Weirded Out - I know what you mean. I'd been separated for 3 1/2 years and divorced almost 1 1/2 yrs. and had no dates. Could have had one with a 24 yr old geek (I'm 43) but I could tell that would have gone nowhere. This spring I could have dated the overweight, long-fingernailed smoker in two of my classes. <BR>Mr. Smoker did ask me out - sort of. <P>Only dates I'd had were with a girl friend. She and I married our husbands on Valentine's Day so we celebrate survival of those relationships annually. I know people must have wondered if we were striaght or gay. But this was the extent of my "date" life.<P>Finally, in desparation, I placed a personal ad in a local alternative paper. First response was from someone I knew was a sicko.<BR>The second one I thought was a narrow-minded "Jesus freak". While I want a Christian man, this short reply turned me off. Strangely, he called back and left a longer message. We've been dating for two months and I'm happy as can be. We're very compatible. <P>Right now I see two problems with the realtionship:<BR>---I'm embarassed to admit how we met. None of the other normal ways to meet men have worked.<BR>---I've never been as sexually attracted this early to the other men(Ha-I was so young they were boys) I've dated. I'm a bit freaked out over that.

Hi Wierded out,<P>Well, I live in Midtown Atlanta, which is practically the gay capital of the south. My roommate is female, I have very short hair, and drive a pickup truck and no woman has hit on me yet. I suppose I get plenty of stares at the local supermarket (who sells special rainbow cakes for Gay Pride month, by the way). In this town, no one cares who you live with, so that is kind of cool. I actually like that some people (mainly strange men) think I'm gay, cause then they leave me alone. When I ran the Peachtree this year, I made eye contact with a few men while waiting for the race, but all of them looked like this 6 miles was the farthest they'd moved all year. <P>The buff ones were with their boyfriends. That is how it is in this town. You see a hot guy, and if they are over 20 yrs old, it is a pretty good bet that they are gay. Oh well, they are nice to look at anyways

Hey Student,<BR> How are you getting along?Glad to see you still around(addicting,ain't it?) <BR> <BR> I did stop over in Atlanta on the way to Florida last year,so at least I can say I've been there.<P> Big question for ya.Isn't there a way to tell if someone is gay?I mean,like an earring in the left,or right ear.Or doesn't that apply anymore?I would just like to have some forewarning in my travels.Don't want to find out"friendly George"is friendly in more ways than one! <P> Too bad about the buff guys being gay.For you ladies,I mean!You better stick to the ugly ones......<P> ~~Murph/Straightasanarrow

I think you are so right! I'd hate to say it but I always go for the most handsome I can find, and they always seem to be pigs. !! I just can't help it, there's just something that makes me need to have tall and gorgeous as one of the menu items. And especially now, when I don't think there's a single man on earth that can be trusted, I'll never find anyone I will trust that is appealing in looks too. Ugly might be a real good thing. I'll have to think about that. After all, a dog-man would treat you like you are something so special. He'd would probably be real hard to disappoint as far as sexpectations go (meaning I haven't exactly been around the block, my STBX was my block so I'm not really sure what to expect out there). Ya, I might have to give ugly a try. I know one thing tho, I definitely would rather go ugly than "samey-same". Whoo, icky chills.<P>Actually, I'm a little bummed because I have met someone at my DivorceCare group who was gorgeous (Richard Gere look-a-like) and he was all over me like a bee on honey (gave me a lot of attention, talking & trying to sit next to me always). At the time we were both pretty distraught, so nothing came of it. Now I wish I could find him and can't. I really liked him. Oh well. GREG from Dexter! If you are on this forum, answer me!! Guess the timing just wasn't right.<P>I'm semi-open-minded, ugly is good. Will consider. God bless, Kathy<BR>

Hey, Weirded Out, why not try to find him? Perhaps the facilitator has a name and phone number list. You could contact the facilitator, explain who you are trying to reach and ask that person to, if such a list exists, contact the man and give him your name and phone number - rather than ask to be given someone else's info, ask to have yours passed on.

Hi "Cindy"-<P>They are friends of mine and I feel like I could ask them. The problem is that part of the DivorceCare program talked about waiting to date 1 year for every 4 you were married. NO WAY!! My friends were really adamant about the long waiting period and would try to talk me out of wanting to find Greg. Besides Greg knows where I go to church and who I hang with, so he could find me if he wanted to - he's just not ready or maybe doesn't want to. The difference is that he was hit over the head with divorce by his wife out of nowhere, where I had gone through "the process" of discovery, trying to save the marriage, pain, hurt, pain again and now divorce. I'm done with my STBX, done and over. He didn't just turn into the alien, he always was and I feel stupid that I didn't see his lies right from the beginning of our marriage. He continues to lie to this day to everyone. It was a little easier for me to come to this point, in my situation.<P>Anyway, I could explain that til I'm blue in the face and my church friends who ran the program would still tell me to wait.<P>Kathy

Hi Weirded out,<P>I ended up in the DivorceCare program too - it was great and healing, and had a good mix of people - but I had the same reaction - How can I wait that long to date? I didn't.<P>For me, it worked out well - but I did notice that their 1/4 ratio seemed to be correct for when I felt I accepted the divorce in a healthy manner. <P>I do believe you have to be very careful with rebounding. Very careful.<P>My situation also defied the rules a bit that the man I am seeing now, is the first (and only) man I have dated - and I think it is going to work out between us. Quite amazing, I think. But we started out very slowly. Lunch, and then coffee breaks every day. It was months before we actually went out on a date at night. Probably the healthiest, most mature relationship I ever had. We really got to know one another well.<P>When the word got out at work that I was separated, the vultures descended - I wouldn't have believed how many really rotten men there are out there, I didn't take it as a compliment that these men were asking me out - I really felt like prey. It would have been very easy for me to get hurt if I hadn't been careful.

Oh, and I forgot -<P>I have a pretty good test to tell if a man is gay. You can't tell by looking at, or talking to people. But if you can do it unnoticed, observe people watching other people.<P>Every straight man, no matter how happily married, sizes up an attractive female in a certain way. Not a lascivious look, but just "takes in the scene." They appreciate an attractive woman. A gay man does not look at an attractive woman that way - he may look, but it is different. It is a subtle difference, but it is there. And it makes perfect sense, I think.<P>I haven't noticed quite the same thing with women though. A little tougher for you guys out there.

My personal experience with DivorceCare was a nightmare. Not a problem with the program just with the logistics. It is run by a counseling service which uses the name of a local church and the group meets at the church although the church has nothing to do with the program. Counseling center says the church provides child care. Church says they don't. Real fiasco. I can't believe the thing is handled so ineptly and with a total lack of communication. This is a "major league" popular church in my city. If they are this imcompetent .......<P>Well, I just needed to vent. You can ignore this if you wish.<P>I suppose I need to find another group. But I was so disappointed.<BR>

That is a shame. There are lots of variables. It was the third group I tried. My biggest problem was finding a good mix of people. A group of varied opinions, but all good people. Kind of like here.

What a guy does is look from the top, down to the bottom rather slowly, then back up to the top, to make sure nothing is missed in the first pass. Gay men do that to other guys.<P>For us straight guys, we are observing the figure to see if the body is attractive, I go all the way to the ankles, because how the calf muscle attaches to the ankle is very important, legs are important.<P>Others stop at the butt, because hips are important. Others stare at the breasts because they are immature, and were never properly weened.<P>Front view is different than side view which is different than back view.<P>thl<BR><p>[This message has been edited by WhenIfindthetime (edited July 13, 2000).]

My, I feel so EDUCATED now. I didn't realize there were so many fine points to the art of leering. <P>So I guess that means, you don't notice our nicely manicured nails, well-coiffed dos, or impeccable fashion accessories?<P>

hmmmm. I guess I did something wrong and double posted.<P>[This message has been edited by honey.west (edited July 13, 2000).]<p>[This message has been edited by honey.west (edited July 13, 2000).]

So, since I can never get it all together at one time, which is the most important view?<BR>I suppose that may may not be easy to answer because you can't really see the breasts and the hips at the same time unless you are looking at the side view.<P>It would be helpful if I new what I needed to spend the most time working on.<P>

Well,<P>As I'm over 40, I'm going to find a way that I am always backing out of a room.<P>Men and women are different that way - I honestly never looked at men "in that way" when I was married. True, I noticed exceptionally handsome or well-built men, but just as I would an attractive woman. <P>Now I'm back to looking at a man's face, if that is appealing, the next place I look is at the left hand for a ring! <P>

Honey.West,<BR>I follow the same routine! Then I check the rest of the "package."<P>WIFT,<BR>I resent that! LOL<P>Bob

LMYO<P>This is too much. Yeah, I'm over 40 to but my hips are 1/2 inch smaller than 15 yrs. ago and I've had 2 children. Not that 39 inch hips are too great but at least I am well proportioned. <P>Let's take a poll. More leg men? More breast men? More butt men? What are ya'll most interested in? Which view should we maximize?<P>Honey.West - I'm with you. Face&hair first/ ring second/general build third. Up close, teeth next. I love good teeth.

Cinderella,<P>Breast man here.

Well, I might pass your inspection then.<P>Grew my own! Hit about 36 or 37 inches at about 15. <P>Unfortunately, it looks like my daughter is going to follow in my, is that footsteps? <P>What I want to know is: if God was going to give us these things, why didn't He give them adequate suspension?

Honey.west<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><BR>So I guess that means, you don't notice our nicely manicured nails, well-coiffed dos, or impeccable fashion accessories?<BR><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Well, If i get to feel the nails, usually theyfeel like talons, the well coiffed do usually don't last all night, and the fashion accessories usually come off at night, or it means that I have to spend a fortune to support the woman.<P>Cinderella, <P>back view is very important, as I can take in the whole view without being confrontational, side view is next, as I can guage the proportion without being confrontational, but front view means that I am in view, and I never look at anything else but a woman's eyes in front view for risk of being labelled "a leerer"<P>Any more qustions, other than never turst a man with sunglasses on, expecially if they don't move their heads.<P>thl