Hello,

As someone who has NOT been in your situation, but who has been around here a long time, I thought I would point out something. The OC is NOT always the product of a MM's affair. The numbers are surprisingly high (estimates range between 10% and 20% of all births) that the man who thinks he is the father is NOT the father.

My point. I realize that this thread and the many others that have appeared here over the years are basically about OW, and how the BW is affected, tbut if you believe the statistics there are probably at least as many BH's around with OM in their lives.

Why do I point this out? I think when discussing these issues that often they become very personal and very negative. Perhaps if you ladies would stop and envision yourselves as H's and OM, you might gain some distance and thereby offer each other the knowledge and wisdom that you have acquired without as much of the personal emotions.

I do see one thing that you all have not been thankful for: that you are women. If you were a man, and the betrayed you would be facing losing your marriage, and your children in your life on a daily basis something that few women have to fear. If you were the OM, you would have NO say other to file in court as to your role in this childs life, and that role would very likely be limited to CS.

That may be good, in fact, in the case of people trying to restore their marriage, it is great. Ask K about that. As Pop's about the alternative.

I see a lot of merit in what each of you have been saying, and actually I think you all are in far more agreement that perhaps you realize. But, I would find it very interesting to hear you discuss this very issue as if you were men in this situation rather than women, and I mean from both sides.

I am sorry to interrupt. Did want to say hi! to Cat though. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

God Bless,

JL

****As far as hurting his family......when you love someone is that really the first thought in your head? ****

needtomoveon,
THAT IS MY POINT EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
But why is that considered an adequate excuse for the ow but not the BS????????????????????
OW didn't care if she hurt an innocent family because she was in love. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> But the BS is a bytch if she doesn't make the oc's emotional well being her first priorty. Be dam$ed with any feelings she might have. Again, am I the only one that sees the hypocrisy ?
Why do ow expect BS to be so much more mature and in control of their emotions?

<small>[ September 13, 2003, 07:57 PM: Message edited by: Jtigger ]</small>

Hi JL. It's good to hear from you, too.

You have presented an interesting and thought provoking question. It never occurred to me to reverse the situation or consider how I might react if I were a man dealing with a pregnant wife, OC and XOM. I can't imagine having to actually live in the same house on a daily basis with a child born of an affair during my marriage. It would certainly require absolute No Contact with XOM in order for me to bond with the child, learn to love it and constantly pray for understanding and guidance and try like hell not to let it make a difference in how I felt about the child. I would hope that over time I would love the child as my own and raise it as my own without XOM interference. But, there could be no XOM interference.

Then there is the question of my continued responsibility to the child and CS if my marriage failed after some time. Perhaps by then it wouldn't matter to me because I will have grown to consider the OC as my own, providing we had had enough time to bond and grow together.

I would hope I would be able to look at the child as just a sweet child needing my love and compassion. I know that my step father felt this way about me all my life since I was 6 years old, but then I was born to my married parents before they divorced and before my stepdad met my Mom which is entirely different than an OC situation...there was no betrayal in our situation.

My Dad's wife, on the other hand, couldn't have been more cruel and hateful towards me and treated me with hostility and contempt at every opportunity for no other reason than I looked like my Mom. Even though her words did a lot of damage at the time, I grew up to understand her fear of me and her own feelings of worthlessness. While her actions were not justified, I did understand. As a result, I have had the opportunity to experience both sides and the ramifications of both. I guess that's why I don't lament the fate of any OC or buy into that tired old "abandonment" drum the TOW's beat relentlessly. The OC's will survive somehow just like children of divorced and remarried parents do. The child might be blessed with a "good" dad some day and all this anger that the MM had prior commitments and obligations may go away. It was painful to watch my son's sadness at being rejected by his father but he was really so much better off without him in his life. My XH, his father, came from a great family, was a track star in school and was extremely popular and seemed like he was going somewhere but became involved with drugs, had run ins with the law and many, many OW's. The only "somewhere" he ended up was jail. Had my current H been a better stepdad to my son, the pain of rejection would not have been so great.

My husband, on the other hand, married me when my son was 12 and was always jealous of him (H's character flaw). It didn't begin to actually show up until we had been married for about a year.

One time during a particularly heated argument involving our different treatment of each others' children, my H said to me that it was unrealistic for me to expect him to love my son as lions in the wild will eat the young of other male lions if given the chance...that we were all animals. I was dumbstruck (for once in my life) and after I thought about what he said, I told him that we are human beings with a soul, reasoning and then cited several examples of Stepdad-stepson love and acceptance.

So, jealousy and resentment isn't just reserved for the OC...it can happen within blended family households to children not born of betrayal.

Since our recovery, my husband has made amends to my gracious and kind son, who has nothing but loving things to say about his snarky stepdad that often made him sad and feel like "odd man" out throughout his teen years and even beyond. My son's kind understanding and compassion of my husband and the terrible way he was sometimes treated makes me proud that my son is so incredibly wonderful, strong, generous and gracious...my husband is a lucky man to have found his stepson to be so forgiving when he caused so much heartache to both of us.

Since my husband has received so much forgiveness and love despite his cruelty, the forgiveness he received has blessed him and softened his heart and he has now morphed into this amazing, tolerant and sweet man who gives everyone the benefit of the doubt and treats my son kindly and with warmth.

Sometimes I stand back and look at where we were and where we are now and I find myself almost grateful things happened as they did...affair, OC, struggle, strife, et al, and I can't believe I think and feel this way. Who wouda guessed it? If someone had told me back in the fall and winter of 1998 that someday these horrible things that were happening would end up being our salvation, I would have told them they had rocks in their head.

Hmmm...apparently I have drifted off course once again...care to sail with me for a while? Thanks for your tolerance.

Have you signed up for the private board? It's a great place and a lot of fun.

Catnip =^^=

<small>[ September 14, 2003, 01:53 AM: Message edited by: catnip ]</small>

catnip:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I can't imagine having to actually live in the same house on a daily basis with a child born of an affair during my marriage.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It's great, actually. Just remember to add extra smooches occasionally... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It would certainly require absolute No Contact with XOM in order for me to bond with the child, learn to love it and constantly pray for understanding and guidance and try like hell not to let it make a difference in how I felt about the child. I would hope that over time I would love the child as my own and raise it as my own without XOM interference. But, there could be no XOM interference.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">As you're well aware, I always look at my little OC as a blessing. It does make a difference, but in a good way. And we've been fortunate in that the xOM has not been involved at all. But if he was, it would just provide another "opportunity for personal growth", as I believe the phrase goes.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Sometimes I stand back and look at where we were and where we are now and I find myself almost grateful things happened as they did...affair, OC, struggle, strife, et al, and I can't believe I think and feel this way. Who wouda guessed it? If someone had told me back in the fall and winter of 1998 that someday these horrible things that were happening would end up being our salvation, I would have told them they had rocks in their head.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Which proves my point about the above "growth opportunity". God does have the distinction of working in mysterious ways---thankfully, He does help us out when necessary.

God bless.

K

This is so weird. I was just discussing your situation with Bipolar and telling him how connected you are to your little one. It is interesting that you would find XOM's involvement as another opportunity for personal growth. I can see that. I can see how one would eventually come to a place where that would be possible.

God bless to you.

Catnip =^^=

Hi Cat,

No I haven't signed up. I don't think I would be an elgible(sp) candidate. I am glad that you are seeing changes in Bipolar as he moves along and that he and your son have indeed buried the hatchet.

I do hope that some of the other women stop to look at the situation under discussion in this thread and consider what it would be like to be a man in their situation. I suspect it might add just enough distance to the topic to get better communications and perhaps some different insight to the issue.

K, it is good to see you again. I hope all is going well, and that your W's health has continued to improve.

So Cat tell me, if you were a guy what would you do, and would it be different that what you did in your situation? CS would be an issue, but not the same sort, visitation would be an issue but not the same sort, OC would definitely be in a different situation.

Somehow I always find it interesting to change perspectives. It is sort of like professional proof readers, often read the manuscript backwards to that they can check spelling and such.

Must go.

God Bless,

JL

catnip:

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I can't imagine having to actually live in the same house on a daily basis with a child born of an affair during my marriage.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

i have to agree with k. it gives you someone else to cuddle and giggle with. looking back on some of the choices i asked fh to make i can't imagine what i was thinking. i could not even imagine life without grace in our home.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
It would certainly require absolute No Contact with XOM in order for me to bond with the child, learn to love it and constantly pray for understanding and guidance and try like hell not to let it make a difference in how I felt about the child. I would hope that over time I would love the child as my own and raise it as my own without XOM interference. But, there could be no XOM interference.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

om having visitation is not that bad. i think that the 16 months where he had nc was probably critical my being able to deal with him. it allowed fh and me time to do some major healing and also allowed me time to bond with grace without any outside distraction. the court stuff was hard on fh. for me it was just business. all visitation times have been set, custody has been determined, and the surname issue has been put to bed. the cs amount has been set with the exception that we need to go back to court in january as he needed to provide some more documentation on some of the hardships he was claiming.

as much as i love grace i imagine if i were on the flip side of the coin (in the bw's shoes) i may act as many here do and ask for no contact.

having been on the other side of cs (not with oc situation) i can tell you that i had no animosity (sp?) towards my oldest son's stepdad. and i can also tell you that if you keep a positive attitude with the oc and don't try to belittle the ow in front of him/her. you will end up with a very fullfilling relationship in the end. one thing that did help my son and me bond was that i had kept a journal of all that happened between the 4 people involved (fh was around for his entire life). i wrote in the 3rd party with as little bias as possible just trying to tell the facts as they occured. when he was 21 i let him have it and it cleared up all the questions he had held onto for so long. this is something i highly reccommend to anyone in this situation. fh has started one for grace.

JL,
Leave it to you to present some thought provoking questions. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Ummm...Let's see.... It was a cold November day and H came back to the home from work and asked me to sit down. The look on his face scared me as I had NEVER seen that look before. AHHH!!! This was D-day.

H has told me it was the worst thing he had to tell me in our lives. If I were him? I honestly don't know how I'd look into his eyes and tell him. Simply because I have no knowledge of being a betrayer. I don't know what runs through that mind set.

On DNA and the following cs order and what would oc's sur-name be?
H wanted to believe it wasn't his. He also wanted to know if it were his or not. Hence DNA test and inevitable answer.
If I were the H?
It would set me back on my heels. If I didn't want to cause further pain for my wife I'd pray it wasn't true. Fact being it IS would set me into a multitude of emotions as it did my own H.

CS became a game between our lawyers. We'd offer an amount and she'd refuse. H wondered why ow would do this. He now knows it's because he wouldn't be a full time father. For God's sakes he couldn't! We wanted our marriage. Ow wanted enormous amounts of time and didn't want me anywhere near the oc.

If I were the man?

I'd wonder how I ever got involved with this woman in the first place...SHE lied to me when she said she'd just leave me alone and have the baby on her own, and now all of these demands? She KNEW I didn't want this! She knew I only wanted to have a taste of something different after my 25 years being married. How dare she!

Then the letter saying she was using our surname. We live in a very small community and she is also married. If I were the man?

Well maybe she should, but then it would further embarrass my wife if people asked who daddy was.
Hey, maybe I should ask my wife. After all I need to help her heal from this devasting ordeal I've put her through. Oh! I don't know what to do!

The courts said she should stick with married name for oc as she had 3 other c's and it would make oc feel different growing up.

Now all these three years later?

And believe me it took a long long time for us BOTH to be able to come to terms with all that happened.

H feels oc is better off in HER marriage without him involved. He feels as if the oc will never know him and he wishes to keep it that way. We pay cs and health insurance. It's the best WE can do together. It's the "WE" that is foremost in our lives.

If I were the man?

I pretty much would feel the same way if my wife and I were begining to heal and put our lives back on track AND it's what I wanted to do.

JL, I tried to give you insight on how my H tells me he feels and how I imagine I would feel.

The crap ow continued to put ME through as a result of trying to set up visits and the things she still pulls to this day have weighed a lot on our decisions today.

We needed peace (do not have it yet, but do for the most part), ow needed and blatantly said she would "wait" for the man she knew to resurface. Very threatening to our marriage.

I wanted it over and told H to do what he felt deep inside was right.

Sorry if oc lost, but oc has ow's huge family to love oc.

I feel no remorse towards ow. I feel extreme pity for oc. H has become indifferent because of ow's behaviour and wishes nothing more that to take it back.

But we all have sadness in life, each and every one of us. We do the best we can and forge ahead.

So I guess if I were a man, like my H's brother said to him during all of this...each person in this mess will have a price to pay. Too bad you didn't think of that before you dived in on ow! Be careful what you wish for because you just might get it, and then wonder why you wished for it!

Catnip? Ready for you now. JL hope this answer was what you were looking for.

love
Debi

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Just Learning:
[QB]Hi Cat,

No I haven't signed up. I don't think I would be an elgible(sp) candidate.

=^^= Why not? You've been here forever and everyone knows you and loves your postings...please sign up so at least you can check in occasionlly. And K, too! It's fun because we talk about all kinds of things besides our situations. We talk about ourselves and our families more openly because we know we are safe to post. We have a lot of fun, too. There is a lot of good will over there and no wars.

I am glad that you are seeing changes in Bipolar as he moves along and that he and your son have indeed buried the hatchet.

=^^= Thanks...he told me a few days ago that he always loved my son but he admits to feelings of jealousy. I had a lot of heartburn over it because I raised his two kids and I adored them and they consider me their only Mom. I feel sorry for his X wife because she missed out on so much with those two wonderful young people and especially because today they have a strained relationship because they don't really know each other. Their bio mom lives in the same town as my daughter (step) and they do see each other occasionally so I am hoping that they can bond a bit for both their sakes.

I do hope that some of the other women stop to look at the situation under discussion in this thread and consider what it would be like to be a man in their situation. I suspect it might add just enough distance to the topic to get better communications and perhaps some different insight to the issue.

=^^= Sometimes I wish we were more like men in our thinking. To look at and deal with life situations pragmatically instead of emotionally would be nice and it would cut back on sleepless nights and crying jags. But, this situation is so emotional in the beginning, even for men. It does take such a long time to make any progress and come to terms with your newly altered life.

So Cat tell me, if you were a guy what would you do, and would it be different that what you did in your situation? CS would be an issue, but not the same sort, visitation would be an issue but not the same sort, OC would definitely be in a different situation.

=^^= Yeah, we would be "recipients!" Hahaha I think if I had a bunch of kids like Pops, I probably might think "what is one more, there's enough life to go around?" and it might be easier for me to incorporate the child into my life and into the family, after I got over the blow. If it were just me and my wife and we had no kids together, I might be resentful that her first child was with someone else...or not. Depending how self possessed I was, I suppose. Gee, I really don't know, JL. I would hope I would be like Pops and say this child is "someone special to cuddle". If I were a guy, I guess I would like to be more like K.

Somehow I always find it interesting to change perspectives. It is sort of like professional proof readers, often read the manuscript backwards to that they can check spelling and such.

=^^= Or kind of like that line of Jack Nicholson's in 'As Good as it Gets" when some sweet young thing raves how much his books mean to her and asks him how is it he can write like a woman. He says something like "I take a man and then take away all logic and emotion". Something like that.

Must go.

=^^= Bye........

God Bless

=^^= You, too

QUOTE]

<small>[ September 15, 2003, 06:56 PM: Message edited by: catnip ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by pops:
i could not even imagine life without grace in our home.

=^^= (sniff) What a lucky little girl. And, apparently, so are you...lucky, that is. You have come so far, Pops.

quote:
om having visitation is not that bad.

=^^= Really? I wondered how that would happen for you. I am so happy that "it's not that bad"

i think that the 16 months where he had nc was probably critical my being able to deal with him. it allowed fh and me time to do some major healing and also allowed me time to bond with grace without any outside distraction.

=^^= See? This is a perfect example of exactly what I have always talked about. Sixteen months is a nice long time to reconnect and bond without those outside distractions. I am so glad you had that time together for all your sakes.

the court stuff was hard on fh. for me it was just business.

=^^= Guy Thinking vs. Girl Thinking. We fly off tomorrow for three fun filled days at court in another state and surprisingly, Bipolar and I are quite calm about it. I am more "stressed" because I hate to fly (and I hope she is still fat...hahaha) and he just wants to address issues and settle it all and go home. Once and for all.

the surname issue has been put to bed.

=^^= yours?

as much as i love grace i imagine if i were on the flip side of the coin (in the bw's shoes) i may act as many here do and ask for no contact.

=^^= Really? Could you elaborate? Is it because women can be so....difficult?

having been on the other side of cs (not with oc situation) i can tell you that i had no animosity (sp?) towards my oldest son's stepdad.

=^^= Is that because your stepson was not born of a betrayal of your marrige and he happened BEFORE you? Did/do you like/love your stepson without any jealousies?

one thing that did help my son and me bond was that i had kept a journal of all that happened between the 4 people involved (fh was around for his entire life).

=^^= How kind and loving of you, Pops.

QB]</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

********We interupt this regularly scheduled programing to bring this special announcement----Just a little off topic here, but JL, try just going over to private! I know that you were mentioned when it first started, and Tempest may have "granted you permission" already! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> ********We now return you to the regularly scheduled programing!

grace has my last name. the judge did order that the b-cert be changed so that her middle name is his last name. that is om's responsibility. it will be a hassle for him as the b-cert has unknown in the fathers space. fh has copies of the original b-cert so she will register her in school by that name.

as far as the different attitude for a man / woman. a woman with a wh seems to have more options and problems then a man with a ww. if ow is a pain in the butt why would her and her h want to deal with a lifetime of grief. just pay your cs support. her h has the decision of wheher to be involved or not. so if he chooses nc then he can move on with out of site out of mind. the paternal bonds are not necesarily as strong for a man as he didn't carry the child. where i formed my bonds with my kids pre delivery was watching fh grow and feeling them move while inside her. wh in most of these cases does not havethat option.

also if ow is a real pain in the neck as seems to be the majority here then why deal with that for ever.

on the other hand if a man has a ww and wishes to rebuild his marriage then what are his options. he could let om alone and not ask his w to seek cs. but what quarantee is there that om will stay away. none even if it's just an i'd like to see her at xmas each year.

and there is no hiding the fact that i am not the bio dad no matter how much i love oc.

i am ok with the om having visitation because he seems to be good to grace. if he were a turd then i would take a different approach. i would be more confrontational. in fact the day after our last court hearing he called fh and started making mire demands for time and calling her a money grabber. she called me crying. whne om came on saturday to pick up grace i explained to him in no uncertain words that it was me who asked fh to seek cs and that he has the right to see grace but not call my w any more unless it was strickly about grace. if he wanted to ask for more time he could but if fh said no then that was the end of it. i also told him that he was very fortunate that he wasn't shot or beat with a bat. that i have refrained from violence and have done things strickly thru the legal system and if he didn't like it he had 2 choices. 1 - deal with it and 2 - tuff. then i asked him if i was clear. his reply was yes but he doesn't want to deal with me. my answer was it doesn't matter what you want anymore that i am in his life and back pocket for the rest of his life. do you undersatnd me? his answer was yes.he called fh the next day and appoligized.

<small>[ September 16, 2003, 08:43 AM: Message edited by: pops ]</small>

i don't have a stepson. the other side of cs for me was that i paid cs for 18 years with my oldest son. so i know what a burden that can be on a family. my son was concieved about 3 months prior to meeting fh. i had broken it off with his mother a month before i met fh. when she remarried i was not jealous of his new stepdad. never even entered my mind. he was about 6 or7 and we already had a good relationship.

catnip,,,,,, that is an interestingstaement about how you would react as a man depending on what your situation was. this is so true. in the beginning many of my choices were based on my situation at home. large family with young kids. i often thought that if my youngest was of the age say 14 or 15 life with fh would have been over. it was our youngest 2 girls (grace excluded here) that kept me in our marriage. also our age and the fact that we had been together for so long and had struggled thru so many hard times together.

Wow, I have only been here a few days and this is a lot to take in. I am the w of 32 years have been seperated for a little over 2 years, since finding (by H finally confessing, after I kept asking what was going on) that he had and affair and a child. I can't say i didn't know something was wrong because for the past few years I have lived with mental abuse, never did anything right, never looked good etc. My question and I really would prefer "christian" answers is the ow moved out of state and I'm sure calls, but H doesn't tell me unless I ask. He wants to put marriage back together, but I have a great deal of problems with even conceiving of being intiment with him again. I also have a problem with thinking that i could ever be a part of the oc life. I have no annomosity toward the oc, or the ow for that matter, I know that it took 2 to make the affair and in my eyes he was the one unavailable, or was suppose to be so had he not been looking it would of never happened. i also know of my own failure in the marriage - I enabled him to use me and take advantage of me. Had I only stood up for myself early on maybe I could of prevented all this pain. I also fear that this was not the first. I have been treated in the same manner a while back in our marriage and there has been indication from more than one person that he was unfaithful before. Thanks for letting me air my frustration. I might add that I do love him but it is deffinately different now. Thanks NMN

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by pops:
<strong>i also told him that he was very fortunate that he wasn't shot or beat with a bat. that i have refrained from violence and have done things strickly thru the legal system and if he didn't like it he had 2 choices. 1 - deal with it and 2 - tuff.

=^^= OK, Pops. I was out of town and missed this priceless post. I read it quickly and thought you were giving him the option of being shot or being beat with a bat! I laughed my a$$ off. This was so hilarious to me ...struck me funny...you are fabulous, Pops.

then i asked him if i was clear. his reply was yes but he doesn't want to deal with me. my answer was it doesn't matter what you want anymore that i am in his life and back pocket for the rest of his life. do you undersatnd me? his answer was yes.he called fh the next day and appoligized.

=^^= Meow. Isn't it great to be able to call a shot or two occasionally...and post your boundaries and ground rules to XOM? I am sure he dislikes you, but who cares? He RESPECTS you...and nothing is better than that. That is so cool.

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by nmn:
<strong>I am the w of 32 years have been seperated for a little over 2 years, since finding (by H finally confessing, after I kept asking what was going on) that he had and affair and a child.

=^^= I always hate to say "welcome", NMN, to newcomers, but I can tell you that you have come to the right place. I will answer you here on this thread but in order to get more responses, you should post a new topic introducing yourself to the group and giving them an idea about your situation. My first question is: was the child conceived during your two eyar separation? Second question is: do you have children of your own with your spouse?

My question and I really would prefer "christian" answers is the ow moved out of state and I'm sure calls, but H doesn't tell me unless I ask.

=^^= As far as "Christian" answers, I am not sure what you mean by that. We are a public forum though most of the people here, I believe, have their own strong and personal relationship with God. No one here preaches but we do pray for one another and many of us have a deep and abiding faith. I hope that is good enough.
If your husband is in contact with OW, then recovery will be more difficult. Are you two still separated?

He wants to put marriage back together, but I have a great deal of problems with even conceiving of being intiment with him again.

=^^= Well, if discovery of the affair is relatively new t you, then intimacy is sometimes problematic in the beginning of recovery, but not always. For some reason it was no problem for me as I saw intimacy as a way to reclaim my husband, my marriage and to begin the healing process. I felt I had a right to this intimacy as he is my husband. I jumped right in but some people take a little longer. Intimacy happens when you feel it is right for you. You don't need to rush it or feel anxious about it...just let go and let God.

I also have a problem with thinking that i could ever be a part of the oc life. I have no annomosity toward the oc,

=^^= During the recovery process there are several steps you can take to determine whether or not contact with the OC will work in your marriage. There are so many factors that will contribute to that decision that to make it now would be premature. First of all, most of us opt for NC to begin with. The first few months after discovery is when your hsuband must sever all contact with OW and recommit to you. During these months, the two of you work on the marriage and learn the Harley principles and the Rules and Policies. Once the two of you are in the recovery process, it is imperitive to the marriage that your only focus be on each other and not the OC for now. Once you have both come to a place where you are feeling secure in the marrige and you are feeling confident that the marriage is moving forward, your husband might want to discuss contact, and it is then that you discuss those possibilities and determine whether or not that is something you can live with/deal with. This is not something that has to be determined tonight or next week...give yourself some time.

i also know of my own failure in the marriage - I enabled him to use me and take advantage of me.

=^^= Don't blame yourself...it was his decision to get involved in an Affair and was his decision alone and had nothing to do with you. None of us are perfect and we all make mistakes, but the benign mistakes we all make are never justification to have an affair. The problems are deeper than you not wearing the right shade of eye shadow or that you weigh 20 lbs more than when you married.

Had I only stood up for myself early on maybe I could of prevented all this pain.

=^^= Maybe, but that's just useful insight to consider change. You want his respect more than anything as it is so incredibly important...mostly for your own self respect. You will be more attractive to him if you demand/command respect. Don't be a doormat.

I also fear that this was not the first

=^^= That's so sad...isn't it strange how we can sometimes see things by the way we are treated? I hope your suspicions are wrong, but if they are not, I hope you will be able to convicne your husband to get into some marriage counseling together with you, especially since he wants to get back together. I'll be praying for you...
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