asked for it and I am hopeful it will help them. I also let the school know they have been troubled.

I really struggled the last weekend so I have gone back to the Docs for more Anti-D's. Therefore Leilana was right all those months ago to not come off them. I felt good about myself and came off Anti-D's, I now know that it was far too early, so let that be a lesson to any others BS's out there <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

I am going to try and focus on myself and the Kids now, keep my Plan B and Divorce going forward. My W no doubt will blame me for many things and say that I wanted it but those of you here know that I do not. I will sadly continue to love my Wife way beyond my divorce because this is not what I want but something that has to happen. In time I am hopeful that she will get the help that she needs because under all this pain and deceipt she is truly a wonderful person.

I may not have said that enough here on MB's but she was a lovely woman, kind hearted, gentle, very funny, attractive and a joy to be with for so many years. She was a thoughtful parent and a doting mother, ok she couldn't buy me a spontaneous Xmas present for **** but that was about her only fault. Thats why letting go is so very hard.

I am off to MC tonight and sometimes I wonder why I bother but invariably something comes up to help me lurch through the next week and the next crisis and a part of me prays that one Monday at 7:40pm she would be there to start talking about R <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

I have received many kind words via email if you would like to email me you can do so at jenz@btinternet.com and I will reply. I haven't put my email in one of my threads before so there it is.

Many thanks for your continued support, Neil.

I think your daughters views should be respected and supported -if they don't want to see their mother this weekend don't make them-they will need security more than ever.

For you,don't forget the anti-D's usually take 2 weeks to start working but diazepam can be good to get you through bad times if you are v agitated but is very sedating. Are you sleeping? What about work? Get signed off if you need to be.Call in ALL your favours from friends and family to help with the girls and give you support.

And keep posting here.

Keep focussed.

Deluded

Thanks Deluded, yes am sleeping reasonably well, but Daughters aren't. I am hoping this latest problem being overcome means that they now will particularly the one affected.

I know about the Anti-D's, and I have some 2mg Diazepam if I needed it, which I did at the weekend but not now. So hopefully the Anti-D will kick in. I have a further Doc review next week because I have something else wrong (don't rain without pouring).

Only one of the girls does not want to see her so I have said if that is what she wishes she will stay with me. They are only going for the day and overnight so it's not long. My W is unable to have them for the full weekends because she has work shifts causing her problems - she's a nurse.

It does of course bring another issue in that I get no time to myself alone but that's something I have to live with now. It's too lonely anyway.

Workwise it's ok. I work for myself or I would be off sick, but when you lose a day pay for every day sick its rare you are sick!

Best Wishes, Neil.

Neil I keep thinking about your poor girls and what would be the best way to help them as a parent. I worry the most when they go quiet and thoughtful.Especially the 9 yr old,she doesn't cry much just withdraws a bit. i am glad they are going to counselling . But I think it is good to maybe have time one on one with them so maybe the D staying with you needs that time with you alone-she is one of the twins I think ,am I right?

That means no time for you -I need that time to myself but not everyone does, I just find I can "catalogue" my thoughts better if I don't have to talk. But you are so right-it can be lonely,and particularly for you as you grieve the loss of your hopes .

Can you get some exercise? I find that helps too.

I am staggered that your WW is still able to work through all this!!!

I think it is also VERY important to let the school know something of what is happening so they can look out for your girls.

There is something I came across once from a counsellor friend-to make a list of little things that make you feel better and actively seek them out to lift your spirits....listen to a favourite piece of music, have a tall skimmed latte(in my case!) go for a run etc. It helps me. Maybe work does it for you.?

Keep posting,keep going,take charge, take care.

Deluded

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Deluded of Devon:
<strong>Neil I keep thinking about your poor girls and what would be the best way to help them as a parent. I worry the most when they go quiet and thoughtful.Especially the 9 yr old,she doesn't cry much just withdraws a bit.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">My 10 year old has withdrawn. She is a different child, withdrawn and inward.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>i am glad they are going to counselling . But I think it is good to maybe have time one on one with them so maybe the D staying with you needs that time with you alone-she is one of the twins I think ,am I right?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes. She is damaged and we need to work on her. I have an approved Therapist seeing them next week.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>Can you get some exercise? I find that helps too.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I have a punch bag in the garage and a bike. The latter gets little use.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>I am staggered that your WW is still able to work through all this!!!</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know but she is doing it. The irony in that regard is that she is doing something she enjoys and something I always wanted her to do. But I never really supported her properly because she gave up things so easily and we didn't need it. So I'd say quit when with hindsight it shoulda been keep at it.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>I think it is also VERY important to let the school know something of what is happening so they can look out for your girls.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes I have kept them informed, both the Headmaster and the teachers. They helped me get the Therapy contacts.

Best Wishes Neil.
p.s. off to MC <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

MC advised me to just get on with my stuff now.

Neil,
I believe MC is right.

I also believe you have the ability and drive to do what you need to do. No contact would be very helpful for you. I don't know, but if you have the money, you could even pay someone to be the go-between for you with the children. Let them make the arangements, pick up and drop off, and everything. Give them your scedule, and let them work with it. There has got to be a way to protect yourself from the emotional beating you have been taking.

Sorry for the pain, I care.

SS

Neil, I think you have no option for your own health and your girls' wellbeing but to do so,as MC and SS agree.

No contact.

What does your solicitor say about W's continued contact with the girls?

Get out into the garage and give that punchbag the beating its been asking for!

Don't drink too much alcohol(if you do)

Get out and do something-do the girls have bikes also? Weather permitting you could all go .

Just a thought but is there any female adult who is close enough to the girls to spend some time with them-not necessarily to draw them out but just a a stable female influence that they can relate to? You could maybe run the idea past the accredited counsellor first. I could be off base here.

Take care

Deluded

Thanks all, again this morning my Wife told me she wants the DV she is not coming home she says.

I am going to give it to her, whilst I love her thats not enough for her now, heaven only knows what she wants or needs. It has been a miserable 2003 so far and is only going to get worse before it gets better I suppose.

I am doing what I can for myself right now (which isn't a lot). I am taking back the family dog because she cannot have pets in her new place. That will be another thing for me to handle, he gets left alone a lot.

Yes I do quite a lot with the Girls now. We are doing more stuff next weekend and my W only has them three days in the week now because of her work. She still views herself as the "Primary Carer" though. It doesn't matter to me really these things.

Its hard to let go of someone you've loved for so long and still do but want no part of you. Just have to get up and move on. If she forces us to sell the home I will probably move nearer my family with the girls so that we can be with them alot, that would take care of my worries for them being looked after but gives me other problems with work and their schooling. I am not rushing into that though yet I have no need to.

I will probably leave MB's soon, so that she cannot read what I am doing. I need to distance myself completely from her so that my feelings hopefully in time will die off.

Best Wishes Neil.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I will probably leave MB's soon, so that she cannot read what I am doing. I need to distance myself completely from her so that my feelings hopefully in time will die off.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You don't have to leave for fear she'll read what you are doing, just change your username and she'll have a hard time just finding you.