My quick story: I'm a 43 year old woman, married for 20 years. For the first 17 years of marriage, it was blissful. We had 2 children. I stayed home and reared them, as we both had planned. When I turned 39, I started wanting more out of my life, other than being a good wife and mother (or maybe IN ADDITION TO). I went online and joined a messageboard (it was a celebrity's messageboard). I ended up meeting a bunch of nice people, one in particular. We grew closer and closer. I live in NY; she in Canada. We became fast best friends. I felt renewed and rejoiced in my new friendship. She made me feel alive, vibrant and wanted. She appreciated me. She said that she didn't have many friends (I did), and I felt protective over her. She seemed to be a breath of fresh air.

Over the course of a few months, we chatted nightly online. We discussed our marriages, things of a sexual nature, etc. I don't know HOW it happened, but we began flirting. This was a first for me. I'd NEVER been attracted to a woman, but this woman made my heart soar! We both had the same feelings. We realized that we were in love. We both felt blessed (and confused).

She had some problems in her marriage--not feeling wanted or needed. I tried to console her. She wanted the kind of marriage that I had. My marriage started slipping away the more time I spent with her. We spoke on the phone a lot. I reserved a lot of time for her and looked forward to spending every moment I could with her. We usually spoke at night when our children were in bed, but that quickly changed--we spoke during the day too. We spoke for about 3-5 hours a day.

She flew here to meet me and stayed in my house. We consumated our sexual relationship. It was amazing! I was so in love. So was she. I went to bed that night and had sex with my husband. I felt blessed to be in love with both of them and somehow thought it would all work out. He didn't know about my affair. I didn't want to hurt him.

Our affair went on for 2 more years. We had many ups and downs. The distance between us was difficult to overcome--being 2,000 miles apart, but we saw each other 9 times in 2 years. She tried to end the sexual part of our relationship a few times, feeling guilt, but always came back. The sex was amazing, but I have to admit that it was amazing with my husband, and by myself too. I'm a sexual person.

In July, 2003, after going away with her in Canada, she ended it again. I was DEVASTATED. Felt suicidal. She stuck to her guns this time, stating that she tried everything to make me happy but I always seemed to want more. In truth I was VERY happy, but the distance and our real lives interfered. It was hard to make it all work, but I never wanted to lose her. We tried to maintain the friendship, even though I was still in love. I was convinced that she was still in love, but blocking her feelings to overcome her guilt. She and I still shared some sexual intimacies after that. She let me touch her (somewhat) and she participated in some things with me.

I went to see her in March and there was tension. I was still in love, and I wanted badly to try to maintain the friendship (which is all she said she wanted at this point). When I got home, we began arguing more and more. She was pulling back and I was upset. I threatened to "out" her to her husband, because she seemed to suppress our affair. I threatened to tell my husband too. That night, she told her husband "everything". She sent me an email, according to his request, and said she couldn't speak to me again. I called her, trying to talk to her, but her husband wouldn't put her on the phone and he told me, "I already know enough. Please don't call here again". I was worried about her (her mental state fluctuated during the past few years and she has had some "low" moments). I just needed to hear that she was okay. I wrote, called, etc., to no avail. I was worried sick!

Three days later, another email came in. She took a chance and wrote to me, even though she wasn't "allowed". She told me that she was trying to get through the end of each day. She asked me not to respond to the email. She said that she was sorry but that I "painted" her into a corner. She said she'd miss me and my family very much. She said that she didn't know if she could ever contact me again. She sounded distraught. I was appreciative that she wrote, but sickened at the same time. I worried more. I continued writing, but didn't acknowledge THAT email, in fear of her husband reading it.

I wrote daily (less than the 5-10 emails we used to exchange daily!!). Just once a day. I still tried calling. All to no avail. No response. I worried that she was dead or in an institution. I called one night and heard her voice. She hung up on me. She was alive at least!

I also looked for her online. I missed her greatly and was VERY, VERY depressed. How could it be that I lost her? I found her on a messageboard, under an assumed name (after I joined this messageboard). She realized who I was and posted hateful things about me, calling me a "stalker". It sounded nothing like her.

She sent me a "cease and desist" formal letter in the mail (this after some of my letters and my package to her of HER belongings came back "refused" to me). She said that I wrote in excess of 90 emails and I phoned her home phone and cell numerous times. She urged me to stop or legal action would ensue. I was once again crushed! Here I thought she still cared, and maybe she even appreciated my update emails. I thought I'd get them bounced back or she'd at least have written, asking me to stop. How could it be that this person suddenly hated me and wanted me to stop all contact??

According to her posts, she was trying to get on with her life. Funny, she told me that if her husband ever found out about us, he'd leave her. He was never too supportive of her in the past. Now he's not only staying, but he's finally being caring and supportive?? Was that all I meant to her?? Was I a pawn to make him jealous? I have good judgment and I believed everything she told me. She was IN LOVE with me, and I with her. How could she put this behind her and try to rectify her marriage?? (This when she told me that she'd never have "mind-blowing" sex with him like she had with me, and she'd never have an "exciting life" with him like she had with me!). Was she feeding me lines???

This was a month ago. D-Day was May 19th, I believe. For one month I've been SICK over this even more. I can't stop thinking of her and reviewing our whole affair in my head. I was ready to leave my husband if we had had a chance together. She meant THAT much to me, but my children meant more.

I'm still trying to figure out a lot. How could I have been attracted to a woman (a 300 lb woman at that!). I'm a thin, fairly attractive woman. My friends & family all joked, asking me to pick someone "sexier" if I were going to have an affair. I was outraged at that--I found her to be VERY, VERY sexy and attractive. How could I have depended on her that much? My life is so changed. I'm sad, sick and depressed.

I told my husband about this in May. He was supportive and kind (as I knew he would be). He said that had the affair been with a man, he'd have left me. He wanted to know what I was trying to "fill" by having her in my life like i did. He was willing to wait around until I figured things out. I have been SO depressed and confused that I haven't wanted anyone sexually. I still care DEEPLY for my husband, but I don't want any sex right now. I'm so hurt, confused and guilty. How could I have hurt my husband when he's been a caring, supportive man? How could I have turned to this woman and trusted her so deeply, only to be crushed and hurt? She DID bring me a lot of good, and I hope I did the same for her. I still can't accept or believe that she's gone from my life. She meant too much to me, and she assured me that I meant "the world" to her. I'm finding it hard to go on, but I am trying to, for the sake of my children.

My husband and I are in marriage counseling. It's helping somewhat. We both want to make this work. We both still care about each other deeply.

Sorry this was so long. My question is: Will I ever "get over" her? Will I ever stop looking for her and longing for her? Will I ever stop hoping she'll contact me?? Will I ever be able to get my marriage on track? I don't know what I want at this point, but it's hard to keep it all together.

Thank you for reading this. Please give me any input you might have! I'm desperate!

I'm running out the door and don't have enough time to respond properly.

If this is all true, Might I suggest you post this on General Questions II. I only say that because JFO is loaded with Betrayed spouses who have just learned of their husband or wifes affair. I'm affraid you may get bludgened a bit particulary because your still in the justifing it mode.

Sorry I don't have more time.

Welcome to MB

Oz

I have been reading here for a long time and your story really caught my eye because i am on the other side of your story sort of.

What I want to know is if you are still married? For one. And if you are going to try to stay married because it sounds like you still care way more about the OW than you do about your own husband! And the OW in your story sure as heck seems like she wants to be out of YOUR picture but there you are still trying to keep her in your life.

I am sorry if this is sounding harsh but what about your husband? you know the one you cheated on? If he is so great as you say then you must just be hurting and hurting him by trying to stay in touch with the ow. Sorry again but like I said I am on the other side of your story. I'm sorry your having so many troubles but it seems like the ow made her decision LAST year you said! you got to have a little flint AND keep your husband because he is such a great guy and now you want to have the OW still too? I'm sorry I can't be sympathetic to you.

Oz,

Thank for your the warm welcome. Sorry if I posted this in the wrong area. I'll post it there instead. Should I delete it here?

Jess,

I can understand your line of questioning. My friend wanted to end the SEXUAL part of our relationship, but she showed an active interest in keeping our friendship for a year after that, until she couldn't handle it anymore. She's only tried to back away since then. And, yes, I'm still overwhelmed with feelings for her, and I'm trying to tie up loose ends and figure stuff out. I know there's no chance of us reconciling, but I thought we could maintain our friendship, and knowing we can't, hurts very much. I'm only now wondering why we put our friendship into jeopardy the way we did.

As far as my husband goes, he IS very hurt over this. Time will tell if he's willing to stay in the marriage and possibly trust me again. I know I'll NEVER put myself in the same position I did. As far as my feelings for him go, I still love him deeply, but don't even know what I want as far as our marriage is concerned. Right now I want to be as supportive as I can, and I care about him a lot, but I could barely function day to day. I have a lot to work through, and I have to figure out if I want my marriage back the way it was before (or even better).

CC,

Are you in counseling? I don't mean marriage counseling I mean individual counseling. Please read your post, and then tell me your OW doesn't have reason to "fear" you and your behavior.

I would also like to urge you to read the articles here, but I don't think they will make much of an impact until you really face what you have done to your family, her family, and yes even her. Nevertheless, perhaps some of the information will help. I hope so.

I thought I would take a few moments and reply to what you have written and offer some IMPRESSIONS from someone that does NOT know you.

You said </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She had some problems in her marriage--not feeling wanted or needed. I tried to console her. She wanted the kind of marriage that I had.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Don't you find it interesting that she valued your marriage but you did NOT. Don't you find it interesting that you did NOT value your marriage, your H, your children, but went off on this complusive affair? This is what I mean by you seeking some counseling. You need to really investigate this.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> My marriage started slipping away the more time I spent with her. We spoke on the phone a lot. I reserved a lot of time for her and looked forward to spending every moment I could with her. We usually spoke at night when our children were in bed, but that quickly changed--we spoke during the day too. We spoke for about 3-5 hours a day.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ah! the compulsion of an affair and what is termed "the fog" around here. When in the "fog" logic is NOT suspended but it is NOT based on reality. THe reality was your marriage was slipping, your kids getting short changed, and it did NOT matter, because by your "logic" the important thing was that you got your fix. Yes, affairs are very much like addictions including changes in the brain chemistry. It will take you months of no contact and that means no communications before things start to change for you, but they will if you maintain NO CONTACT as your friend tried to do.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She flew here to meet me and stayed in my house. We consumated our sexual relationship. It was amazing! I was so in love. So was she. I went to bed that night and had sex with my husband. I felt blessed to be in love with both of them and somehow thought it would all work out. He didn't know about my affair. I didn't want to hurt him.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">But of course you were hurting him and planting the seeds for continued betrayal.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Our affair went on for 2 more years. We had many ups and downs. The distance between us was difficult to overcome--being 2,000 miles apart, but we saw each other 9 times in 2 years. She tried to end the sexual part of our relationship a few times, feeling guilt, but always came back. The sex was amazing, but I have to admit that it was amazing with my husband, and by myself too. I'm a sexual person.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Obviously she was beginning to realize what she was going to lose if she continued this. It is clear you did not and still do not. You are NOT out of the woods yet.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I went to see her in March and there was tension. I was still in love, and I wanted badly to try to maintain the friendship (which is all she said she wanted at this point). When I got home, we began arguing more and more. She was pulling back and I was upset. I threatened to "out" her to her husband, because she seemed to suppress our affair. I threatened to tell my husband too.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Don't you find it interesting that you claimed to love her, but you were willing to devastate her life and potentially ruin her family because she wanted to return to her family. I don't think your idea of love and mine are the same. I think the term is lust. You claimed you loved your H as well, and look what you have done to him. Time for some counseling CC. It really is.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> That night, she told her husband "everything". She sent me an email, according to his request, and said she couldn't speak to me again. I called her, trying to talk to her, but her husband wouldn't put her on the phone and he told me, "I already know enough. Please don't call here again". I was worried about her (her mental state fluctuated during the past few years and she has had some "low" moments). I just needed to hear that she was okay. I wrote, called, etc., to no avail. I was worried sick!</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You were NOT worried about her, you just decided not to listen to her, or her H, and you decided you KNEW better than anyone what was best for her. You did become a stalker and a menace to their marriage. You are very fortunate that they did NOT call the police.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Three days later, another email came in. She took a chance and wrote to me, even though she wasn't "allowed". She told me that she was trying to get through the end of each day. She asked me not to respond to the email. She said that she was sorry but that I "painted" her into a corner. She said she'd miss me and my family very much. She said that she didn't know if she could ever contact me again. She sounded distraught. I was appreciative that she wrote, but sickened at the same time. I worried more. I continued writing, but didn't acknowledge THAT email, in fear of her husband reading it.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Still not doing much listening here were you? You did NOT listen to her and you did "paint" her into a corner. You were worried only that you would NOT get your fix, right? It is time to face a few things in my opinion.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I wrote daily (less than the 5-10 emails we used to exchange daily!!). Just once a day. I still tried calling. All to no avail. No response. I worried that she was dead or in an institution. I called one night and heard her voice. She hung up on me. She was alive at least!

I also looked for her online. I missed her greatly and was VERY, VERY depressed. How could it be that I lost her? I found her on a messageboard, under an assumed name (after I joined this messageboard). She realized who I was and posted hateful things about me, calling me a "stalker". It sounded nothing like her.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She was/is right you were a "stalker" and a big threat to her. You still are. It is time to face your obsession CC. You need to understand why you felt the need to destroy two families and not even listen to the one you claimed to love. This IS about YOU.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She sent me a "cease and desist" formal letter in the mail (this after some of my letters and my package to her of HER belongings came back "refused" to me). She said that I wrote in excess of 90 emails and I phoned her home phone and cell numerous times. She urged me to stop or legal action would ensue. I was once again crushed! Here I thought she still cared, and maybe she even appreciated my update emails. I thought I'd get them bounced back or she'd at least have written, asking me to stop. How could it be that this person suddenly hated me and wanted me to stop all contact??</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Obsessive people are NOT attractive even to a Wayward Spouse. You were way out of control here.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">According to her posts, she was trying to get on with her life. Funny, she told me that if her husband ever found out about us, he'd leave her. He was never too supportive of her in the past. Now he's not only staying, but he's finally being caring and supportive??</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What is funny about true love? Just because she did NOT know her H loved her did not mean he did not. It was her disrespectful judgements, DJ, that was clearly causing part of the problems in the marriage. You can read about the power of DJ's to destroy a marriage in the love buster section here.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Was that all I meant to her?? Was I a pawn to make him jealous? I have good judgment and I believed everything she told me. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well, CC good judgement is in the eye of the beholder, and from where I stand you have lousy judgment and made some really poor decisions. You mistreated your marriage, your family, and yes her and her family. I don't call that "good judgment". You need to stop worrying if "that is all she meant to you" because she should have meant NOTHING to you. Your bigger concern is that your H may yet leave you.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She was IN LOVE with me, and I with her. How could she put this behind her and try to rectify her marriage?? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Do you realize how dumb that sounds? You married a man you were in LOVE with how could you put all of that behind YOU and try and have affair with another woman? Just because your affair partner has a greater love for her H than you, and apparently values marriage more than you, doesn't make her wrong. It makes you look pretty self-centered and selfish. You did the very same thing to your H, with the notable exception you VOWED to him you would be faithful and love him. Those vows were never exchanged in your affair.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">(This when she told me that she'd never have "mind-blowing" sex with him like she had with me, and she'd never have an "exciting life" with him like she had with me!). Was she feeding me lines???
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Are you missing something pretty important? Yes, you are. You are missing that the excitement of an affair, the thrill of cheating on your loved ones, the travel,and the lack of responsibility are never going to be matched in a committed relationship. If you two were together and doing the daily things such as paying bills, taking out the trash, it would NOT be so thrilling either. That is why there are marriage VOWS. This takes a COMMITMENT to a relationship that neither of you had.

CC, I realize you are in the fog. I realize that you really don't care if your H stays or goes,although you may say you do. But, I also realize you need help, because if you don't turn around after awhile your H will tire of this and move on.

This is a marriage builders site. The purpose is to build and rebuild marriages. I strongly urge you to get counseling and come ask questions when you decide to consider working on your marriage. You are still in withdrawal ( you can read about that in the articles here as well), and it will last awhile longer, but you need to start to focus your attention where it is supposed to be, before the damage and loses become insurmountable for your H and your family.

Finally, you mentioned that your friends knew about your affair and kidded you about the size of your OP. I wonder what kind of friends you have. Her size was not an issue, your lying and cheating are the issues and if they condoned this, you need new friends.

Please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

Just Learning you said so much that really touched me and made so much sense to me. It's pretty hard having to see this from the other side (reading her post) but I'm learning a lot.

CC what I still don't get is why you think its a smart idea to stay FRIENDS with someone you had an A with! I just dont think that I could personally handle it if my H said to me, "Hon, I want to stay FRIENDS with the OW. Shes gonna be hangin around here all the time nad talking to me all the time but hey we're JUST FRIENDS, dont worry!" How the heck is your Hs upposed to feel about having the OW hanging around HIS house???? Thats just nuts in my opinion.

It sounds like you totally want everything. You want your OW and your H and you want to have everything just exactly the way YOU want it. Sorry, but that's so damn selfish it brings tears to my eyes. Grow up. How DARE you say you are supportive of your H and at the same time you are actively pursuing a continued friendship with your OW? Wrong wrong wrong. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

JL,

I'm trying to take all of this in. I'll have to get back to you on most of it after it's absorbed. But for now, I'll tell you that my therapist was recommended by my gynecologist. The therapist deals with "women in crisis" and he's also a marriage counselor. I don't know if I"m too happy with him--he loses his temper. He's also waived me off by saying, "The affair is OVER, so get over it." Well, I have a lot of questions. I want to figure out why I had the affair in the first place. I want to figure out about my sexuality and how I could be attracted to a woman. A lot is not answered in my mind.

As far as my "friend" putting her marriage first now, I doubt it. I KNOW how she thinks. She's willing to stay in a crappy marriage for the sake of the children. She never got her needs met by him, and even if he's trying to work things out now (which is a miracle!), it won't last. I feel for her. I truly DID love her and saw us possibly having a life together. We connected. She said it was like "lightening struck". We dreamed of a life together. Would it have worked out? I don't know, but I was nearly willing to try. She was more afraid of losing her security.

I admit, this was the most selfish thing I've ever done. I only thought of myself, and YES it was like an addiction, but I strongly believe that there was love involved in there too. I have heard of situations like this happening before, and it's worked out for them, and I thought that MAYBE we were in the same position. Problem was that neither of us were strong enough to follow through.

I am CERTAIN that she'll NEVER have with her husband what she and I shared. Never! I'm certain that my H can't give me what she and I shared either, although it came very close. The two of them were alike in MANY ways. Have I been fair to him? NO WAY! Have I been selfish? YES. Have I neglected my children? I tried to justify that in my head, and say that I talked to her only when they were already taken care of, and since it brought me much happiness, only good could come of it. They thought of her as a close aunt. Her children thought of me as a second mother. There was a lot of closeness there. Although I regret that it's turned into this, I don't regret the relationship and I envisioned that we'd be together in some capacity, forever.

I never would have stayed friends with her after telling my H., although he said that if we wanted to remain friends, he'd be okay with that. Now he has a different attitude. He's beginning to let his anger and disappointment out. He's upset with me and with her (because he trusted her too).

Anyway, the rest of your post I'll get to... and I'll try to find those other pertinent sections as well. Maybe, hopefully, it will help. I obviously am going through a lot here, and I need all the help I can get. I want to be strong, for me, my husband and my children.

Thanks for your input.

Jess-Anne,

She is NOT very unique at all. The same sex part is a bit different, but even that is NOT uncommon around here. The sad but true fact is that YOU have just gotten a glimpse of what a "fogged" affairee is really thinking and focusing on...themselves.

It is normal and I was not kidding about the brain chemistry either. It truely does change in an affair, it is part and parcel of an Affair.

What you see is that she assumes her H will always be there to be used by her as SHE sees fit. She assumes that her actions and even a divorce will not HURT her children. It is now known the older they are the more they are hurt. She assumes it was mere shortsightedness on the part of here OP or that the OP was being forced to end this relationship. She assumes that if it feels good it must be right.

Most of her assumptions are incorrect and some dangerously so.

I am glad you got something from the post and hope it helps you.

God Bless,

JL

Where is the "love buster" section?? I can't find it...

P.S. How was I (am I) a "threat" to their marriage?? It's not like she's entertaining the thought of running to me! And, as far as the stalking goes, part of me wants to come clean about this WHOLE affair, if that's what she wants to do! I have pictures, emails, letters, etc., showing that she was a willing participant in this. She's portrayed me as the dominant one, and I know in my heart that that WAS NOT the case! Although I wouldn't want to hurt her further, I feel like clearing this up with her!

CC,

Perhaps I am being naive, but I don't see the same sex thing as that big of surprise. If you want to learn about why affairs occur, you might want to consider buying Surviving an Affair by Harley. It can help you see. Mostly it is about investing emotional energy in someone other than your spouse. This usually starts these things.

It also sounds as if you are going through a bit of mid-life crisis. As for your counselor, get a new one if he/she is not helping. Your marriage nor you will recover if you try to "just get over it" and you darned well had never say that to your H. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

As for your OP, well you are NOT in a position to judge her or assess he decisions at this point. You are hardly unbiased. Further, if she is moving on and finding a better marriage, it blows up your JUSTIFICATION for your behavior. You are justifying you realize?

Your H is NOW correct, you two can never be "friends". You would NOT tolerate him being "friends" with a woman he slept with on the side would you? I realize at this point you really don't care much about what your H does, but the time will come.

I mentioned this to a lady here about 6 months ago, that it would take her months before she would realize what the costs were for what she had done (betrayed her H). They are recovered and she is starting to see what they were.

As for the kids, the price for them will come if you divorce or you and your H never reconnect. It will affect them for the rest of their lives.

So do some reading especially about withdrawal, and Love Busters. I know you don't feel much like working on your marriage, but there is NO need to damage your marriage and your H further if you can avoid it. You may yet decide to work on this marriage. If you do it will help you to have not hurt him further. Oh and yes he will be angry, but CC you need to realize that anger is a secondary emotion it is driven by the primary ones: fear, pain, etc. In his case I would guess fear and pain are big ones for him.

Keep reading and posting.

God Bless,

JL

CC,

You can find something about love busters here Love Busters Please read all of the articles on the main web page of this site.

You asked </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Where is the "love buster" section?? I can't find it...

P.S. How was I (am I) a "threat" to their marriage?? It's not like she's entertaining the thought of running to me! And, as far as the stalking goes, part of me wants to come clean about this WHOLE affair, if that's what she wants to do! I have pictures, emails, letters, etc., showing that she was a willing participant in this. She's portrayed me as the dominant one, and I know in my heart that that WAS NOT the case! Although I wouldn't want to hurt her further, I feel like clearing this up with her! </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You are a threat to their marriage by doing just what you are claiming you want to do "clear things up". <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> Leave the woman alone, and stay out of her life.

If she is lucky she will recover her marriage and with her H's love they can rebuild and make it better. You being there or trying to "clear things" up, will hurt them terribly, not to mention your H if you continue contact. Further, any more contact will set you back to zero with regards to withdrawal.

Leave them alone. You have done enough, and you cannot fix their marriage, or really justify what you have done. I know in your mind you think you can but you are wrong, very wrong.

Please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

JL,

Thank you for that link. I'll read more when my migraine clears up (long story there).

I know that I come across as selfish and horrid, but I haven't been that type of person EVER, until this all happened. I didn't expect my H to stick around and support me in my decisions, but, truthfully, we always were so close that if he came out of the closet, or if I did, I know that we'd support each other and be as close to each other as we could be. He and I were friends first, and I believe we'd always be friends--even if he cheated on me. Naive??

As far as my children are concerned, my main concern is the example we set for them. And, yes, this has been a bad learning experience and they're just beginning to deal with the outcome. I'm sure we have a long road ahead, but what they see between H and I is a close relationship. They don't know the details of the affair yet though.

We are all human, and if I had an affair, it was wrong, but does that mean that I'm useless now? Should I give up and run away (or worse, do away with myself)? Right now I don't have the strength to help rebuild my marriage. It's very, very hard. I have CONSTANT reminders of her everywhere, from tons of jewelry to magazine subscriptions she bought me. I have momentos everywhere. I already put aside a boxfull of things (pictures of her, etc), but I am still constantly reminded of her and it's difficult. I am in mourning over the loss of my friendship, and I'm just beginning to see the fallout.

CC,

You are not going to like to hear what I have so say about a few things you posted. But, hey that is part of the deal. I would like to suggest that you search for KiwiJ's original posts here and then read her posts now. You will see quite a bit of yourself in her first posts here. So I'll answer your questions now.

You said </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">
I know that I come across as selfish and horrid, but I haven't been that type of person EVER, until this all happened.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Actually you are selfish and have been for over two years. Wanted your cake and eat it too. Further, YOU ARE NOT UNIQUE. You are actually pretty normal and what you say has been heard here thousands of times and I do mean thousands. This is important for you to come to realize. Please read the posts here after you read the articles. You will be amazed, truely amazed.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I didn't expect my H to stick around and support me in my decisions, but, truthfully, we always were so close that if he came out of the closet, or if I did, I know that we'd support each other and be as close to each other as we could be.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">CC, this is NOT about coming out of the closet. You may be bisexual, but frankly it doesn't matter if you could and can find happiness and satisfaction with your H. Yes, I do mean sexual satisfaction.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> He and I were friends first, and I believe we'd always be friends--even if he cheated on me. Naive??</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well, here is the hard part. If you had a friend that lied to you for 2 years. A friend that betrayed your deepest trusts. A friend that rejected you in favor or someone else. Would that person meet your definition of a friend??? Now stop and consider that you resent your OP for deciding to return to her marriage, and you thought she was a friend. Then look at what you have done to your H, now was that friendly??

No, not really is it. You may think he is your friend, and he has been, but the converse has NOT been true for two years. However, it is not too late to start to rebuild that friendship with him. You see this is part of the delusion of an affair. You really do think you have been a good friend to your H. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> Sort of sad isn't it?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">As far as my children are concerned, my main concern is the example we set for them. And, yes, this has been a bad learning experience and they're just beginning to deal with the outcome.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You don't know the half of it YET. But it will come. However, with work, honesty on the part of you, and forgiveness on the part of your H, you can heal alot.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I'm sure we have a long road ahead, but what they see between H and I is a close relationship. They don't know the details of the affair yet though.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Here is the part that will hurt them. They see a close relationship, that was a lie. You were NOT close to your H, you were betraying him, so they will doubt their ability to trust what they see and hear in you. You see the trust you betrayed wasn't just between your H and you, it was with them as well. Their "aunt" was not an "aunt" but a lover, destroying their family and hurting their father.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">We are all human, and if I had an affair, it was wrong, but does that mean that I'm useless now? Should I give up and run away (or worse, do away with myself)?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well, there is no IF about it. You had a full-fledged affair with all the bells and whistles. But, NO it does not mean you are useless. That is what this site is about. Rebuilding marriages that are failing, some due to affairs, other due to just neglect. And if I felt you should give up and run away I would NOT be posting to you right now.

The goal here is to help you and your H rebuild your marriage. It can be done, it is done, and you can do it as well. When you are ready to start I and others will help you.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Right now I don't have the strength to help rebuild my marriage. It's very, very hard.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Tell you what, instead of starting to rebuild, why don't you do something else. Why don't you start by eliminating love busters from your behavior? Why not ask your H for his forgiveness? Tell him what you REALLY think of him, and sort of be there for him. Just do that, it doesn't take work, it just takes a bit of a heart.

You are NOT ready to rebuild anyway, you are still in withdrawal, eventually you will be ready to move into recovery. Not yet, but in a few weeks/months. But, help your H now, he will need ALL of his strength to endure the recovery process. It will be harder on him than you, no matter how much he may want you now.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I have CONSTANT reminders of her everywhere, from tons of jewelry to magazine subscriptions she bought me. I have momentos everywhere. I already put aside a boxfull of things (pictures of her, etc), but I am still constantly reminded of her and it's difficult.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ok, here is the part you won't like. You need to get rid of all of the momento's. Donate the jewelry, burn the pictures or throw them away, cancel the subscriptions everything that reminds you AND your H of her. It is time to move on. This will be very hard, ask your H for help. You need to get rid of the reminders or they will eat at you and your H.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I am in mourning over the loss of my friendship, and I'm just beginning to see the fallout.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yup, you are in mourning, here it is called withdrawal, and it is understood to be a normal process. It is expected and you must get through it. There was a death, if only of a dream, that occured. Your H will mourn his loss of innocence with regard to you as well. Hence some of his pain. Have patience with him.

Oh and the fallout will come, but again it can be addressed once you are into recovery. Please do read KiwiJ's threads.

You are on target here, and very normal. Hang on.

God Bless,

JL

CC,
I was just checking in quickly to see if you were bludgeoned. I’m happy to see that is not the case. I can’t say anything better than JL has put it. For now let me just reinforce JL’s last post. The mementos have to go. You have to work through withdraw and reminders won’t help. Understand this CC, your lover is going through the same withdraw and trying to put her life in order.

If you contact her you will be harming her by surfacing all the old emotions. I know you think it will help but in fact the exact opposite will happen. You will have to restart your withdraw after contact as will she. It’s a vicious cycle, like an Alcoholic you have to stay on the wagon. Truly if you two ever cared for each other you will leave it alone and commit to a timeframe to devote to recovery.

More when I can…..

JL, I’m glad to see you again, it’s been a long time old friend. I hope all is well with you. I couldn’t think of a more patient, straight speaking person to help CC.

Oz

I might not have been "bludgeoned" here but it's almost unbearable to me right now. I don't know what I expected to hear. I don't know if I'm up to this yet.

I thank you all for your posts, and I'll try to read the information you directed me to read when I am able.

As far as asking for my H's forgiveness, I already did that--back in May, and he said that "yes" he forgave me. I do think that it'll take him a while longer to mull this all over before he can even think of forgiving me. I *am* trying to keep him in mind, first and foremost, but for now I'm still in very, very bad shape. I'm taking sleeping pills every night, sleeping in every morning, and just trying to find something to hold onto each day. I have moments where I forget about all of this, and then something will remind me, and I'm back to square one. I'll read the info and see if it helps.

About the momentos-it would take me VERY long to clear everything out that she's ever given me/us. She's showered us with so much that I think half of my house is filled with stuff from her. I'll ask H if anything reminds him of her, and if I stop and think of things that remind me of her, I'll put them aside, in storage. I don't want to get rid of anything yet--not that I'm holding out any hope for rekindling our affair, but I can't get rid of it yet.

I thank you all again for your advice. I'll be back when I'm able.

CC

<small>[ December 03, 2004, 01:03 PM: Message edited by: lovemyhubby ]</small>

I have a question for LMH,CC, and JL:

My wife had a PA that originally developed over the Internet and the phone as an EA. After reading the story of CC it is quite evident that many folks are fully capable of falling madly in love by reading words on email and by talking on the phone. I can't imagine myself doing that, but it is obvious that many are able to fall in love without having the physical presence of the OP.

The question is:

Does physical appearance really matters at all once two people fall in love over the internet and the telephone?

I ask the question because it seems CC fell in love with a woman even thou there was no indication she had lesbian tendencies.

I ask the question because my wife’s OM is such a huge mismatch in terms of physical appearance.

Is there something different about folks who are prone to have affairs?

How come I simply cannot fall in love my reading what others write on the Internet?

I enjoy the exchange, but I think it is completely silly to fall in love in that manner. I can accept the Internet as a dating service, but that is all. For me to fall in love I must have the physical presence of the person.

Why is it that WW or WH fall in love with married people who sleep in bed with their spouses every night and have conjugal sex on a regular basis?

Why would any man (for example my wife’s OM) fall in love with a woman who sleeps naked or with just her panties every night with her husband? Why would anyone want to fall in love like that?

It would drive me craze to fall in love with a woman who is in bed with another man every night!

BTW, I don’t judge those who fall in love like that. I simply want to know WHY! It may help me understand my wife!

I have some questions, too. Or maybe they are just comments I don't know.

What I want to know is where these cheaters think they get off? I mean, this CC person thinks she gets to have it all? I mean, she gets to have her H and her marriage still, she gets to have had an affair that she thinks was just great, she gets to keep her family in tact now (for whatever thats worth -- not that it'll necessarily stay like that becasue she sure isn't working too hard at it), she gets to stay in contact with her gf (or at least she thinks she is trying to). I mean COME ON! How much more selfish can one person be?????? She doesn't even apologize for what she's done, she just thinks she's entitled to more more more! She comes here and wants people to FEEL SORRY for her and say poor baby, you were "in love" and everyone is SO SORRY that you lost your lover. And she BRAGS about her good sex life and how she got to have sex with her husband AND her lover???? And now, oh please, I can't take all this stuff your telling me and I don't want to listen to anything more that you have to say. I'll come back when I can handle it. WHAT? YOU got involved in an extra-marital affair. YOU are trying to continue it even AFTER you told you H!! What is there to "handle"???? Obviously you know what your doing, your just too damn selfish and not getting the support here that you expected to. Give me a break.

I'm sorry for ranting like that. I guess this just brings up feelings in me that I thought I was over. My H's situation was a part internet affair too and even though we've gone through all this and I thought I had talked it all out, this story just got to me.

So somebody tell me, what is up with these liars and cheaters??? Are they all just horribly selfish like this woman? Are they all addictive type people? And WHERE is people's common sense??? Grrrrr ....

Stanley,

Oh it is really very possible. People used to do it all the time with letters. In my parents time it happened all of the time during WWII. People got a letter from someone and they start to correspond, they start to talk about themselves and each other. They begin to share their problems, their successes, ...they begin to connect.

You have no doubt here that the biggest sex organ is the brain, and love is NOT all about sex. So via the internet now, one can meet and share ones life.

Looks for example are a relative thing and frankly as we age they become less important. Note that CC is in her 40's now. She is NOT looking for looks, heck she wasn't looking for a man. She connectted with a woman. Now she may have lesbian tendencies and I think it is safe to say that she is bisexual. But, my reading is that most people have a broader spectrum of sexual response that often thought.

But, it is the mind where all of this happens and the fantasy, the relationship with NO problems, mortgage payments, day care, jobs, disappointments is much easier to have via long distance. IT IS PERFECT.

Stanley, you won't fall in love because you are NOT looking for love when you go on the internet. You look for information, you look for guidance, but romance was not what you were looking for. You were happily married to your W. The key is that you found happiness and sustanence in your marriage. CC did not. Your W did not.

Trust me the human brain is an amazing thing. Consider the tribe that puts disks in the lips of their women. It was done to make them UGLY so another tribe would not want their women. Guess what the men in that tribe find them good looking. All the while knowing that other tribes would not.

I am sure I have not completely answered your question and the reason is I cannot give you a "good" answer. Just my opinions and observations.

I do hope your W does come out of this mess she created and that she can help you recover much of what you lost in this mess.

God Bless,

JL

CC,

Take your time. This takes time and requires a lot of patience. Come back when you are ready.

God Bless,

JL