On the "other board", I read an antiquated phrase I hadn't heard since the 70's suggesting that....

Marriage is nothing more than a piece of paper

Apparantly, the person touting this (more than once) is under the impression that an institution that has been a part of civilization and society since the dawn of time and desired by 90% of the world's population is reduced, in her mind, as nothing more than a piece of paper. Just pulverized wood, water and chemicals stained with ink.

The writer implies that the "bond" between a husband and wife is not significant and has no value. The writer implies that the history they share is meaningless and that their union is nothing more than convenience and then minimizes the importance of marriage that is created to nuture a couple and their offspring into a whole and complete unit.

Well, I guess we are all entitled to our own opinions. I understand that some people who are not married will blow it off as no big deal (for whatever reason) until they find "The One" and embrace marriage and all it's meaning and significance for themselves.

For me, I put that "marriage is nothing more than a piece of paper" on the shelf along with other outdated phases like "groovy", "peace, man" or more recntly, "schwing"...hahaha.

Seeing that phrase resurrected after all these decades after we have all been enlightened how crucial marriage is to the well-being of society as a whole, is troubling for the lament of the writer who might be reacting out of lonliness, envy/anger or fear.

The point of this post is to rebutt the other poster's declaration that marriage is nothing and to reinforce the pervasive notion that marriage is the foundation of an adult's life, well-being and gives each person in the couple the connection to create a bond meaningful in their lives that will see them through the good, the bad and the ugly.

Look, I just woke up. I'm groggy and not very eloquent yet, but this has bothered me every time I read it and if anyone is reading this stuff over there, especially Newbies, I don't want the power of suggestion to influence you and take from you what is your truth, your foundation.

Nuf said.

So if it's just a piece of paper, why is the gay community so eager to get in on the same piece of paper, huh????????????

It doesn't surprise me to hear the term. Especially on a site that affirms adultery.

The term alone lends itself to legitimizing an A.

Afterall, how much remorse is there in being party to ripping up a piece of paper?

Oh and cat, even groggy, you are still eloquent.

~ad

People who make these blanket generalizations usually are the ones who can't find anyone who WANTS to marry them. That's JMHO.

Marriage is so much more than a piece of paper. It is a commintment you make to one another in the eyes of the lord. But as others have stated already, we can tell that the person who posted that comment doesn't have much of a life

I recall reading the piece of paper comment too. Although I remember it being used in the context of a discussion about the relationship of the BS and the OC, as in there is no blood connection between them. Which is the truth. It was not claiming marriage is "just" a piece of paper. At least that is how I took it. I'm married and I didn't take offense. I think everyone really needs to relax a bit.

Let me guess - the person who made that very profound statement has never actual had ownership of that particular "piece of paper" & obviously covets those who have that "piece of paper" & seeks to destroy the relationship that is represented by that meaningless "piece of paper".

CC68~

I don't know about everyone else, but I'm relaxed.

It's a peice of paper to the OW. But to the W it was a commentment, a promise, FOREVER! Though hard times, good times, all times. Not just a "piece of Paper" until some no account hiefer with no morals, no respect for herself or her children try to GET the piece of paper! Hello, thats what they want. They want H to leave and marry them. So them it becomes more than just a "piece of paper". That just really kills me. I have never had as much disrespect for people, until I read on the TOW site. This is what these people are up to, how they think, act, and preceive marriage. No concept of what they caused will effect our children FOREVER, And we are to CARE about them and the OC first. NOT ON THIS EARTH. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> I beleive in turning the cheek, but GOD never said let someone keep slapping it. He, expects us to take up for our marriages, families and what we believe in. I can see w/o him, why theses OW feel so much hatred, and who their leader is. I would be sad to know all my effort, and time was spent tring to tear apart someone elses life.

I also read that statement on the "other board". They were implying that MM & OC were connected by blood and MM & BS were only connected by a "piece of paper", the old agage 'blood is thicker than water'.

There is a signifigance in that statement though. MM and BS are also connected by CHOICE, something that MM and most OC are NOT and are NEVER given.

That right there sums it up for me. MM is CHOOSING to be w/ BS and BC, while OW FORCES OC upon MM. We all know that men, married or not, have absolutely NO say in the birth of a child. That is a legal fact.

In a marriage, most H and W CHOOSE to have a child. I don't know of any marriage where the W got pg on purpose w/o H consent.(although I'm sure there may be wacky ones out there) Even "unplannned" pg IN marriage are usually welcomed w/ the idea that "occasionally it happens" and "what a NICE surprise".

Not like the unplanned pg from A that most men do NOT want but then are forced.

Yah, they can trivialize all they want and then build up the relationship between OC and MM but we all know the cold hard truth.

OC are chosen by their mothers and are forced upon MM while BC and BS are forever chosen by BOTH parents. OC will forever be an outsider in some way, I don't care how great the relationship is between all the parties involved. At best OC will always "visit" w/ their father and never "live" w/ them like most BC.

Father will have limited C when OC is born whether he wants to or not because of logisitics, newborns need thier mothers to provide necessary nourishment, for one. It is not like children in the home where father can come straight home from work and cuddle w/ baby, or even take time off of work to offer support to the new mommy and baby. THERE ARE MAJOR DIFFERENCES that will always be there.

Any way, you all know what I mean so I don't think I really have to explain much more.

For being 'just a piece of paper', it sure does bring a lot of priviledge and power. And another thing, THAT piece of paper assures that the legiteamacy (sorry sp?) of MY children will automatically be ASSUMED and not questioned, rightfully so! NOBODY doubts who the father of MY children are!

Just like many other pieces of paper we receive in our lives. The difference between the guy who surgically repairs your heart and the one who wheels you into your hospital room-----a piece of paper---which one do you want to operate on you?

Thanks cat, for bringing this up. I am not insulted by their point of view because I don't expect any less from those still in the "fog". It's' just so interesting that 1 side can be considered so "sacred" (OC & blood) yet the other side is so trivialized (BS & marriage).

Haven't read it myself,
but I would be willing to wager that the comment
could have easily been made by someone who, during
the throws of the A, was looking forward to/hoping for
that"piece of paper."

And Cat, I agree... even groggy you are eloquent.
I've missed you!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

*waving*... HI AUT!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I have heard people say that about marriage too. It definitely is said with the attitude of looking down their noses, but rarely said by someone who, as mentioned, owns the paper. It means a lot to me. Even my hubby doesn't understand that I meant it when I said no matter what, even when I don't like him, for better or worse, forever. It's more than just paper, more than words in a ceremony; it is a sacred vow and commitment. Unfortunately I chose to marry a jekyl and hyde. Without the paper, I would have been outta here long ago. Since I have it, I'm doing my darndest...

<small>[ March 23, 2004, 11:05 AM: Message edited by: aimee2 ]</small>

What I find so ironic is that the person who made the comment on the other board isn't an ow.

It says alot about generalizations.

Well said Amiee!

Catnip,

I believe a person involved in the deceit of an Extra Marital Affair and they know full well their lover is married, does not honor the institution of marriage itself. So naturally the opinion from the posters of the TOW board really doesn't surprise me.

Sometimes I think how quickly the majority of OW would change their minds if their MM would act the slightest bit interested in divorcing the W and indicating they wanted to marry their OW.

Probably all in all, its a case of total sour grapes.

JMHO of course.

I used to buy into the adage, blood is thicker than water. What my H has demonstrated to me, proves it is NOT true in all cases. He is not related to me or our son by blood, but loves us just as much as the children we produced together.

My H chose to marry me, yes. But he sure as hell didn't choose for me to have another man's baby, but when faced with it...he chose to accept the baby as his own. He chose to love the baby and to view him as someone on the same team as himself. DNA made no difference.

As Coffeeman likes to say, "Love knows no DNA"

On the piece of paper thing...Wasn't that a common thought on marriage by people who were justifying living together out of wedlock, years ago?

Hi back atcha, Stacia...(the emailing has been fun, bringing lots of sunshine to me up here!!) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

<small>[ March 23, 2004, 11:27 AM: Message edited by: autumnday ]</small>

well then CeeCee68, like I tell my kids....people will think you are who you associate with.

Trying to teach them to choose quality friends and people to be "associated" with. If my children choose to hang out with those of low morals and standards then others will not expect more of them, but if they choose to hang out with those who challenge them to be better then others will expect them to be better too.

If my children choose to hang out w/ losers people will think they are a loser too. That's just how it is. Then they also run the risk of actually becoming one. That's why I try to stress to them to "choose wisely".

hahahahahahaha! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> LOL & totally smirking to myself!

IT is so good to actually see--in writing--(confinrming everything we have always thought)-that we (the "horrible") BS are not the ONLY ones guilty of the occasional broad sweeping generalizations. The way we sometimes rant and rave about "our" OW, sometimes making our statement all inclusive.

The other board has written a response to us, I encourage you to read it for yourself. Maybe you will learn something. Get some good marital advice! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

You don't really have to read it to know how much marriage is really respected and valued on the other side. The truth is only "thier" marraige is respected and valued, at the time of the actual marriage, of course.

And it's funny how upset some get when thier "posts" are supposedly taken out of context but I never noticed anyone bothered when MY posts have been taken out of context. But that is ok. It doesn't bother me. I felt quite flattered that something I actually said was important enough to "quote" and get some actually thinking about a different view, even if still disagreed with.

And the point that a marriage can end but a father (or any sperm/egg donor) will always be a father is total ......you know what! Ask ANY adopted child or adoptive parent and they will laugh in your face! It takes MORE than DNA to be a father or a mother!

I am speaking from experience just so there is no mistake. I had my bio-mom and non-bio DAD in my life my whole life. I met my sperm donor. I vaguely remember him as a child, (not knowing who he was) and met him as an adult (knowing who he was). Does that make him my father for life? NO WAY! What a slap in the face to my REAL father and any adoptive parent who has put in the real time and energy to EARN that title!

AND by the way any sperm/egg donor can terminate THIER rights to thier "child" @ any time by signing a PIECE OF PAPER! A piece of paper that many adoptive parents fight for and value w/ thier life!

Here on this board, we know and value the difference between sperm donors and FATHERS.

It is funny to me-- the women who are *so* against marriage- oh its just a piece of paper... a joke... OK.. WHATEVER... how can these women be SO perfect and SO wonderful... why on earth then can't they "hunt down, pummel and keep captive" the man like we BS can!!!! Ha!!!!

They just say this crap cause MM came back home and they can't stand it-- *NOW* MM is a liar, swindler, loser--- they don't want him--HA- he didn't want you or the piece of paper that could bind you. As far as the OC and that issue-- they were not fun and games anymore-- they were having children and wanted love and commitment-- DUH, then wy does OW make us out to be SO BORING... they chased off H with "our" antics, right??

I also know that a WOMEN must protect her reputation, her body and herself from GETTING PREGNANT especially to a MM. Many men are MORE than happy to go unprotected if we WOMEN let them.... and I know personally there would NEVER come a day when any MM or any MAN, PERIOD could sweet talk ME into no birth control/condom. Let alone-- wanting to knowingly sleep with anyone who I knew was getting heavy nookie and sharing personal items (eew... toilet.. cups... etc.) everyday with another.

How can it be that we are so stupid for thinking that paper means everything.. how can we want this guy... how can we believe we matter...

WOW... OW are insane in this regard... they were willing to wait, settle for and not protect their body from pregnancy to someone who was giving them 1/100th of what they share w/us. (but not sex of course).. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Actually, the phrase, "marriage is only a piece of paper" gets tossed around on MB here quite a bit too.

And it's usually by those who have decided to divorce (prior to the completed divorce) and have started dating.
After all, as they say, "my ws broke her vows first. If it's means nothing to her, then it means nothing to me, so my dating (while still having a "piece of paper") is now okay".

<small>[ March 23, 2004, 02:51 PM: Message edited by: Chris -CA123 ]</small>

I haven't read any of what is posted on the other board about this subject. But as and Xmow, I know during the time of my affair I was in a fog. But one thing I know, I never wanted or expected XMM to leave his wife for me. In the affair I had I was the one with all the guilt and I was the one who ended it and fessed up to my H. I consider that time of my life as hitting rock bottom. I know have more respect for marriage and still have a hard time believing what I have done and that others can have such a crappy attitude towards being respectful towards anothers marriage.

Yeah, a poster on that Other Board is quite upset about this thread. Yawn... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Back and Forth, Back and Forth.

The thing is we write something then get accused of quoting out of context and then we are quoted out of context on the other board.alwasy a double standard.

OC----BC

One counts more than the other.

BS-----OW

One is more responsible than the other.

Depending on which side you are on decides who you think is more responsible and which child counts more.

On THIS board, we focus on marriage so our advice is to put the marriage first. On the other board, where that is not the focus, it will not be the priority.

It's not about you or me or even who's fault this is.

It's about mistakes and people who are here to repair the damage that has been done. It's about a terrible violation and all the consequences, pain & anguish and innocent lives that are affected by it.

It's about struggling to find your way when the path you are on suddenly---w/o warning has been utterly destroyed.

It's bigger than me or you, bigger than OW, MM, and BS. Sometimes it seems unbearable and it feels like there is no hope and never any answer or solution.

It's about being a mother or father and seeing your very own children hurt and you are helpless to make it better.

It is about something that started out being just about MM and OW and then blew up in everyone's faces and we are all reeling from the fall out ......... still.

What do you expect? What do you want? Every one is angry. Every one is hurt. Everyone has a valid point ........ somewhere.

Really, if women would not sleep w/ MM, then there would be no cheaters. If women did NOT put up w/ crap then men would always be on their best behaviour. If women used the power and control over our own bodies that we actually have then their would be NO unplanned pregnancies.

And if you do not act like something you once WERE then you are no longer that person or label. My H is no longer a WS. There are women here who are no longer OW. So the label does not apply to you because you are no longer that person.

These now are things that you once DID but no longer who you ARE.

That is why a BS CAN take back a lying, cheating H. Because we see that he was not always that man and he is no longer that man and he proves it everyday. Is he capable of being that man again, of course. I am capable of becoming a WW, we all are. I can become an OW if I choose. I choose not to.

I think OW have been so hurt that they find it hard to face reality and the fact that MM has changed. He is not the adulterous man she was once with. He is now finding his way back to the honorable man he once was. He is going back to his wife and family and reminding OW that she was w/ a man w/ a wife and family.

That is a hard thing to face. To face that you have to face then what you have also become. Just like BS has to face where she was and what she was during the A.

There is no excuse and there are a # of reasons why any one strays from their marriage and covenant. BS are not blind but because we knew the spouse BEFORE the A, we can remember what that spouse was once capable of being, MORE than just a WS, more than a liar and a user. We know because we would have NEVER married a liar and a user. We know that BS can return to the honorable, loving spouse they once were.

That leaves OW alone to face the fact that the MM they were w/ WAS a liar and a user and they willingly agreed to get involved w/ THAT man! Then when MM is no longer that man, obviously, he will not want to be w/ her.

It is very sad all around and devastating when a child is involved. There are lots of children involved, which is what most here on MB remember to point out and give voice too. ALL the children, ALL the childhoods that are and will be affected, ALL the innocence lost!

Just as many have advised any one here, OW or BS, to get legal advice to look after their OWN.

ANY good mother would.

As for the piece of paper thing...whatever, it doesn't even matter, that was just a plain DUMB thing to say.

It's a 'piece of paper' that holds the key if OC has MM DNA or not. Dollar bills are only 'pieces of paper' but no one discounts thier value. Our constition is a 'piece of paper' and one that defines our country. There are tons of 'pieces of paper' in this world and we all know the value of each of them and what they intrinsically imply.

The one that is in ??? here is the difference between buying and renting. One you put your time and energy to invest in and the other-----someone else OWNS and you are just borrowing and every one knows it.

AND YOU CAN QUOTE ME ON THAT! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Great post, kt!

I'll second that!!! (clapping)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by catnip:
<strong>

The point of this post is to rebutt the other poster's declaration that marriage is nothing and to reinforce the pervasive notion that marriage is the foundation of an adult's life, well-being and gives each person in the couple the connection to create a bond meaningful in their lives that will see them through the good, the bad and the ugly.

this has bothered me every time I read it and if anyone is reading this stuff over there, especially Newbies, I don't want the power of suggestion to influence you and take from you what is your truth, your foundation.

Nuf said. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">OK, Kids. I am quoting myself to reintroduce my point. This was just a musing...not trying to start a board war. Really. Really, really.

I wasn't "insulted" or pissed off about the remarks, I am simply confounded by the thinking that minimmizes something that the majority of society continues to embrace despite the minority of nay-sayers. I admit I don't like having people putting down a tradition, institution or covenant complete with all the bells and whistles (like sacred vows and promised) because we are all struggling so hard to recover our marriages and I don't like seeing something we are working at so diligently devalued and minimized.

To me saying that marriage is nothing more than a piece of paper that was once popular rhetoric back in the 70's along with "love the one you're with", (which unfortunately, was done to most of us to all our detriments) the "new" Coke or other rejected notions, I refrain from accusing the writer of sour grapes and instead give them a pass that they are misguided (?)

The blood is thicker than water thing is also a misnomer in many cases (i.e. stepparents, step kids etc) I PREFER my stepdad to my real dad and I love my stepkids as my own. But, that's just my family. So, expecting someone to shed his life, his family, his history with a family of several people for a relationship with an OC is not always feasible for lots of extenuating reasons. Thus, the cry of the OP over their confusion why their child is not #1 priority is usually based in emotion rather than practicality. This is just an observation and a generality and not meant to tweak or challenge anyone, but I am getting off topic. My original train of thought was my observation surrounding the comments made on the other board about the value of marriage (or lack thereof) and reducing it to something meaningless as just a piece of paper and my discomfort.

As usual, it is all about me. Hahaha.

<small>[ March 23, 2004, 09:11 PM: Message edited by: catnip ]</small>

I haven't gone back there since earlier in the day. From what I read though, if you are able to read it objectively, there wasn't much to be up in arms about.

Ok, so there was the dramatic run down of, in 10 years, in 15 years, and so on... I think the point trying to be made was that no amount of time, no amount of no contact will ever change the fact that an OC has the same blood as the MM forever and ever. All right, true enough. When they refer to the MM as Father after all the years of no contact, that is plain silly. We all know what it takes to be a parent, and blood/DNA ain't it, not on it's own merit, anyway.

Can't take what they say personally over there. They would love nothing better, as I'm sure they're loving all the emotional responses on this thread.

As far as I'm concerned, this board gets off the principles of MB way too often and is NOT always focusing on the marriage. The C v. NC ongoing controversy is just one example of that. It gets old, fast, especially the times when it doesn't seem to be discussed with the M being the central theme. That's my gripe though.

Cat, look what you started...shame on you!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

<small>[ March 23, 2004, 11:26 PM: Message edited by: autumnday ]</small>

Autumn...Mea culpa!

No kidding! All I wanted was to start a thread of discussion/debate on the perceived values of marriage. Ahhh, never mind. You and KT and others had some really great insight, though.

And Autumn, technically YOU started this last week by waking the sleeping dog, er, cat...hahahaha.

Sometimes I feel like all I have to say is 'shoehorn' and we are off and running...

And my post, Autumn, Catnip... maybe my post was seen as catty... but I can't apologize! I'm tired of "always" being mature and sweet.. so I can get walked all over. Can I be build my marriage and still be honest of how I may feel on some days? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> I also think that the contact vs. no contact issue will always be important to many many new posters as well as ones that have been dealing with it for some time. I know it is on my brain all the time, even when I feel I have "made up my mind" on certain issues. It is a major part of this forum, as it is a huge slice of the marriage now and we cannot escape it or change it.

The other board won't be up in arms about anything over here! They all fight amongst themselves like mad-- its funny. A BS will come over.. put a nasty post or something they don't... the BS disappears and 20 of them are in a huge argument calling each other vile names....
I've never seen anything like it.

KT thanks for the post, it was awesome!
You are so nifty! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

<small>[ March 24, 2004, 09:18 AM: Message edited by: giovanna123 ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> And Autumn, technically YOU started this last week by waking the sleeping dog, er, cat...hahahaha.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Shoot, now that you know my methods, I shall have to come up with a different approach next time! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

How surprising! Usually the ones who say that can't attain it, so therefore they have to devalue it.

I loved KT's message too. Wonderful!

The oc may have blood, but where is the bond? Families live together and grow together.


I have a teenager living in my home for the school year as her parents moved and she wanted to Graduate with her life-long friends. I have known her since she was 1 year old. I love her, always have. She is, especially now, like a daughter to me. We have not one drop of blood, but the love is there. We are very close. Her mother is like a sister to me and they feel like family. I have cousins 4 states away. I rarely think of them, send the cards, attend the weddings,etc. But I do not love them like I do this girl and her family. Love and acceptance is a choice on many occaisions.

What the ow have a hard time accepting is when the MM stays with his wife and children, and turns his back on them. They do not see that the wife and the children are the "blood" that is thickier then the "water" (ow/oc).

g123~

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> And my post, Autumn, Catnip... maybe my post was seen as catty... but I can't apologize! </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Who said your post was catty? Who asked you to apologize? I know I never did. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I only know of one very catty person on this forum, and she will remain nameless! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I'm tired of "always" being mature and sweet.. so I can get walked all over. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That's why I said we can't take the stuff they say (or anyone here for that matter), personally. They are not your OW. They are not walking all over you. Your OW cannot even walk all over you, unless you allow her to. You can be as mature or immature as you wish. You can be sweet, or not sweet. It's all your choice. No one can control how you choose to conduct yourself.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Can I be build my marriage and still be honest of how I may feel on some days?

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Absolutely!! In fact you can build your marriage and be honest about your feelings on ALL days.

I'm sure cat will respond soon...Just let me say though, that cat would be the first to defend your right to speak your mind on here and to be honest with your feelings, without fear of TOW scurrying over here to beat you over the head. I happen to agree with her. This is YOUR board, your safe haven. If they and their minions do try to clobber you, so what...clobber back, or don't. I'm merely suggesting you don't take it personally.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I also think that the contact vs. no contact issue will always be important to many many new posters as well as ones that have been dealing with it for some time. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">C v. NC issues are important. I don't deny it's a central theme to this board. How can it NOT be when this is a P/C of infidelity forum?

Perhaps I should've made myself more clear on this. What I don't like, is when threads pop up that go on and on, to and fro, back and forth, people getting upset because their view doesn't seem to be agreed with or whatever.

Who cares if some stranger on the internet doesn't agree with your stance on C v. NC?

Who cares if someone in your personal circle doesn't agree with your stance?

It is a personal, private decision to be made between the M couple.

It also irks me when a thread that doesn't even begin w/ C v. NC ends up being ALL about it. I've been here a year this month, and I've seen that occur more times than I can count. I swear, the thread could start out with the topic: "Taking My H Out for Sushi Tonight", and still manage a way to turn into C v. NC. I've been a party to many of them, so it's not like I'm above it all.

Again, this is just my gripe, my personal opinion.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> The other board won't be up in arms about anything over here!</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I didn't say they would be. I said, what they have posted is nothing to be up in arms about. As in, consider the source? I do contend though, that they probably enjoy it when they see their baiting was successful.

Take good care,

~ad

oops

<small>[ March 24, 2004, 10:56 AM: Message edited by: ktbunch ]</small>

C vs NC. It will always be a personal choice.

Blood being thicker than water. The Mm will always be the oc father. Not true. How many case out there of adopted children where they are loved just like a child born of the family? My H may not be the greatest father, but he does love the 2 kids I had with Xmm as his own.

by g123:KT thanks for the post, it was awesome!
You are so nifty!

Fifty, NIFTY united states and 13 orIgInaL COlOnIEs............

uh...wait a minute.....Did I just start singing that OUT LOUD? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="images/icons/blush.gif" /> Good thing I don't know the rest!
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

love ya g123! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Anyone that thinks marriage is "just" a piece of paper should also understand that to reproduce is nothing more than a simple biological function. Even the most primitive of animals do it, it takes no special talent or commitment.
But to spend your life caring for someone, taking the good times with the bad, building a life together is what makes that "piece of paper" so important. It is a symbol of commitment.
The same way that raising a child, loving and nuturing that child is what makes a parent. It has nothing to do with biology. Its all about love and bonding.
To assume that someone will love a child simply because that child carries their DNA is simplistic and naive and probably a little wishful thinking.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Jtigger:
<strong> Anyone that thinks marriage is "just" a piece of paper should also understand that to reproduce is nothing more than a simple biological function. Even the most primitive of animals do it, it takes no special talent or commitment.
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hahaha...I laugh because I just had to chase a couple dogs out of my yard stuck in their "passion" on my front lawn. The look on their faces was so incredibly comical, I wish I would have had my camera handy instead of my arms loaded with grocery bags.

I bet he never calls her or visits the kids either.

<small>[ March 24, 2004, 02:41 PM: Message edited by: catnip ]</small>

Autumn... I'm sorry.... I really just mentioned you cause your post and catnips were much more elaborate and serious than mine-- I was teasing *myself* about being catty.... cause I was being fecetious, which I usually am not. I try to debate, rebut and stick to trying to be fair and open and pretty accepting of everyone AND THEIR RIGHT TO AN OPINION, as I am in the real world!

I, however, am not granted the right to *any* opinion, anywhere! Do you believe that since I posted here earlier, I was stalked via pm at the opposing board about it?? Cause I mentioned that *they* fight and namecall-- which that board is famous for!!This is the second time someone there has called me out at another board-- I'M SCARED--there are laws against that! EEW that is so weird. I was posting there regarding the OC/BC issues and was very open with them there and honest -- just as here-- but no more. I don't need to be stalked its creepy. Can you imagine messaging everyone from every board about what they say?? W-O-W

Its JUST LIKE YOU SAID....

WHO CARES WHO POSTS WHERE AND ABOUT WHAT AND IF IT IS DEAD OFF FROM WHAT YOU THINK??? I personally don't care - if I don't like it I can post my side of it, or not read at all- why is that so odd? THATS WHY WE ARE ON THESE BOARDS TO SAY WHAT WE FEEL-- WHEN WE OTHERWISE MAY NOT BE ABLE TO BE OPEN WITH OTHERS IN OUR REAL LIVES!!!! Geesh... I welcome others' opinions and rebuttals, it gives me the opportunity to dig deep within myself to challenge certain things, thus helping me sort out my own feelings- know what I mean???

Its amazing... a BS can't speak the truth or have an opinion over there cause the posters must own it-- and *now* I can't talk about anything I feel like over here, cause they "own" this board along with the right to KNOW MY HANDLE NAMES ON ALL BOARDS.... umm.. and the right to control what I say and where I say it?

Man, that stinks! LOL! I am a ROBOT.. I COME IN PEEEACE.....

Others lurk here and post from other boards and also have *much* different attitudes and/or handles on other boards-- I thought everyone posted w/handles and not their real names for a reason????

I'm off topic of course.. but today was so strange to me... WHO on earth chases people from board to board? WOW.

Well said KT, Jtigger and Catnip.

Twiisty
(who barely makes it to the boards anymore...as she isn't exactly a fresh breath of spring! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> )

Twiisty...Where have you been and what have you been doing? I've lost touch with so many people since my hiatus. I bet you are spending most of your time chasing the baby around. I'm glad to see you back and lurking.

Catnip... You kill me! I bet he doesn't visit the kids either! Very good point. Hit the nail on the head with that one my dear. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />