I wouldn't do anything too quick.
It's a normal response to a situation that when confronted with it, they lash out, with words that they know hurt, but don't necessaily mean.
Sit on it for a few days, and see if he doesn't have a change of heart.
Stay Strong!
Wallace

I have survived the night! Actually he reacted much better than I expected. He has said so many mean and hurtful things that his reaction came across as the most civil response to me he's given in quite some time. I still don't have a clue how he really feels tho. Now he acts like nothing has happened and he is just a happily married man. Till next time. It's the jumping back and forth that is getting me down. There will come a time when he is downright mean and hateful one too many times and that will be it. The way I see it is he has about one more time time crush me before I go the other direction and never look back. I'm tired of playing these games of him thinking he can talk to me and the kids any way he wants and then turn around and be sweet. It's hard on them too.I don't even know if he means it, I think it may just be another manipulation tactic and a way to mess with my head. I'm sure he feels like he is doing nothing wrong. Which brings me to another point. If he can't admit what he's doing and quit then I'm out of here. Starting over just being nice is not going to cut it. At this point I need a sincere full confession and admission from him of his wrong doings. I will never excuse another lie.

Free

Hi Free,
I wanted to correct myself on last nights post... I was leaving my office when I noticed your post and I wanted to give you a response before I left.
IMHO. it is not a normal response, but more of a typical response from someone who may probably be in a state of depression.
I'm not a Doctor, but have dealt with it with my STBXW... who has been diagnosed as a bi-polar manic depressive.
What you described and are describing is some of the same traits my STBXW has and still does exhibit.
There is no simple answer for it, as to how to deal with it. Aside from your "H" seeking a "C" and have them treat him for it... there is not much you can do to help him.
It's not a good place to be... especially if they refuse to get treatment or take there meds as needed.
I know there are others on this board that are very familiar with this type of situation and maybe they can give you some good sound advice on this one.
Stay Strong!
Wallace

<small>[ September 26, 2002, 04:43 PM: Message edited by: Wallace ]</small>

Hi,
Wallace I want to thank you for the support you always show. It helps so much having a place where I can vent safely. I know H needs help, but like you said if he isn't going to get any I can't do it for him.

I had a day like no other yesterday. S's friend started to take him to dr to get his bandages changed. They made it 15 miles (total trip about 110 miles) and he called me at work, screaming in pain. I told them to stay where they were and I'de be right there. I called the paramedics to meet me there. He had already had 1000mg vicodin.I told him to go ahead and take 500mg more. Ok'd by dr. The paramedics called ambulance and they transported him to nearest hosp.( 22 more miles) They gave him 6 mg morophene on the way. Then the hosp gave him 4 mg morophene. Before we left they gave him 2 mg mor. They gave him a script for demerol. While waiting for script his pain get so bad that he was screaming and getting delerious. Dr said give him 2 demerol and bring him to original destination hosp. So his g/f and I started taking him to see Dr. about 30 miles short of hosp. he started haveing a reaction to demerol and then had a seizure. I called 911 again and they picked him up on the side of the road where we waited. They gave him and anti narcotic to counter act all that he had had, all by Dr. orders. Everytime they gave him something else I reminded them of everything he had already had. During this entire trip S was screaming and crying. This went on from 9am till 3:30pm. My nerves were fried by last night. Dr aspirated his knee without much luck because the blood was already clotting. He then admitted him to keep him for pain control. At this point I left the hosp and went to eat something and drink a lot of coffee. I told S I was coming home. I have never left one of my kids at the hosp without staying by their side but I had to gat out of there. His g/f stayed with him. So I drove 2 hours home, only to get another call from my cousin's wife with a whole new, heart wrenching, disaster. This one had a happy ending tho before I got off the phone. Say a prayer for me today as I am on my way back to the hosp. I had to take H's truck yesterday because...someone stoled my tire and I have not had a chance to get another one. Got home and H says, "What did you do to my clutch?" ??? I have no idea. I was so careful to drive his truck carefully so he wouldn't have anything to be mad at me about. Right now I have to go borrow my mom's car to go pick up S from hosp. I feel much better this am to face the day but yesterday was very stressful. The ambulance driver asked me if I was ok to drive and S told him "My mom doesn't freak out about anything" and I don't, but the stress really affected everything on the inside. Will give you an update later today. H was so cheerful everytime I talked to him yesterday that you'de have thought he just won the lottery. He kisses me bye in the mornings and has been less hateful since our discussion. I don't know at this point if he's glad I'm leaving him or trying to get me to change my mind.
Take care,
Free

Hi Free,
I was wondering about all the pain killers your "S" was getting.
The dosages you were telling me about were right up there.
It sounds like you are having quite a time.
I hope your "S" is doing better... he has been through quite a bit.
I hope his day is going better.
I remember when my "S" got into his car wreak just shorly after the STBXW left... it was quite an experience.
I have a pretty good idea how your feeling about now.
Say a pray it has to get better.
Interesting that your "H" is acting nice again.
Who knows.... if he reads some of your posts, he may straighten his act out.
I still think he needs to see a Doctor for his depression.
Keep me updated on things as they progress
Stay Strong!
Wallace

It's me again...
Much better day today. S is home from hosp. Has had 2 more bad episodes of pain but I think we are getting it under control. He is on percocet and valium now. He is having some pain right now but we just got home from a two hour trip. I feel normal again. I am in agreement with you on the depression bit. H is not in as good a mood as yesterday and did offer to go with me to pick up S but there really wasn't enough room. I don't know what is going to happen but I do feel at peace. I almost feel like I'm on the outside looking at someone elses life as far as emotions go. If I can keep feeling like I am right now I'll be ok. I have just about gotten completly over feeling reponsible for other peoples problems, which is really a big step for me being the codependant person that I am. I have the next 2 days off and plan to do a lot of painting for my craft sale coming up. I usually make a small chunk of money at it and it's fun. I love talking to people, especially when they buy my stuff!

How is your life these days? It's getting closer to some closure but I know it's not much to look forward to. I think the day will come when you can get past this and be happy. I've been trying to get over it for about 2 years seriously now and feel like I have made some progress but it is hard to think of giving up a life you have grown comfortable with no matter what it is like.

Take care,
Free

Good morning! I feel great today...so far. My S has had some extremly hard times with excruciating, unrelenting pain, but seems better today. I had a good night and feel rested. I am going to go through with divorce. I feel it is the right thing for me to do. Some things have transpired that just make me sick to think about (H's behavior) He will just have to do what he has to do. He doesn't seem to care that's what I have planned or he doesn't believe me. I feel totaly at ease with this decision and if it's not what he wanted, he should have told me when I told him of my plans. I feel it it my best option at this point. I know a lot of you won't understand as it sounds like I'm throwing in the towel so easily. This decision did not come easy. It has cost me a lot of anguish. He has issues, mainly non-communication with me and if he doesn't want this, he better get a grip and and get it quick. It's like the song says, "You've got five minutes to figure it out" I sound cold and uncaring but that about sums it up. Maybe he will find some support somewhere, maybe even here. Since he does know about this site now. I don't hate him but I am feeling quite indifferent about the whole situation, which I don't particularly think is healthy, but I'm working on it.
Free <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Free - I don't think you sound cold hearted at all. You have been through a lot with this man and you tried more than once to get back into your M and have him seek counseling, etc. Sometimes we just have to say enough. I know that you tried a lot longer than I did before I said enough so if you are cold hearted than I'm really cold hearted.

Sounds like you know where you are going and how to get there. Your H and my STBXH sound a lot a like in the fact that if it isn't for them they don't want any part of it and that is the most selfish thing that I think anyone can do.

Court is tomm. afternoon. Met with IC on Friday and she asked if I was worried about it. Told her that I was a little concerned about how I was going to react once I left the courts but I really was worried about what I was going to wear. Plan on something that will knock his socks off and make him see what he lost.

I stated that sometimes you just have to say enough is enough. I had enough when I no longer had any love or feelings for him. He has lied and been so decietful and hurtful that I could never have that love back or trust him. He is not the same man that I married so it is like he is a stanger now and someone that I wouldn't be interested in.

Planning on dinner with a girlfriend and her family tomm. night. My S and her S are a couple of years apart in age. Just want to be calm, cool and collected when I get out of that court room and even when I'm out tomm. night. I have told myself if I want to let it loose it will have to wait until I go to bed tomm. night.

Take care of yourself and hope your S improves. I will check in on Tuesday and let you all know how things went. Thank you all for your support. Without this forum, I would be lost.
I can do this, I can be strong.

Hi and thanks,
I have had enough and I no longer feel guity for not being able to turn things around here. I have given it my all. I feel so much better that I have made uf my mind. I kept waiting for a "good" time to tell him and do this and actually ended up picking a very bad time with S's surgery and all but it's ok. I will survive. I feel such a relief. I am going through with this.
And just in case you are reading this Ray, I am not bragging about this divorce, I am sharing with my online friends because they offer me emotional support, something you have never been able to do. This is my life too, and if you have a problem with this then don't come here and read. Simple as that.
S is doing a little better but has some nasty looking blisters on his knee. I hope it's not staph infection. Will call Dr later this am and find out what he thinks.
Good luck in court today let us know what happens.
I have a new set of concerns with one of my kids. Do any of you know much about spiritual diliverance? This subject I would like to confer with someone knowledgable, through email.
Have a great day
Free <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Hi All,
I have been away from the boards for a couple of days to get a handle on this bombshell that my OD19 dropped on me Satuday night... and I am just fuming.
She announced to me... that she has dropped out of college and is moving in with her boyfriend in the next couple of weeks.
I am so much against this, that I just snapped a nut.
After much discussion, of why she was making a "HUGE" mistake... I told her to have her and all her things out of the house by the end of the week... that I would not be a part of her throwing her education away and moving in with her boyfriend.
I feel that strongly about it.
This goes against "everything", and I mean everything... that I believe in.
My daughter knows my convictions as far as my walk with the Lord, and the sanctity of marriage and she couldn't have picked a worse time to come up with this situation.
I am just livid.
I may even post this just to vent, I don't know yet.
ITABD...
We will be thinking about you today and I want you to know that our prayers will be with you.
I hope your day goes as well as it possibly can.
I'm glad to hear that you will have a friend be around after it is all said and done with... I think that is a very wise move.
May the Lord be with you and comfort you as you go through your day.
Blessing always.
Free...
I support you in your decision to move forward with your life... be it with or without your "H".
I know this is not a reckless decision on your part... you have tried.
We will be here for you as you move forward, and things progress
If your "H" would like to post something on this site, after he is done reading... I'm sure we would all be more than happy to have a constructive dialog with him.
Who knows... something good may come out of it all.
Sounds like your "S" is doing better... glad to hear that.
With all the pain he has been in..he could very well have an infection... are they giving him any antibiotics?
Hang in there... it's got to get better... at least that's what I keep saying to myself.
Stay Strong!
Wallace

Wallace,
I have been through a similar situation with my oldest. One of the hardest things I have had to learn in life is compromise. Especeally when it comes to my Christian beliefs. Sometimes we just have to let go and let God handle it. One thing you have to be thankful for is you still have her here. I am dealing with someone right now whose D just had too much dispair and agony in her life, was a beautiful model and two small children. Life became too much for her to handle and she ended it. It all seems devastating when things happen, but once they are gone we would trade anything to have them back. I'm not trying t minimize you pain in this, especially all you've gone through already. It may be that she feels she has had all the saddness she can handle and this is her way of coping with it. Just love her no matter what. As much as we want our kids to do right and protect them, mostl;y from themselves, we are not their judge. I'm not saying we have to or should condone their actions, but right now, the more she is pushed, the more she is likely to resist. Love her unconditionally and she will return from where she strayed. That is a promise from God.
My S is still having a terrible time with his surgery and is now running a fever. He is bruised from his him to his ankle and has been in agony for one week now. I'm about ready ti fire my Dr. Gotta run now. Hang in there and I'll be praying for you guys.
Free

Hello Everyone:
Well here I am the divorcee (that is a word isn't it?). Things went well at court yesterday. Spoke to EXH about D and the fact that she isn't paying for her car insurance. Wants to be treated like an adult but doesn't want to act like one. EXH also told me that he has called her 3-4 times and e-mailed her a couple and she hasn't responded to him. I just said that she hadn't said anything to me about why she wouldn't be returning calls/e-mails. We also talked about S and how he was handling school and driving, etc.

I got the feeling when we were in the parking lot that he was waiting for me to break down, but it didn't happen. He asked if I wanted to drop S off tonight or if I wanted him to pickup. I told him that I could drop him off but you normally pick him up before I get home so just let S know what you want to do.

Gave me the sob story about having to keep the money in the 401K that I give him out of mine so that it is protected from the bankruptcy that he is going to file. I got the equity in the house when we sold it and he is upset because he won't have any cash out of this. Told him that I didn't think of it that way and his response was "I know, but I wasn't going to argue with you" What??? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />
I really wanted to say well if you didn't run the business into the ground, you/we wouldn't have to file bankruptcy. That will be the next hurdle in this mess. Just taking it a day at a time.

Only broke down once when I was talking to a GF on the phone yesterday. She asked how I was doing and told her that there was an ache in my heart. I guess I just have to remember that he isn't the man that I married and as far as I can see he never will be again. I will just have to have the memories of the good times to think about.

Wallace - I don't know what to say. My D is 19 as well (B-Day on Saturday) and I would have the same views as you about dropping out of college and living with someone. I'm a little more open about the living together but the fact that her future is at stake is the big problem. I hope and pray that you will find a way to work through this with her. It's the real pits when you have to be both Mom and Dad to children and they know that you are vulnerable right now and take full advantage of it. Hang in there and keep us posted.

Free - Hope your S is doing better today. Like you said you were waiting for the right time to tell H about divorce but I think sometimes we don't have control over things and they are told when they are supposed to be told. I know you aren't bragging about the DV, this is something that you have tried to avoid for a very long time.

Thank you all for your support. I will touch base later in the week.

Hi again,
I just returned home from taking S to see my brother. He is a neuro doc and has a clinic today 40 miles from here. Although he doesn't specialize in this, I wanted him to have a look at him because I am beginning to think his
Dr. is not the best. He has been running a temp and his coloring is horrible. Starting to look a liitle yellow. I'm concerned about his liver at this point because of all the medication. He has had more tolerance for his pain since about 11 am today. My brother is going to check with some other ortho doc's to see if anyone will take him since he is only 1 week post-op. This has been so draining.

Now I need to go get a rim and tire for my car, since someone thought they needed mine worse than I did, so I will have reliable transportation. Somethngs wrong with H's truck and he took it into the shop to get it fixed. We live so far from town (60 miles). I wish H would have been kind enough to pick up my tire for me since that's where he went but said he didn't have time because everything would be closed by the time his truck was ready. He could have just left sooner and done it but I might as well get used to taking care of myself since it looks like that's what I'm going to be doing.
I put in a call to a minister that I had met some years back that deals with deliverance and such to see what kind of help I can get for my oldest S. He really needs some help and has always felt like
God is calling him into the ministry but he has been fighting it so far. The first time he told me he had a calling for this he was only 2 and a half years old. I have so much hope for a happy life or just a life without all of the negative that is brought on just through my situation. I am a very strong person but I have endured just about my limit. I know God says he won't put us through more than we can bear but he also says his grace is sufficient. My heart and spirit knows the right way to go if I can just get my body to follow.

Wallace, I understand how you feel, but don't let the devil use this to bring you down further. Let's keep binding him off our lives so God can bring us into the place he wants us to be.

ITABD, You have crossed some major bridges and you will have some bad times as we all will but we will all be overcomers and stronger for it. We just all need some relief from our pain, if even for a short time.
Blessings to you all
Free

Hi All,
Free...
I posted a thread on this, and I just wanted to let you know if you didn't by chance see it... that my "D" moved out yesterday.
I knew that the closer that I got to the day of the "FJ", that things would most probably get worse.
I feel that I am about to go through a living hell... more so, than what I am already going through.
I have found that the closer I come to the Lord, the more Satan tries to destroy.
Sometimes I feel like Job.
I've lost all my previous battles with Satan.
I am determined to stand regardless of what transpires this time around.
It's killing me, but I am determined.
I am very concerned about what you are telling us about your son.
I think you made a good move by finding another Doctor
My prayers will be with you... and I hope and pray that your son gets relief from all of his pain.
ITABD...
I am so pleased to hear that you held up so well yesterday.
I'm sure it was very tough on you.
Hopefully as the days pass you will feel less amd less stressed about what has happened.
It's got to get better for you from here... right?
Tell your "D" I said "Happy Birthday".
I hope she has a wonderful day.
Thank you for your kind words of encouragement and direction... it helps, make no mistake about it.
I'm still feeling pretty overwhelmed by all that is going on, so bear with me if you can.
Thanks for all of you being here.
Stay Strong!
Wallace

Wallace,
I did read your other post and I feel...I don't know what I feel....But I know the anguish and the way you feel about the closer you get to God, the more intense the battle gets. One of the reasons I stayed in my marriage through the worst times was just to prevent the devil from having victory in my life. However, I know in my heart and spirit God told me to get out and by staying maybe Satan has won. I don't expect anyone to understand what I mean about God telling me to get out b/c in effect, it goes against scripture. I have my oldest S now telling me he thinks he may be possessed! I told him whether it's possession (which I have doubts) or oppression or just needing deliverance from some things he has been into, I will find him some help. Told him don't be surprised if I show up with a posse of a deliverance team and we will get this taken care of. I feel something there and I don't know what it is, but I need some people experienced with this to help me out. I have called a man in this ministry, he is praying for direction. I feel like it is a generational curse on his fathers side. I know who is stronger and God will prevail. I also know who ever tries helps him is going to have to be stronger than I am or at least a little more knowledgable in this area. I feel a mighty battle coming on and I am already so beaten down that I have got to get strong. I feel strong and ready in my mind and spirit but my body is so exhausted. I think you are not the only one feeling defeated at this time, I do too. But we have to keep trying. I feel like I wish there was someone just to hold me and tell me everything is going to be ok. Even in a bad marriage, we still had that sometimes. I'm sure you probably need some of the same. We just have to keep our faith, no matter what it looks like, but God, WE NEED SOME RELIEF AND A BREAK!!

As appealing as have someone hold me and tell everything will be ok, I'm not willing to backtrack and go crawling to my H. I'll just do without and wait on the Lord and I hope he hurries.
Free

Hi Free,

You are not kidding about needing a break... I know exactly how you feel.

It wears you down... and the sad part is, there is no escaping it... at least not for the time being.

I understand now about the spiritual deliverance you were asking about.

I think I could use that over here as well.

Put it in God's hands at this point, because we are fighting against something that is much more powerful than we can handle by ourselves.

I wish Lara was around, she is much more versed at this than most.

My prayers are with you, and I am standing with you on this one... it's not something that you can handle on your own.

I found that out the hard way.

I hope your S is doing better.

Stay Strong!

Wallace

I'm changing my name. I'm not free, I am in bondage to something within my head. Don't know what it is. I stressed to the max tonight. I have got to make some changes while there is anything left in me to do it. I am running out of steam. I spent 2 hours visiting with the pastor and his wife tonight. Just talked, trying to feel something and understand anything. I survived the hard trials and now it seems the litttle one will be the ones to do me in. I have never in my life been in the shape I am in now. It feels like I'm being crushed and about to explode at the same time. I don't think the peace of mind will return until I can relinquish all of my problems to God and leave them there. It just seems like he gave us a brain for a reason and I'm trying to use mine to solve my problems and do the right thing. I hope and pray when I wake up in the morning, God will be so kind as to let me know without a doubt what I need to do...about a lot of things. If anyone has time for an extra prayer, I could use one.
Thanks

Well, I'm am better today. Still have a way to go before good, but better. My physical state is just so jittery, but I think I'm getting my head back in order. My heart is broken over all of this but it is something I'm going to have to do. I'm am too co-dependent and I am working on myself.

ITABD how are you doing? I hope things are getting easier for you.

Wallace my prayers are with you as your court date approaches and hope it brings about some closure and a healing can begin.

I just can't keep doing what I'm doing because it is making me so physically ill. My boss offered me the day off on friday because I was a mess but I told her I would rather work and keep my mind busy.

I will talk to you all later. Not sure when, but my prayers are with you.
Free

Free -
I knew there was a reason that I needed to check this board today. I'm sorry that this is affecting you physically as well as emotionally. I, like you, was to a point where I couldn't eat because of the huge lump in my throat all the time. My company also offered to let me have some time off, but like you, I found it was better for me to be there and keep busy than dwell on it at home. Hang in there and your heart and God are going to lead you to where you need to be. I will say an extra prayer for you.

I have good days and bad days. Today is an o.k. day. My D came home last night from college. Her B-Day is today. We had dinner and cake/ice cream and then I took S over to EXH's. We watched a DVD on the new player that my family bought for her and just hung out. When S called EXH to see if he was home last night before I took him over, he asked to speak to D to find out when he could see her this weekend. I guess he had been trying to call/e-mail her for about a week and she wouldn't return calls. She spent about 2 hours over there this afternoon. I get the feeling that she really doesn't want to see him, but knows that he wants to see her. What is really sad to think is that this was one of the most beautiful days of my life with EXH. I will never forget the look on his face when they gave D to me the first time and big tears were in my eyes. That was 20 years ago.. hard to believe that you can still think of all the really emotional things that happened with you when you were M. I hope that some day I will look back on these things and remember how it used to be and not be so sad about it. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

As for having the D final, sometimes that doesn't really register with me. I've been trying to read the book "Mars and Venus Starting Over". Has some good things in it but I think that I might still be too angry and hurt to put a lot of the things to practice. Just takes time, right?

Wallace: How are things with your OD? How are the other kids handling this? I know this has been a big blow to you but we just keep on trying and doing our best at raising these kids and that's all that God asks. You take care and keep us updated. I will say a prayer for you as well.

ITABD Thanks for being there. I'm still pretty much a mess, but trying to get my act together. My friend and I took our kids (some of them anyway) for a ride to the mountains and had a picnic yesterday. It was very relaxing. We saw some deer and just relaxed for a while. I had planned to get my laundry caught up and clean my house but said what the heck it will be here when I get back. It was! I have two more road trips coming up for my job, the 3rd and 4th week in Oct. It's a lot of fun and really helps to get away, even tho it's all work. I have an art show Thanksgiving weekend I have got to get ready for if I'm going to do it. I love doing the show and I usually make some money and I always wait till the last minute to start painting my stuff. I just realized by this post that I am trying to avoid my real issue here and focus on some other things. I just feel like I have to get my mind on something else for a . Nothing in my relationship situation has improved as far as I can tell. My S that had surgery has had some bad nose bleeds and we had to take him off some of his meds. He is very depressed right now feels life will never be better. Thanks so much for the prayers, it is helpin and I sure need them. I will keep you guys in mine too.
Wallace...How's it going? I guess all we can to is as you say,"Stay Strong", stand our ground and keep the faith ans we travel down our bumpy roads. It can never be just one problem at a time, the devil has to throw us a curve ball, put big rocks in our road, dig big holes in our path, and then we have to watch out for falling rocks while we make our way. I'm praying for you too.
Free