Today I met the XH at the post office to send the 2002 taxes in. Yes the 2002 which he didn't send it. Sent Registered form. Which he found the taxes, and agreed to send them in. This was a good step to do this together, and I kept the green receipt. I want my life back in order and this was a good step in that direction. At the post office, I brought my tax return with me, for him to right down the figures, that I used which he will use the same figures on his tax return. Which we agreed to on the phone. Anyways, he got so angry and started yelling again at me, for that I had claimed all the kids down on my income tax. They live with me and I feed them, and they live under my roof. Also, the divorce decree states that I get to claim them for 2003. I did what the counselor has been teaching me, I took the papers and put them in my manila folder and started to walk away, stating that I am no longer going to listen to him berate me in public. I had to walk away, and it actually was very sad to have to do this again. Inner feelings were hurt, and you know, he didn't flinch one bit. He doesn't even feel guilt or remorse about berating me. I saw this again today. And I just drove home very carefully. The vehicle I was driving is very wrong with the brakes, and very little brakes and big time noises. My son used my car today for school and symphony practice. I didn't think that I had to go anywhere today.

I was home for awhile after the post office, working on getting my paperwork done today. For tomorrow is studying for class. And he calls and wants to talk about the tax return. He states he wants to claim at least the one son. I had the tax return sent in electronically and I already cashed the return. I am getting afraid again, and scared! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> I don't like this feeling. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> Why doesn't the wayward spouse leave his X alone? Why do they have to show power over the weak link? I don't understand, and this is one thing that he has done most of the marriage is rule and control me. And get mad and yell when one doesn't do what he wants! I just don't know anymore! <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

I had to hang up the phone, for I could not deal with it anymore. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> To show his anger at me in public is not being thoughtful towards me and showing disrespect. Then to do it again on the phone. He will do this till he gets what he wants. He called one more time and I had to hang up on him again. I don't like hanging up on him. It is not respectful to him. But I didn't want to deal with it again. He also stated to me a couple days ago, why am I being so mean to him, and put the no contact on? Should I get rid of the no contact? And why? He is really pressuring me. He stated that if the kids were living with him, he would allow me to the house. This is proof that he still doesn't get it. He does not see what he has done by being here. I am so sad for his selfishness, and that he does not see beyond his eyes. He reflects only himself. Has made me very sad tonight <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> . I watched Paul and Jesus by Jennings tonight, and prayed. Read some of the scripture they recited, and prayed. There is so much one human can endure, and I see more that the XH only sees me as a mean, vindictive woman. He has no eyes for caring for me. He has no eyes for love. He only sees himself with himself, and the OW. Since he speaks so highly of her. I see more that he continues to get pleasure in throwing me in the ditch and throwing more dirt on me. I guess I should get ready for him to stomp his feet on the dirt to pack it down. Seems to give him pleasure. Not once did he even consider my part of the taxes. Not once did he even consider what the heck I have been going through since his contact with the other woman, and all that this family has gone through.

Today was another day, of criticizm and demeaning his XW. Stating nothing to me that was of authentic care or love. Nothing, but what is best for him only. Yes, he will have to pay taxes this year. Yes he has nothing to really deduct. But that is what happens in divorce. He wanted the divorce and now he wants his cake and ice-cream. He thinks I have it easy, well, I would like for him to be in my shoes. And try to see how easy I have it. And now to face another surgery. He doesn't even ask how things are going with me. Which I am getting used to. I don't offer, cause why talk to a wall, when the words get bounced back into my face. Never thought that this would happen between the two of us. We would be so considerate and kind to each other. But it has, and the best thing for both of us is for him to move to Arizona, where his other woman is, and he can live his life there with her.

I know there were going to be many ups and downs. I had a fantastic 2 weeks, enrichment from school, and church and no contact. And then XH gets mean and unthoughtful again. When things don't go his way, he will use whatever to get his way. He even stated that he was upset at the post office and I guess this gives his justification to get UGLY? I guess so in his terms! Just afraid to even pick the phone up. Maybe I will live somewhere else for awhile. I have a place to go. Just need my computer for my school work. But I would have to legally get a PPO, so that he would not come to the house. And notify the police. I really don't know what the heck is going on anymore? Just wanting to get my life together.

Should I let him claim one son? And why?

What about the no contact? Should I go further and get a PPO? He has done very well, in not coming over, I knew it would be hard for all of us. But now he is criticizing me for this no contact too? I can imagine what he has said to the kids! More putting me, the mother of the children, down.

I really want my life to settle down, still have many issues to deal with per the divorce. Will be getting things settled little by little. But this is another control issue by him, which is him. Controllers do not like to have others telling them what to do. I do feel that my XH is very depressed. He should get on medication. But he feels he is fine. He looks terrible, and is so lonely. That was the empath in me as we were dating. He met me when I was in the circle of friends of a christian group. He didn't have friends, and I had the friends. And I wanted to show him what friends were like, and to have a family that loves people. He seemed to really enjoy the contact, but then he criticized me during the marriage for friends calling me. Which I know now was jealousy. I still feel sorry for him, and wish he would get professional help. He deserves to feel better.

Peachy, has some of the same problems. And I have done well with the no contact. XH has done well with the no contact. But now he is trying to push his way into my territory. Asking for help again. I thought I was doing good, but now with a strong willed person he is, strong character of a person, it didn't last long. I am praying and crying for peace! <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

So help once more. I do listen to you all. And have done well in the last 2 weeks. Have to get to bed, my drugs are kicking in. Am getting tired and need to get up early. Have an appointment tomorrow.

Just reading this and thinking -- why are you talking to a wall? If you did the taxes and sent them in, why is he talking with you about them? That's his business.

How old is this son? If he lives with you, it makes sense you would claim him.

Faith4me,

Hi, sweetie. You know I've been in your shoes, right?? I want to make this sort of easy for you.

1) TAXES. Do EXACTLY what the divorce decree says you should do, and if it says you declare all the children, then you declare all the children. There is NO room for negotiation. SNL can scream and yell and holler all he wants, but the judge said you declare all the children. Period. It's not your decision to make...you just obey the judge and let SNL have his fit. You know in your head he is only having this fit because he has to pay taxes and he wants his way. Ignore it. Literally...IGNORE IT and obey the judge. If SNL has an issue, he can go to the judge.

And when he calls you harrassing you about it, just keep repeating the same phrase over and over and over: "I am following the divorce decree to the letter, and the decree says I declare all the children" (he will fuss and fume) "I am following the divorce decree to the letter, and the decree says I declare all the children" (he will yell and scream) "I am following the divorce decree to the letter, and the decree says I declare all the children" (he will intimidate and threaten) "I am following the divorce decree to the letter, and the decree says I declare all the children." Okay?? Got it??

2) No Contact. You have been doing good with no contact. It is healthy for you to have a break from the verbal and emotional abuse. No contact is in YOUR BEST INTEREST. Therefore, why would you stop it? You are not being mean to him. You gave him YEARS to treat you respectfully and courteously. He made the decision to treat you abusively, and you made the decision to protect yourself from him. That is not "mean", F4Me, that is WISE. He is merely thrashing around looking for any way to control you again, so show him that you mean business and keep that No Contact in place. If he does not like it, he honestly does have the option to start treating you respectfully, and yelling at you in public does not cut it.

Make it very simple for him and for you: NO CONTACT REMAINS IN PLACE UNTIL THERE HAS BEEN 6 CONSECUTIVE MONTHS OF RESPECTFUL TREATMENT. It's very cut and dry. If he goes 2 weeks and then screams at you in front of the kids, NO CONTACT STAYS IN PLACE. On the other hand, if he's serious about having it removed, he can take personal responsibility and learn alternatives to abusive treatment--and practice them for 6 MONTHS!!! Any time you state your boundary clearly like that and he does not respect it and work within it, that means he is just trying to control you, so ignore it.

(I'll give you an easier perspective. If you said to me, "CJ, please do not respond to me anymore as your posts upset me" and I stopped responding and honored your wishes, you might say to yourself, "Aha! We disagree but she respects me." OTOH, if I ignored your request and kept posting to you anyway, you might say to yourself, "Aha! She does not respect my boundaries and will force her control on me.")

3) PPO I'm not sure if that is required at this time--wait and see. A protective order requires that a threat has been made or physical harm in the recent past or physical damage of property in the recent past...that kind of thing. There needs to be demonstratable fear for your safety, and it needs to be current. I got an PPO (TRO in my state) on my exH the day he broke into the house and sat in my bedroom during the night...and when I awoke in the morning he said, "I can get into this house any time I want to." SPOOKY. In the recent past were events where he had broken into the house and deleted my harddrive (physical damage of my property) and threats over the phone to take the kids and I'd never see them again. I was scared out of my wits, and I felt like a sitting duck in my own home waiting for him to come attack us. At this time, whilst SNL is certainly upsetting and inappropriate, it doesn't sound as if he is a clear and present danger. Thus PPO may be jumping the gun.

4) Criticizing and Demeaning XW F4me, I'm going to keep saying this until one day DING you will get it like a lightbulb going off in your head. An abusive person is not respectful, so stop expecting him to treat you well. There are two types of power: Personal power and Power Over. You and I have personal power, meaning that when we feel powerful, it is because of something within us. When I have power to make decisions and be myself, I want to share my power and have a mutually equal relationship. Your ex and my ex have Power Over, meaning that they have no power of their own from within but rather only gain power by overcoming or overwhelming someone. When they have power to make decisions and be themselves, they are dictators and lord-it-over others by force and pressure. Their goal is to have a self-serving, controlling relationship in which they are the "winner" and we are the "loser." If we do not LOSE, they do not feel powerful.

F4Me, whenever you "win" SNL loses power and will do every trick and trap in his book to trip you up so he can "win" and be powerful again. His tricks and traps include saying you are being mean, holding the business phones over your head, holding the children/visitation over your head, not doing paperwork that is ordered from the court, not paying for things he is ordered to pay, not filing doctor payments/paperwork timely, etc. These tricks/traps ENGAGE you, you lose it and get all emotional, you "lose" and he "wins" and he feels powerful.

Now, I have NO DOUBT WHATSOEVER that he will dispute everything I've written, and use dazzling facts and internet quotes to prove me wrong, but you know what? IGNORE IT. He is like that little guy who is running all the knobs and whistles to be "The Great and All Powerful OZ"...lots of bells and smoke but very little substance.

Stay strong hon. You are doing well. Trust in yourself, your taxes, and your no contact.


CJ

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Should I let him claim one son? And why? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No, your taxes are completed. The issue is dead.

I know what you mean about the late filings. It took a court order to get X to send in the 2001 tax returns, in May, 2003. And I haven't yet filed my 2002 returns because he gave me his information too late. So I'm filing 2002 & 2003 together.

Take the advise of the posters. Stop engaging him.
And find the local woman's crisis center and get counseling soon. It's typically free.

Faith-

You have already been given a lot of good advice and I don't really have anything to add. I just want to throw in my two cents to keep those boundaries in place. Of course he won't like them as you are taking away his control. It will also be hard on you and your kids, but it will get better as you reclaim the control of your life and safety. Today's incidents were a clear example of why you need to stick with no contact, no matter what, both ways.

Take and God bless!
K

I am glad you have the NC in force but would like to add...our sitch's are only the same in the fact that infidelity occurred. Totally different. I have been able to keep NC for weeks on end until my x does something that requires it. Either a financial or parenting issue. Other than that, there's no contact at all. And I like it that way.

You're still lamenting b/c he doesn't treat you w/respect or even the word "love" as you used. I demand nothing but basic respect from x as I demand that from TOTAL STRANGERS BASICALLY. I don't expect anything but poor behavior from him as that's the status quo...but from time to time I'm shocked as he still does really stupid and way out there stuff.

You need to continue NC. And it's not something to discuss. How your xh is feeling about it? WEll...if you were in NC you wouldn't know how he felt at all.

I don't think you need a PPO. There was a RO against my xh last year but it was because he broke illegally into my home. Caught by police and on video from them. Unless there is imminent bodily harm or a break-in or some real danger to your well-being, then I don't think anybody needs one. WAste of tax money and just a manipulation tool used by lots of people imho. You need to cut off all contact and stick to your guns.

These are your own words:
"Today was another day, of criticizm and demeaning his XW. Stating nothing to me that was of authentic care or love." You SHOULD NOT EXPECT CARE OR LOVE b/c you're divorced. I don't expect that nor does anybody for that matter. You do deserve respect and decent treatment.

IMHO, the NC isn't a real NC b/c he called you and you actually spoke to the man before hanging up and also b/c you met him at the post office. NC is NC. Period. Minimize most contact and keep it only about kids or finances and ONLY when a REAL situaiton arises.

You can use email to communicate and do that only. And then keep emails only to subject. BTW...which meds are you on? I am wondering. You alluded that you are now on some. Which one?

It's as though you're using the NC to see how far he goes before he caves in. It's not for that. It's for YOU to refocus and grow in the right direction and get things going in your own life and not worrying about this guy or anymore about the past. It's for you to have clear vision.

I personally would not be able to function as awesome as I do if I had to deal with my xh day to day or frequently. HE HAS ONLY BEEN INSIDE MY NEW HOME ONE TIME AND ONLY IN THE FOYER. Never been inside it for 6 mos.

Keep him out of the house and work on you. He perceives you as punishing him with the NC. He lurks here and I hope that he finally gets it that the NC is for YOU to move on.

Forget about him and the OW. Or anybody he dates. Work on you, focus on you. Keep on the meds and go to counseling and stay active in school. RESIST THE URGE TO CALL HIM...Yea, I heard about how the constant calls to him were going...that's why I am not completely buying the whole NC that suddenly arose. It's time to let go. Quit thinking they will magically change and that the "happy marriage fairy" will fly over and sprinkle some happy dust on him and he'll return after having a life-changing experience and change his ways. They don't do that. There is no magic fairy.

Leave him alone and get after it...

YOUR LIFE IS WAITING...

"It's time to let go. Quit thinking they will magically change and that the "happy marriage fairy" will fly over and sprinkle some happy dust on him and he'll return after having a life-changing experience and change his ways. They don't do that. There is no magic fairy. "


AMen! That is the best thing I"ve read all year! Thanks Peachy!

.

<small>[ April 07, 2004, 09:40 AM: Message edited by: KaylaAndy ]</small>

I will keep the NC for awhile yet. The issue of talking to him was over the 2002 taxes, cause I informed him if he didn't send them in I was going to file separate, and claim the kids. I don't call him on a regular basis, so I don't know where you get that information from. I did call him last night, to ask him if he heard from my oldest daughter, cause she still wasn't home at midnight. He was unaware of where she went, and I only called to see if she called and talked to her dad. I did talk to her this morning, and asked for respect to take her phone with her, or call me once in awhile so that I know she is ALIVE!!! I did express that I was worried!!!!

Yes, NC has helped and is helping to move on. I just wish there was respect from XH. Not sure what his motives are to coerce me and manipulate me but to only show his power over the weaker link. If so, I am growing stronger, little by little.

Taxes, will stay the same. I did talk to a lawyer today, and yes, they will stay the same. That is over settled now. He can get mad, call me a FB, or whatever, and think ugly thoughts. But this is part of the divorce, and that is what he wanted anyway a divorce. So he has to face up to the facts of divorce. We are not a family anymore.

Kaylandy - Not sure if you meant I am the witch that turned the prince into a frog. Could you clairfy on that. People all did things for better or for worse. I wasn't the best wife in the world, and I didn't feel loved, by my husband. I could of done things differently, like give more admiration, and more sex. When we dated we talked all the time, conversation was of essence to both of us. With having kids, it was hard to work on ourselves. We devoted so much time, to making money, paying bills, and I spent hours taking care of the kids, and doing day care, and simple piano lessons, and being active in the schools. With the youngest son being high risk pregnancy, caused a lot of problems, with going to the Dr. every week, and then he had problems when he was born. All the way through his first year. We had physical therapy coming out. He was sent to the childrens hospital for research, a failure to thrive child. There was so little time for us. I babysat for the neighbor kids every friday night.

Also, XH was starting his business, and I had to do the phone calls and paperwork. Yes, if I could go back, I would of done things differently. I would of hired a babysitter regardless of what he said, and said we are going.

I would of taken responsibility for more activities of the family and getting out more. Even to picnic in the park, and do this twice amonth. I did take the kids to the library everyweek, even the ones I babysat. For they had a good program for the kids, and I could watch and read while they all were in the program. I stayed with the baby. I did fairly well in the emotional support.

We all have made mistakes, and God will help us with our mistakes.

Was a busy day today at court, and Dr. visit again. Dr./Chiro. really helped me today, and I was really out of whack, my neck was totally misaligned. It is spasming pretty bad, thought so, so tonight is a night in the bathtub with hot water. And I have a herbal bubble to put in the bath, to help the muscles relax. She said to use the hot pad again.

Peachy, I have been on Lexapro for about a year. Will be on it for another year. I was given the option to increase the dosage in January by my Dr. when I saw her. But I refrained, and stated that I would like to stay on the same dosage, and take herbs, and yoga. I am looking into Yoga classes. Dr. thinks it would really help. Chances are I will have another shoulder surgery sometime next month.

Thanks for the advice. I thought in my mind that I should stay on the NC, longer. And the taxes stay the same. But when XH demeans me, as he did. I thought maybe I am being unreasonable. There still is somewhat of a power he still puts over me. He is a controller, and that is the way they conduct themselves. Things are much more peaceful around here.

Schooling will be ending at the end of this month. Really enjoyed the classes, they were hard to do with the stress. But I know that I am a smart woman, and am a well loved woman. Time will tell what is going to happen. Right now, I just want to stay with the Lord, and be on his path with the Lords heart.

Hi Faith4me!

I'm so happy for you that you stayed strong for 2 weeks of NC!! This is just a minor setback, and I'm confident that you will get on track quicker than you ever have before.

Faith4me, I'm proud of you for maintaing NC for 2 weeks and I'm proud of you for asking for help as soon as you need it instead of continuing contact which ALWAYS leads you into a downward spiral into a black hole of despair. I'm so proud of you for reaching out BEFORE you're in that hole again! I'm thrilled that you won't go into that black hole this time--no matter how hard it is to change your direction I'm sure you will do it quickly. I'm proud of you Faith4me and I hope you're proud of yourself too!

You said:
"I did what the counselor has been teaching me, I took the papers and put them in my manila folder and started to walk away, stating that I am no longer going to listen to him berate me in public. I had to walk away"

Good job!!! You did exactly what was best for you to do after putting yourself in that situation!

You said:
"And I just drove home very carefully."

Good job taking better care of yourself, because you are a valuable person!! In the near future I hope you take even better care of yourself when there is only an unsafe vehicle available for you to drive, and just reschedule for a time you have a safe vehicle to use. You DESERVE to take the best care of yourself as possible!!

You said:
"And he calls and wants to talk about the tax return."

In NC you don't answer the phone. In your case it is IMPERATIVE that you don't answer the phone! This is just a minor setback if you quit answering his calls IMMEDIATELY--don't answer next time, or the next, or the next, or the next, or the next, or the next! It is part of your pattern for him to start calling incessantly and for YOU to answer his calls--until you start calling him, then he stops calling and you call him even more. Don't fall for it! It's a trap!! You know that from experience!! NC! NC! NC! NC!

You said:
"I am getting afraid again, and scared! I don't like this feeling."

This is how you feel EVERY time you allow your ex to have any contact with you. NC! NC! NC! NC!

You said:
"I had to hang up the phone, for I could not deal with it anymore."

NC means you don't have to deal with it. NC! NC! NC! NC!

You said:
"He will do this till he gets what he wants. He called one more time and I had to hang up on him again. I don't like hanging up on him. It is not respectful to him. But I didn't want to deal with it again."

You won't have to deal with it at all when you maintain NC. NC! NC! NC! NC!

You said:
"He also stated to me a couple days ago, why am I being so mean to him, and put the no contact on?"

In NC he wouldn't be able to state anything to you. NC! NC! NC! NC! If you want to provide your ex with answers you both know he already has from reading at MB, why don't you refer him to FaithfulWife? I'd bet she'd be willing to explain it to him for you <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

You said:
"Should I get rid of the no contact? And why? He is really pressuring me."

Look at the difference in you during NC and then after contact. You already know the answer Faith4me--NC! NC! NC! NC!

You said:
"He stated that if the kids were living with him, he would allow me to the house. This is proof that he still doesn't get it. He does not see what he has done by being here."

Sorry Faith4me, but this is proof that YOU don't get yet why he says what he says and why he does what he does. You will get it eventually, this is just a minor setback. You'll get on track quickly and be on your way again--IF YOU MAINTAIN NO CONTACT! NC! NC! NC! NC!

You said:
"I see more that he continues to get pleasure in throwing me in the ditch and throwing more dirt on me. I guess I should get ready for him to stomp his feet on the dirt to pack it down. Seems to give him pleasure."

Stop that right now Faith4me! You are NOT a victim--don't become a volunteer either!! This is usual thinking for you after contact with your ex. This used to be your constant thinking when you had constant contact with your ex. See a connection between this thinking and contact with your ex? NC! NC! NC! NC!

You said:
"Today was another day, of criticizm and demeaning his XW."

Why, Faith4me, why are you listening to this??? If YOU didn't provide the ear he needs for this crap he would have to wear out someone else with it! Let it be someone else's burden--you've had more than enough already, haven't you? NC! NC! NC! NC!

Faith4me, didn't you know to expect extra pressure after posting your last thread? If you didn't know to expect it, then realize it now. Part of your pattern is when your posts are positive and/or about YOU, your ex puts on however much or however little pressure it takes, you succumb, and then you're in the black hole of despair where your ex has all the power over you. Whenever your posts are positive, be prepared for this and DEFINITELY MAINTAIN NO CONTACT! That's probably when you are most vulnerable to breaking NC so take extra care and get extra support, ok?

This is just a minor setback. Well, it doesn't have to be any more than a minor setback if you don't allow it to become more. NC! NC! NC! NC!

Faith4me, I'm proud of your NC efforts and success for those 2 weeks! NC will be your best friend if you maintain it. You deserve all the good things NC will make possible for you!

Take care Faith4me, and in case I forgot to mention it--MAINTAIN NO CONTACT!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

We were writing at the same time! I'll read your post now.

I read your post. Wow! What a huge difference since you initiated NC, even with a setback!

I'm proud of you and I'm happy for you!

Yes, we were writing at the same time. Just decided to stop in on the computer as I am getting ready for my lesson tomorrow at Art. I am starting Art again, Yes, Yes, Yes. I would like to devote more time to this class. When school is out in 2 weeks, I will be able to. So I am prepping my piece, and putting the background on and sketching the pattern on the piece. And tomorrow I will start this new project. It is a beautiful piece titled the Elk Calf. I know why I choose this piece, I saw our little Lilley born, the foul, of my oldest daughter, and this reminds me of the strewn straw and those long slender legs, and those beautiful BIG evening eyes of wonder. What a beautiful capture of nature, and the newness of life.

Yes, the NC, NC, NC.

I do put myself down, when the XH berates me, puts me down, and criticizes me. It is the entangled language that was used for many many years. I know that I am a wonderful woman, with great abilities, and great amount of love. I love my children with all my heart. And worry about them all the time. Just like when my oldest daughter was home late. I worried, and this morning we talked. I do love her, and her abilities are so wonderous. Just wish she would help me out more here. Financially, and physically. I am having a hard time with what $$ I get per the divorce decree. And to possibly have another surgery, will take me quite a while to get back on my feet again.

NC is the one thing that has brought myself back to life. For I do care about my XH quite a bit. And I do wish him happiness in his life. I do wish that he would be respectful to me, for Jesus says, everyone should treat each other like they themselves would like to be treated. And that is what I would like for the X to do here, treat me with respect, and take the rules of the divorce decree and read them.

Busy day tomorrow, with appointments. Will look forward to getting away at the end of this semester for a few days. Chilling out, and looking forward to being away for a few days and reading a book, and doing nothing.

I am also looking for a bicycle for myself. A off road bike with good suspension. I need it for my back. The physical therapist told me to get a off road/road bike. With the wider tires, and the handle bars upright, so that I am sitting upright. He said, I actually should have the one that you sit back in like a chair, and put your feet outward towards the front. But those run in the $thousands. Can't afford that. I am also looking for a child seat to put my bird on the back of bike. She is going to join me in the bike rides, and I have already figured out how to manage her portable cage, to take her with me and protect her from the sun. Or get her a small cage, for lots of air. The cage will be belted into the childs seat.

I looked on ebay, and the bikes are too far away. My oldest daughter said shipping costs would cost me a bundle. I live in Michigan near Metro Airport. So I thought I would check some of the bike shops and call around and see if they have used ones. Also, I will see at UofM Ann Arbor, cause now is the time that kids graudate and sell their bikes.

I am looking forward to biking and meeting more people. Who knows what could happen in the world of sports. At least Solo the bird will have a good time too. I saw on ebay a pet cart you pull behind you. But I don't want that, cause I need to put my bike on a bike rack on my car. And the cart would be just another added thing to handle. Which I need to buy a bike rack too. And a helmet. A MUST for a helmet! I won't ride a bike without a helmet. What brains I have, I need to Keep <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> !

Well, LovingBoundaries, thanks for the encouragement and yes, I mustn't get down on myself. I see the connection when the XH berates me and my self-esteem goes really down. Thank you for showing my eyes the pattern.

Need to go, have to get the piece started for tomorrow. And my back is starting to spasm. Look for my neck heating wrap that I put in the microwave. It does help, but wished that it would stay heated for a longer time.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Faith4me:
<strong> Kaylandy - Not sure if you meant I am the witch that turned the prince into a frog. Could you clairfy on that. People all did things for better or for worse. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Faith4Me - I may have been hard on you, but no matter what your x or his intellectual prodigy may say about you, I have never thought of you being any less than a wounded daughter of a Heavenly Father who loves you.

Witches always entice princes into traps then cast their spells - I was in a pretty pissy mood yesterday when I wrote about Jethro and SNL - what I wrote about their character (lack of) may have been right on the mark, but usually I'm more of a lady with some restraint on expressing such things. The witch I had in mind was the witch from Arizona.

Sorry for the misunderstanding <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Well I didn't think that you meant me. But yes, SNL is entralled with the witch, and like I said, he is going out again to Arizona, and I know their time will be together again. He can have a women of deceit and lies. He can have a woman that berated his wife at the time I was his wife, and he did not protect me or feels no remorse or guilt about it. But let them have their frivulous life in sin. And yes, he compared me to her sexually, stating it was only biology. I wonder when they have sex, if he tells her it is only BIOLOGY. Yes, he will be living in sin with this woman. That is okay. Cause I don't want him back.

Back to me. I am enjoying the no contact. It will stay this way, for a long time. No contact, means no harassment from me. No contact, means no berating me again. No contact, means I don't have to listen to his criticizm.

Kayla Andy - do you remember when he was SNL how he said he would always take care of me. My counselor told me that was lies too. And it was, you know I could really kick myself for believing him. I could really kick myself for believing that he meant what he said. But it is being shown that it is all lies. More lies and more of his deceitfulness. I hope the woman in Arizona is prepared for his ballistic actions, and harassment.

Time to go. Have plenty to do today, and time is running short.

My days are numbered with many things. Just working on getting things settled here, and getting

More crap is happening. Yes, ex is at it again. He is using the oldest daughter to get after me for claiming the kids on my taxes. Kayla, the 25 year old was on me today, stated that I didn't give one f*cking bit about the kids. I know where she is getting this from and it is the ex. She wouldn't even listen to me, wouldn't give me a chance to state much. She is like her dad, but she is more compassionate, she has a short fuse like the ex. And I guess she thinks this validates for her foul mouth, and disrespect behavior. I told her to lower her voice, just like the ex. Since ex does it most of the time, she has seen his examples. It seems that when ex was calling her and the rest of the kids f*cking kids, that that was okay. Now she can tell me I am a f*cking mother. Yes, ex is using her, and manipulating her. She stated to me today, that this weekend that ex and her are going to talk to me and there will be consequences to pay. If I don't let ex claim the kids on the taxes. See the pattern of ex is showing again. I told her that I think she should go live with her father, if he is that great frog. I am using your example Kayla. She is acting so much like her father. ex will be going to Arizona shortly, and staying for quite a while. He will probably ask the 25 year old to go with him. Since she believes what he says. Let her believe his lies. Let her live a life of with her dad of lust and untruthfulness. I did find that she lied to me today. Won't go into details, cause she reads her as well as ex. It upsets me that she thinks she should lie to family. Upsets me that she thinks the life her dad is leading is so great. Where is the christian beliefs? Where is the guilt inside with the lies? I really don't want my daughter following her dads lies, and mistrust. I know a wayward spouse lied for years, and that is something that they will continue to do. Books state it, and so does counselors. With my ex, he has lied for many years. The ex really has the daughter fooled about the money. He has been hoarding the money, and one day the truth will come out. I think she should go to Arizona, that way she can meet the woman that is her fathers life, she can see where her dad will work, where he will live with the ow, since this daughter is going to work for her dad.

I am sad that she has been used by her father. I am sad that she has decided to follow his path. One day she will look and see that her father has failed. Failed this whole family. And one day she will see that her father has been lieing. I tell her the truth. Things are hard for me here. Financially, since I don't receive food stamps. I have to pay all the groceries out of my pocket. The alimony is used on groceries. Kids don't help with the groceries. Cause the frog dad said they don't have to. But he sits at his room of his mothers house, and eats gourmet foods.

Yes, I am venting, cause I had a pretty good two weeks. Now that ex can't get to me, he is using the oldest daughter. I think I will talk to someone about this, and see what can be done. Possibility. I hate to do this, but ex is showing more of his vindictive side, he is short tempered, and this is coming out more and more.

I will refuse to talk to him. NO need, for like others have posted. The wayward spouse only see the betrayed spouse X as an object, to kick and yell at. There is no kindness, no respect. So I don't see any reason to talk to him. He is vindictive and mean-spirited. I even stated to the daughter, that her dad yelled at me at the post office. She only said she wasn't there. More that she will believe what her dad says. But if she was on the phone when he called me, and I asked why he yelled at me at the post office, he said he was upset. Maybe she would of believed. Maybe not. Who knows.


I have the starting of getting my life in order. I decided to do what I had to do. So things are moving along. Ex states he doesn't have money, I know, and he is going to buy a van out in Arizona. I don't think they are giving any vans away. I did the books for 20 some years. I know how much he makes and he makes and he made enough money to house a family of 6, horses, horse trailers, many vehicles, outside activities. He has not fooled me. And I believe some of the kids are not fooled. Time will tell.

Now for myself, I am telling the truth. I don't get food stamps anymore. And my alimony is going to food. I have to feed 5 of us here. Not much left over for anything else. That is the truth. He only feeds himself, his gourmet foods. His mother doesn't feed him, cause she doesn't cook. And she said she wasn't going to feed him. He is old enought to cook his own food.

This may be a rough weekend. I just wanted to have a nice Easter service at church. But now the oldest daughter has threatened me. More of ex manipulation. I assume the oldest won't come to church, cause dad doesn't go to church, and she basically hates my guts. So I will take my mother and MIL to church. I think a few of the kids will be going. Maybe I will do something special after the service.

I haven't talked to ex in anyways since he berating me at the post office, and yelling at me on the phone. I did answer the phone once here while I was in my room, don't have caller ID. Ex asked for oldest daughter said she wasn't here and hung up. No need to talk to a mean, vindictive, crazy man. I am so sick of him using the kids, so sick of him putting me down, and so sick of him telling my oldest daughter that I will have consequences to pay. Threats, that is suppose to make me feel better. But, that is the way the ex has been most of our marriage. He was like that with his brother. Ex doesn't have good feelings aobut himself, so he puts others down to make up for his inadequacies.

Doesn't give him justice, just causes severe pain to the people that love him. He has his life now with the other woman. I sure hope that she is prepared for a man that is critical, and demeaning. But the one thing is that she was much better at sex than I. The biology he stated to me was with her, and the biology was much better with her.

I am spiraling down, why stay here. Why does my oldest daughter think she can act like her father. Where does she think she is showing love. Where does she think this is helping anywway. She seems like she is going to continue this in any partner she has. And this is so unhealthy. Her dad is very unhealthy, emotionally and relationship wise. He needs counseling, but like he states her on MB, he knows everything. The man of many words. BIG words!

Okay, it was a good 2 weeks. Now I just want to go away for a few weeks, but I have my home, and ex is not to come to my home. So I have to stay here and protect my home. Cause I do feel he has been here without the kids telling me. So I am a prisoner to my home, because of the ex.

I haven't gotten the PPO out yet. And I want to keep it this way. But I will continue the no contact for quite awhile. He needs to show respect. If he continues to use the kids, he will in the long run, show his childness attitude.

<small>[ April 07, 2004, 05:51 PM: Message edited by: Faith4me ]</small>

F4M,

Comparing your daughter to your ex won't help you heal that relationship. I wrote to her a bit when she posted here.

Your daughter and I share a few wounds and I had hoped that I could help her.

I can give you a couple of pointers on how to help her, if you are willing and if you want help on it.

Step one - I highly, strongly, can't stress how important it is to your own recovery that you read and put into practice "THE FOUR AGREEMENTS" by don Miguel Ruiz.

There is a reason I recommend this - primarily to provide you with a new way to think about your xh's emotional manipulation and your daughter's buying into his side and profanity, etc. If you become practiced at these agreements, your relationship with your daughter will heal - because I know that she loves you, in spite of the "grooming" done by your xh to how she sees the world and especially you.

One other thing that you can do immediately before you read any other book...

PLEASE become aware of how you talk about your children to other people. Please don't get defensive with what I'm about to say, because there can be no change if you try to defend instead of listen.

My mother always told me the wonderful things I could accomplish, but never missed an opportunity to tell people that I was lazy, or ungrateful, etc.

You have been REALLY critical of your family - most of your posts you describe a pretty messed up situation in your home and how your children play into the mess part that you are having to clean up.

One last thing:

A healthy boundary is not one that demands something of someone else. For example a healthy boundary does not sound like "You must treat me with respect and dignity. You may not use profanity in my presence."

Rather, a healthy boundary is more like "If... then...." For example, "If you will talk respectfully to me, I will listen and carry on a dialogue. If I feel manipulated, or you begin to lose control of your emotions and use profanity around me, I will ask you to leave. If you cannot/will not do that, I will remove myself from your presence (phone contact), until such time that I am confident of being treated respectfully." In other words, the boundary governs what YOU do.

KaylaAndy,

You said:
"In other words, the boundary governs what YOU do."

This is the best explanation of the root of boundaries I have come across. Thank you so much! I think I will make quicker progress with setting boundaries that are loving, and setting boundaries in a loving way.

Who knows, maybe one day soon I'll even love setting boundaries? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Take care

Hi Faith4me,

Hold on tight Faith4me. You knew your ex would step up the pressure because he didn't get what he wanted.

Remember, I posted this to you just yesterday:

"Faith4me, didn't you know to expect extra pressure after posting your last thread? If you didn't know to expect it, then realize it now. Part of your pattern is when your posts are positive and/or about YOU, your ex puts on however much or however little pressure it takes, you succumb, and then you're in the black hole of despair where your ex has all the power over you."

You're still ok Faith4me, you haven't succumbed to ex's pressure! You don't have to succumb now either--that power is in YOUR hands, not ex's or anyone else's--it's in YOUR HANDS!

I also posted this to you just yesterday:

"Whenever your posts are positive, be prepared for this and DEFINITELY MAINTAIN NO CONTACT! That's probably when you are most vulnerable to breaking NC so take extra care and get extra support, ok?"

I strongly, strongly, strongly encourage you to MAINTAIN NO CONTACT! NC means no receiving communication from your ex through your daughter and no sending communication to your ex through your daughter. NC! NC! NC! NC!

You said:
"Yes, I am venting, cause I had a pretty good two weeks. Now that ex can't get to me, he is using the oldest daughter."

Your ex couldn't get to you--that's good!! Now your ex is ATTEMPTING to use your daughter to get to you--but it is up to YOU whether you allow that to happen or not!

You said:
"She stated to me today, that this weekend that ex and her are going to talk to me and there will be consequences to pay. If I don't let ex claim the kids on the taxes."

Ok Faith4me, why didn't you tell your daughter that you are in NC with her father so she and her father WILL NOT be talking to you this weekend?

And what's with this THREAT of "consequences to pay" if YOU WILL NOT DEFY THE JUDGE'S ORDER and give your ex what he wants? It's just hot air--let it dissipate in the breeze as soon as it comes out of her mouth.

Faith4me, you know that you are bound by the judge's orders just like your ex is bound by them. Neither one of you likes what the judge ordered but you BOTH have to comply. The day the judge orders you to give the deductions for the kids to your ex is the day you do it--and not one day before!!!

You said:
"Okay, it was a good 2 weeks."

Yes it was! Ready for 2 more?? NC! NC! NC! NC!

You said:
"So I have to stay here and protect my home. Cause I do feel he has been here without the kids telling me. So I am a prisoner to my home, because of the ex."

Oh no you're not a prisoner!! If you believe he is coming to your home, there are ways to prove this and take legal steps to maintain your boundaries. You're only a prisoner if YOU allow yourself to be!

You said:
"But I will continue the no contact for quite awhile."

YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Faith4me, you know about the lurking, you know your ex will see that even enlisting your daughter's help to step up his pressure on you isn't going to work this time. And you know what comes next right? Be prepared for it--and notify your in-person support network (counselor, pastor, friends, etc) that you need them to be "on call" these next days ok?

Take care Faith4me--MAINTAIN NO CONTACT!!

OK, this was a REALLY BIG STEP for me. Last week, when H swore at me when I was talking with him on the phone, I said, "You swore at me. I'm hanging up." and I hung up the phone.

There is no need to participate in a conversation where you are being sworn at, whether it be from XH or D.

I am enjoying some tapes on win-win negotiating which I got from the local public library. The point is that you approach everything as "Either we both win in this interaction, or I don't participate." Think about it. You simply choose to remove yourself if this is not a win for you. It is up to the other person to decide if it is a win for them, but you want to make it clear to the other person that you want them to have a win, too. How simply, how incredibly simple. This ends all fights because a fight is about someone wanting to get to a win-lose position.