</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Jtigger:
<strong>I had no intention of getting involved with this post but I have to respond to this...

///But the bs has choisen to stay in that marriage and make it work. ///

That makes as much sense as a BS saying to an ow you chose to have this baby now live with it.
And I mean live with it with no support from mm.
It makes NO sense does it ?
Neither does that comment above.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">jtigger: If you read the post for what it's meant for and the rest of the post you would understand it. The ow has her fair share to deal with too. It's to bad an innocent child has to pay for the mistakes of two people and that of the anger built around it's birth and existence. It's to bad that the mm's kids have to deal with this too and not understand what is going on in there family. Do you think that all ow are NOT remorsfull? Do you think that all OW want your money and then still not be happy? Do you think that all OW want your uh after all he's done as well? I'll even admit that some of the stories are very sad here about the ow and court and everything....that does not mean it's every ow. Not all uh are telling the truth to both ow and wife. Do you really know all the circumstances? Can you postively say all your actions are granted or just going off what your uh said? There is "action" then "reaction".

The bottom line of this messages is that a BW has rights. If you do not want contact, you don't have to have contact. The OW has no right to control what you and your husband decide. If you do not want contact, the OW can't force this on you. If your UH decided he wants contact, and you are against it, that is not wrong.

BW should not be forced to feel this way or that way. Your feelings are your own.

Yes we have oc. We CHOSE not to have contact and did it all through attorneys. PERIOD.

I am angry that so many BW here feel they have to do things that they don't want. You don't.

Empower yourselves.

I am one who chose NC. My Husband chose NC. Our children want NC. We have attorneys to handle the details. By reading here, some act as if this is wrong, how dare we, funny how suddenly I am this bitter angry woman? For what? Setting by boundaries? For fighting for my children? For letting you know you have a voice and can have things set up anyway you want? If a BW and UH want contact, I said you could have it set up that works for you. That the OW does not have a choice or a voice in how you deal or feel. Reality and the fact that you have rights does not make me bitter.

What makes me angry is some OW with an OC all upset that a couple would choose what is best for them and their children, and not care what the OW thinks. The OW feelings matter not one iota to me. Nor should they to you. Do what is best for you. As for oc, sorry, he is not my problem.

And the OW can say "well oc is 1/2 sibling" or "your UH has another child" all they want. That is their way of trying to control. They are using "family" terms to try and guilt and manipulate situations. My H had a decision to make. He chose NC. The OW does not like it. That is to bad for her. Her feelings don't matter.

As for this whole thread. The whole point is that what a couple decides to do, is none of the concern of the OW. Some chose contact, some don't. Either way, it is up to the couple to what is best for them. The couple should not take the OW feelings into account as they don't matter. That is the whole point.

Lynn you scare me to death not just in uh case but in general. NO BS xmm or anyone will tell me what to do with my child. YOU HAVE NO RIGHT!!!!! You seem to forget that one other person has given birth and has birth rights before you have rights to control that person's life. YOU STILL HAVE TO GO BY THE LAW!!!!! Who cares is xmm wants contact. I DON'T. You have achieved your point there. What I do care about is that someone would purposly try and cheat the system in order to be a selfish mean venditive person who only cares about herself. Your lucky you don't have an ow that fought you and hired someone to run a full investagation on you and your uh. Then your butts would be back in court and you would be answering to the courts for hiding, lieing and deceiving. There is a difference between "loophole" and the law.

Needtomoveon, YOU scare ME to death!!! Please explain why you are here. Are you building/rebuilding your marriage? If not, and you are here simply to push buttons, or to upset BW, then you are unwanted and should leave!

You sure are helping to enforce the idea that most OW are lunatics.

You and lynn are really the only ones that feel that way I think. No I'm not. But at the same time I don't feel it's fair you compare everyone as one. Everyone is different. Why do you want one set of rules for you and another for the ow? Is that fair? I see you guys are the other boards and I don't see them telling you to run off. They may debate but they also when a question comes up say I'll ask so and so.

Lynn
you keep saying that bs has the control, well in a sense you are right, did you forget though that me the uw has a bs and he has been fighting for the rights for his children and family. and i am sorry to inform you , you dont have all the legal rights, the oc has many, even if your h quit his job, they would still get cs. you need to find some peace.

<small>[ September 23, 2003, 11:15 PM: Message edited by: Justuss ]</small>

I totally agree with you needtomoveon If the w chooses to accept the H back then she should accept the child. I myself am currently in this situation and yes we were both very wrong but I don't think I should be the only one being punished here and have to pay for the consequences he fed me lies and said he was going to leave and said he wanted me to keep the baby then went back to his w, I'm the one that didn't want it but he talked me into keeping the baby and your right the thought of giving the baby up for adoption is just wrong the baby shouldn''t have to suffer the consequences for mistakes that myself and the uh made. But CS isnt nothing Money is nothing he doesnt have to worry about who is going to watch the baby or wake up in the middle of the night with the baby, So why should he just get to walk away from the situation. He should have to pay he choose where he wanted to go but theres always going to be a child to take care of. And when he pays CS I hope he goes broke and I hope his W can't stand it. He didn't just ruin the W life he ruined mine also. But I'm leaving it all to GOD now He will take care of everything who knows whatever he did to me may come back to him maybe not today or tomorrow but someday

And when he pays CS I hope he goes broke and I hope his W can't stand it. He didn't just ruin the W life he ruined mine also.

Samara. I can understand your feelings but what your saying is not right either. Karma works both ways. I totally understand your hate. My xmm and I did not split easy either and his w does not even know yet.........anything. You need to remember that even though you wanted to not keep your baby and your xmm talked you into, you still had the bottom line choice and take responsiblity for it. BTW....I did not say that putting a baby up for adoption was a bad thing. I actually think it's a very "unselvish" thing to do, but it was not for me as it was not for me to abort. Somehow you have got to accept that things are the way they are and somehow enjoy your pregnancy. I really hope that your not holding on to this pregnancy to hold on to your xmm. I'm not trying to be mean here. We are talking about an innocent child here. More than likely you will be raising this child by yourself. Yes your xmm is legally bond even by accident to pay you cs. Remeber though that this is an innocent child and you need to put your baby's needs before your own. Also, you need to put your baby's feelings above your own. It will be less stresful on your pregnancy and in the long run yourself. It took me about 2 months to let go of the hatered I had for xmm and realize I can't control his actions only my own. There are several people on this board that helped me see there side of things as well. If you are not ready to hear what they may say you may want to go to a board that is more for the OW. It's a hard thing to go through. I KNOW!!!!! I'm not saying I've totally let go of all my anger towards xmm, but I have come to a lot of reasoning with myself and know it's time to concentrate on myself and my child. I wish you luck. If you want to talk I'll be more than happy to talk to you. Take care of yourself and your baby. Also if your xmm does want contact with this child be prepared that his w will be involved too. In reality if he is planning on staying with his w this is best for the child as long as the w is good to this child. I can't imagine if she has contact though that she would not be good to her kids half sibling. Be prepared too that they or he has no contact at all. One thing I've already thought about is what is my xmm tried to see this baby behind her back (as he did me). That is not right. It's either in the open or nothing at all. Do you really want your xmm to treat your child like he did you on the side? Do you want this child to have contact with him once in awhile and unavailable when needed? Just something to think about.

<small>[ September 24, 2003, 12:12 AM: Message edited by: needtomoveon ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by needtomoveon:
<strong>I see you guys are the other boards and I don't see them telling you to run off. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'm not on any other boards.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>You and lynn are really the only ones that feel that way I think.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No, I see you ruffle others the wrong way, too.

Why are you here???? I'm trying to rebuild something...are you?

The BW owes you absolutely nothing. Nor does she owe your child anything. Where on earth do you get off saying that now that your child is here, that they have to accept anything? They don't. They have options and tons of them. Yes you will get CS and that is all you are due.

Grow up and realize that what you have done (and UH) is to create a mess where lots of people get hurt. Where you are considered less then dirt on the bottom of a shoe. Your OC, who of course is innocent, is going to grow up with a stigma, all because of the thoughtless, selfhish actions of two. How dare you come here and say that if the married couple works out their marriage that she now owes your child anything. She owes it nothing. You are the one that owes it. You have to somehow raise this child, not her. She may chose to, but that is a choice. She does not have to. Nor do her children have to ever consider this child a sibling. IT is not a sibling. This is your child with her H as it's father. This does not automatically invite the OC into the family fold. The BW and her family have rights too.

As for your attitude, bring it on. You may hurt and scare some of the BW on here who are fresh to their pain. Not me. Your words clearly personify exactly what others think of an OW. Greedy, self absorbed hypocrites.

I completely understand both sides here. In my case, OW told UH that she would get an abortion because he supposedly made it clear to her that he was done with children. She agreed to doing this then when he decided to stay with me, after begging and pleading of course, she is now keeping it. So, because she made this decision on her own now, why should she be entitled to anymore then CS. She had options and she chose to have it for reasons only she will know. I am not saying that every OW that became pregnant should be hung out to dry but let's be honest, do you think that my children and I and H for that matter should have our whole lives changed because of a decision she, and she alone made? Yes, H and OW know the consequences of having sex. They both know what could happen but when the OW says she would get an abortion and doesnt do so for that simple fact of spite, what kind of person does that make her???

I don't quite understand how anyone perceives that ntmo is asking for the BS for anything. She's asking the father of her child. Yes, it is thru that avenue that the BS is involved. If you think she doesn't have a right to seek support from the father simply because he is your husband, then you should understand what you signed up for when you chose to stay with him. That's my thought. And, LG, I'm no *clerk* in a law firm. People of all backgrounds have voiced their disagreement with your position here.
The child is a half-sibling to the other children. Thats a simple fact and all of your obvious anger and hate doesn't change that fact, LynnG.
You can attempt to de*humanize a child by referring to him as an IT but really it speaks much more to your character than anything else.
The posters on this board have been asking for peace for quite a long time, to be left to their rebuilding and healing process. Why don't you let them have that peace by putting a stop to this now. It is causing that peace to unfold.

Like I stated previously, I can definitely see where the high emotions come from. The desire to strike back and get &#8216;em where it hurts is pretty universal. THAT&#8217;S the problem. Tit for tat is only going to get you tit for tat. I&#8217;m not against doing what is FAIR, but going out of your way to &#8220;sock it to her&#8221; is locking you into a vicious battle where nobody wins&#8230;.and I&#8217;m not talking money. My concern with Lynn&#8217;s advice is that it appears to go beyond legal tactical maneuvers to preserve a way of life for the children of the marriage. My perception is that she&#8217;s advocating going after another person with claws and teeth bared&#8230;.going for the jugular, so to speak. In the long run, I see this poisoning all parties involved. I think it IS possible, in many cases, to come to an amicable agreement without all the &#8220;creative accounting&#8221;. The course I see being laid out by going Lynn&#8217;s route is one that is long, stressful and consuming. Sure, the BS may get a &#8220;win&#8221; in the beginning&#8230;.which will probably make the OW feel like her child was cheated&#8230;.prompting her to go after xMM year after year after year&#8230;.. Whereas, had the parties mediated a settlement they could all live with, the CS issue would become a non-issue and the respective parties can move on with rebuilding their lives.

This is just my ideal view of what should be. I&#8217;m not saying the BS should be a doormat. I wholeheartedly agree with empowering yourselves&#8230;.knowledge is power. I just don&#8217;t agree with the &#8220;no holds barred&#8221; attitude.

OB1

" I just don&#8217;t agree with the &#8220;no holds barred&#8221; attitude."

I see Lynn expressing a different attitude .... I'll call it the

"cover your [censored], just in case" attitude.

When dealing with an outside person (OP) AND/OR an inside person (WS) who have shown blatant disregard for the family's well being .... cover your [censored] seems rather sensible and prudent .... especially as one is waiting for all the cards to be played out.

Even if the attitude is *aggresively* cover your [censored] .... it is prudent to be ready for any unexpected attacks on the family assets .... from WS or OP.... both having shown character defects that put the family at risk.

It is not trying to "get" someone who has hurt you .... it is to prevent being eaten alive by that same person(s) in the future.

Be smart, and be pro-active... when it comes to saving your family. That's the message I hear.

Pep

So you're saying hope for the best but prepare for the worst? I can't argue with that. I live the same way. The difference, IMO, is how the situation is approached. I guess this is where perception comes in. I perceive Lynn's approach as not just to "cover her a$$", but to indirectly put the OW to task by using the child, which will only serve to fuel the fire. As long as the OC is the target (my opinion as mother to OC), there will be no end to the legal drama between xMM, BS, and OW. I, for one, would not want to continue that kind of fight if there were other options available i.e. mediation and agreement/settlement. But that's just me. I would think that, at some point, one would grow weary of the fight and want some peace.

Lynn G said:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Where you are considered less then dirt on the bottom of a shoe. Your OC, who of course is innocent, is going to grow up with a stigma, all because of the thoughtless, selfhish actions of two </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That seems to go quite a bit farther than the "cover your a*s" attitude. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> The OW was obviously not dirt when my H was sleeping with her and I doubt very much the OC in my life will grow up with any stigma at all. This is 2003 not the Dark Ages.

If Lynn G's desire is so sincere, why has she failed to answer the basic questions asked by other members. What about her story? Why is it taking DAYS for her to come up with a story?

Who TOLD her to come here? She said it was a regular poster. I don't see any regular poster stepping up and saying they told her to come to MB.

And why are posters suddenly appearing on this board who have never posted before but have such incredibly strong views? Check the names and number of posts, you will find that Lynn is not the only one who seems to have appeared out of nowhere.

There are all kinds of knowledge, strength and assertiveness. Because some people feel that Lynn's tactics are immoral or cruel does not mean that we are not strong and knowledgeable people. Some were quick to say don't label Lynn, yet those are the ones who are labelling and admonishing those you don't agree with Lynn.

Some of the things Lynn suggested ARE illegal, others are definitely loopholes. And, as one poster pointed out, if not handled properly they will backfire and you will be in worse shape than you were before.

Getting a lawyer is excellent advice. But I find it very odd that every post pushes the same mantra. I think K is righ ton target when he said she sounds more like a paid lobbyist capitalizing on people who are hurting and don't know where to turn.

Some of you seem to believe that if you try to work out contact, the ONLY reason you could possible have is that you are are weak or afraid. Contrary to what she claims, Lynn does ont represent "what most BS think and feel". She can and does only represent her own view, just like the rest of us.

An example... Lynn wrote:

"Is the UH supposed towelcome this child with open arms ad embrace it?

My answer -- why shouldn't he? He made the child. It is his child. It may make the BW feel better that the H turns his back on the child, bu thow many of us could do that to our own childre? Id on't understand why people believe that only mothers are attached to their children. Some fathers love their children just as much.

And, if a man tells you that he does not care anything at all about a child he fathered, I personally believe there are one of two things are play -- He is trying to please the BW, or he is a real user who doesn't care about anyone but himself.

I am a BS with an OC and these are my feelings. So, now tell me, I don't belong on this board and try to run me off too!

This entire thread has done nothing constructive. It has only served to incite people and create a divisive atmosphere.

As a previous poster said, that is a tremendous shame because the board was just getting back to normal ...

I DO consider a woman who would bring a child into the world under these conditions to be "les then dirt on the bottom of a shoe". She was perfectly happy to try and destroy a family, obviously had no thoughts as to the pain it would inflict upon the children of the marriage. I have no problem with saying that. (And YES I am aware that it takes two, before you get on that mantra)

Story: Married with children. 18, 17 and 11. H has 15 OC with XOW. Long long past DDAY. Could care less about XOW. Angry when directed to sites by a regular. Can't believe that OW are on here calling XMM "cowards" for "abandoning" the OC. Yet expecting and hoping they would do the same to the children of the marriage. Feel strong and far past any hurt. See BW here in a fragile state, afraid, scared and lonely. Not sure what they should do, if anything. Not knowing who to trust. I tell them there are ways to protect yourself. COVER YOUR [censored] is a great explanation. While their lives are spinning out of control, things can happen to make it all worse. I encourage them to seek legal help. I will keep pounding it too. It is the absolute only way to deal with this.

I see where this attitude terrifies some, and sorry about that. I see where you think I am bitter and angry. Whatever. I am terrified for some of these BW who are in the dumps, hurting and afraid. I was there. A very dear friend is who drove me to an attorney and it helped. He took care of all the details. Of course you can't do things illegaly, it will only get you in trouble. Big Trouble. But a good firm, who not only has family laywers, but also finacial laywers will help you get things in order.

I see where it upsets many who read this. It reads harsh. Very harsh. But this is the real world. A pregnancy goes by in a blink of an eye, and time is wasted in those early days. I do not advocate to do anything illegal. That is why I push laywers. OW want to scare you from this advice cause they know what can happen. See, it almost falls into plan B in a way. You file for a legal separation, and get CS for your children. Shows your husband you mean business and that you are looking out for your children's interests. Now, I know I seem cold, calculating etc. But I am not. I spent a long time reading here and other places and became enraged at the irrational advice. Furious at the audacity of some OW when it comes to this situation. There is no way a marriage will heal in a few months. There is no way a family can make these decisions on the spot. That is why I push for the laywer. It gives you time, gives you breathing space. Gives you peace.

If a husband wants contact with the child, and the wife doesn't, there is a problem. If she goes and sees that her children are taken care of first, it gives her time. If they can't work it out, then she has done right by her children. If it works out,then it is a moot point isn't it?

I see people here are hurt, and I see where some are rather quick to point them in a direction that may hurt them more in the future. I see where some think it is their duty to accept oc. That works for you. I am letting them know to protect themselves IMMEDIATELY. In those early days after dday, you can hardly put your faith and trust in your husband now can you?

I know it is harsh. But it is a harsh situation. It infuriates me that OW are here, twisting and whining about how they hate the XMM and so on. FOR WHAT? Was she not a willing partner? If he chooses to put his family first and help them heal, as he should, then he is a coward? The mentality is beyond irrational.

So there it is. Like it or leave it.

Oh, and as for OC. No, we have never had contact. I assume he is fine. She remarried and he has a father figure. She recently went on a binge and started calling cause she lost a job and wanted more CS. We have a restraining order on her. We own a business together and my H also has a job. Both are in the same field. She calls whenever my daughter gets local press for her acheivements, complaining about it. My children know of the ow and the oc and they chose no contact for themselves also.

I am simply amazed that when a BW choses to protect her family at all costs, and the couple fight to keep the marriage intact and decide on no contact, that would be a shocker to anyone. Early on, right after I learned of EMR and pending oc it was hurtfull and humiliating. Only after speaking to an attorney, assuring that me and my kids would be ok, did I feel that I had something to ground myself to. It was years before I trusted my H completely again. In the early hours, after seeing attorney I started feeling better about myself and my future. It wasn't until after oc was born that we made the decision. Ow wanted money, and H to spend every other weekend at her place. Wanted invites to family Thanksgivings, etc. The gall was appalling. So I put my foot down. N/C. And that is what we did.

Oh, and for the regular who pointed me here. For obvious reasons, she doesn't want to be outted. Since I have apparently caused trouble. So I will respect her wishes.

But, to the rest of you BW. I am going to be here, reading your stories. I was helped in my hour of need by a wonderfull, stong, vocal friend. I hope I can help some of you. I can't be hurt. I am thriving, love my kids, love my husband, love my life. And I was once in the same pit of sorrow that you are in. I am living proof that you will survive this. You will heal.

And even though I sound bitter and mean and angry, it is cause I am angry at what has happened to you. I am bitter that people still take each other for granted, I am mean to OW who think they and their OC should be all that matters. The BW and her children are affected deeply by this, and somebody has to stand up and say I HEAR YOU. I CARE. and YOU CAN PROTECT YOURSELF.

If it comes across as mean,so be it. If one woman gets some strength from it, and gods out and learns to protect herself, then it is worth it.

I DO consider a woman who would bring a child into the world under these conditions to be "les then dirt on the bottom of a shoe". She was perfectly happy to try and destroy a family, obviously had no thoughts as to the pain it would inflict upon the children of the marriage. I have no problem with saying that. (And YES I am aware that it takes two, before you get on that mantra)

Story: Married with children. 18, 17 and 11. H has 15 OC with XOW. Long long past DDAY. Could care less about XOW. Angry when directed to sites by a regular. Can't believe that OW are on here calling XMM "cowards" for "abandoning" the OC. Yet expecting and hoping they would do the same to the children of the marriage. Feel strong and far past any hurt. See BW here in a fragile state, afraid, scared and lonely. Not sure what they should do, if anything. Not knowing who to trust. I tell them there are ways to protect yourself. COVER YOUR [censored] is a great explanation. While their lives are spinning out of control, things can happen to make it all worse. I encourage them to seek legal help. I will keep pounding it too. It is the absolute only way to deal with this.

I see where this attitude terrifies some, and sorry about that. I see where you think I am bitter and angry. Whatever. I am terrified for some of these BW who are in the dumps, hurting and afraid. I was there. A very dear friend is who drove me to an attorney and it helped. He took care of all the details. Of course you can't do things illegaly, it will only get you in trouble. Big Trouble. But a good firm, who not only has family laywers, but also finacial laywers will help you get things in order.

I see where it upsets many who read this. It reads harsh. Very harsh. But this is the real world. A pregnancy goes by in a blink of an eye, and time is wasted in those early days. I do not advocate to do anything illegal. That is why I push laywers. OW want to scare you from this advice cause they know what can happen. See, it almost falls into plan B in a way. You file for a legal separation, and get CS for your children. Shows your husband you mean business and that you are looking out for your children's interests. Now, I know I seem cold, calculating etc. But I am not. I spent a long time reading here and other places and became enraged at the irrational advice. Furious at the audacity of some OW when it comes to this situation. There is no way a marriage will heal in a few months. There is no way a family can make these decisions on the spot. That is why I push for the laywer. It gives you time, gives you breathing space. Gives you peace.

If a husband wants contact with the child, and the wife doesn't, there is a problem. If she goes and sees that her children are taken care of first, it gives her time. If they can't work it out, then she has done right by her children. If it works out,then it is a moot point isn't it?

I see people here are hurt, and I see where some are rather quick to point them in a direction that may hurt them more in the future. I see where some think it is their duty to accept oc. That works for you. I am letting them know to protect themselves IMMEDIATELY. In those early days after dday, you can hardly put your faith and trust in your husband now can you?

I know it is harsh. But it is a harsh situation. It infuriates me that OW are here, twisting and whining about how they hate the XMM and so on. FOR WHAT? Was she not a willing partner? If he chooses to put his family first and help them heal, as he should, then he is a coward? The mentality is beyond irrational.

So there it is. Like it or leave it.

Oh, and as for OC. No, we have never had contact. I assume he is fine. She remarried and he has a father figure. She recently went on a binge and started calling cause she lost a job and wanted more CS. We have a restraining order on her. We own a business together and my H also has a job. Both are in the same field. She calls whenever my daughter gets local press for her acheivements, complaining about it. My children know of the ow and the oc and they chose no contact for themselves also.

I am simply amazed that when a BW choses to protect her family at all costs, and the couple fight to keep the marriage intact and decide on no contact, that would be a shocker to anyone. Early on, right after I learned of EMR and pending oc it was hurtfull and humiliating. Only after speaking to an attorney, assuring that me and my kids would be ok, did I feel that I had something to ground myself to. It was years before I trusted my H completely again. In the early hours, after seeing attorney I started feeling better about myself and my future. It wasn't until after oc was born that we made the decision. Ow wanted money, and H to spend every other weekend at her place. Wanted invites to family Thanksgivings, etc. The gall was appalling. So I put my foot down. N/C. And that is what we did.

Oh, and for the regular who pointed me here. For obvious reasons, she doesn't want to be outted. Since I have apparently caused trouble. So I will respect her wishes.

But, to the rest of you BW. I am going to be here, reading your stories. I was helped in my hour of need by a wonderfull, stong, vocal friend. I hope I can help some of you. I can't be hurt. I am thriving, love my kids, love my husband, love my life. And I was once in the same pit of sorrow that you are in. I am living proof that you will survive this. You will heal.

And even though I sound bitter and mean and angry, it is cause I am angry at what has happened to you. I am bitter that people still take each other for granted, I am mean to OW who think they and their OC should be all that matters. The BW and her children are affected deeply by this, and somebody has to stand up and say I HEAR YOU. I CARE. and YOU CAN PROTECT YOURSELF.

If it comes across as mean,so be it. If one woman gets some strength from it, and gods out and learns to protect herself, then it is worth it.

Lynn,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">And even though I sound bitter and mean and angry, it is cause I am angry at what has happened to you. I am bitter that people still take each other for granted, I am mean to OW who think they and their OC should be all that matters. ... If it comes across as mean,so be it. If one woman gets some strength from it, and goes out and learns to protect herself, then it is worth it.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I think if you leave out some of the bitterness, anger, and meanness out of your posts, you may end up helping 10 women, instead of one... I think a lot of issues you bring up are good (although difficult to implement in some cases, given the MB rules on POJA, etc.)---but bringing them forth without the animosity would probably get you a wider audience.

" somebody has to stand up and say I HEAR YOU. I CARE. and YOU CAN PROTECT YOURSELF."

Thanks LynnG, <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

I think you've already helped more women than you realize.