RUN, RUN, RUN, RUN FAST and don't look back. Don't go any further to where it will be almost impossible to get out emotionally. You are setting yourself up for heart ache and pain down the road. Don't do it!!!! The guy may have charm and charisma galore but you have to resist it and get out. There are many other wonderful men out there without having to deal with him and the X-files. Don't do that to yourself. You deserve much better.

Ashygirl, I read your story. All I can say is MY, MY, MY! He sounds so much like my Rev. Dude. I hope you've managed to stay away completely. <p>Here's the account of my finally-ending saga:<p>HOW WE MET
I live in GA. In early Nov. I attended a friend's son's funeral in IL. After the svc. concluded, we were all standing around in the lobby of the church. Most were preparing to proceed to the burial; I was to head straight to the airport to catch my flight back home. As I'm standing against the wall waiting to see my friend and bid him farewell and my final expressions of sympathy, I happen to catch the eye of this gorgeous gentleman across the aisle staring holes through me. (Ya know how you just happen to catch somebody's eye because they're blatantly staring at you...?) Anyway, I dismissed it and turned
my focus back on the grieving family. Less than 5 minutes later, he's approaching me. <p>Him: "Hi. Do you go to Pastor *@#%*'s church? You look real familiar." (Oldest line in the book, right?) He was asking if I was a member of my friends church...my friend's a minister also. <p>Me: "No, I've visited his church on a number of occasions a few years ago when he was a part of this ministry." (Referring to the church that we were in at the moment.) "I know he's got his own ministry now. Do you attend his church?" <p>Him: "No, but he used to be my pastor some years ago at the other church he lead. I couldn't help but notice you from across the room. You have a certain aura? about yourself. I had to come over and say 'hi'. You seem to have a really gentle spirit." (Later on the plane, I thought to myself, 'why couldn't he just come out and say this instead of running the you-look-familiar line on me.) "I pastor a church over off of
%$#@ Street. Do you know where that is?" <p>Me: "No. I don't live here." <p>Him: "Oh, where are you from?" <p>Me: "I'm here from GA." <p>Him: "Ohhhh, ok. So how long are you gonna be here?" <p>Me: "For about another couple of hours." <p>Him: "Are you flying?" <p>Me: "Yes." <p>Him: "Do you need a ride to the airport?" <p>Me: "No, I rented a car." <p>Him: "Oh, that's too bad. I could have taken you to the airport." <p>Me: ...joking, "I wish you had told me that yesterday." <p>Him: ...in a real charming-borderline sleazy manner: "I wish I'd met you yesterday." <p>Anyway, to shorten this story, he gives me his card for his church and asks me to call him sometime. I said I would. He says, "maybe I can come down to GA." ...which made him appear pretty assuming. He walked away from me slowly, like he didn't want to let go of the moment, continuing to look back gazing at me. He seemed to be totally mesmerized by me, but as I usually do I immediately concluded in my mind that he would shortly be telling another woman the same thing. (I tend to distrust men...but of course the attention is terribly flattering.) <p>Later that night when I was back at home, I got a chance to speak with my friend by phone. I asked him, "what do you know about this #*@^% fella?" (We'll just call him 'Tony.') My friend did not hesitate to let me know that Tony was a
womanizer and had been married "about" 5 times. He went on to tell me about how he'd been (sexually) involved with one of the women in his (my friend's) ministry. With that, I decided that I would not waste my time calling him. But one day, curiosity overcame me. I couldn't help but recalling our meeting and I suppose I was taken in by his attraction for me. I really wanted to see what he was all about and whether he would divulge the same information to me that my friend did. <p>Surprisingly, he did. He was up front, honest and attempted to lay it all out on the table. One night at work, he said he felt led to write me a story about his life...and all those marriages, so he did. That's the 6-page expose' that I mentioned previously...the one that turned the women into the villains. With the letter, he sent me sweet little cards in frames...the ones you get from the Christian book store...one with my name and my name's meaning on it and another with that "I Prayed For You Today" poem, a tape of one of his sermons, a tape of a few of the 'pre-demo' songs that he'd recorded along with some jazz tapes. (Boy, it sure didn't help my lil' heart any that he has a LOVELY voice! This immediately appealed to the musician in me.) We've continued to talk on the phone every few days...usually him calling me. He keeps saying you can call me anytime, I don't care how late it is...if you ever want to talk, just call. Sooooo sweet and charming. "Call me and let it ring once, if I see it's you, I'll call you right back so the bill's on me." (He gets 1 cookie for being considerate.) He read me a number of the poems that he'd written in the past and since our first phone conversation, he has written a number of poems just for me. <p>Continued...<p>[ December 24, 2001: Message edited by: Anchorwoman ]<p>[ December 24, 2001: Message edited by: Anchorwoman ]<p>[ December 24, 2001: Message edited by: Anchorwoman ]</p>

I must admit that I wrote him a letter back. It wasn't anything that was to fuel his desires for me...the bulk of the letter was my sharing a traumatic experience in my own life that I thought he could stand to learn from. (That's another whole story too long to share, but it was my own expose' of a could've been fornication experience with a fatal end.) But by the time he received and read my letter he knew that I sympathized with his 'fornication' struggles...that I knew the path all too well. But my letter also made it clear to him that I'm presently commited to sexual purity until marriage. I tried not to slam him too hard, but I didn't mince words either. My letter was clear about how much I was bothered by the fact that 'men of God'...i.e. preachers, pastors, etc. often have no better standard than that of the world when it comes to sexual immorality. His letter to me alluded to the fact that he knew he needed to be married for what God was doing through him in ministry. (Mind you, his first marriage was a result of 'matchmaking'...he was a new minister and one of his fellow ministers said that "you're a minister now, you need to be like us and get a wife.") He was quick to use the 'better to marry than to burn scripture' and I was quick in my letter to let him know that many times when we have strong desires for companionship, sex, etc. God is wanting us to learn restraint. I told him I felt like if God couldn't trust his SERVANTS to learn restraint, discipline and control in our mere fleshly beings, how would He be able to trust us in greater spiritual feats...int'l missions work, ministering to others' deep hurts and bondages, battling spiritual wickedness, etc...areas where restraint, discipline and control are mandates for success. Really, I let him have it (in a tactful & loving way), not because I think I'm so saintly and he's such a heathen but because I'm so sick and tired of ministers claiming that God has endowed them with so much power and established positions of leadership and influence for them but they don't seem to want to tap into that same power to find the wisdom and strength to resist tempation! The first time we talked on the phone and he shared with me about the baby, he was really casual about it like it was no big thing. It was like, "yeah, last year some things went down...and I didn't try to hide it from the church, I was up front about it and they surrounded me and prayed me through it (like he was a victim) and encouraged me to go on in the work of the ministry."<p>In our next conversation after his reading my letter, he was humbled, broken..."pierced" was what he called it. He sympathized with me about the experience I shared with. (I didn't give him my whole life story like he tried to give me.) He expressed that through my letter and sharing my experience that he liked me all the more. So on he goes laying it thick...more poems, more singing, more "hey, girl I'm really feeling good about us and I believe God is going to do big things through us." <p>And the whole time, I'm saying in the back of my mind, I have to get running. I know this isn't going anywhere, so why indulge either of us in this. But the conversations were sooooo good. Last week at least twice we must have stayed on the phone from 1 something a.m. until 4 something. He's really comical and makes me laugh, we prayed together a few times...but every time he started with that "you're my soulmate/I want you/I can see us doing this and that together" I would get quiet. He kept saying, "I'm not gonna try to convince you" but in the next breath it would seem like he was trying to sell me the idea. I made it clear to him that I have reservations, that I don't trust men very easily (due to growing up in a family - immediate and extended - where infidelity was a common thing.) He said that he understood and that he was "willing to wait"...that he was not intimidated by my reservations. (As if he'd already hit a homerun, he was just gonna wait as long as it would take for me to round home plate. Ha!)<p>Anyway, I know I should not have kept the conversations going. I was guilty of flattering him too. And I knew that I was not 'guarding my heart' like I've promised myself to do. You see, I've been in a number of 'wrong' relations in the past myself. I've been engaged four times - just fortunate enough to have not taken the plunge. Each time, I realized before it was too late that none of them weren THE ONE and that I had issues that need to be dealt with as well - then, and STILL.<p>Continued...

I'm sorry this is sooo lengthy, but this is the last one:<p>...One of our last lengthy conversations was Tues. or Wed. night last week. I let him know in so many words that he needed to back off, that I didn't want to lead him somewhere that I wasn't going to continue to follow. He listened intently and said he understood and that he would stop calling and stop sending poems, etc., but he wanted us to continue to intercede for each other. Then later in the conversation he got quiet...and then mushy and stuff, "I wished I could say that I wasn't bothered...that I'm really ok with this, but I'm not. I'm kinda hurt. I need you. I want to be with you"...yada, yada, ya. I sat there and listened to him. (He really seems to have a codependency problem. He admitted that he wears his heart on his sleeve.) He went off on a tangent about our prior conversation and about how much he'd enjoyed talking to me...that when I talked to him he wanted to hold me, he wanted me there with him. He was like, "I could just feel you here. I just wanted to love you." I immediately stopped him and asked him what he meant by that. "You know what I mean." I said no, I don't...tell me. He asks, "Do I have to say it? I wanted to make love to you...love you all over." I'm thinking, FOOL YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW ME! I had an idea that this is what he meant, but I couldn't believe he was saying that or that he would desire me like that WITHOUT EVEN KNOWING ME! Though that was a major turnoff, by the time we got ready to close the conversation, he had softened my heart and I was wimping out where my 'running' was concerned. We got off of the phone around 5 a.m. The next morning I knew that I had to write him. Morning time is my quiet time with God, time to pray and meditate on the Word...morning time is also reality time for me...emotions are out the window and logic and wisdom are the order of the day (no matter how emotional, flirty and fantasizing I've been the evening prior.) I knew I had to write him and cut it off cold turkey. I'm a lot more blunt, to-the-point and thorough when I write. On the phone and in person, I have the need to soften things and spare people's feelings. So I did just that. I wrote (typed) on nice Christmas stationary a 4-page letter. He will have no doubts about what we can and can't be after he reads it (he will receive it today) but the hard part will be for me to stick by what I've said. (I think we confuse men a lot of times - I know I do - going back and forth based on how we're feeling at the time.) I was honest with him about how I felt about his 'baggage.' I told him that it was HIGHLY UNLIKELY that I would ever commit myself to him in marriage so there was no use in us continuing to waste time - and money on 4/5 hour phone calls. I was honest with him about my own capricious, fickle nature (which has helped to sabotage many of my relationships in the past.) That I knew he'd been through enough relationship trauma. I told him that I was open to friendship but nothing more. I didn't want to "write checks that I couldn't cash." I also let him know that him telling me that he wanted to make love to me helped to send me 'packing' and that I was apalled that he would say that after my last letter made it clear about how I was trying to stay clean. (I think I was kinda upset that him saying that stirred up those desires in me and got me thinking on that circuit again...I have a strong sex drive and I know that the thoughts are usually the precursors to falling into the act.) I've learned to stay away from guy friends/suitors who don't share my conviction and commitment to celibacy 'til marriage! And him saying that was enough to let me know that if he probably had not cleaned up his act like he led me to believe...that if he had the chance, he'd jump right on it - or should I say "in it" [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] One word of advice that a lot of people have offered me here became all the more magnified..<p>RUN, ANCHORWOMAN, RUN...like Jenny told Forrest!<p>That was the good girl in me. The bad girl sent pictures. (He had asked me last week about sending him a picture of me.) I said that I would, then a few days later decided that it would only fuel his desires...and told him on the phone that I'd decided against it. But then I sent with this 'Dear John' letter a collage of pictures that I created for him - color photocopied pictures - not the actual photos. I told him on the letter that I wanted him to trash them after he looked at them. (I know, I know...it was stupid to send them.) Of course he's not gonna trash them and it's gonna make it that much harder for him to get me out of his system, but at least I'll know that he knows where I stand and that I'm not only looking out for me but him too. <p>Here's the funny thing: not one time do I remember 'Tony' asking me about my own personal interests. He knew from our conversations that I'm in school...never asked what I was studying. It was always emotional stuff or about what we could be & do together (within HIS endeavors, that is.) It was always about how "beautiful you are", how "I really want us to be together", how I could assist him in ministry, how with his voice and songs that he's written he could give me stuff to play on the piano. Mind you, I've been playing for 20 years...you'd think I might already have some personal nterests and tastes in the music that I write and play...did he ever ask about that - NO! He was already talking about me moving to IL. More and more I'm seeing that I was probably just next in Tony's wifely lineup - even though his intentions may have been good. <p>Ashygirl - yes, please send me your email address. I'm curious to know if you've been able to stay on track with your studies or whether you're finished. I'm a 'non-traditional student' as well and it IT'S NOT EASY.<p>[ December 24, 2001: Message edited by: Anchorwoman ]<p>[ December 24, 2001: Message edited by: Anchorwoman ]</p>

Hi Anchorwoman,<p>WOW, when I read your story, if I wasn't on the other side of the US, I'd say we were talking about the same man. There are quite a few things in your post that I want to address, but I won't have time till after Christmas is over. <p>But I'll say this quickly. I have had a track record with men like you have. I wanted in therapy to figure out why I choose these types of men, and what I really learned is that I don't choose THEM, they choose ME. There is something about that type of man that they can spot women who have traumatized pasts or are in a vulnerable state. I believe you are in the same situation. My former boyfriend was incredibly gorgeous, and while I've been told I'm a beautiful woman, so many times I wondered how I could have captured such a wonderful, handsome, talented man (who could write, sing, was so open about telling me his life story and how he had been hurt so deeply by women.<p>I am graduating magna cum laude in May from a major university [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] I failed one class, had to take it over again, but I did, and I got my life back on track. <p>I did work through this, better after cutting off ALL contact with him. It wasn't until I did that, that I was able to move forward and he was no longer able to manipulate my emotions. I can see your ambivalence in breaking off this relationship, because of your sending him pictures of you and telling him you are open to being friends. It's like a moth drawn inexorably to a flame, but anchorwoman, you get too close and you'll be burned. I hope you are not offended when I say that by doing this, you gave him a way to still keep in contact with you. It's VERY flattering to have the attentions of a gorgeous man, especially when you have a love/hate relationship with men, as I feel you may have. I may be wrong, but I do sense this.

It took me a LONG time to get him out of my mind and my heart, whereas if I had listened to my inner voice in the beginning about reservations I had, I would have saved myself a lot of grief, money, time and heartache.<p>My email address is ashygirl99@yahoo.com. I'll look forward to hearing from you.<p>Take care and God bless.

Hi Anchorwoman,<p>I want to post this url for you to read. It's an eye opener, to say the least. I printed it out for myself for future reference.<p>In case the url doesn't post correctly ( I lurk a lot, but don't post very often), go to the General Questions forum, and find a post by Resilient titled "To Hailey". <p>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=37&t=014307<p>In case you are wondering why I still lurk here, I use the principles here to guide me in developing new, healthy relationships with men. I also follow some of the stories here, because by learning from other's experiences, I hope to avoid the pitfalls they have encountered. <p>Have a wonderful Christmas.<p>[ December 24, 2001: Message edited by: ashygirl ]</p>

Anchorwoman,<p>I think it's time you asked yourself these questions...<p>Why do you continue to lead this guy on?<p>Why do you continue talking to him?<p>Why do you sit on the phone listening to a preacher telling you he wants to have sex with you?<p>Why do you talk to a preacher who has these thoughts for hours and hours?<p>You say you stay away from people who don't share your conviction in celebacy???? Then why do you tell him you will still be around and be his friend???<p>Why did you send him a whole photo album of pictures of you??? <p>You say you know it'll make it harder for him to get over you with all those beautiful pictures of you??? Well, why send them??? Perhaps because you don't want him to get over you? Perhaps because you like this cat and mouse game???<p>Do you really want him out of your life???<p>Is he the only one playing games in this relationship or are you playing them too?<p>Is he the only one codependent, or are you codependent too?<p>ANNA<p>[ December 25, 2001: Message edited by: Anna2000 ]</p>

RUN< RUN FOR tHe hills! Just my 2 cents, good luck to you... there is better than this out there. love to you, honey

I'm starting to wonder the same things as Anna2000...<p>What's up?<p>Aloha,
Ms.O

Anna scared her off!!!!! [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img]

Nina too: ...not a chance. Try again, dear. The Anchorwoman can't be scared off that easily. If it's okay with you, I've spent some quality time with my fam. the last few days...I figured my last post (the book) was enough to last for a few days.<p>Anna, I do believe if you'll read back - carefully - through all of my posts you truly will find the answers to all of your questions. It's not so much about enjoying a 'cat and mouse' game unless that's the term you use to describe the simple "liking to be liked" that all women (I guess) enjoy. Arrrgh...ok, ok, I'll admit that the Anchorwoman is not completely cured from her character of conceit and vanity and I suppose I wanted I wanted to hear him say...<p>Nevermind...<p>I know, I know...sending the pictures was a bad idea. I think I've said that already, too. So I guess that makes me a little teaser. But anyway, it was my decision to not write Rev. Dude off as a complete demon, closing the door to ANY and ALL future communications. It is quite clear to him that we will not be building on anything for a relationship and that's what I was after. We agreed to continue to intercede for each other in prayer though we haven't been and obviously won't be communicating like we were.<p>Thanks again to all of you guys for you input and advice.

Anchorwoman,<p>I was joking!!!!!!!!<p>Sheesh!!!!!!!!!!!