Thank you Holly for listening.. You are getting me through this day.. I too am stuck -- I lost my career job of 17 years to hostile takeover, and atty(I saw without him knowing) informed me I made such good money, that I will get very little alimony if any... So two kids, no job now, and a WS.. Life sucks sometimes! I couldn't leave my two little ones. I would have to take them with me. Luckily in our county, I only have to let him see them every other weekend, and 2 hours every other Wed. evening. That's it.. With his affairs, frequent traveling for work, etc... I will not lose my boys.. Thank God for them.. They are what get me out of bed in the morning..
I ordered that book last week(how to survive an affair).. Waiting for it to come.. I'm just trying to keep my head on straight and not do something stupid until the book comes and I have some step by step guidance, and dear Cerri told me she'd walk me through the steps. I'll check out the radio show... Thanks again-- you have no idea how much you helped me make it through this emotional roller coaster day.

Glad I could help,,,,Cerri's great,,,,listen to her advice and you wont go wrong <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Have a great day <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Holly

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Amethyst03:
<strong>cerri,

i'm jumping in on this thread but i figured you'd be sure to be checking up on this one. my h and i are moving at the end of the month and i'm a bit nervous about finding a mc that will suit us as well as the one we're seeing right now. he was the one to get us reading hnhn which lead me to this site. i tried opening the link you gave for the "questions to ask an mc" but i can get it to work. if possible, would you be able to copy and paste it into an email and send it to my hotmail account? it's peter_amy@hotmail.com. it's likely just a problem with our computer and not with the link.

thanks so much in advance.

amy</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hi Amy... I have to tell you that one of my dearest friends uses the name Amethyst!

I'll try to remenber to do that on Monday, but if I forget, just send me an email at help@saveyourmarriagecentral.com and remind me.

You can also view that article at my site www.saveyourmarriagecentral.com on the newlsletters and articles page... toward the bottom.

C

He's home from the trip-- he's extremly moody. Looking at me through brown colored glasses. I don't know- but I feel like he's trying to give himself an excuse of : "See-she's soooo bad! This is why I need to leave her, or this is why affairs are o.k.-- who could live with that!"...

I'm trying to figure out if he's going through withdrawls of the other women, or just really wants to leave, or what.. I broke down and bawled today when he was just being so difficult. If I ask him something it's "Whatever".. And criticising everything I do. I bought an "off brand" of vitamins.. Have many times before. He goes- "Oh, YOU decided if was ok for me to take a different vitamin--so nice of you to make these decisions without even asking".. WHAT???? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> Like's he's ever cared -- he never shops-- I don't know this person I'm living with.. If I comment on something -just talking- it's "whatever" or just totally ignoring that I even spoke.. He has put up a 500 foot wall. This had come down lots before he saw the OW 2 weeks ago.. Now it's like he's all freaking out again. I HATE THIS!!!!!!!!!!!

Now he's out "running" He does run, but I'll never know if he's really running this time, or getting a different form of exercise. I really REALLY HATE THIS!!

I just got the book SAA hours before he came home-- I just read part of it- was all ready to "not cause any confrontations" and do plan A.. Then when he just kicked me everytime I turned around.. I just broke down and bawled today.. trying to pick myself up so I can continue plan A.. I can't go to plan B until I have a job so I can support the 2 boys.. I can't leave them.. No way..

Thanks for listening to me vent. Just a very hard day....... <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

{{{{{{{2boysmom}}}}}}}

Oh, honey. I am so sorry. With the job situation you are stuck between a rock and a hard place. Something you might want to check into would be the idea of legal separation which would force him to pay child support while you are looking for a job.

Ugh.... how terrible that you need to even think about uprooting you and the kids because of this thoughtless and cruel thing that he is doing!

Ok, so you got the book. Here's what I think. Be good to you. Don't confront anything for few days.... lay low.... stay in the background. Not as in being afraid to rock the boat, but as in gathering info, strength and building a strategy.

You need to be strong, be smart, and to shut off the emotional screaming that happens in your heart and in your head. That's not going to be easy, and frankly... women suck at doing it. I'd take a male client over a female any day because women are so in touch with their emotions. They aren't nearly as able to shut them off and to do the really hard icky things needed when a husband is having an affair.

Women have this wonderful ability to feel, to care, to be in touch with the emotional energy all around us. Women rock. But when it comes to what needs to be done to save a marriage, those abilities work against us. Know that.... believe that... and steel yourself for needing to act contrary to what your instincts will tell you to do.

Ok, so tonight, tomorrow, take care of you.(Well, everday... but think of this as preparing for battle) Take a hot bath, eat well.... good healthy foods. Get enough sleep. Do not engage in an argument or a discussion about the marriage. Walk away. Protect you.

For tonight imagine that you are safe and surrounded and that you do not have to address anything. Let the icky crap he's tossing at you roll away. Remove yourself from the line of fire. Take the kids to dinner or to a movie if you need to get out of the house. Rent a movie for you for later if you need an excuse not to engage.

Tomorrow let's talk about the affair and the day to day stuff. Let's make a focused Plan A strategy, and let's look at what you need to do do be ready for Plan B.

And by the way. It's ok to cry. It's ok to let hinm know that he is hurting you. The need for hoensty does not go away in Plan A... it becomes even greater. It's a delicate balance.... and you can do it.

As far as I know, I'm in tomorrow. (With kids it's hard to tell some days!) You can email me, and I will check here too.

Hugs and blessings to you....

C

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by HeartHealing:
<strong>Glad I could help,,,,Cerri's great,,,,listen to her advice and you wont go wrong <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Have a great day <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Holly</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hi Heart Healing. What nice things to say about me. Many thanks! Now.... I see you are a brand new member... Feb 2003... so how, pray tell, do you know about my advice??????

C

Thank you Cerri.. You are saving me here. I can't believe how I'm freaking out-- I know I'm not pregnant but geesh- that's the only thing I can compare to these flying emotions!!

When he came home from "running" he was a little more humane, but I had to push away the notice that he was not sweaty. Hard to just ignore those things. Normally he's drenched.. ugh...

I will write more tomorrow after a good night sleep so we can work on plan A.. Email isn't safe, as I'm sure he'd check my emails.. This is safer-- he doesn't need to know what my plans are..

I know I have to make the tough decisions.. I'm just so torn between jumping to Plan B- and having no job, and the boys adore him.. Will they hate me for life for pulling them away from their dad! If we separate or get divorced, the 4 year old will crumble. He is a very emotional boy now who picks up on everything-- he is going to freak.. Well--that another day. Right now, I just need to concentrate on today...

I'll write tomorrow. Thank you my angel..

You can call me if you like and we can talk about Plan A vs. Plan B and how to pull this all together.

My number is on my site... I'm in the central time zone and here today until 2pm. Post when a good time is for you, and we'll make it work.

C

Good morning Cerri.. O.k., just have to make sure-- how do you pronounce your name? Is it like Carrie? or??? I don't want to be saying it wrong to myself <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Ok, he was much MUCH nicer last night. I don't understand these flipping moodswings! He even asked for my help on a CD they created for work.. What was my opinion?? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Trying to read the book when he's not around, and kids not hanging on me.. What I have so far is plan A is to not be confrontational. Don't give him fuel to feed his fire... Since I have no concrete evidence of OW, don't say anything right now.. Especially while he's so dang moody and freaking out.. Am I getting this correct? Or am I missing something? Since we've only been talking less than 24 hours, my gut feeling is to continue to lay low a few days... Let him settle back into being home after being gone 7 days..

THANK YOU!!!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> (I'll probably take you up on phone call someday when I'm not bombarded with little ones.. )

O.k., just have to make sure-- how do you pronounce your name? Is it like Carrie? or??? I don't want to be saying it wrong to myself

Ahhhhh.... that is a mystery!! If I told you, then everyone would know. But I'll give you a hint.... it's from the name of a Celtic Goddess <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Mother goddess of transformation and rebirth... how fitting for what I do wouldn't you say?

Ok, he was much MUCH nicer last night. I don't understand these flipping moodswings! He even asked for my help on a CD they created for work.. What was my opinion??

Think "addict" He's addicted to the OW and he is behaving like an addict. And you have to think of it as an addiction. The steps you need to take are much like those whose spouses are addicted to drugs, alcohol, gambling... whatever.

Trying to read the book when he's not around, and kids not hanging on me.. What I have so far is plan A is to not be confrontational. Don't give him fuel to feed his fire...

I do a much more focuses Plan A, simply because it's for a short time. The idea is that you want to entice him to leave her by showing how good it can be with you.... And if/when you go to Plan B, you want the last memory of you to be good.

Since I have no concrete evidence of OW, don't say anything right now.. Especially while he's so dang moody and freaking out.. Am I getting this correct? Or am I missing something?

Yeah, for the most part. Snoop like your life depends on it. AND you can talk about how you FEEL when you don't know where he is. So the way to do that is to say, "I'm unhappy when I don't know where you are or how long you'll be gone. (or what you're doing) I'm wondering if there is a way we can work this out so I have that information." No demands, no judgments... it's about how you feel and a request to have those feelings taken into account.

Since we've only been talking less than 24 hours, my gut feeling is to continue to lay low a few days... Let him settle back into being home after being gone 7 days..

Yeah.... see where it goes. But SNOOP!

(I'll probably take you up on phone call someday when I'm not bombarded with little ones.. )

Just send me an email.. or call and leave a msg about what times would work for you. Hopefully I'll have my phone and intenet issues worked out soon.

C

Well, just a check in for the day.. Last night went very well for how things are these days. He was talking about his work, we all had a nice dinner together, played games with the kids. No snide comments from him. Besides the point he never touches me or is at all "lovingly" towards me, no one would ever know nothing wrong.. Today- I was good to me. Went and painted on tiles at a surefire place we have. Started to make a welcome entry sign for our house out of tiles.. Just paint and forget.. Ahhhhh.. I really needed some time for me! I'm still on plan A.. Hard to snoop cerri.. Very hard. The first OW he had was a pro.. I couldn't begin to reckon how many affairs she has had with married men, and she teaches newbies like my spouse how to cheat and lie.. He doesn't use the computer any more, he doesn't use our phone, if phone calls are made on his work cell- he uses a prepaid card(even if the call wouldn't cost anything) so the number he call can't be traced. He erases his call list every time he makes or receives a call on his cell. Now he is supporting the family. Letting his work know I need the phone bill from corporation and exposing he's using a work phone for private use- well - I can't afford to have his butt canned at this moment in time- and in this economy. I don't think that would help our situation or my boys in anyway! So- very hard to snoop.. I do try.. I even have a black light which would show a monica lewinsky dress if necessary!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> But emotions don't stain the pants.. and I think right now- it's just an emotional affair. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> So, I'm laying a little low-- keeping my ears and eyes open, and being a good person #1 for the kids, #2, for me, #3 for our marriage.

hey there...

I am away from my office all day today.... meetings....

Keep reading and do your best to be pleasant. You're doin' good. We'll talk more later today or more likely tomorrow.

Black light, oh that's good!!!!!! And I thought I was the suspicious type! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

C

Well, just your daily update. We had another ok night last night. Again, ate dinner together.. no smart remarks, told me all about work- etc.. Still-he wears his"clothes of armor" to bed, and there is no physical communication at all. If I even try and touch his hand- he pulls back like I'm the plague. But - at least we are communicating on the surface. Much better than those first 2 resentful days he was back home from trip. I know he has lots and lots of resentment against me.. Where can I find out more about resentment, or how to deal with it? Have fun at your meetings <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

I know he has lots and lots of resentment against me.. Where can I find out more about resentment, or how to deal with it?

Resentment, in a generals sense comes from old hurts that are not addressed and are in your face in one way or another. So.... say for instance after the A is over and you are working hard at recovery, YOU will feel resentment when something triggers the memory of the A or of this time.

Another example is something that one spouse has indicated is a problem and that the other either refuses to address or promises to do something about and then never gets around to it.

Resentment is also a by-product of this idea of unconditional love in romantic relationships. Much as we would like to believe that we can love someone no matter what.... or that we could be loved that way.... in reality, romantic love is conditional. So when we care for someone else in a way that is sacrificial.... that is, meeting needs without having them met in return or doing things for the other person that we find unpleasant.... eventually resentment will surface.

Those are the garden variety causes of resentment. But when an unfaithful partner is feeling resentful, there could be other reasons. The fact that you exist and stand between him and the source of his addiction? The fact that you are making it problematic to carry on the affair? Your honesty about how you feel when he hurts you, therefore making him face (however briefly) the thoughtlessness of his behavior? There are many more I could list, they're part of the addicitive process.

What to do about it? Weed out your own love busters, do your best to meet needs.... continue to be honest (that's not negotiable) and know that he is held by an addiction.

Have fun at your meetings

Actually, it was wonderful. I belong to a womens networking organization (www.eWomenNetwork.com) and we have event monthly. This is the first I've taken the timne to attend. It was fabulous!!!! Women rock!!!! The local director of this group is the one who got me the interview with the Pioneer Press that later went national.... MadlyTrulyDeeply has a thread here that has the text of the article.

How ya doin' on the book?

C

I'm basically through plan A on the book. Need to re-read a few parts. Resentment. I know where lots of his resentment lies.. About 5 years ago, I was not mentally in the marriage. I didn't have any affairs, but I put my husband on the back burner. 3 miscarriages, 2 babies close together, 18 months of puking every day during the pregnancies, and an extremly stressful job..and gardening, flowers are my outlet- we were in a house where I was unable to do the things I enjoyed. My husband asked me to quit my job-- I couldn't let go.. Everything was spinning so out of control around me, I felt I couldn't let go of the only structured thing in my life. I totally blocked him out. He brought up counseling once. I couldn't even fathom it at the time. Between colicky kid, work, depression? etc.. It was like "Sure- just add something on top of everything else".. I blew him off... I totally withdrew.. Long story short- I then lost my job as you know last year--and it was like everything stopped spinning. Kids getting a little older(not quite so needy as an infant), no stressful job, new house that I love- the weight that lifted off my shoulders, and the fog that lifted was unreal. I had no clue. I was ecstatic!!! I was going to rely on my husband to be the "white in shinning armor". I was going to be my kids mom.. I was sooooo happy!! Then the phone call came just a couple weeks after my new "revelation" saying my husband was a slut and if he touched this guys wife again, he would kill him.... My husband I'm guessing from the guilt, etc.. just wanted to run.. He thought I would just kick him out of the house.. I think it would of been easier for him if I "punished" him. He thought I would just do the divorce, he'd just have to sign, and he would get his "just deserve".. I didn't.. I said I wasn't going to file, I wasn't going to kick him out.. He said he wants a divorce as I pushed him and pushed him to the edge of that cliff, he's fallen over the cliff, and he can't just pull himself back up now.. (I don't believe this-- there is always a rope to grab on to). But he resents that I didn't "punish" him. He resents I'm still here saying I love you. He resents the 5 years I ran in a sense away from everything. He also resents as he says "When I wanted to get our marriage together 5 years ago-you wouldn't do anything, but now that YOU(me) want to do something, I'm suppose to just jump-jump-jump for you. As you can see, he has a lot of anger and resentment. I don't know how to handle this. He refuses to go to counciling. I am in some counciling, but may need to change. The counselor does believe in "divorce busters" and SAA.. so that is good. I do like the counselor. Anyway, there's my life in a nutshell for the past 5 years. Last night was another good night. He's been very friendly. but still cold as ice.

Just checking in. Well, the weekend just went with no upsets.. Just pretty nothing. Still he's cold as ice, but cordial. Feel like I'm living with a roomate, not a husband. I'm still sure he's having an emotional affair with someone nearby..He has to "lift weights" at the town next door 2 days in a row--odd, but I can't dispute it so I don't have any proof. I actually had a pretty good weekend as far as keeping my moods in check, and keeping the task on hand. Found a couple more jobs to apply for, which definitely will help..

Posting to myself <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> But that is o.k.!! Just putting down emotions here! Well, same thing- different day as far as WS goes.. Sure he's having an EA now.. Not a guess anymore.. But, I feel good.. No, not happy about the EA, but I feel strong, and confident within Plan A.. I had a very good session with counselor today.. I gave my anger to God last week.. Boy do my kids thank me! I was using a way louder voice with them then I normally would. My counselor and I went all through today when to call it quits. This has been my struggle. I now know I'm not ready to throw in the towel. I'm not ready to quit. I know I can't have him live in this fog forever, but... I can for now, and guess what.. Me and the kids, we will be o.k. Yes, I would love to have my marriage back, my man back.. but for now-- we will be o.k. and I can live with my decision to continue in plan A for now. I feel like I should be doing more on Plan A somehow to get him off this picket fence.. need to do some more reading! Well, I'll see myself next time!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by 2boysmom:
<strong>Posting to myself <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> But that is o.k.!! Just putting down emotions here! Well, same thing- different day as far as WS goes.. Sure he's having an EA now.. Not a guess anymore.. But, I feel good.. No, not happy about the EA, but I feel strong, and confident within Plan A.. I had a very good session with counselor today.. I gave my anger to God last week.. Boy do my kids thank me! I was using a way louder voice with them then I normally would. My counselor and I went all through today when to call it quits. This has been my struggle. I now know I'm not ready to throw in the towel. I'm not ready to quit. I know I can't have him live in this fog forever, but... I can for now, and guess what.. Me and the kids, we will be o.k. Yes, I would love to have my marriage back, my man back.. but for now-- we will be o.k. and I can live with my decision to continue in plan A for now. I feel like I should be doing more on Plan A somehow to get him off this picket fence.. need to do some more reading! Well, I'll see myself next time!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Honey, I'm on vacation this week, but I have to respond to this. If all your counselor is doing for you in this situation is helping you decide "when to call it quits" then you have the wrong counselor if you want to save your marriage.

Have you been to my site? www.saveyourmarriagecentral.com There's an article on the articles and newsletters page... near the bottom..... about questions to ask a MC or Coach. Check it out.

Really, that's all I have time for right now, but I am really concerned about that comment.

Hugs,

C

I need to rephrase the counselor thing. He DOES NOT want me to call it quits. He feels as long as we are under the same roof, we have better chance of working things out. He totally believes in the book divorce busters, and he's reading Harley's books now <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

It was ME who wanted to call it quits. Who felt like I was just letting my WS have and eat the cake! My counselor just walked me through all the steps so I could see what he was seeing.. There IS NO REASON TO CALL IT QUITS NOW! He just wanted me to come to the conclusion myself.. not spoon feed me an answer!

Sorry if I was confusing there!! Have an awesome vacation <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Forgot to say in the previous post- A big thank you for thinking about me even on your vacation!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />