Hi Kathy...<BR>I had sent a reply to you that seems to have gotten lost...but you are doing exactly what I suggested anyway. I hope that this weekend that you are out having a good time, taking care of your needs.<P>I did ask though that certainly besides Sea World, there are other places in need of your services in light of the ever worsening problems in the sea with the coral die off, fish populations dropping and a host of other marine disasters looming.....<P>Yeah, you are problably right, your husband is in a fog and thinks he is right. I understand about how he can do what he wants....if you don't show then he wins, by default....you can always throw a monkey wrench into the works by showing up at the proceedings and saying 'judge, he wants this, I don't.' and seeing what happens.<P>I am afraid though that the more I listen to this, that you may be better off cutting the poor man adrift and moving on with your life...I have had to do that before. At some point you have to decide, do I try to keep this person from drowning in their own bad mistakes or do I save myself because they are bringing me down....<P><BR>Sorry if I sound down...hasn't beena good weekend here at all....<P>Anyway...tell me one thing...just how do sharks teeth wind up on the beach...I would think that they are heavy enough to sink???<P>Have a great weekend.<BR>Fred

Fred,<P> I'm so sorry you're feeling down, I know it's not the best way to spend a weekend. Especially since it makes it seem so long.<P> In answer to your question, there are other places I can find jobs. I have been looking and have sent a few resumes out. There are a few more that I am going to apply for...but it will probably take a long time to find anything.<P> Question...You suggested that I may need to let my H go. How do you do that and deal with the fact that you are still very much in love with that person?<P> I was re-reading basic concepts yesterday and was going over the EN's. I realized that one of my husbands EN's was for recreation. He is a very social person and thrives in social settings. When we first started having our problems he told me that he didn't feel the spark anymore. He said it was sometimes there, especially when we were out having fun and being ourselves. Whenever we did that, he was very loving and affectionate, even up to the last week we were together. Througout the past few months, my husband went out a few times a week because he couldn't stand sitting around the apartment. He usually went to bars to play darts and hang with friends. He always asked me to go, but I said no because I wasn't really into it. He asked me several times to play in dart tournaments with him, I said no. I was afraid of playing badly. Anyway, my point is that I was able to realize one of the things that my husband was lacking from the marriage. I'm not saying that this is the only thing wrong, but that according to Dr. Harley, our EN's weren't being met, and therefore we wouldn't have that "in love" feeling.<P> This hit me pretty hard as I knew how important it was to my husband to go out and do things. But I just didn't do it. Yes, my H didn't do a lot of things either. It's sad that it is now too late.<P> As for shark's teeth, they weight about the same as shells and the small pebbles. Once they get caught up in the current, they are swept ashore. I'm going to head back there at some point today. <P> Take care, Fred. And I hope the rest of your weekend is better. Feel free to talk to me if you want.<BR> Kathy

Hi Kathy;<P>Thanks for taking time out of your Sunday to reply.<P>Let's deal with the letting go thing first... I have been 'in love' about four times in my life. I mean really in love, let me be with you the rest of my life kind of love. My first ex-fiance left me for another woman....real ego buster and then I married the same woman twice and I think if I recall correctly there was one other woman in there that I really should have married and I ended up messing it up badly. Anyway, the point is that deep down, I still care for and love these people very much. At least once or twice a week, their memory will pop up and I will spend a pleasant moment remembering some nice thing that happened.<P>I have never really let them go, they have just been put in a different part of my brain and memory. My first ex-fiance, the one that left me for the other woman....she kept me on a short chain for 4 and a half years before she had enough of me and moved on...I even moved her over a thousand miles to be with me and she was, for 90 days before she moved out. She also sent me in to bankruptcy....and even after all that... I still don't hate her to be quite honest.....<P>My current W wants me to hate my ex.....I can't. I mean we made four kids together and yes, I will probably not see them again, but I still care for her.... funny huh.<P>It is very hard to do this, but like many things that we do even if we don't like them, we just have to put it behind us and move on. Oh, I am not saying that you have to let him go....I was merely saying, (I think) that you need to be prepared for that to happen if he will not recover from this severe case of cranial/rectal inversion he is going through.... <P>As for him being a social animal... I wish I could relate to that...personally, I am more like you, I like to stay home...to me, going to a bar and spending money is a waste... occassionally, my W and I will go out and bowl or shoot pool or something. Our biggest pastime is to take walks in the forest near where we live.<P>My Wife at first had to practically drag me kicking and screaming to get me out...now I go pretty easily...<P>As for this weekend...I have been talking myself out of things again. Last nite I was up for four hours from midnite to four in the morning. She had left the tv on and I had drifted off around 10, then when she turned it off at midnite, I was in the mood and she wasn't.... Then this morning, she asked if I needed anything...we had to get ready for church and I hate rushing....so I did it again.<P>I really wonder why making love is so hard?! My problem is that she is past that stage in life and her sex drive is way down, while mine is still way up....Also, I like 'making love' to her, the fondling, touching, caressing and all that. For her, she is open to 'quickies' unless her homrmones are peaked on what is left of her cycle....<P>I also have some things to accomplish yet today and I need to get started so I don't think anything will happen when I get home...(I am at the office now).... I just wished this married thing came easier to me. For her, everything is hunky dory....she just lives her life and I overthink mine...sorry, didn't mean to get too carried away.<P>Thanks for telling me about the shark's teeth...I didn't know that....what kind of shark did they come from? Also, can you theoretically find teeth on any beach?<P>Hope you had a good weekend<BR>Fred<p>[This message has been edited by freddyb (edited July 01, 2001).]

Fred,<P> I have thought I was in love a few times, you know, when your young sometimes things pass for love. Anyway, I was with someone for 4 years, he was 10 years older and acted as if he were 10 years younger! When we finally broke up, I was devastated. However, it was one of the best things in my life. He was a dreamer, but never acted on them. Whenever I had a question about what to do with my life, I would ask what I thought he would do, then did the opposite.<BR>It works. I did that when I made the decision to go back to school. I looked at my job, which was pretty decent, and asked if I want to be stuck in this for the rest of my life like my ex. So, I packed up my life and moved 600miles to go to school. It was a great choice, not one regret. It's amazing, that he influenced me like that and has no idea. <P> I know I need to prepare myself for what is likely to come. It's hard to do that and have hope at the same time. I went to the divorce busting site today. Perhaps I'll go to the bookstore and look at it.<P> One of the things that attracts me to my H is that he is so social. He is very funny and quick witted, and people are drawn to him. And he doesn't have a problem with looking goofy. I'm like you, I over-analyze everything. As if you couldn't tell by my postings. But, I can be too concerned with what other people think. Perfect example...I just came back from the beach again. While I was looking for the teeth, I was worried about what people thought of me as I squatted on the sand looking through a pile of shells. Don't get me wrong, I'm not so overly concerned that it would prevent me from doing it, just enough that I'm aware of it. Kind of annoying. <P> Can't help you on the sex thing. I'm the one that has a higher sex drive than my H, so he rarely (if ever) had to ask. <P> As for the marriage thing, can't help you there either. I wish I could. All I know is that being alone is no picnic either. There really should be a class given to high school students about how to survive relationships. They teach sex ed. but send their students into the world without any guidance or sense about what to do with their most important relationships. No wonder why there are so many of us on this board. <P> In answer to your question, I would presume you could find shark's teeth on any beach. I guess it would depend on the currents. They're hard to find, so if you go looking, remember that they are black, not white (fossilized). I don't remember the beaches in NY having too many shells and such. So I'm not totally positive.<P> Hang in there, Fred. We're all here for you.<BR> Kathy<BR>

Hey there! Thanks for the reply....<P>I wish I had your guts to just go off and do things like that...believe it or not, you are not as timid as you may think...and the part about what people think...I usually don't have a problem...it is my W I worry about. I really think that I times I am imposing on her....taking up her space....she is 8 years older than I. In her mid 40's now...and she is now working to the part of life where she just wants to enjoy living....sex and making love are about number 15 on her list of things she likes to do....me, number 4 or 5....so I HAVE to ask.... <P>As for the class for kids on marriage...on of my W's kids, the oldest (24) said that people should get a license for 4 or 5 years and when it is up, get it renewed or let it expire....interesting thought....<P>I have said this before....I wish we could get all the people on this board who have low sex drives together and get those with higher ones together...It has just been my luck throughout my life that I am always attracted to women who end up telling me that they just don't like it as much as I do.....maybe one day I will get it right....<P>As for the teeth...black eh? I guess they don't brush after each meal do they.... <P>Thanks for the encouragement....I know it is there. I am also trying to get used to the new meds the doc put me on last Thursday....more Depakote and Propanadol...a beta blocker he thinks may help....<P>Well, got to get back to my project...I am working to correct a project that I did for my W last week....I thought I did it just the way she wanted....it wasn't so now I have to take all my work apart and put thinkgs back the way they were...hmmmmmm I wish she would make up her mind sometimes... <P>Thanks Kathy<BR>Fred

Good morning, Fred.<P> Hope you are getting your project done. Too bad it's for the second time. <P> I think your W's kid is on to something. They give you extensive tests on learning to drive, make you have a waiting period to buy a gun, but let you go free-handed into marriage. Sometimes, when I look at some kids/parents in the mall I think there ought to be a license for having kids too. Who knows, it may cut down on the problem of child-abuse and overpopulation! Just a thought...lol<P> I hope those new meds of yours are working, with very few side effects.<BR> <BR> I went to the beach last night, but it was too windy. The sand was wipping on my legs and it was annoying. But I did find some teeth, not many though. I'll try again soon. So, have a good day, and i'll talk to you soon. <BR> <BR> Kathy<BR>

Hey there;<P>Just got into the office...I will finish up here in a few minutes..then I have some more work to do. This will be my last day in this job...stillhave a desk and storeroom to clean out....my W's position was cut the last day of the school year so we will be moving....we have the computer at home, so I will not be out of touch.<P>The meds are kicking in nicely I think...I feel kind of blah at the moment....just don't want to do anything....<P>I always thought it was stupid that you had to get a license for all sorts of stuff, yet could run out and get married....and about the kids thing...I will be mean and take it one step farther...if you look, somof these people should not be allowed to breed.....I teach agriculture and we call it selective breeding.....I now, I know....BAD BOY! Slap hand! <P>Sorry to hear about the wind. I know about wind and sand...being a desert dweller and all...<P>Well, I guess I had better get on with it.<P>More later<BR>Fred

Fred,<P>I must admit I agree with you about not allowing some people to breed. It sounds horrible but I'm sure many would agree. Oh well, guess we just have to live with it.<P>I've had a lot of the blah feelings over the past few months. I just can't seemed to get myself motivated sometimes. I'm having lunch with a friend from school. He always makes me feel good and I haven't seen him in a long time. He calls us kindred spirits, which is kinda nice. He's been married for 26 years so maybe he can give me some encouragement.<P>Even though it's hard to start, just get yourself doing what you need to do, and it will be over before you know it.<BR>Good luck.<BR> <BR>Talk to you soon.<BR>Kathy

have fun at lunch and don't be afraid to ask any of the hard questions that you need to have answered....<P>Still early morning here...we have barely all sat down to breakfast. <P>see you later

Hi, <BR> Lunch was nice, although it was quick. My friend was naturally inquisitive about what had happened. It had been so long since I've seen him that the last time, I wasn't even with my H! He supports the move to TX. He thinks if I love my H then I should fight for my marriage. <P> Afterwards, I went to the bookstore and bought "divorce busters". I have read about it and visited the site, so I'll see if it's any good. I think the ideas are similar to MB's, especially Plan A.<P> I'm still dog-sitting, and had to take my sister's dog to the vet today. She has been having trouble breathing and the Dr. told me she has a severe case of congestive heart failure. The prognosis is not good, but gave her some meds to see if it would work. Everytime I pet-sit, someone gets sick! I'm not sure I'm going to agree to it anymore. Anyway, I hope she is ok. Especially until my sister gets home on Fri.<P> Well, hope you got your project done. Talk to you soon.<BR> Kathy

One project done, one more to do before I can go home today...<P>Have a great evening!<BR>FB

I called my H tonight. I can barely type this because of the tears. The phone call wasn't bad. It was very cordial. I was trying not to LB, I was acting like a friend and thought I sounded upbeat. I didn't bring up the subject of us. However I did ask him if he wanted some pics of our cats that I had developed and mentioned that I had developed the lost role of our honeymoon pics. He just sort of mumbled somthing about that and I let it trail off.<P>I can't tell if he sounds like he is happy or not. He talked about the city being a lot of fun, but said he doesn't have much money to do anything that often. He said he has a couple of friends and hangs out in the pool or plays volleyball. He did say that it is sometimes like it was in IN, how he sits around and plays computer games.<P>Part of me was being positive and talking about him going out and doing things and how good it could be. But, and I know this sounds cruel, the other part of me was glad to hear him say he sits around sometimes like he did when we were together. Perhaps it will show him that it wasn't the marriage that was so bad. Just the habits. I want to know if he misses me as much as I miss him. But I guess if he did...he'd tell me.<P>I bought the divorce busting book today. There was a concept addressed that stuck out at me. It made me see how something I did could have been perceived by my H. Not too long before this stuff started, we were making the decision to go back to schoo. Well, my H was making the decision. I think we both went on this power trip and I was looking for him to come to me and we made the decision together. I think he was waiting for me to tell him that I would support him and go with him. There was never a question in my mind that I wouldn't go. But, I made the mistake of letting him believe he might lose me if he made the decision to go. It wouldn't surprise me that he would feel hurt and rejected. And even start doubting my committment. The more time I'm going through this, and the more stuff I read, the more I realize that it was both of us that did this. He is not entirely to blame. It's amazing how peoples ego's can get in the way of love and chip away at is foundations. If only I could go back and show him how happy I was for him that he got into school and that I never stopped supporting him or loving him. I don't think it would matter to him now.<P>I keep crying, and I'm not exactly sure why. We are communicating, if even on a basic level. We aren't fighting nor do we hate each other. That should be something, right? <P>I miss him so much and just want to be with him right now. Other than being cordial/friendly on the phone, there is nothing I can do right now. <P>I''m sory for venting, even though there wasn't much to vent about. Perhaps, i'm upset because i'm so worried over my sister's dog. I don't know.<P>TTFN<BR>Kath

my sisters dog died tonight. i tried rushing her to the e.r. vet but she died on the way. i feel so guilty that i didn't do anythng sooner. why didn't i notice her cough over the weekdend and bring her in tehn? maybe she could have beebn treated with the meds sooner and she wouldn't have suffered as much.<P>i dont even know if i should tell my sister or wait til she gets home.<P>sorry for dumping...i'm by myself and am so miserable...

Hey there Kathy;<P>I am sorry to hear about your sister's dog. You should call her and let her know what the vet had said and that you had done every thing that you could possibly have done. Do not kick yourself over it. We personally have cats at our house andtwo weeks ago one of them was shot through the eye with a BB. The kids, especially the one that begged for the cat, don't seem to care...I was the one that ended up taking care of her. And I don't even like cats that much. <P>As for you H. I know you are hurting. I know you want to be with him in all those ways and I know that you are crying a lot.<P>I want you to go back though and re-ready what you wrote me last nite (Sorry I didn't get back sooner...). I want you to pay particular attention to the facts that he doesn't seem to be as broken up over this whole thing as you are. You are right, if he really missed you, he would tell you. <P>Yo are also partly right in that it is both of you to blame....yes and no...it takes two people to get into this mess, but he is the one that chose to leave...that wasnot on your adgenda. <P>He obviously didn't want the pictures or he would have said something. I mean, my goodness Kathy, this is going to sound cruel...he doesn't even sound like he misses sleeping with you or holding your hand or anything....<P>I am in the process of doing it again with my W...I think I have talked myself out of stuff about 15 times in the last few days.....I really want to be with her and just about the time I think everything is going ok to that direction....wham! I kill the mood for me all the time....but that doesn't mean that I am going to leave...although she is timred of hearing me ask if I have done anything wrong for the 40,543 time....where does confidence come from in people...I have it with my kids in class, family members, but when I look into those startling green eyes of my W, I turn to mush...<P>Sorry, I am venting now. I wish I could give you a hug, I know you could use one. So here is one like they do on these forums {{{{{{{{BIG HUG}}}}}}}}<P>Let me know how you are doing. I am going to be in and out today as I have mucho errands to run. You are not alone, I am thinking of you and hoping that you are doing ok today.<P>Take care and try to relax. It really will get better.<BR>Fred

Hi Fred,<P> This has been a bad day. Besides feeling awful about my sis's dog, I feel awful about my marriage.<P> I guess I shouldn't be surprised that my husband wouldn't say he missed my. After all, he is the one that said this is the best for me. <P> I e-mailed him late last night, I wanted to tell him about the dog. I think I was looking to see if he still cared about me. Anyway, he wrote back, again nothing too personal. But he did close with a reference to a memory we shared. 3 days before we separated we were in the pet store and found a little pug. We both fell in love with him immediately. But we agreed we should wait until we were in TX to get a dog. Anyway, he said that whenever he was feeling badly, he thought of that dog, and mentioned that he still wants a pug, badly. I know it isn't anything. But, I guess my heart wanted to hear that he thought about me and the good memories we share. <P>Oh, when I wrote about the pics, he said he didn't want the pics of our cats just yet. He was afraid he'd lose them or ruin them since he is still living out of boxes and will move soon. He mentioned then that I could send them.<P>I'm just grasping at straws here. I know. But I just don't want to give up. Sometimes I think that if I did move there, then we would be able to build on what we have now. We would be able to live some of our dreams we had, and perhaps build new ones. The DB book gives me hope when there probably shouldn't be any. But they talk about marriages that were in worse off places succeeding, and I can't help but wonder...<P>I don't know, I'm sorry for always being such a drudge and dwelling on false hopes...<P>K

Don't be sorry, your ot a drudge...what is that anyway....<P>You stillhave choices to be made only by you. I know that deep down inside you want ot move to TX and see what happens. As I said before...go for it. San Antonio is a huge city and you can build your own life down there and still be close to him. What may end up happenig is that the two of you basically start over with your life together.<P>You need to quit wringing you hands and just do it. Make your arrangments, pack your bags, load up the little car (or is it an SUV) and off you go.<P>We had some excitement around the house here today...I am installing a ceiling fan in the bedroom and I look out the window...(Oh, background...it had been a REALLY STRESSFULL afternoon...) anyway, I look out the window and here is this fairly large brown bear waling outside the window...pretty cool...we called game and fish and they said that they had been trying to catch this particular one for six weeks...<P>You love your husband. Deep down, he loves you. You will not know what will happen unless one of you makes a move and gets on with life. Right now it is limbo...go do something about it.<P>I am off to bed now...see you tomorrow.<P>Take care Kat.<BR>Fred<p>[This message has been edited by freddyb (edited July 03, 2001).]

Happy 4th of July!!!<P>I'm not sure why I used the word drudge...I have to look it up to see what it even means.<P>Yesterday was a bad day. I was so distraught over my sister's dog, and was sad after talking to my husband.<P>I know what I need to do. And you are right, it could be a chance to start over for both of us together or a chance at a whole new life. <P>So, you had a bear in your backyard? Where do you live?<BR>My parents live on a golf course and there has been sitings of black bears coming out of the infringing woods. My sister works on a military base as a teacher, and there have been times when the students can't go out on recess because of a bear walking across the field.<P>All the wildlife that i've seen outside my window was a few deer, red foxes, and some toads...I love the toads. Never had them growing up, so I love playing with them.<P>Hope you have a fun day today. I'm spending it with my father, it's his birthday. I'll probably be home before it is even dark.<P>Take care,<BR>Kathy

Happy 4th right back at you!<P>What a coincidence..taday is my W's mom's B-Day too....we went up and barbecued ribs and kicked it back a while. I live in the White Mountians of AZ...about 175 miles from Phoenix....when it is 110 down there, it is usually about 85 here...we called game and fish and they are still looking for this fellow.<P>I hope you had a good day. I need to get off to bed now...we just got back from the fireworks...been a long day.<P>More later;<BR>Fred

Hi Fred,<BR> Glad to hear you had a good, albeit tiring 4th! My father and I went to lunch and then took a quick drive to the beach. My dad is not much of a talker, so sometimes it can be weird.<BR> Told my sister yesterday about her dog. She and my mother were in Assisi when it happened. It just so happens to be the home of St. Francis patron saint of animals. That p*ssed my sister off. I felt so bad, I didn't want to tell them but couldn't hide it in my voice. They were supposed to leave Italy on Fri. but had to leave today instead. Something about the airport closing and not being able to their original flight or get on any later flights...Over all, they seemed to have a miserable time. Too many bad things happened.<BR> They had invited me to go on the trip, and I'm so glad I didn't. Originally my H and I would have just moved and it would be a strain financially and on our relationship. But after we separated, my sister looked into it (I had no desire to do anything) but it was booked. I'm glad because I really could not have afforded it.<BR> Not much else going on...I filled out a job application today for a job here in NC. There are a few others i've seen, but I'm hesitant because I feel as if I need to work on my marriage. Not sure if that is a good idea or not. <BR> Well, hope there aren't any more bear sitings. Have a good night,<BR> Kathy

Your sister will forgive you in time....As for dad being quiet...mine is the same way...his family was one of those where feelings were kept inside and not expressed.<P>As for you looking for a job....it is going to be awfully hard for you to work on a marriage if you have no money.....<P>remember, you have to get you act together in order for everything to work out.<P>Well, got to go, I am trying to patch the bird holes in the house so I can paint it....someone painted this house a very light shade of blue up here in the forest....we are going to restore it to a more earth friendly tone...<P>Stay in touch<BR>Fred