LAdysheep,,
in the past when i ,emtioned an agry outburst,, all i actually allowed was for my voice to become raised. As if in a firm tone. As in maybe you need to just listen sort of thing. I wasn't yelling. My question is, is this act not normal? Am i realy that much out of control?
I could understand this, if i was to be yelling. Now, is there even a difference?

As for me asking her questions, i have asked her about the other guy.
Other than that the questions i have asked, are like how are you? Type of questions,,i have not asked her her whereabouts. I really think and or freel that its not necassary. WHen she was home, i'd ask her those ?, now i'm considered controlling.
when i have attempted to not answer, she becomes a little aggresive if you will. There's something she usually says, (can't remember at the moment) anyhow, i usually give my info, but not complete.
I think what she actualls says, is more in the lines of accusing me of something,,, next time i'll have to pay more attention.Ok? LOL
I know when she thought i had a girl, she asked several times about my plans. Like maybe, 5

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">when she left, she said "Steve don't you want me to be happy?"
How selfish, at the expense of her family </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You know, thats exactly what i thought at first, eventually somehow, i started thinking i was selfish, for thinking that. Also cuz for quite some time i have been informed i'm selfish,, recently, i'm back to knowing that *her* decision, was selfish.

I gave her an angry outburst again today as she turned and walked away rudely said "Good-bye"
Really don't blame you there. Look how she treated your daughter.
Really, i do need to have this question answered, is this really a sing of being angry, and out of control? I have always thought it was a normal reaction, if frustrated, then my tone will be according,, same if excited, my tone will still be louder than the norm,, just under different circumstances. All i allowed was just a little volume, spoke like there was an exclamation point at the end of my words.

While i was there yesterday, (name) drove by,, i asked W about why didn't he stop, cuz i was here?
She emailed me last night, informing me he was in the mobile home park, visiting a friend of his.
My response simply was, i appreaciate you sharing this,, I also asked if it was (sons) week-end with dad. Yes.

She emailed me also to inform me just how daughters, and my behavior had her so she couldn't think clearly,,,so she decided to just walk away. so i said some times a time out is necassary.

She also spopke of yesterdays im'ing deal,, how she was so ssslllooowwww. and was trired, if i remember,, she was still on her second cup of coffee,,, ok.

At times i wonder, what is it like to be so perfect, innocent, and never wrong. hmmm It truly amazes me, how she is never incorrect,, is this part of her fogged game,, or what?

You won't like this,,but: i spent six hours today, trying to send her an email. I checked it several times, for anything that may, or might be used against me. While talking with the courts recently, they advised me to protest, and they added that she should not in any way be attempting to encourage me, to contact her.

Ladysheep, often its like we're actually back in the conflict stage, again. Yet, at the same time maybe its just me,,

The PPO, yes i can have it sent registered mail. Even if i can't get it to her, i'm still going to go to court,,,
I read somebodys post about background search,, there has been a few jobs i was convinced i would get hired for. Ended up not. For the most part i think its been cuz i still show signs of being kicked around some,, now i wonder if the PPO does have anything to do with it.

Again, no i'am not going to give up any custody, I know that would be a mistake!! Yes, i just spoke firm again,, yikes.

Is it truly possible for people to always remain, calm, cool collect??

Hi Stephen,

Is it truly possible for people to remain calm, cool, and collect?
In your situation, I don't think so. But speaking in a firm way is o.k. Don't let her
manipulate with the "you are yelling thing."
Yelling is not abuse. It's the words that may
come out that can be abusive. You just have to
bite your tongue sometimes if other things would like to come out of your mouth. I think you've handled it pretty well, if all you have done is said "Good-bye" in an angry tone. Nothing wrong with that.
I guess. What does she want your respect and well wishes!! LOL

Ladysheep

Hi Ladysheep,
i think i'm finally realizing one of my issues,, i'm still wanting to be understood from where my wife is concerned.

Regards to me, my frustration,, i don't mean to blame, but (example) last Sunday when all of the sudden i'm approached with *YOU LIAR!* and the rest that followed,, i was so caught off gaurd,, yes i *reacted*,, i'm not a switch,,,

I'm realizing/learning that i really should not have been acepting, I thought it was ok,, sake of arguing,,, I didn't care who was right/wrong,,

Anyhow, i'm getting back to me finally taking back my own power,,,and start standing back up!!!

I taught my wife how to treat me,,,now hopefully theres time to renigotiate,,

I still pray for a reconciliation!!!

God of Israel tells us he hates divorce
God tells us that all marriages can reconcile, *that none shall parish*

<small>[ September 01, 2003, 02:18 PM: Message edited by: Stephan ]</small>

Hi Stephen,

How are you feeling today?

Are children all in school?
Mine starts this morning.
He did seem excited and left
very early, so I pray he has
and excellent year. He's in
8th grade. Teenagers!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />
I worry more about teen girls,
than I do teen boys. How bout
you?

Ladysheep

Hi to ya!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
I'm feeling ok,,,i still have too many confusing/blue moments though. thanks. And yourself?
W and I were on the phone again today, it went ok. We talked for maybe half an hour. Mostly about her job, some about us. Discussed our last episode, referring to the dog thing. I was informed i didn't support her, adding she felt the dog wouldn't be able to handle going from home to home,,,, So, i reassured her(that day) i was truly saddened.

My children started school last week, yay!!!
My three year old started Head Start today. He has a major seperation issue.

Thursday find out if my 5 year old has to have surgery for her eyes. After her brain tumor was removed, one of her eyes stays turned in. For the past year we've been trying glasses in hopes,,

Yeppers, i worry about teen girls,, especially mine. She has always had the rule, no boyfriends. This is one rule she has decided she doesn't need. SO, i informed her last year that she does NOT have to go thru drivers training. The earned and privialage thing.
She now agrees with the rule.
My childrens ages are, 14D,9th grade, 12S,7th grade 5D,young fives, (her third year in school) and 3S, now head start.

My oldest two recently suggested that they get ahold of my W, informing her they would move out for awhile, if it would help things. Adding that they don't want to, but,,,,,they're taking into consideration of the five and three year olds. In a way, i think thats wonderful of them, yet at the same time its quite saddening.

You have just one child? Does he like school? All of mine do!!!

Hi Stephan,

This shocked me!!
My oldest two recently suggested that they get a hold of my w. informing her they would move out for a while if it would help things. Adding that they don't want to, but,,,they're taking into consideration of the 5 and 3yr olds. In a way that's wonderful of them, yet at the same time it's saddening.
This is why this shocked me. Your 12 and 14yr olds are blaming themselves now. I remember you posting previously that your W did not want one of them in the home any longer. Those children came way before she came to be your wife, and she has made them feel its their fault now. I don't know Stephan, but the children hopefully will be in counseling soon. That is heartbreaking, and how could your wife even ask you to pick or choose her over your own children. That is just sick!!!! And if you do, you are even sicker than her!!!!

My 18yr old D didn't get along w/ my husband very well in the beginning of our marriage (she was 16 at that time), and she was very mean to him, especially when she was on drugs. She didn't like a man in the house at all. But I could never kick her out because of her hatred at that time for him, and choose my husband over her. I bore those children, love them dearly and they stay w/ me reguardless.
We worked through it, and she's off drugs, and loves and respects him now.

We learned early on that I continue the discipline in the household only, not H. My
children never had a male in the home, until he
came along. And it was a difficult adjustment for them. Through therapy, we came to that decision, and it has worked very well. He talks to me if he feels that S has done something wrong, and I take the lead at disciplining, but usually I know what son is doing before my H does. This is what I suggest for you. Did your wife feel it was her responsibility to discipline your older ones? Did she discipline them? Not a good idea if she did. It would cause resentment. Now with the little ones yes it is a matter that both of you should discipline them when needed.

Over all I feel very sad for your older ones. Your wife I believe treated them terrible, and yes maybe they treated her terrible too, but who is the adult there? Did the older child hear her say she wanted him/her out. How saddening <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> . That is why they are saying they will leave. They are 14 and 12 yrs old for goodness sake!!! What did she want you to do
put them on the street so she could have a better marriage/family w/ you? Then she leaves, leaving the little ones with you and taking her older ones. She is just so messed up!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Sent with Love, Ladysheep

Ladysheep,,
there was a time that my two oldest were blaming themselve quite a bit. They still do, just not as much. Recently we had this discussion again, abiut them moving out,and them feeling responsible. While we were talking, the tears were flowing. My 14 D suggested that they move out, therefore they can build an relationshipp with their mother, and it also woild help benefit my younger two.

My oldest heard my W request my son move out. The only way i would have even considered this, would have been for a temp. situation, where all of us was with the agreement that it was only temp. Ladysheep, when my W first started saying this, which was quite some time ago.(first of Aug.?) At first i thought she was suggesting this only to try to use against me.Two weeks ago, I informed my son this is his home, he will not have to move to his mothers, he gave me a big HUG!!! Then said Thank you dad!!! My W stated to the FOC, she'd keep custody of our son, allow me custody of our daughter. From all the talk, and the amount of times, my wife has always came up with an excuse as to why not, regards to getting back together. One was her new job,,, one was her mom doesn't want to live alone anymore,,, the bathroom wasn't finished,, I don't know.

When W requested, (last year) that I move my two children to their mom's, when I explained they're my responsibility, the guy their mom lives with is not, and will not be responsible for my responsibilities! Their mom does not work, and they're not married. My wife's reply was * you mean you'd pick your children over me, YOUR SICK! YOUR MESSED UP!! Yes in some ways I will pick my children over my w.

Yes my W felt it was her responsibility. In our beginning i had suggested that I discipline my two, i feel she may have took this offensively. Thinking, hoping, that we all would be as if a natural family. Eventually I gave in,,, when we first were married, i suggested that i still do things with just my two, the same as her, with hers. That wasn't a good idea. I don't mean that way all the time, meaning that we all still go out and about as a whole family as well.

No Ladysheep,, I'm the one messed up!!!
Recently my W was informing me she was upset, and it hust her cuz i didn't say *Ilove you* often enough. So me, Mr. Mouth, commented about all of my actions!!! Sharing with her that my actions spoke quite clear, and loud. I always brought flowers, cards,,,cooked meaks,, and the list goes on,,, I'd always hear how i was sick. I discussed one time, asking that maybe i could recieve some *loving* from at least one time? I heard again i was sick. I used to always go wash her back, in the shower, after several months, again i shared with her that some times i thought it would be ok, for certain doors to be opened, Guess what? Again, I was sick! Quite often I'd wait up for her, i'd sit at this damn computer, sharing her interests,,, again, sick! Nite after nite i'd be awaken to listen to her night while at work, i asked if maybe *once* she could come home to me, and or us? Sick!

Counseling,, yes, she wants to see me one more time before the children.
One thing I truly struggle with, just like I stated to and with my W in Jan. We're family, we're not suppose to turn our backs on each other. But, unfortuneatly, our world has tought us to do just that!!! Granted, there are exceptions,,,I'll tell ya, when a wife wants to become an ex-wife, and when her war paint comes on LOOK OUT!!! RUN!!!
Its scary,,,
Back in Feb. My W accused me of something, something quite i=on the serious side,,,the counselor stated i prepare myself to go to jail.
He has seen this before, (kind of woman) included. Not often, but has seen this before. Now maybe, after i said its scary, maybe you can understand, or *feel* just a little bit more, as to just how serious I was.
I often wonder if she's even dome with me?
While on the phone yesterday, we discussed last Friday's ordeal. Guess what??? I stood my ground, and stated again, i never once yelled. All i was, was upset, cuz *my* daughter was saddened. I then heard how I didn't support her. She added that the dog shouldn't be expected, and the dog can't handle. being drug around back and forth to house to house. After each time i do, or have stood up to her, hours later i actually become quite nervous. Again, wondering,,,
Five minutes ago, an individual pulled up, in his hands i could tell was some *official* looking papers. Yeppers, you guessed it correct, He was a server. He was here to serve some papers on my W though. The year we found out our daughter had cancer,,, my step daughter one week before, was hit by a car, after school at the crossing area. The ambulance bill is still outstanding.
Yes, before i knew what was what, i was scared.

Before i was fired, a State Police drove thru the parking lot for several minutes,, Ladysheep, i was actually trembling!!! About a month ago i answered the ringing phone, the individual said who he was, and where he was from, A Police Dept. MY first thought was W was doing something in regards to this PPO!!! This BOGUS PPO

Yes, she is my Wife, and i still want to do what is right. I'm not referring to what the world thinks is right,,, I pray.

Hi Stephan,

Two weeks ago, I informed my son this is his home, he will not have to move to his mothers, he gave me a big Hug. Then said Thankyou Dad!!!
Awe, he must have felt such love and relief at that moment <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> . And even though W wants to leave doesn't mean all the children get split up too. You have done the right thing keeping them w/ you, and not sending them to mom's that would probably do more harm than good from the sounds of it.

Stephan, if she thinks all those sweet actions that you told about are sick, something is wrong w/ her perception of what sick and well mean. Was she abused in past relationships?

Now maybe after I said it's scary, maybe you can understand or *feel* just a little bit more, as to just how serious I was. I often wonder if she's even done w/ me.
She definitely has not given you any reason to trust her lately. Just guard you heart for now.
She is talking, even if it is mixed up, fog talk.

While on the phone yesterday we discussed last Fridays ordeal. Guess what, I stood my ground....She added that the dog con't handle being drug around back and forth to house to house.
Wow, she's worried about how the dog feels being drug from house to house. Does she care how the children feel being ddrug from house to house? That amazes me. The dog would probably enjoy it more than the children do.

The year we found out our daughter had cancer,,,my step daughter, one week before was hit by a car.
I'd have to say you family has been through a lot of trauma the past few years. Glad you all are recieving counseling, and it seems you are doing your best considering all circumstances.

Yes she's my W, and I still want to do what is right. I'm not referring to what the world thinks is right....I pray.
Yes!!!! That's good!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Ladysheep

Hi Ladysheep!!!

I spoke with my W again today. When she called, it was to talk to our 5 D. Who was sleeping. I ascted as though I had no desire to talk to her. She picked up on this, and kept on,,, so eventually i finally started talking.
Asked what she needed from me, to stop the divorce,,, she still wants me to agree to joint custody. I asked her if and when i sign, and or make the arrangements, can we begin on us, and our marriage? Her reply was that thats not right,, , that I'm putting a price tag on this. I just wanted to know exactly where we stood. If we were going to be pursuing the same thing.
Was that wrong???
I was informed my actions are saying I want to be in control,,, that I have a problem with her being a mother,,,

As our conversation continued, i was informed of several things I have done wrong, even as far back as seven years ago!!!

In regards to the dragging dog,, a few days ago she stated that she was upset with me on that day, because she *felt* I didn't support her.

Aw we were about to hang up,, she stated how she's working on *our* bills. My first thought was i liked that word, (our) Now that I have thought about it, I honestly wonder if she threw that in there, to mislead me??? Remembering that I was wrong to ask to work on our marriage, after agreeing to joint custody. Hold on, No I haven't agreed to anything as of yet.

If we're going to work on the marriage, why should it matter about custody? Maybe you as a mother, even as a female, can shed a different perspective on this??
Was I wrong for requesting that from her,, *after* I agreed to joint custody? I thought part of this communication thing was to know where each one was?
thanks ladysheep <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

The Mr nice guy that I'am, I agreed to bring our children to her in the morning,,,so she could sleep in, until ten. sucker??

As for her being abused,, I don't have a clue/ She never mentioned anything, either way. The first counselor has suggested the same thing.
Months ago I tried talking to her mother, looking for some answers. All i got was Steve you forget, I raised her. Whenever I'd attempt to tickle my W, she always bacame upset. That was the most concerning thing where the counselor was concerned. For myself too, throughout the years. I never did quit trying. you know, there must be some stubborn donkey in me.

<small>[ September 05, 2003, 07:43 PM: Message edited by: Stephan ]</small>