Happy Thanksgiving guys! We're still doing very well (knock on wood); however, I'm nervous about the holiday b/c they always seem to set me back and I end up re-living the anger of the A. It happened on Halloween night and it happened the day after our anniversary too. Since we'll have company in town for both Thanksgiving and Christmas, I really hope I can hold it all together.

My H wore his wedding ring during sex with OW. I took mine off for a while, but am wearing it now. Don't know how I feel about the ring issue. My H always wore his and cheated anyway. It certainly wasn't a deterrent for the OW (quiet the contrary)! Have a nice holiday! -SNS

<small>[ March 08, 2005, 05:11 PM: Message edited by: Still-n-Shock ]</small>

Hey guys - I am now writing this reply for the third time because the first two got lost somehow. Hopefully you will only receive it once. Anyway, hope you had a happy Thanksgiving. We celebrated last week so yesterday was just immediate family. It turned out to be an awful night and morning. I went to bed in a mood and he woke up in one because of it. I returned to my crazy, angry self and he was crying and miserable. He thought we were back at square one. I felt it was just a bad day and that he would have to learn to deal with some of those. Luckily it only lasted a few hours and we were able to move on.
As far as the ring goes, he was very excited about the gesture. I feel as if I may have done this too soon, but it felt right at the time. My H didn't wear the first one mainly because he is not a jewelry wearer. Just a watch to work and that is it. As I said before, he wanted to wear the old one after the A, but that nauseated me. It never really bothered me because as you both said, it certainly doesn't stop someone from cheating. He says he is anxious to wear the new one. We'll see.
I think the holidays are hard for everyone. There is always a bad connection somehow. Hopefully this year they will pass quickly and uneventfully for all of us. My mom is having her surgery on Tuseday and will be in the H all week. I'm hoping it is an easy week at home because I couldn't handle that tension right now.
I give you both a lot of credit. As much as I prefer being happy and less angry, it is a battle everyday to push the images and thoughts aside. I struggle with it daily and can't imagine a time when I won't. On a brighter note, I hope you both enjoy the rest of your weekends.

hi there - haven't heard from anyone in a while. Hope all is okay. Mom had surgery this week and is starting a long recovery process. I have been spending most of my time at the hospital, but did make time to go to the MC with my H today. Not much new on that end, but only because I have been so busy with everything else. Fill me in on what's doing with everybody, I need a good distraction. MP

Hi MP,
I hope your Mom is doing well and I pray for her speedy recovery. All is pretty good here, although putting up the Christmas tree was hard for me. As I unpacked all of the ornaments (Our 1st Christmas; Our 1st Home; Baby's 1st, 2nd, etc... Christmas) I grew angrier and sadder by the second it seemed. We didn't have an argument, but I did express my pain, disbelief, disillusionment and sorrow at what he'd done to our family. All he could say is how sorry he is and how it will never happen again as long as we live. All in all though, I am doing pretty good considering and we, as a couple, seem better than we've been in years. Hope your recovery (and Andrew's) is going well too. -SNS

<small>[ March 08, 2005, 05:12 PM: Message edited by: Still-n-Shock ]</small>

Still-N-Shock,

I have read a little on this post and I am amazed how similar our situation's are. July 4 was my D-Day. I struggled on Halloween and Thanksgiving and putting up the tree.

My husband had a A with a woman we go to church with. He moved out for a short time. Since he has been home he has done everything possible to make this up to me.

It would be great to have someone else to talk with. I guess kinda of like a partner. I am at work right now but I will try to reach you later.

hi there - thanks for the good wishes. The recovery is going slowly but she is making progress. I feel terrible, I've hardly seen my kids in days and it is really hard. I know exactly what you mean when you say you were growing angrier by the second. Sometimes things will trigger me and I just grow angrier and angrier. The hospital is in the same city where the OW lives, so I find myself looking all over NYC for this person. How crazy is that? I'm convinced every 35 year old blonde woman is her. I know it's not productive, but I can't help myself.
I'm glad you made it through the tree without an argument or fight, that is one of the true signs of moving forward I think. Maybe the holidays will be better than you expect - kind of like a new beginning.
Well let's keep up the good work, I know how hard we are both trying.
Andrew - hope everything is okay with you. Let us know. MP

Hi all!

Thanks for the concern. Everything is fine..I've just been really busy at work lately. And...to be honest, I've tried to pull myself away from the this board a little bit. I think I needed some time to sort out what my situation actually is..and how it fits together with the situations that other people here are in. There is so much really good advice here. I decided to step back for a while and make sure that I am applying the MB principals in the right way. Does that make any sense?

MP...I think we are going through the sme thing. This is really an emotional rollercoaster. The hard part, I find, is the need to avoid love-busting. We've talked before about how hard it is to have to swallow things. I think it's inevitable that the sadness and anger are going to come out.

The hardest part, in my case, anyway, is getting past the notion that unless I am perfect, my marriage is in danger. That's a big burden. It's an unrealistic one, and it's one that I have put on myself. But..it's the way I feel sometimes. I think I am rambling. The question, I guess, is whether anyone here feels like they haven't been themselves since D-Day - like they are struggling to figure out exactly what they SHOULD be to make things work.

Anyway, having said all of that...I hope everyone has a great holiday. It's a tough time of year, I know. Try to find a way to make it special. My wife and I have done that by putting up our own Christmas tree in our bedroom. It's decorated with ornaments that we picked out or which we made for each other - no "kid" ornaments or anything. It's just for us.

MP...are you still pushing the polygraph issue? Your H said he wanted to talk to the MC first about that, right? Also, I hope your mom is doing well!

hi all - mom is doing a little better. Still in a step-down ICU, but slowly making progress. Probably another week in the H.
Andrew - I understand the need to take a break from the board for a while. Sometimes it does serve as a reminder, although I find comfort in hearing from you guys and swapping stories and advice. There is no anger towards you so I am able to think and write more clearly here. The emotional rollercoaster is a perfect way to describe my life. It is a constant up and down. I am happy one minute and miserable the next. When my H and I are together and things are good, I'm fine. As soon as something triggers me, everything goes wrong. I truly hate living life like this. Unfortunately, I don't think your goal of being PERFECT is realistic. Nobody is. You need to make sure your W can live with you and love you when you are perfect and when you are not. That is when you will know things are okay. Do you expect your W to be perfect 24/7? I'm sure you don't, so don't put that pressure on yourself either.
As far as the polygraph, I am still pushing it. I have only let it go for now because of my mom and I just don't have the energy to come home from the hospital every night to fight. I;m just too drained. When this is behind me, I will pursue it more. He knows I have not let up on it yet. I just feel like I need that final reassurance before I completely let myself move forward. We have spoken with the MC about it and unfortunatley for me, she does not believe in it or its accuracy. I'll have to go this one alone.
SNS - things sound like they are going well for you and your H. Keep up the good work. I am in envy of all who are able to do this without so much anger and sadness. Pass along your advice to making it work.
Enjoy the holiday season everyone. MP

Hello all!

MP I think about you often. What a double whammy for you, first the A, then your Mom's illness. Boy, when it rains it pours doesn't it?
You know, I get angry at my H the most when I think about how much I had on my plate already without him dumping his A in my lap to deal with as well. Right now all of my energy needs to be focused on fighting with the school board for speech and occupational therapy for our child instead of fighting off anger and images of my H with his OW.

For the most part these are feelings that go through me daily and I come here and read or I work through them within myself as opposed to hashing it out with my H, again. What is the point in that? What is done is done. He is sorry. I'm trying to come to terms with it and move on. I hope I can. If not, I'll know I gave it my best shot. If he ever does anything remotely unfaithful or deceitful again, I'm out of here. I figure there is no point beating him down with his failures as a human being b/c there will always be some OW ready and willing to fill his head full of wonderful compliments, etc... and then there we'll be again, another affair, another D-Day and a painful divorce.

For me, getting over the fact that he cheated, as hard as that is, is not as hard as realizing that I didn't make a wise choice for a life partner. I wanted someone who'd always put family first, not themselves. I wanted a man of honor and integrity. I wanted someone who was mature and a good judge of character, not someone who was extremely impulsive and prone to engage in self-pity and self-indulgence. I wanted someone I could respect and my children could look up to. I wanted someone I could trust. I made a bad choice and that is hard for me to live with. I'm questioning my own judgment. I remember seeing OW's name on H's phone and wondering, "Who is ---?" but not even asking him or following up on it further. I look bakc on how stupid I was not to realize something was up when school should get out at 10:00 p.m. and yet the professor ALWAYS held them over, the traffic was ALWAYS bad, etc... so he got home late every single time. I considered myself hard to fool and yet he easily carried on an A for 9 weeks.

Sorry I'm rambling. I'm very sick with a bad cold and a high fever. Maybe I'm delirius. I understand what Andrew says about needing to be perfect. Kind of goes with what I said about not arguing about the A anymore for fear it will lead to another A. Plus I feel the pressure to wear makeup, shave my legs, dress up, wear pretty lingerie, have sex more often, etc.... My ultimate fear is that so much resentment will build up inside of me that one day I'll just say, "That's it. I'm done. Have a nice life!" It is like my marrige is fake in many ways. We seem happier. We don't fight or argue. We spend more time together, laugh more, blah, blah, blah... but is it a facade or is it real??? I don't know yet. -SNS

hey SNS - WOW - it's like the first time I heard from you on this board and said how it amazed me that someone else was writing the EXACT words that I was thinking. I feel exactly the same way now. I am furious that I have to focus any energy on him and us when it should be used for other things like my mom (or in your case, your child). I too feel like I made a bad decision in my choice of a H. I always wonder how I could have decided to have children with a man like this, someone who could do this to me. Like you, I too suspected something and said nothing until the day I actually caught him. I guess we never think these "good guys" we married could ever do that, so there was no need to question them. How naive we were. At least we know we will never be duped again. You are not rambling or delirious at all, in fact I think you sound quite sane. I know the pressures you feel and they suck!!! They are the ones who should feel the pressure to be perfect. I do feel both people need to work harder on the things that made the marriage not great in the first place, but the pressure to be perfect should be on them. They should spend most of their waking moments figuring out ways to make us feel good about ourselves and rebuilding our confidence and our trust. While I know that is unreasonable, I wish it were true. Your ultimate fear is mine as well, that I will put all this work into it and then decide I can't live the rest of my life with him knowing what I know. I feel bad that you are sick and dealing with this. I too had bronchitis this week with fever on top of everything else and it just stinks. I tried to explain to my H last night how I had just reached my limit. The way I tried to explain it was that each individual dilemma is a layer and the layers are just building up too high and I've hit my max. We talked through it, but I don't know how often I can talk myself through it. It is sooooo tiring. Well I hope you feel better soon. You need to take care of yourself!! Maybe when your energy returns, you won't feel as pessimistic as you do today. As you know each day brings new and different feelings.
Just a question for both you and Andrew: Next week is my H's office holiday party. I have decided not to go. I feel weird, even though he insists nobody in the office knows a thing. He feels I should try to go as a matter of respect for him and his work. I know the subject of his travel will be a good portion of the conversation
and I just don't feel like dealing with it. What is both of your opinions on the subject?

hey SNS - WOW - it's like the first time I heard from you on this board and said how it amazed me that someone else was writing the EXACT words that I was thinking. I feel exactly the same way now. I am furious that I have to focus any energy on him and us when it should be used for other things like my mom (or in your case, your child). I too feel like I made a bad decision in my choice of a H. I always wonder how I could have decided to have children with a man like this, someone who could do this to me. Like you, I too suspected something and said nothing until the day I actually caught him. I guess we never think these "good guys" we married could ever do that, so there was no need to question them. How naive we were. At least we know we will never be duped again. You are not rambling or delirious at all, in fact I think you sound quite sane. I know the pressures you feel and they suck!!! They are the ones who should feel the pressure to be perfect. I do feel both people need to work harder on the things that made the marriage not great in the first place, but the pressure to be perfect should be on them. They should spend most of their waking moments figuring out ways to make us feel good about ourselves and rebuilding our confidence and our trust. While I know that is unreasonable, I wish it were true. Your ultimate fear is mine as well, that I will put all this work into it and then decide I can't live the rest of my life with him knowing what I know. I feel bad that you are sick and dealing with this. I too had bronchitis this week with fever on top of everything else and it just stinks. I tried to explain to my H last night how I had just reached my limit. The way I tried to explain it was that each individual dilemma is a layer and the layers are just building up too high and I've hit my max. We talked through it, but I don't know how often I can talk myself through it. It is sooooo tiring. Well I hope you feel better soon. You need to take care of yourself!! Maybe when your energy returns, you won't feel as pessimistic as you do today. As you know each day brings new and different feelings.
Just a question for both you and Andrew: Next week is my H's office holiday party. I have decided not to go. I feel weird, even though he insists nobody in the office knows a thing. He feels I should try to go as a matter of respect for him and his work. I know the subject of his travel will be a good portion of the conversation
and I just don't feel like dealing with it. What is both of your opinions on the subject?

Hi MP,
I'm glad you can relate to what I wrote. I know under the MB philosophy what I said would be considered "love busting" but it is how I feel. The way I see it is if we can share these things with one another on this board, we're less apt to blurt it out to our H in the heat of an argument. It certainly helps to know other people really understand what it feels like and know what you're going through. Thanks for that.

As for the office party, I've been reading many posts on this topic lately. My H isn't having an "office party" per se, but several people from his work are having parties that we've been invited to. Some of my H's friends from work know some (but not all) of the story. When I kicked him out after D-Day he was a mess at work, plus he was looking for a place to live so some of his close friends know something was up. He told them it was an EA with some kissing, but didn't admit to the sex (just like he did with me in the beginning). Now, these are men so I'm sure in their heart of hearts they're thinking, "Yeah, sure, okay, whatever you say...".

In any event, they don't know the OW and since she doesn't work with H, we wouldn't have to worry about running into her at any of these parties. I'm going (we're only going to one)b/c I think part of what led to the A in the first place is that after having two babies in 13 months and quitting my job to be a SAHM, I wasn't visible in my H's life any more. It was if I no longer existed. I was stuck at home with two babies, plus I didn't feel like going out until I lost the baby weight, was getting a decent night's sleep, wasn't breast feeding, etc... All of that helped put a wedge between us.

My H is and has always been more sociable than I am. He likes being around people, going to parties, mingling, talking, etc... I am more of a loner and don't really enjoy making small talk with people, etc...

Since the A, we've tried to have a "date" every now and again (as much as we can arrange with a 3 and a 4 year old) and my H likes that. I think he wants a wife he can take out and be proud of. Plus, I want us to put forth a united front. To remind everyone, yes they're happily married, there she is, I haven't seen her in a while but she looks great. I think my H likes it when everyone comments on how lucky he is and how nice his wife looks. I think if my H is always out by himself and looks alone and single, OW will approach him more readily than if everytime he is at a function he is accompanied by his W and we look happy together. OW don't want to be embarrased or shot down, so I don't think they move in on men that they don't feel they have a chance with.

That is just my thinking. As you say, our feelings fluctuate from day to day, so when it comes time to actually go to the party, I may say no. You know I do look better than I have in about 5 years. I'm the same size now as I was b/4 I got pregnant so I feel like I've got my body back finally. My baby was only 4 months old when I got pregnant with baby #2 so it was like I was pregnant for two straight years!!

Now I have a question for you...my H went into the university yesterday to check the roster for his upcomming classes (as he does every semester to make sure OW is not in his class nor even in the same building at the same time as him) and sure enough she had signed up for both of the same classes. This is the same thing that happened last semester. Two days after D-Day she called him and told him she'd changed her schedule to make sure they wouldn't be in the same class; however, when he went in to verify that, she was still in the class. He dropped out for that semester. When he went back in October, she had already registered so he picked classes she wasn't in. She then changed her schedule and added one of his classes. Since this is the THIRD time this has happened, don't you think this is purposeful on her part? My H says, "Well, we do have the same major so it is possible that she is just ending up in the same classes as me without even knowing it." My response to that is, well right after D-Day she took the initiative to contact you to let you know she'd change her schedule to avoid seeing you (so she is aware it can and should be done) so why isn't she checking b/4 she adds a class to make sure H isn't in there already.

Maybe she is trying to get into a class with him to see if things can resume again. Maybe she thinks we've had our "cooling off" period and she can move back in. Maybe she doesn't care if he is in the class or not and figures he can be burdened by checking and changing his schedule around to avoid her, not vice versa. Maybe she is just trying to be a b*tch? This makes me angry b/c H let me sit there and listen to him on the phone telling her good bye, thanks for being a friend when I needed one, I wish you well, you're a good person, yuck, yuck, yuck...! This was when he was still insisting there had been no sex. I still can't believe he let me sit there and listen to his "kiss a$$" good bye knowing he'd had sex with this person and knowing he was still lying to me about it. I think if he'd have ended it differently, she wouldn't want to be anywhere near him. I think he should have ended it in such a way that she'd never want to see or hear from him again.

What do you think? Just keep doing what we're doing and change his schedule everytime she ends up in his class? Confront her? I think she must be seeking out some sort of confrontation or contact indirectly, what do you think?

Thanks! -SNS

Hey MP!

THe holiday party question seems to come up a lot. I'm not sure what the answer is. I went to my wife's party last night, and though nobody there knows anything about the A, it still seemed kind of weird. I posted about this in the "recovery" section, but...there was a guy there who was pretty self-centered and who seemed to like to talk about himself a lot. I talked to him and didn't like him..and I think a bunch of other people didn't either. Still...I was pretty envious because I thought that, even though this guy is a jerk, his wife has probably been faithful to him. It's irrational, I know. But...it's the kind of thing that can make a Yuletide party less than festive.

There is a lot of sense in what SNS said about putting up a unified appearance. But maybe it's too soon after D-Day for you. One thing that I am leaarning - and which I think it is important for our spouses to learn - is that affairs leave many, many scars and affect aspects of our lives that we probably hadn't thought about.

Since I found out about my wife's A, for instance, I've given up most of the things I used to do. I was an officer in our PTA. But..I've skipped the last two meetings and I'm going to resign. The OM's wife is a member - that's one reason. But..more importnatly, the A has stripped a lot of the life out of me. I simply can't go to a PTA meeting and pretend that it matters or that I am interested right now.

I suspect that you feel the same way about the party. You don't want to go and put on a happy face - particularly for your husband's sake.

I think that if you do decide not to go, your H will have to face the fact that the fact that he's alone is a consequence of HIS action. The Chrismas party is one of the many casualites of the affair.

Does this make any sense?

hey guys - hope you both had a good weekend. So much to respond to.... As far as the holiday party and all of your wise suggestions, I agree about the unified front. My H definitely is looking for that as well. He thinks it would be more suspicious if we didn't go together. As much as he would like me to go, he also understands why I might not want to. It's not so much the people there as it is the conversation about the travel. I know it will come up constantly. My H's response is that it is not the subject matter, but how we handle it together and that if we are standing there holding hands and just say "yes, we're glad it's over", we can move on, have a fun evening, and deal with it as a couple.
Andrew - you are not irrational!!! From D-Day forward, each one of us has thoughts that might seem crazy to others, but certainly not to anybody who is in our place. Everything can be a trigger to make you think about the A, even if it's some jerk who you know has a faithful wife. Things like that always make me start thinking about my H's affair. I look at everybody I know and wonder to myself, is that H cheating? I do it ALL the time. The craziest, most innocent things can set me off for an entire day. Isn't it sad that the guilty one's actions have stripped the life from the innocent ones? Whether it is going to a party, or attending a meeting, I think it is so unfair how the A affects every aspect of our being. I wonder if that ever passes. I'm curious why it was weird to be at the party if nobody from work knew? I too am afraid it will be weird even though nobody knows. Andrew, I must say your motivation and spirit don't seem as high as usual. Has something happened or is it just a passing thing? You are generally so much more positive. I hope things are still okay...
SNS - in re: to your question, it is quite obvious to me that the OW has made an effort to be in classes with your H. It seems clear from what you have said that she is either trying to see him or at the least get his attention. Is she much younger? It seems like an immature attempt at having him call or contact her, even if it's for a negative reason. It's almost like a child looking for negative attention. I do think if he contacts her it will be exactly what she is looking for so I would not. I think the more you (your H) ignores her, the more likely it is that she will just go away. Since she has not made any overt attempts at contacting him, she probably won't. My best advice is to ignore her. I really believe otherwise she would be getting exactly what she is looking for. Have him change his schedule until this monster goes away!
Someone tell me when this all gets easier. I wish I had a crystal ball and could predict whether in 5 years we will all be in happy relationships or if all this hard work was a waste of time.

Hi MP!

Thanks for your concenr. I'm fine, in general. I think I'm just at that point in recovery when the anger surfaces a little bit. I've been told that you eventually find a "safe" spot where you feel secure that the marriage isn't in imminent danger and you can grieve a little bit. I think that's where I am.

One more thing on the party issue: Is there any way your H can skip it? You don't want to go, and he doesn't want to go without you, it seems. So...why not go out someplace else for the evening, just the two of you? It would be a good chance to re-connect...and it would give the two of you some togetherness time that is really hard to find during the holidays.

Anyway, I hope all is well with you. I hope, also, that your mother is feeling better. I will keep her in my prayers.

Hello MP and Andrew,

Everyone in my house is very sick (except WH). My 4 year old has pneumonia, my 3 year old has bronchitis and I feel like I have the flu. I'm the only one who hasn't been to the doctor yet, but probably need to go as I'm not getting any better. My mother-in-law comes in to town for a week starting Monday the 20th and her room isn't ready and my house is a wreck.

MP, I feel horribly selfish complaining about the above when your mother is so sick. How is she? Is she out of the hospital? My prayers are with you!

Thanks for your advice about the OW trying to get H's attention by signing up for all of his classes. We're going to ignore her but it still makes me angry at H that he brought this on-going problem into our lives. Who knows what else she does, drive by our house? H's work? She is 34 years old. I wish she'd go away! I remember long ago our MC said I should feel sorry for her b/c she is obviously messed up. I guess there was some truth to what he said (but I don't feel any sympathy for her)!

What did you decide about the Christmas party? It may be a moot point for me as I may be too sick (or the kids still too sick) for us to go - and no, he won't be going to any parties without me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> !

Take care all, SNS

hi guys - looks like my mom will be coming home at the end of this week. She is SLOWLY getting better. She will need an aide at home with her in the beginning, but she is finally starting to improve. Just as a side note, my wallet was stolen from her hospital room today. Luckily my sister-in-law went searching the floor and found it (minus the cash) in the bathroom garbage along with 2 other people's wallets. As if I don't have enough going on!!! Anyway, Andrew I understand what you are saying about the safe spot. Although I am not there yet, I can see what you are saying about the anger. Mine creeps up at some point every single day. Some days I just don't act on it as much as others. Have you spoken with your W about this and what are her feelings on this? I'm always curious how your W acts in these situations since I am always dealing with the male perspective. I wonder if she deals with things the way our H's do. It's just an interesting thing to think about.
SNS - so sorry to hear how sick you all are - you should get yourself to a doctor!!! Your nice, you actually let your mother in law stay with you. Does she know about the A? I am always so tempted to tell mine, but I know it would come back to hurt me in the end.
About the party . . . I like the idea about neither of us going, but it is not really feasible. It is a small company and it would be really unprofessional for him not to be there. As it turns out, I have another party that night and with my mom first coming home, it's just a bad night. There is no chance of OW being there, so I don't feel too uncomfortable with him going alone. I wish I could talk to the MC about this, but we have had to cancel last 2 appts. since I have been at the hospital each time. As always, thanks for your thoughts and prayers. It has been a long day so I will try to go to bed without images, thoughts or anger and just get a good night sleep. Speak to you soon. MP

Hey MP,

That is horrible about your wallet. That is pretty low to go into someone's hospital room and steal a wallet. You know I often wonder what is the world coming to. Does anyone have any morals? I guess the only good thing is that you recovered all of your credit cards. I'm truly sorry that happened to you. I am, however, so glad to hear that your mother will be coming home soon.

My MIL and SIL don't know about H's affair. He can do no wrong in their eyes and I'm sure they'd find a way to make it all my fault. My FIL knows (my H's parents are divorced) and he was none to happy with his son. My H's parents divorced b/c H's mother cheated on H's father. She left him and moved in with OM (who left his wife and family) and they lived together for 20 years or more. He just recently moved back in with his wife (felt he owed it to her to take care of her as her health is failing). Is that a bizzare setup or what?

My H's childhood was not good as a result of his parent's divorce which is another reason why I felt certain he wouldn't not do that to his own children. Wrong!

H's affair started during MIL's last visit. That is when he'd go out for a 30 minute errand and be gone for 2-3 hours leaving me home to entertain her. She and I both commented on how long he'd stay gone and wonder aloud what in the world could be taking him so long. Maybe she suspected something then, who knows... I know he took advantage of every opportunity to leave here to go see or talk to OW. Again, how stupid could I be??? I was too busy with her and my 2 and 3 year old plus planning H's birthday dinner!

Yesterday H had to go in the safe to get our child's birth certificate and he told me he felt horrible b/c when he opened the safe pictures from our honeymoon fell out. He said he still can't believe that was him- that he did that. I'm through trying to understand it myself. There is nothing about it that makes sense to me. No way to rationalize that behavior.

I closely followed the Laci Peterson murder trial and everyday H and I would talk about what was happening in the case and what a scumb bag Scott Peterson was and all the while my H was doing the same sort of things as Peterson. Go figure.

I can't believe Christams is 10 days away. I am so unprepared. I know you're probably similarly unprepared for the holidays. This is my favorite time of the year too so I wishe things were better all around so I could savour it!

Take care, SNS

SNS - hi how are you feeling? I hope everyone is getting better at your house. Isn't it awful that the MIL and SIL's don't know. I feel the same way that they would find a way to blame me. My H agrees with me about that and since I am desperate not to have my kids find out, I will never say anything. I don't trust them to watch what they say around their families. My MIL has not once offered to help out with my kids during this entire thing with my mom. I made my H call her tonight and tell her how he has taken off from work the last 3 Wednesdays and how we have friends helping out around the clock. I'm sure she doesn't even feel badly!

Your MIL's situation sounds a little wacky. I have never heard anything like that in my life. No wonder your H had some childhood issues. Not that it gives him a right to cheat. I always say to my H I wish he had asked for a divorce or to go to MC first. It is such a better option. I know hindsight is 20/20, but really had they done that, our worlds would be a much better place right now.

I wonder about the Peterson trial as well. I've even said to my H what if his OW turned out to be crazy and hurt me, you or one of our kids? He didn't know her that well - she easily could have been a psycho. That makes me furious all the time. Unfortunatley, it doesn't take much to make me furious. Almost anything that triggers a thought of her can do that to me. I said to him the other day that it makes me insane that she is going on with her life, while we are plagued with this 24/7. I wish she was suffering at least half as much as we are. I can't stand that she gets to lead a normal life and mine is so screwed up - thanks in large part to her.

Anyway, enough rambling. By the way, I am definitely not going to the office party and as long as I can find a babysitter, I will be going to my friends going away party. Try to enjoy the holiday season, even if it's just for you and the kids!!! MP

Howdy!

MP, I know exactly what you mean when you say OW's life goes on as usual with absolutley no repercussions, while the BW and WH's lives are forever changed. That really makes my blood boil. She protected her world and ruined mine. I do know from the grapevine that everyone that works with her considers her a sl*t! From what I hear she has 4-5 guys on a string at any given time and I believe the father to one of her children is and was married at the time she got pregnant.

My H says that she didn't want anyone to find out either and on D-Day she was afraid I'd go to her workplace and she'd get fired. She threatened H that if I caused her any trouble she would cause him plenty of trouble. She especially didn't want her mother to find out so I have considered writing her mother a letter on several occassions, but I haven't done it. Maybe if she signs up for the same class as my H AGAIN next semester I will write her mother. Her mother is always watching her three kids while she goes to school at night so I don't think her Mom would appreciate knowing that when school lets out early, her daughter takes MM to hotels.

I found out yesterday how to subpeona H's Nextel Direct Connect phone records. He thought since they used the direct connect "walkie talkie" feature there wouldn't be any trace of the calls. He had always promised me he didn't talk to her on Mother's Day, my birthday, his birthday, etc... any special dates or events etc. Whatever! I said wouldn't it be interesting to see just how many times a day you called her vs. her calling you since you say she pursued you! He was stumbling all over his words, saying, "Well, I would initiate most of the calls b/c she never knew when it was safe to call me." He doesn't want me to see those phone records that is for sure. He said, "Well, I called her alot, so you're going to see alot of calls." I said, "Yep, and I'll get to see how many nights you two got out of class early too b/c if there are calls b/4 10:00 p.m. on a Monday or Thursday night that means you're both out of class and driving and talking about where you can pull over and make out." I'd also get to see what time you got out of class on the night you checked into the Howard Johnson's and what time you left the hotel (in otherwords how long they were in the room). I'd see how many times he would be talking to me and then immediatley call her or vice versa. I'd also be able to see if he was calling her while he was taking the children somewhere or keeping them while I went for a doctor's appt. or hair appt., etc... He swore he never talked to her around or in front of the children.

Now, I don't know if I will actually get the records or not b/c that would only create more torture for myself seeing it all in black and white. If I looked at those records he'd probably be back on the street looking for a place to live. That wouldn't really be fair to him since he has admitted calling her and vice versa, so seeing how much they talked isn't healthy for me or our recovery. I don't think I will do it, but I'm glad he knows it can be done in case he thought the walkie-talkie feature of the Nextel was a safe way to communicate with her or anyone else in the future for that matter. Since I'm trying to recover I know I shouldn't go there, but boy is it tempting. I'll keep it on the back burner for now. Another down side is that since it is his work phone, Nextel would most likely notify his employer when they received the subpoena and I'm sure they'd want to know why I was doing it.

Our Christmas party is tonight. I don't know who will be there. OW shouldn't be there as she doesn't work with H, but if she knew we were going and she was trying to see him, she might find a way to get invited or go with someone who was invited. We shall see. I think seeing her would make my H physically ill. He hates the day he laid eyes on her. He said if a friend of his confided that they were thinking of cheating he'd tell him to slam his p*nis in a door as that would be less painful.

I'll let you know how the party goes. We won't be staying long as we're both under the weather. H went to the doctor this morning and has sinusitis.

Take care! -SNS