She called tonight & finally talked to me. Little chit chat at first. Then, “When should I call you to talk about the divorce.” I told her we could talk right now, but she was on her way to work.<P>I got a bit irate (no too much but she said, “I can hear the venom in your voice”). I said can you blame me? I told her I haven’t had any venom in my voice since I found out, but she hadn’t wanted to talk to me because of it?!?! Not very logical, eh?<P>Anyhoo, I told her I would not go along with it & I would contest it big time & I know we can work everything out. She asked why and I told her, “I can’t just throw everything in the toilet after 20 years and I still Love Her.“ She asked if I thought she was going to come home some time & I said I didn’t know.<P>I told her she would have to file in Colorado because that is where the kids are.<BR>Yeah, a few lovebusters. I told her she didn’t love the kids because she moved across the country when she told me she wouldn’t. She had told me she wouldn’t leave me for another man and she did.<P>Man, I feel like crap right now. <P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html</A> <BR>

Oh, Chris.........<P>I'm so sorry......I know how you are feeling and it is the pits of hell..<P>What can I do? God, I wish I could talk to her myself!!!!<P>So what is the deal - when will she call back?<P>What did she say when you replied that you didn't know if she would come back?<P>Why would she even ask that question, anyway?<P>BIG HUGS and prayers of strength to you,<P>You know that I'm here for ya!!<P>Sheba<BR>

So sorry for you Chris. Glad you are here. I will pray for you tonight.I did not want of throw away 11 years. But, yu know there aree days when I still want a divorce since my H was very deceptive Nasty and downright disgusting.(SEX on my sofa and in our vehicles) Who can ever believe this man ever loved me?? He is being Mr. Wonderful now. TOO scared I will leave him. knows how important I am to him and how much we shared. How "CLOSE" we were to each other. I believe he got sick of himself , after seeing how horrible he can be. He is being witnessed to alot. He is not a christian. I am not a doormat either.

Hey Chris -<P>I just had a thought - could be way off but - do you think she was feeling you out trying to get your mindset when she mentioned divorce?<P>I was just thinking that being that she hasn't really spoken to you, she wouldn't know how you are feeling and might have figured that you are completely disgusted with her by now!! Maybe she broached the subject in defense of any onslaught by you or as a result of the guilt within herself? You know - the not worthiness coming through. What do you think?<P>

Chris:<P>It's miserable to hear these words but based on my experience, I suggest you NOT take them to heart just yet. It's a long way from asking you this leading question to actually initiating a filing and following through. Her hearing that you will not cooperate, combined with her knowledge that what she is doing is wrong and this is her fault (it's deep in there somewhere), may result in her "never getting around to it". That is what I have observed in my own husband.<P>You're playing this as well as possible. We do NOT make divorce easy for betrayers. They have to do all the work, be saddled with the responsibility for the decision, and live with their choices while we are Plan A nice to them all the way. I do think this is the best way to work her right now.<P>I am curious as to why she brought this up just now. Might the OM be starting to put some pressure on? Frankly, I doubt that she brings it up of her own initiative.<P>Keep at it. You're an inspiration and a legend on this board.

*sigh* This isn't what I expected to see when I returned from vacation this evening, but it does kinda seem par for the course these days. Nobody deserves this and way too many of us are having to go through it. I'm sorry, Chris.<P>An observation or two: A person can't be forced to stay married, no matter how certain we are that their decision is in error (and if they could be forced or coerced, what's the point?). So, when one person makes that decision I would think that working to make the process go smoothly would be preferable to making things as difficult as possible. Surely it would make things more condusive for a reconciliation on down the road when they wake up, provided that's your goal. (Sorry, Distressed, that's just the way I see it.) If this is really what your wife thinks she wants she will have it, and making it difficult for her to do so will only breed more resentment and make it that much harder on you and the girls. Surely you've already taken whatever steps you need for the benefit of your girls (and you too).<P>For what it's worth, the psychologist told me months ago that my kids would handle divorce much better than the limbo we had been living in for months. That's not to say that everything is peachy right now, but things are better overall for the kids AND myself (MUCH better for me...).<P>This is a rotten turn of events and I'm so sorry it's happening to you. But you WILL get through it and you and your girls will be fine. Another thing the psychologist told me about six months ago... He said he wished he could be a fly on the wall in two or three years to see how much happier I would be by that time. Well, it hasn't taken nearly that long and honestly it gets better all the time. It takes awhile, but it will happen. Take care... y'all are in my prayers.<P>------------------<BR>Bobbie<P><BR>

I just wanted to let you know I feel for you brother. Not a good time. I am truely sorry. I know somewhere in my heart that someday our Wives will regret the things that have transpired. I just hope that it is sooner than later. Know this.... I think you and I will be able to look back on this and know that we tried everything we could..... No " What if's.... " Be strong and hopefully it's just talk and she isn't really wanting this.<P>------------------<BR>Rutger......One day at a time.<P><BR>

Chris-<BR>You know, I thought I was all ready to move on. Then last week in counseling my H said he was going to file for divorce. I completely fell apart. For the past week I've been back like the early days -- not eating, not sleeping, just a wreck. I can't believe its really happening. So I really feel for you right now.<P>Of course, later in the session when I asked him if I should just give up, he tearfully said "I don't know". <P>I'm sorry you are faced with this. Remember that you don't have to be belligerent, just be recalcitrant. Don't move the divorce process along any yourself, but don't give her justification either. I went through several weeks of treating my H like dirt after he said he wanted a divorce. You know what? It didn't make me feel better. It just made me feel like I really was this monster he was making me out to be. <P>-Annie

I asked her why she wanted a divorce & she said, “don’t you think it’s for the best?”<P>I told her it was the absolute worst thing for us & the kids.<P>Sheba, Don’t know when she will call back. I’m guessing not for a while. I believe she thinks I’m an idiot thinking she will come back because she’s “so happy”.<P>Perhaps she brought it up because I haven’t told her I loved her since she was here in June and she may be wondering where I stand. I mean, how stupid do you have to be to sit around while your wife is screwing some other guy across the country?<P>Distressed, I’m not jumping ship yet. It just hurts pretty bad, ya’ know? Gotta feel the pain a bit. I did tell her that I understand we both were guilty for letting the relationship rot & I didn’t blame her for all of it. I’ll take my share of the blame, but she NEVER let me know how she was feeling. How can we work on anything if one of us doesn’t know the problems exist?<P>Bobbie, I know what you’re saying, but I’m not ready to give up yet. I CAN’T just quit!<P>Reconciliation down the road? If we get divorced, right now I just don’t see it even as a remote possibility!<P>I KNOW everything will be better down the road. How much further? I don’t know, but I know we will get there, together or alone.<P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html</A> <BR>

Annie,<P>I was typing while you were posting.<P>Sorry to hear about you & your H. This really, really sucks so much (what an understatement!)<P>I have yet to be mean to my wife. She has had no reason from me to be angry since the day I found out.<P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html</A> <BR>

Hey Chris -<P>Interesting that she answered "why divorce" with a question instead of a statement of her certainty of her "happiness".....Don't you think?<P>Did she say that about being "so happy"?<P>I agree with your "Perhaps she brought it up...." statement but I'm not letting you go to the "stupid" scenario. I'll only say this: Couldn't be any stupider than having your H's lay-dies in your face and calling your house and driving by and sitting there and watching your house. Could it be stupider than having to suck it up when your spouse goes to be with someone else on your birthday and Valentines day - or when you don't get a X-mas present but they do!!!! Not only that but since your greatest joy at X-mas is giving gifts to the nieces and nephew and are denied access to monies for the purchase of those gifts - is that stupider?<P>The only response to that is the realization that I (and you) are only doing what we have always done, are only being who we have always been (a wife in my case and a husband and father in yours) and last but not least we are only feeling what we have always felt (the love for our spouses and the reasoning of how to work out problems).<P>We are not the ones making these situations we are the ones trying to hold our lives as a family together!!<P>They are the ones DOING things without regard for real life!!!! We are not the ones who are being foolish - they are!!!<P>So don't you go there!!!!!<P>When and if we are supposed to change our family status - God will lead us there!!! It will happen if it is supposed to!! We don't have to force it because of some self-defication!!! Don't forget that God led us to MB for a reason - we might not know what that reason is, but we can follow what we've learned and use it. THAT is doing what we are apparently supposed to be doing!!<P>Enough said about that "stupid" nonsense!<P>My H didn't talk either until to late in his mind - unfortunately this also fits the pattern. I am not a mind reader either. Everything I have said about the problems in my marriage (except the work thing) is speculation!!!<P>Your Wife needs to believe that you are somewhat mean and angry so that she can continue to justify. Being that she spoke of these things to you, even in the context of divorce, I think that her justifications might be wearing a little thin.<P>Hugs and Strength,<P>Sheba <P>PS-Boy, did I write a book or what? LOL!<BR>Sorry, it just makes me so angry that we have to question ourselves when we are here dealing with life!!!!

Or another angle, from a woman who looked for another man because husband didn't buy pepsi or coke (can't forget which....)....<P>Maybe because you've been sooooo pleasant, and so accomodating (Plan A) - she IS beginning to wonder where she stands, and wants to know if she matters at all any more? I mean, the comment you made about not telling her you loved her since June...<P>Then, on the other hand, perhaps she is a conflict avoider - and feels so far away from marriage and responsibility that she feels this is the easy way out of ?????<P>Maybe she just tells you what she thinks YOU want to hear - by talking about getting a divorce - because she hasn't gotten a reaction out of you?<P>During the living together pre-affair time of the marriage, was there ANY lovebusting going on? <P>By the way, Chris - you've done a fantastic job with all of this, and seem to have no problem expressing yourself. I can tell you don't like to revisit your problems until you've pretty much resolved them in your own mind. - what are you thinking about. <P>Are you journaling to your wife? About the pain and about the things she is missing with the girls, about the self doubts they are having now, all of it? <P>I guess we can label your wife clueless.<P>

(((hugs))) cl

Chris,<P>I haven't posted in a while. Im sorry to hear that she is bringing up the big d. I wouldn't take much to heart until she actually does something in the legal sense. You can refuse to play the game. I filed for divorce in Mar and have left it at that since. He responded to my filing that our marriage is "not" irrevocably broken. But has never tried to reconcile w/me since filing. I sometimes think he is too "lazy" to finish it up or maybe he is waiting for me. I have found that I like this modified plan B mode I am in. I only speak to him about our children or our joint finances that need attention. I have stopped expecting him to fill any of my needs, he is just the father of my children at this point. He is only seeing his daughter once a week now. I have tried to talk custody or how we will handle holidays with the kids and he doesn't want to talk about it. He called me a couple of weeks ago and said "I fired my lawyer". Just get your lawyer to figure out what you want and I will agree to it. I haven't done this because legally I don't think I should make this move. I don't want him coming back saying I didn't know what I was signing because I didn't have a lawyer. So I am doing nothing. Let him do the dirty work. My lawyer will protect me if I need it. I am not sure why I filed except to protect my interests in our savings. He has been very good about providing for me and the kids financially and so I just hate to rock the boat at this point. I guess if either of us met someone and wanted to get married again then the divorce would make sense, but that is not a reality at this point. I have to applaud you on the great way you are bringing up your girls. You seem like such an active father. They will appreciate it as they grow older. Take care. Gerri

Hi Chris-I haven't posted much lately. I just wanted to let you know I know where you are coming from. My H will be gone a year tomorrow, still maintains nothing is going on (just friends) as he continues his affair. He filed in March 99. We are still negotiating the divorce. I moved to a modified Plan B in May of this year. I talk to him only if I answer the phone. He prefers I write him letters-so I do this only if I need to ask him something about financial situations or the kids. I keep thinking this affair will die a natural death but things keep progressing. Sometimes I wonder if he has had any thoughts that this might be a really stupid thing he is doing. I can't figure out how he is going to bring her out after the divorce since he has lied to his whole family and everyone else that he is not seeing her. People say it will be better after the divorce (our court date is Oct. 20) but I don't see how. Then I will just not be married to him any longer. But maybe at least things will not be in limbo any longer, visitation will be set and the money issues will be set up. I wish I had some words of encouragment for you. Let's just hope she doesnt' follow through. Take care

Sheba, She had told me before she was sorry to make me sad, but that she was happy. Last night she said she hasn't called & told me she was unhappy, meaning why do you think I will return?<P>I didn't mean I was stupid, I was suggesting that she thinks I'm stupid because I'm waiting around while she's doing this crap. It sounds extremely illogical to someone on the outside looking in. However, unless you've been in our shoes...<P>Ah, God! Yes, I know He is on my side & He will heal me of all the pain. In His time, not mine. But as a human, (and like my wife) I WANT IT NOW! Patience, patience, patience.<P>tnt, It was Coke. LOL.<BR>I just couldn't stand to hear her say, "I know" when I told her I Loved Her, so I didn't say it. WHen she left, I did tell her EXACTLY how I feel & that I wanted us together.<P>Yeah, there were lovebusters going on pre-affair. Not too much, but we just drifted apart. She did not tell me how she was feeling about anything, so I couldn't do anything about it.<P>I don't like to keep going over the same thing and moaning about it, so I don't feel I need to put a bunch of posts here. Yeah, I'm journaling (but not enough).<P>Limerick, I have thought about filing for divorce lately, but it's not what I want, so I won't do it (yet). Still following the MB principles & waiting for the affair to die.<P>Bailey, yes it will be better after a divorce, IF you have done everything you could to save the marriage, otherwise you'll be wondering, "what if I tried this or that?"<P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html</A> <BR>

I'm sorry Chris. I also vote that you are not stupid. But sometimes it is hard not to feel like it.<P>My H told me Saturday for the first time that he wants a divorce. He'll be moving out again. In our case I don't see how his actually stating he wants a divorce changes anything for me. He's repeatedly told people (the OW for instance) that we are divorcing. Just another loop-de-loop in the great rollar coaster.<P>I don't know if this relates to your situation, but my H feels so terrible about himself that he's sure I despise him. I don't and I tell him I love him a lot. It's the "I'll leave you so I don't hurt you so much." train of thought that a lot of us have heard. And it is pure selfishness on their part, they don't want to see the outcome of their actions. <P>With so little communication with her, you just can't know what is in her mind. I talk to my H everyday, right now he's living with me and I don't know how he can come to the conclusions/actions he does.

Morning Chris!!<P>OK - now I get it!! As long as it wasn't you questioning yourself then:<P> Nevermind!!!!<BR> (Best Gilda Radner impersonation)<P>You're right about us humans and our patience!!! I guess we're in the "practice makes perfect" phase!!!<P>Have a good day, today and give yourself a pat on the back for reinforcing your position on this situation and your love for her. The little LB's were necessary and might let her think a little!!<P>How are you doing with the girls - anything else come to light with the little one? Were they around when you talked with your Wife?<P>Hugs,<P>Sheba

Lor,<P>Sorry about you & your h. I know how you're feeling. I don't know if she feels bad about what has happened. She won't open up to me.<P>Sheba, They were in the house, but I went outside when I was talking to her. They did here me say something about f*cking up the relationship.<P>I did make an appt with Steve Harley for Thursday.<P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html</A> <BR>

Harley.....Thursday....YAY!!!!!!!<P>How do you know they heard? Did they say something or you saw them listening as you said it?