For anyone who feels they can help me please respond! my boyfriend and i are planning on living together before we get married. We have made to commitment to eachother that we will marry and that we will when we both are earning enough-he had just graduated from college. any thoughts?

I don't think this would be a good idea. I have seen that most of the people who moved in with one another before actually getting married, have either 1.) Broke up, or 2.) are still living together after many years, yet still aren't married. If marriage is a big deal to you, DO NOT move in with this person prior to that! From what I have witnessed (and this is including myself), the men in this situation think; "Oh, why buy the cow when I can get the milk for free"? I am sure there have been other cases where this wasn't so, but for the most part it is. Men get comfortable with living with their partner, yet still have their freedom. They think that if they get married, they will lose that freedom. I am sure there will be others who agree and also disagree. That is fine, but in my personal opinion from past experiences and witnessing this, I would advise you NOT to move in with him!

Best of wishes to you both, Orion

Hi, Samantha.

The greatest sorrow I see in most marriage breakups is that people didn't take time for the old-fashioned courting route before they got married.

They skip the "dating" (without sex I mean!) part and there is nothing to anticipate for the marriage. They don't take the time to build a friendship first and then when things begin to unravel later, they think they can just walk away because it was never totally about commitment.

It's a risk, I realize, to marry someone when you don't know if it's going to work out. The hope should be that you are so in love with one another there is a strong sense inside that it's a risk worth taking.

Freshstart is so right. There are reasons for the courting and the rituals. They build the foundation for a healthy marriage.

I used to think that living together was fine. But from experience and observation I’ve changed my mind. When living together a couple does not have the same commitment that a married couple does. They may think they do (I did so long ago) but it is very different. They build their relationship on that foundation and get married. Then they found out that the foundation they built does not work in a long term marriage. When living together a couple has more of a hers/his attitude. They distinguish between what belongs to whom. In a marriage a very strong ‘us’ is necessary. The difference if also forced by the legal differences. In marriage the couple is legally one. Living together you are still independent people who share only as much as they want to. I have also found that many men do not feel as committed to their partner when they are living together.

I lived with my ex-husband for 5 years before we got married. The his/hers things was there. When we got married it carried over into our marriage and became a huge dividing point. We never became ‘us’. When I realized what was going on I tried to changes things. But by then he really liked it and would not hear of ‘US’. A horrible power struggle ensued as he tried to, and succeeded, to get much of my financial assets moved into his name. He felt entitled. But he would never open a joint account; never work together with me on things. We were always pulling in opposite directions.

And as far as being committed goes, that was a farce that I found out about too late. While I was playing at being ‘married’ his take was, I’m not married so…. After we were married I found out that he’d had this attitude and found out about some other girlfriends he had. Since the pattern was set, he carried it into our marriage. He cheated then entire 14 years we were married.

If the two of you want to be together now, then get married. Many a good marriage started out on a shoestring. Money is not a reason to not get married and live together. Marriage is sacred. So are you. Don’t throw that away.

Living together before marriage doesn't work for some people, but it does for others. I think that you should definately consider it since it is an excellent opportunity to decide if you are compatible *before* you get married. If you are happy with all the little things (like leaving socks on the floor or drinking from the carton) that bother you, then your marriage will surely succeed. Another way to look at it is a trial before marriage. If you aren't happy or getting along after 6 months or so then you can both go your separate ways and know you didn't make a mistake marrying someone you really didn't know.

Living together before marriage is a great way to find out if you are really compatible. But if you really feel some doubts about moving in, don't do it. It is, after all, your starter marriage.

Just my opinion.

G

I thought that myself, when I moved in with my fiance', but this usually isn't the case. I suggest you both read 'Living Together Before Marriage'. It might help clarify the compatability factor a little for you. From what I understood from reading it, you would think that people who lived together prior to marriage would get along better and their marriage would be stronger than those who didn't. But this isn't so. Partners who live together, follow a different set of rules, than married people. Live-in partners TEST the comatibility, where as married partners MAKE it. You don't feel as comitted in a live-in situation, as you do a marriage. Just read the page, you will understand what I mean.

Orion

Here is a link that you might find interesting. If you search for cohabitation on the web you will find many many more that say the same things.

<a href="http://www.usatoday.com/news/comment/columnists/lovemarriage/love4.htm" target="_blank">
Cohabitation and marriage </a>

We lived together before marriage. While it didn't seem to have a disasterous effect on us, we ARE here on MB. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> You create habits of independent behavior that carry on into marriage and are very detrimental. I strongly caution against it.

Living together before marriage is different for everyone. My husband and I did it and we recently got married. We lived together for about a year and a half before we were married. We moved in together because he got a job in another state and asked if I wanted to go with him. We had been dating for 5 years at that point, so I said yes. My family was mortified, but we were happy.

However, before I moved in with him, I made it very clear that moving in together was going to be a move towards marriage. I told him that he had one year to ask me to marry him. He said that was his intention anyway and so the arrangement would be fine with him. My husband and I were very happy living together, however, there is a definite sense of "yours" and "mine". We did our best to avoid this and we talked a lot about how one persons spending directly affects the other person. Of course, not being married, I would not recommend joining your finances. I suppose that I would only recommend living together if marriage is in sight. (when I say "in sight", I don't mean 5 years from now.) If the two of you really want to be together and be married, you might as well just do it. Large weddings and expensive engagement rings are not all that important.

Would your parents not help with the cost of the wedding if money is what is holding you back? Even so, you can get married on a shoestring. Many people don't have two pennies to rub together. If your boyfriend is really serious about marrying you, then he should be willing to committ to some more solid plans. Talk to him about having a small wedding sooner rather than later. If he's really committed to you, then he will agree to this. Good luck!

My boyfriend and I have been living together for four years, and I love it. We are not talking about marriage. I’m not saying we never will, but I just have too many “issues,” and prefer just to let it lie for the foreseeable future. He seems content with that plan.

We maintain a joint account for the house payment and other household expenses. But all other money is kept separately, which I am more comfortable with. For me, this is a tremendous advantage. While my boyfriend is not a spendthrift, he’s not the miser I am. So I don’t have to get my miserly instincts into a rustle if he buys a new computer component – it’s HIS money, not OURS. Reduces my stress level tremendously.

Our commitment to each other is quite strong. Each of us is completely welcomed into the other’s family. Each knows where the other is at all times; there isn’t much “independent behavior.” While the risk of affairs is present for any relationship (as proven by this site), we’re doing just fine on that front. Most important of all, we’re very, very happy.

That said, I don’t want you to interpret this as an endorsement for living together before marriage. I think each relationship is different, and there is every reason to be cautious. I think my boyfriend and I have several things going for us, that many other couples may not:
§ Neither of us is anxious to get married. That is, living together isn’t one person’s attempt to nudge the other to the altar. No one feels pressured to do anything different from what we’re doing now.
§ We’re older (I’m 37, he’s 41). We’ve settled on who we are and what we want from life. We’re not in imminent danger of diverging into to opposite directions with our lives, as often happens with younger couples.
§ We have very similar tastes and values. Same religious and moral beliefs. Same lifestyle preferences.
§ Children aren’t an issue for either of us.

If you and your boyfriend aren’t in confident agreement on these issues, you need to achieve that agreement before you marry, whether you live together or not. The difficulty is that living together can complicate the issue, or cloud your thinking.

I do not believe that living together endangers relationships that would otherwise have resulted in happy marriages. Many young people live together these days, then break up. I don’t necessarily think that’s a problem, when you can extricate yourself from the bad relationship without tremendous cost, and when there are no children involved. To tell the horrible truth, I think too many people get married in situations where they really shouldn’t – when if they had been more mature, or more honest with themselves, they would have realized what a mistake they were making. But then, what would you expect from someone with major anti-marriage issues.

If you keep your eyes open, and be brutally honest with yourself, you’ll do fine. Good luck.

QB][/QUOTE]Each knows where the other is at all times; there isn’t much “independent behavior.” While QB][/QUOTE]

You said ( look above ) and then you also said

QB][/QUOTE]Originally posted by curious53:
So I don’t have to get my miserly instincts into a rustle if he buys a new computer component – it’s HIS money, not OURS. Reduces my stress level tremendously.QB][/QUOTE]

The latter falls into a category of independent behavior. Sorry

Yes, you are right. There is independent behavior with regard to finances (outside of household expenses). I stand corrected.

I was thinking in terms of going places and doing things on one's own, without involving or even informing the partner. We are really quite involved in each others' lives. Neither of us is secretive in any way, and we do not communicate on a "need to know" basis. I had a former boyfriend (not a live-in) who was the king of independent behavior. I realize now that he behaved that way as a means to convince himself that he wasn't completely IN the relationship. And indeed, because of the independent behavior, he wasn't.

And there is no independent behavior with regard to our household expenses or our joint account. We discuss everything in this matter and do not move forward until there is enthusiastic agreement (classic POJA).

But yes, he is free to buy all the computer components he wants with his own money, and I won't say "boo." He can continue to throw money into his clunker car rather than invest in one that works, and I will only raise an eyebrow. If this was OUR money, I'd stress out, even though he's not being irresponsible in the least. We are running no financial risks. But I would stress out nonetheless. This is my means to avoid the stress.

I suppose my feelings about the matter might be different if he were irresponsible with money. But then, if that were the case, I'm not sure we'd be living together at all.

Curious,

My situation is much like yours, and, like you, though I'm not advocating living together before marriage, I don't necessarily see it as boding ill or boding well for marriage.

I'm 42 and my GF is 46. I've been married once before and she hasn't. We've discussed marriage in the most round 'about of ways, but we both seem happy with the arrangement as is. We call each other fiance's because we feel comfortable doing that, though there is no date set.

I have some issues with marriage as an institution (perhaps from being burned before) and she has some issues with the legal entaglements it entails (she has a substantial pension and has seen to many of her fellow retired officers lose it in divorce).

Like you, we handle our finances the same way, and it works out wonderfully. Joint account for our house (which we jointly own) and seperate checking and savings accounts for our 'own' money. Now, though we both consider it our own money, neither of us has ever held back from contributing it to household needs when and if we desire. We have the same financial outlook, goals and needs. We're lucky in that regard.

In my first marriage we pooled all the money, it lead to no end of resentment on both our parts. I earned much more money, and felt resentful that I had to get 'enthustiastic agreement' to spend money. She felt resentful, because she felt that since most of the money in the account was earned by me, she had no right to spend it. We had a lot of money conflicts. Honestly, even if/when we do marry, I don't see our financial arrangement changing. My brother is married and they handle thier finances this way also. I think its tremendously helpful in keeping conflict and stress levels lower.

Some people say that living together doesn't show the same level of commitment as marriage. Perhaps in younger individuals that's true. But I think, that in older couples, it doesn't hold. I have no interest in dating around, or leaving for greener pastures. We have our differences, and of course arguements, but we both know that relationships take work, and I think, we're both committed to making things work. Sure leaving would be somewhat easier, but I don't consider leaving an option, and I don't believe she does either.

New here, I do agree with Zorweb, and Make it work, Freshstart. I liked the courting w\o sex. I was happier when I did it this way.

Living together, for me was not good for me.
I had to try it to find out ...... I felt better being married, there's no question if he accepts you. You and he become WE US......and it's not a big deal the M word or the L word......living together I found out the hard way, what I felt was not what he felt.......and it was down hill from there every time we went out in public, the reminders of innuendos from others around him. A disaster for me. I can say the courting was the best way for me, it was the best I felt as a person. I didn't have to deal with if he suddenly changed his mind, or I became a mistake. Character plays a huge part in all this. I'll say the disappointment was huge for me. Divorce is a disappointment too. All the issues Zorweb mentioned did show it's ugly head. For that happened to me too, this with living together before marriage and living together w\o marriage.
The only time I didn't have the issues raised by Zorweb, is when I married without sex.......for it was accepted. Some of the others here posted they had a clear agreement that marriage would follow time frame and how the money would be handled before hand ......I think that is good too. Not everyone wants marriage. If you do then do not live together........for some men rely on this as a way out down the line and if one is thinking marriage and the other is just playing along then there is pain in this.......that I am going through now........ <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Opps I didn't state that right, yikes, my meaning is I was courted w\o the sex in the way, then married. It was the best sex too.....it meant more to me, well, it was the best....we learned together and there was no room for name calling ever he respected me. I say Character is more important......lifestyle. Then again life out there it consumes some people up........as I see it today......

<small>[ November 03, 2002, 11:08 PM: Message edited by: BarbT ]</small>

Wow, lots for me to think about.
I am in a situaiton that I am in the middle of moving in with my boyfriend. I have been married twice (divorced recently),and I do not feel that it would be in his best interest to be married to me. He is 38 and has never been married or engaged. I have two sons from my first marriage and we do not intend to have any children ( unless cats count) from our relationship. I love him with all of my heart and soul, and I am looking at this as a long term relationship for us.
After reading everyone's response to this post, I am now wondering am I doing the right thing? I do love him and I want to spend the rest of my life with him, however I can not say right now today that I will want to get married again. He says he is okay with us never getting married as long as we are in a happy loving relationship. I have noticed that on some things we say ours, us, but there is a lot that we say mine on. I do not want to ruin our relationship by living together, but I do not want to run off and get married.
Any advice would be great.

I think being living together before marriage is ok. I think it can be a nice way to save money as well as work on your relationship. I agree in an ideal world it would be nice if you could wait, but hey, life is not perfect and what's the big difference if you are having sex why not share an address, save some money, and learn even more about each other. I think as long as you treat it as something real, something that will lead to marriage when you are 100% (financially, emotionally, etc) ready then no prob. If you think you'll leave him if he never cleans or something, then no.

I don't recommend it. I lived with my H before we got married. We or should I say I, treated it as if we were married. We combined our money into a joint account, paid all the bills from that account. In the beginning it was fine. Somewhere along the way he got the idea in his head, that "I'm not married, so I don't have to live like I am". He did like my paycheck though, so he started going out all the time, found a another girlfriend one month before we were supposed to be married and walked out on me with an 18 month old and a 6 month old. We got back together, and got married. I refused to live together again without the marriage. The old patterns are still there. He wants to live like a single man and enjoy the benefits of a double income, and a family when it is convient.

Samantha, I started seeing my H in Sept. 2001. He moved in with me in Oct. We married in December '01. We are now separted and have filed for divorce. We are an older couple (I'm not that old 40 <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> , and H is 55) but we did not get to know each other before we married. I regret this terribly. Enjoy the dating period. Get to know your mate and be sure of what you both want before you commit in marriage.

I just dont understand why any woman would give all the benefits of being a wife without recieving any of the benefits of being a wife? And I am not talking about sex. You do realize that beyond all the relationship stuff which makes absolute sense the realities in your situation should give you pause. For instance...you as the live-in have no rights in terms of assets or property...even if you sign as joint owners etc...this is a world of difference in reference to dower rights. If something were to happen to your live-in, you realize you have no rights in determining what sort if any treatment is given. Legally you are no one. NO RIGHTS, NO OPINION. Now you may think you have rapport with your soon to be inlaws but think twice. You put yourself in an emotionally connected position where only you and your live-in see yourself as committed. The law does not recognize you, nor do many other entities. Why would you set yourself up for so many different ways to fall? Honestly what do you get...a break in rent?

There is no reason to ally yourself with such extreme emotional ties by playing at being married when you truly gain nothing but the possibility of losing everything you have invested and then some.

This may sound cold. It is cold...and oh so true. Consider everything these people have said and then think again. What do you stand to lose by living separate? If the answer is money you are already doing this for the wrong reasons. If the answer is you fear losing the relationship then you know youre in trouble already. If the answer is it would make me/him/us happy then you have a long way to go in understanding what true happiness is.

best wishes

ayslyne