Couple of questions for anybody out there:

1. I have told OM at least 3 times (verbally) and another time via mail that N/C is absolute and that he is not allowed on my property (house, farm or rentals-one has a soda machine on it). He says that he respects my wishes, but his action show otherwise. I also, said that if they (OM or OMW) need to contact me, to call me on the phone, not just show up. Then two days ago, a gift is returned (a coke antique/paraphenalia type thing that was given to OM during A). It was set next to the soda machine. So this AM, the W takes a bunny cage (a gift from him to one of our kids) back and sets it on his driveway with a note that says sorry we sold the bunnies. So, then he stops to talk to the W, and says "Don't you know we're not allowed to talk?" She never asked him to stop and talk and he keeps interpretting his [censored] that way. So the question is, How can I stop him from contacting us? Can this be perceived as harassment?

2. There were other gifts that we (my W & I) had given to them pre-A. Should I ask for them back so that they don't just mysteriouly show up some time? I'm thinking yes. I'm getting tired of dealing with this [censored]. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Further, information: When he stopped to talk to the W. She said, then don't stop to talk to me. He tried to keep talking, but she got in the car and left. He asked as she was leaving are you going to tell your H about this? She called me at work as soon as she got home. I'm sure he'll tell his W and put some kind of spin on it so that it was my W who wanted to talk to him.

<small>[ May 14, 2004, 08:58 AM: Message edited by: Recovering H ]</small>

Well, the situation kind of took care of itself before any advice was received here. Oh well. The OMW called to explain. She was upset that W & OM were talking. Unfortunately, I don't think she sees her H (the OM) as the stalker. He's the one who always does the contacting (and never my FWW)

The OMW does not know where any of the other gifts might be, so at least I don't have to expect them to show up anytime in the future. Hopefully, she just pitched them.

Well, I do have another question but I'm going to post that in General Questions II, under the thread -OMW asking ?'s about other A's by him. Check there if you wish to see it.

Rec. H,

First, I want to congratulate you on the outstanding job you have done with handling this awful and unfair situation in your life. IMO you have went about this process with dignity and grace. (I truly wish I could have handled my situation as well as you have....... right from the start!) So good for you! Here's hoping you DO figure out what to do next.

However, I do understand and sympathize with your current "stalemate". Getting to those neutral places does suck, especially when it seems you've been making progress. All I can say on that is hang in there because this entire process is not one that follows a set pattern. The highs can be high, but the lows are REALLY low.

Next, have a question for you on something I see as very Problematic.
Have you given any real thought to just moving away from there?
I realize that this is not something that can be done instantly, but is there any plan to do this at some point?

If not, what is your Plan to deal with this issue? Because it seems being neighbors is very problematic.

I fear for your sanity and your emotional wellbeing by staying in that place. Indeed, I also fear for your (mostly his) safty, as I could see the constant stress making you do something to the OM (physical) that you would regret. I know your handling it right now, but can you deal with this emotional grind forever?

I realize that on some level that will seem like the OM winning, but who cares about him at this point. He is irrelevant (or can be if there is ever NC).

Also remember that your M cannot begin to heal and recover UNTIL the A ends. And as long as there IS Contact, the A is NOT over (at least on some level). Just wondering how there can ever be NC, with your W and OM living Right NEXT Door?

As you have children will it be at all healthy to keep them hostage in this toxic environment? I say this because I really doubt the other family is handling this in the manner you are.
Kids always find out. Always. Do they deserve to be hurt by all this? If you stay there they most certainly will be.

Besides a financial issue, what else is keeping you there?

Can you really get a hold on your emotions seeing this guy (or even OMW) on a daily basis? Will you be able to deal with the "Triggers" that are to come from the infidelity occurring in your own HOUSE?

Can your wife handle the temptation with OM being right there? (The intense emotions of an A are very powerful). Even if she can, can you handle the constant fears & doubts that are sure to be there?

Maybe you can handle it. I don't know. But if your not going to move, how can you get to recovery with this OM still in your life to some degree?
The Stress of you going off to work every morning must be pure Hell!

In my situation, my wife not only left her job, but we also moved, to get away from the house and even the area we lived in. All I can say is that both moves have helped us greatly. So many of the triggers and much of the baggage was left behind. NOT having to continue to be confronted with all that "stuff" has helped me tremendously.

Anyway, if you can deal with seeing this OM and his family and the fear and suspicion that come with it, then Bless you. Cause I sure couldn't. At least not indefinitely .

I'm sure you've already considerd all this, but I just want you to be sure and consider what a huge obstacle this really is.

Any way, Its funny or maybe sad (not sure which) that you found all the same sites that I found when I first found out about WW A.
In any case, keep up the good work. You've been doing a great job. I'll look for better posts from you in the future. Take care

<small>[ May 18, 2004, 08:36 AM: Message edited by: top rope ]</small>

TopRope:

Thanks for the reply and the nice words. None of this has been easy.

The "stalemate" from last week seems to have passed. I look at it now as one of those periods of two steps back, one forward rather than 1 back and 2 forward. As far as the ups and downs, they seem to have leveled out from what they were.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Have you given any real thought to just moving away from there? I realize that this is not something that can be done instantly, but is there any plan to do this at some point? If not, what is your Plan to deal with this issue? Because it seems being neighbors is very problematic.] </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes, we have. That was one of my first thoughts. I have since reconciled that with myself. We just built this house 4-5 years ago. We have it pretty much like we want it. We have 7 acres that gives us peace and quiet. The taxes (while raising significantly the last few years are still low compared with all the surrounding areas). The farm has been in the family 136 years. Eventually, I would like to make it into some type of fee hunting/game farm. That said, while the OM is a neighbor, he doesn't live next door. It's not like I see him everyday. Plus, he drives school bus. No matter where I move to, there will be school buses. That's a trigger for me and probably always will be. So it's something I'll have to work through.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I fear for your sanity and your emotional wellbeing by staying in that place. Indeed, I also fear for your (mostly his) safety, as I could see the constant stress making you do something to the OM (physical) that you would regret. I know your handling it right now, but can you deal with this emotional grind forever? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Again, thanks for your concern. I don't want you to think that I haven't thought about these things because I have. He's an outlaw. He can fend for himself. I'm an upstanding person in our community and have a reputation to keep. Revenge, while the thought of it would be nice, doesn't fit in with my plans.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I realize that on some level that will seem like the OM winning, but who cares about him at this point. He is irrelevant (or can be if there is ever NC). </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">True, it may seem that way, but I know he's a loser and always will be. You are correct that he is and will be irrelevant.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> remember that your M cannot begin to heal and recover UNTIL the A ends. And as long as there IS Contact, the A is NOT over (at least on some level). Just wondering how there can ever be NC, with your W and OM living Right NEXT Door? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I respectfully disagree with part of what you state here. I think that recovery has already started. The W feels a true emotional intimacy that she hasn't felt for quite some time. (We are taking the time to talk and just be with each other.) True, each time there is contact, there are setbacks and hurdles to overcome. Again, it's not like they live "right" next door, but it is a small community. (We have a 7 ac tract, our farm is a mile to the east and OM/OMW live 1-1.5 miles to the N/NW.)

Re: the Children- so far the situation has not been "toxic" to them. They may have been aware of tension, but not as to why. When the time is right, they will be made aware of it. The oldest daughter was told that we are working through some issues. She is aware that we're seeing a MC.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Besides a financial issue, what else is keeping you there? Can you really get a hold on your emotions seeing this guy (or even OMW) on a daily basis? Will you be able to deal with the "Triggers" that are to come from the infidelity occurring in your own HOUSE? Can your wife handle the temptation with OM being right there? Even if she can, can you handle the constant fears & doubts that are sure to be there? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">History, family, quality of life. Could some of these be found elsewhere? Sure, do I want to look for that? Not yet.
I'll have to work on the triggers. We have made plans to replace the couch and are changing other things in our life to accomplish this.
Can the W handle the temptation? The OM has shown his true colors since the A has been outed. She has no interest in him.
Yes.

TR: One thing I did before answering your message was to take the time to reconsider these things. I didn't just want to give a flippant response. I have thought out these things. My W and I have discussed them and this is where we're at right now. Six months, a year from now, maybe we'll have to revisit it and say No thanks, it's not worth staying here and plan our future from there. The big thing is that we're talking and communicating which is a step up from the last year or two. (Plus, the predator is out of our lives and if he's not talking, he has no power.)

REC H.,
Thank you for answering my questions. Hope I did not come across as too big of a pest.

My intent was not to Tell you what to do, but simply to perhaps lend a voice to the thoughts that may have already been in your head and heart but you may not have wanted to listen to or face and deal with.
(Understandable, as when dealing with the consequences of an A, there is sooooo much and so many different aspects to deal with.)

Your response does clear up some of the issues that I found hard to reconcile about your situation. (The part where you are neighbors but actually "live" fairly far apart does make things clearer).

I do respect WHATEVER it is you have (or will ) decide for you and your M. Of course, you know your situation, W, M and details much better then I ever will.
If staying in a place you love and feel safe and happy is the best thing for you guys then by all means do your rebuilding (relationship wise) there.
However it is that you do it, I wish you only continued success.

Just didn't want the "where" you were rebuilding to be an extra obstacle for your recovery.
Glad to hear that its not.
Should you choose to readdress this issue in the future, I'm confident that you'll make the best decision for all concerned.

MY concern for your children was due to the fact that they are for the most part powerless in all this. I see now that your kids are NOT close by the OM or his family. That was my biggest fear for them.
Unfortunately, kids do talk and kids can be cruel and thoughtless. But as you are not that close in proximity to them, then it appears it is less of an issue.

Take care...........you seem to be on the right track......continue to do your best to stay there.
(Its not hard to get off of it, believe me).

Some follow-up since my last post:

Well, the last week has not been so good. It seems when the W is PMS'ing things get worse. There really hadn't been much talk between us (at least it seemed that way to me). OM has been very "visible" lately. Driving by, waving, generally being the a$$ that he is. Well, his birthday was last Friday (which I didn't know). The W thought another NC letter (1 was sent early on, and another written but never sent) was in order. So she sent him a note giving him what he wanted, to never see her again, 'goodbye' or something like that. Then she called me at work Friday to tell me. Felt like another knife through the heart.

For some reason, I knew something was up, but couldn't put my finger on it. So anyway, I tried to talk to her, but couldn't, I said something and she hung up on me. Later she called me back to give me a message and we talked a little more. Her reasoning for sending the note was that she thought it would "mean" more if I didn't tell her to do it. (It still hurt.)

So anyway, I get home Friday evening, take care of what I need to and try to talk with the W. She seemed to be trying to avoid me and was doing a good job. So after the kids went to bed (9PM), so did she. So I made my move. I figured we could then talk. So I tried to inquire what she was thinking. Well, she didn't answer. We hardly ever fight, but I felt that I had to here, so I started Love Busting big time. Just saying anything and everything I could think of to provoke her. I asked her if she even read the Harley books or anything else we've picked up recently. Finally, she started to respond. She said, yeah, hadn't I? I said what do you mean. She told me she was still in withdrawal and that as long as she had feelings for him, how could we recover? Well, at least I know what I'm fighting now. We talked into the night and I explained that I need her to talk to me (now, more than ever). There will be times when she needs to talk about certain things, and I told her I would tell her my limits. She still refuses IC, says that she sees that as an abnormality in her. (Or people that go to counselors are abnormal.) Can't seem to get through to her on that one. She does talk to her sister some, but that has backfired on her some too and she felt somewhat judged by her sis. She did say that she didn't think she could ever trust anyone ever again because how everyone betrays her. She felt that everytime she tells me something, it always comes back to bite her in the butt. I tried to show her that even though it felt that way, it wasn't really that way in reality.

So it seems the lines of communication are open again. I do wish she would go back on AD's (she started them, but then quit when she got a rash and a case of the itchies). They were supposed to help her stop smoking too, but now she's about doubled her intake of smokes to about 2 packs a day. I probably shouldn't have put that (to go back on AD's) here as she'll take that as me trying to control her or directing her, though I wrote it only as a feeling.

At least I can see she's working on us (even if it is in her own way). I should know that I can't tell her what to do or even how to do it. I just wish I had a better idea of the hell she is going through. I've wanted to start a thread for her and introduce her to Lisa103, KiwiJ and some of the other FWW's out here. I think it would be good for her. She does lurk here (at least to read my posts). Her ID is jezebel.

I go to the Orthopedic surgeon tommorrow. He'll be looking at my knee. I have a torn meniscus. Hopefully, we'll set a date for surgery. I'm tired of walking around like a cripple.

Also, I think I will continue this "update" in GQII now since it doesn't really seem appropriate anymore in the Just Found Out section. Thanks everyone here for your input, you've been great!

RH

Link to new Recovering H Update