TMCM,

This weekend W has to work Fri, Sat, Sun, so I will be keeping the kids alone all weekend. (This is no small chore) Do plan to see the fireworks and then go to an olde time village with the in-laws. (This will drive her nuts, because she hates the fact that her parents don't support what she did)

Hopefully all will be well and I am definitely looking forward to getting out and doing something recreational. (really wish it was with her though)

Oh well, back to my reading (LB),

r0uter

TMCM, I also have plans this weekend, but they involve her family, being a party for the fourth.

She did have her session with the therapist and came home in a nasty mood.

We started talking and again, everthing that is wrong in the marriage is my fault, according to her theory the EA has nothing to do with the whole thing, and the problems we are having now.

I did go into the explanation that I contributed to her not having her needs met, but the affair was her sole responsibility and that I was not accountable in the least for her seeking refuge elsewhere, she was going to have to take that one.
I explained how the affair left me feeling humiliated, embarassed and betrayed. Somehow she did not like that.

A couple of weeks ago I informed one of wife's fellow co-workers of the OP where she works. This person is one that is in a management position. I did this to get the word out where she works as to what is going on.

The W was supposed to go to a seminar out of state, and yes the OP also was scheduled to go along with another employee. She stated that at this point they, her and the OP are just friends.

Last night she told me that her boss told her she would not be going to the seminar, that the OP and other employee would be. She was quite upset about this.

I asked her if she thought that her boss might know of her involvement with the the OP and that her A might have influenced the decision for her not to attend the seminar as her employer was not going to partake or aid in her relationship with the OP. She became very angry ( I did ask in a very calm manner, respectful manner.) She stated that she did not think anyone there knew of her and the OP, and if they did she did not care as people are going to talk anyway, she is in such a thick fog, that she doesnt think any one around her at work realizes that the OP cannot leave her desk, that they go to lunch together and such and not figure out something is going on,(she states that they no longer do lunch and any conversation they have is of the type of general office conversation).

Seems like one day things do have a chance, on others the walls are crashing down.

It's getting to the point I'm begining to loose my feelings for her. She treats our son(10) almost as if he is nonexistant, it bothers me to no end that she could not only betray me but also betray the love of our son. It seems selfish and self centered beyond belief.

Just want to wish everyone a happy 4th. The best to all of you.
Rookie

Well, so far the weekend has not been good at all.

Wife went to a new therapist last Weds. prior to that she had seen one other about two weeks ago. When she did not see a therapist, things actually started to get better, she and I did get intimate several time.

Since seeing the NEW therapist last Weds., things have gone south. She again is very distant and no signs of affection what-so--ever. I asked her about this and she stated that when she spoke to the new therapist, she had to relive everything all over again and it caused her to shut down.

I have been pretty patient, but I can only take so much. She this morning was showing the son and dogs affection, I didnt even get a good morning, I brought this to her attention and she blew a gasket, I simply said I wanted some level of concern, maybe even the amount that she shows the dogs. I know this was not a good plan A route but I have no needs that are being met at all and it is really driving me nuts.

On the 4th we went to a party on the lake, I figured I'd give her some space with her family, went on the lake in the canoe for bout a hour, came back she's gone, went to my car to get a pack of smokes, my cell phone is gone, I call my cell phone number after walking around looking for her for bout a half hour. She comes back saying she was exactly were I was looking but did not see her. Says she took my cell to call, her mother, a other son or my daughter (both from a previous marriage), my wife knows how to block the phone numbers called and I think she called one other number to show the time of the last call to cover her call to the OP. The cell is under mydaughter's name and I need her to get the detailed billing, so till then I cant prove she called the OP.

I know I'm rambling, but I cant take too much more of this. If there was even a remote attempt on her part to make this work I'd be overjoyed.

Today she invited a friend and the friend's boyfriend over for dinner, I asked if she wanted me to stick around or if she wanted to have her friend over without me, again she blows a gasket.

Seems like this is a no win sitaution, I cant get her to go to a MC, she says she wants to see a therapist on her own to see if she even wants to stay in this M and to sort her own problems out before working on ours. I continually get the I dont think we can work this out statement and she refused to acknowledge that the OP has any affect on our M and the current situation at all, she says that the problem is between us and the problem would have existed had he not even been in the picture. Funny, but there really did'nt seem to be any problems till that scum bag entered the picture.

Rookie

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">"Seems like this is a no win sitaution, I cant get her to go to a MC, she says she wants to see a therapist on her own to see if she even wants to stay in this M and to sort her own problems out before working on ours. I continually get the I dont think we can work this out statement and she refused to acknowledge that the OP has any affect on our M and the current situation at all, she says that the problem is between us and the problem would have existed had he not even been in the picture. Funny, but there really did'nt seem to be any problems till that scum bag entered the picture."</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Rookie, it may be time for you to start getting ready to implement Plan B. There can be no marital recovery until she uniequivocally decides to stop all contact with the OM, and from the looks of things I say that she has not done this, AND she she expresses a desire to commit to a marital recovery plan that includes counseling with a pro-marriage professional and to following the principles embodied in The Four Rules For A Succesful Marriage. Plan B will help you to take back some control over your emotional wellbeing and preserve the remaining love you have for her which will be an extremely necessary component IF and when she expresses a desire to follow the above. Don't kid yourself, marital recovery (initially) is a lot harder period to endure than the period when the A is in full swing, and many marriages do not make it. Without Plan B, marital recovery has as much chance as a snowball's chance in hell.

OK, just had a major blowout with the wife, told her that I no longer was going to tolerate the OP calling or her calling him, one of us was going to have to leave the house till that happens. This conversation took place within hearing distance of our son.

She stated that she was going to leave, but prior to that she was going to take the one dog(the one I did not want) to our daughters farm to live. While she was on the phone with the daughter she told her that she was getting rid of the dog as we probably were going to divorce, I stepped in at that point and informed the daughter that if the divorce was to happen, it was because of the OP and the affair she was having, this enraged the W saying that I was tainting her in the daughters view.

I also told her that I was going to contact her work and advise them of the A, again more shouting by her. I remained calm throughout this and told her that if the FRIENDSHIP was just that it should be not problem and others will see it for what it is. Only problem for her is that the OP's wife used to also work for the same place and informed her friends that are still working there that she and her H are getting a D because of his affair with my W.

What I'm getting now is that if there ever was a chance to repair the marriage, I just blew it by blackmailing and threatening her as she will not be able to work there any longer with everyone pointing fingers at her.

Seems to me that at this point I'm like a dog chasing it's tail. I keep getting told about how she feels but my feelings are never taken into account.

She stated that I come across as a angry vidictive person, I explained that she is mistaking hurt, humiliation and pain for anger.

Rookie

Well the damage is done, no sense in dwelling on it. It might help you if you have a few days away from her to help you calm down and decide what you really want to do.

TMCM, there is no debate on my part as to what I want to do, that is to start rebuilding our marriage.

I cant do that as long as the OP is in place, she did state this morning that he is no longer in the picture, (yeah right) it cant be a one sided effort though.

I've avoided all conversation the last couple weeks bout the A, except to ask her if she has spoken with him.

I have recieved several phone calls at home where the caller ID is blocked and as soon as I answer the phone the caller hangs up, her response is that it's probably telemarketers (last one was 4th July morning), told her they do not block their calls, it simply says caller unknown, these specifically stated blocked.

On the 4th when I caught her with my phone she tells me, "Why dont you have a beer", this hurt because I have not been drinking at all, I dont want alcohol to be a factor and I know that I had a problem in the past. I told her that was cold and that she should never have said that, but, I did not drink and will not drink, I'm doing that one for myself.

Like I said before, think about getting ready to go to Plan B because your WW has still not ended all contact with the OM and your love for her is in danger of ending.

Rookie,

Sorry to hear that things are not going weel for you. I really was hoping that at least one of us would have had good news over the weekend.

Again our stories sound very familiar with one big exception this time; My W told me that she wanted me to leave because she needed time to decide what she wanted. I tried to find out how long she wants me gone and Itried like heck all weekend to get more information from her, but nothing.

I feel like a shattered man. I am now out of the house for at least 3 weeks unless she calls me and tells me I can come home.

I honestly believe that she made it look like she was trying a little bit ao that when she brings me the papers she can say, "I tried". Problem is, she didn't try. She kept saying that her being there was her "try". But, as you said about your W, there was no emotion what-so-ever, and none of my EN were being met at all. We went to MC at her request, she only went to 2 sessions!! And when we did go she would say "yes, I know", and all that at the session, and then not follow any of the advice when we left there.

I am a wreck! She still is throwing mixed signals too. She told me to call her, and when I questioned this with a look, she said, "Well I'll call you later to see how you are."

I was very good all weekend and did not LB even once! But, that was all she did! Granted she hasn't bought into the MB theories yet, and may never. But, I have been talking to her about how we need to take baby steps, and start by being friends again, and that the other feelings will follow if we work at it. She says that she cannot do "things" to work on the marriage if she doesn't have any feelings. I told her that if she really wanted to try to save the M she would have to do things and that the feelings would follow. She doesn't buy it.

I think it is all over but the paperwork. God, how I hope I am wrong on this one!!
I still love her unbelievably. I don't think I can love anyone else. I have no idea where to go next.

And to top it all off, I think that the original OM is out of the picture, but another has taken his place. A very wealthy Dr. that she works with. Actually she works for him.... been thinking about informing the Hospital of their relationship because I feel it is unethical. But, I don't want to stir up the sh*t if there really isn't anything there, and she says there is not. But, I know that she is a habitual liar. She has been since I've known her. I used to be able to tell what was truth and what was fiction, but she has gotten better at it lately. I caught her in a lie this weekend, and it's trivial, but it just reminds me that she still does that.

I am rambling, sorry. More later when my head clears.

r0uter

rOuter. sounds like your married to the same woman I am.

She now wants to put the house up for sale and get her own apartment, at this point I say fine, I need the break.

Found out by the OP's wife both of them are still in contact with each other and nothing has stopped.

I explained to my 10 yoa son what is going on and he is pretty upset as his mom has been telling him the reasons for all the problems are me. That fries me to no end......I'm upset, I still love her to some degree,, but it's have a good life time.

Rookie

Oh Man!

I am so sorry to hear that. It does sounds like they are at least possessed by the same demon!

I don't blame you for feeling that way. I am wavering back and forth between throwing in the towel, and crawling back begging. I keep wondering how my children will react too, since they still don't know.

How many lies do they think they can get away with? I just fond out from my MIL whom I am very close to, that everyone in town already knows all about this, and I haven't said anything to anyone, and she says she hasn't. But everyone knows! Now I feel like a real [censored], because I have been going around like everything is okey dokey!

Apparently everyone at the hospital where she works has been saying that she is going through a D!!! But, I didn't know that!

Again, I am very sorry for what you are going through. Too bad there isn't a magic potion to make everything better, huh?

Is there a Pathological Lairs Anonymous?

r0uter

<small>[ July 07, 2003, 03:01 PM: Message edited by: r0uter ]</small>

rOuter, here is where things are, I talked to the OP's wife today, seems the W and the OP are still a item. She told me of places that my wife was supposed to be that she was' and where her H was, and that they were talking on the cell.

When the W came home from work today I told her that she has to leave, that I was not going to live this way anymore, she is going to her mother's home on Sat. to live with my son.

The son asked me today what is going on,,, he is 10 and I explained it all, now she is saying that I am sabotaging her relationship with him.

Seems it all fits into the LB zone, but like I told her I cannot live being the man in the middle.I also explained that IF she ever decided to move home again, she would be welcomed, but it would have to be that she has no contact with him what-so-ever.

We talked tonight, later and it was pretty civil, she is wanting me to keep the house, go figure.

Rookie

Rookie,

I think baybe in this case you did the right thing. You need to be happy too, and her not being honest is obviously not going to make you happy. I hate all the sneaking around. It is good that she has someone that she can stay with. Is it close by?
I'm glad that you were able to talk to your son first. It's no surprise that she thinks you are trying to sabotage her relationship with him. When (And if) the fog clears, she will realize that it was her that sabotaged her relationship with him. Make sure that you talk to him often, because you don't want her filling his head with a lot of junk about you. I have seen that happen and it ain't pretty!
So yesterday she wanted to sell the house and get an apartment, but now it's keep it? Hmmm.... fog's as thick as pea soup! Does your soup have bacon or fat-back?

Didn't hear from my WW at all yesterday. I suppose she is living large with her new freedom. I can't wait for reality to set in. I gotta be careful though because I have been doing all of the bills and check book balancing. Gotta somehow keep up with that or it could spell financial disaster.

Good luck and hang tough!

r0uter

Spoke with her on the phone this morning, very civil.

I have two other children from my 1st marriage, the W did bring them up, I've informed both of them as to what is going on.

My daughter(28) is very upset with the W and e-mailed her so. They were pretty close prior to this and now the W is upset that the D is upset.
My other son,(26)is pretty much staying out of it.

The W now states that since everyone knows there is no way she can stay in this relationship as all would think ill of her. Actually the extended family is not even aware of the problems we are going through except her parents.

Her parents think I should not have told my children, I expected them to support the W. They state that my youngest son is too young to be told what he was.

There have been numerous discussions where the 10 yoa son has heard the OP's name mentioned and the fact that the W has been involved with him.

The W though always gave her version as to why the marriage was breaking up and always told him that there was no one else involved. When the son did ask her this time(being last night) she had to confess that there was someone else involved, now she is claiming that I made her look like a liar to her son. Well???????

You did the right in informing your other children and the more family members know the truth of her A, the more she is going to suffer the consequences for her choices, more so if she lied to them.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The W now states that since everyone knows there is no way she can stay in this relationship as all would think ill of her.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That's a cop out because people will think what they will about her whether she had an A or not, so she's going to have to come up with a better excuse than that.

Stick to the real Plan B(NO CONTACT).

TMCM, just a quick question, do you think it was appropriate to tell the 10 yoa son?, that is the only one Iam having a problem with.

The two older ones are mature enough to handle and digest the situation.

When she found out that the kids knew, this is the first time I've seen her the way she was, usually very confident in her moves, this time she was crying and seemed sincere about being hurt by the kids being upset.

TMCM said it almost exactly like I was thinking it!!

What a cop out! People may actually think better of her if they see that she is trying valiantly to save her marriage. And (like TMCM said) People will form their own opinions no matter what, just based on what they see.

You know what they say about opinions...

I also agree wholeheartedly that your children, no matter what age, deserve to know the truth. Why perpetuate the lies? My son does not know right now, but he will this weekend when I take him to the races. I plan on telling him the truth and I will not try to make his mother look bad. I am not sure what his reaction will be. He has always been more attached to his mother than me, a result of ten years in the NAVY. But, I am making much headway in repairing my relationship with him! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Hang tough rookie,

r0uter

rOuter, how old is your son?

I started my conversation with the 10 year old by asking him if he knew what the problems were between mom and dad.

He is very perceptive and overheard conversations between mom and I to know the name Jon, but aslo the spoonfed line by her, that he was just a friend.

I let him ask all the questions and simply answered them the best I could.

He asked if it is ok for friends to talk on the phone, and I informed him he was right, friends do talk, but one does not talk to another in a way that makes dad feel uncomfortable.

He asked how I knew if there was more than a friendship, this was the hard part, I told him friends do not kiss each other or do things with each other that a husband and wife would.

After about a hour conversation he said he was pretty confused cause dad was telling him one thing and mom was saying another. Again a hard part because I told him he would have to ask his mother what was the truth. Suprisingly when he did, she answered him honestly.

rOuter, please be patient with him when you talk, I did not bad mouth mom in the least, I simply stressed that if you ask, I'm going to answer you honestly.
rookie