stilldreamin,<P>Needing you to *prove* your love this way is him wanting to control you out of some insecurity. I know because my h used to be like that.<P>Love wants the growth and the best for the other person.<P>In a sense all human love is *conditional*. Even the best husband wants something back! No, I would not label control as conditional love, but as insecurity.

BTW I am not saying that you have to accept her actions if she continues to do wrong.....please understand that.... <P>I pray that you and your son will find strength and peace through all this....<P>The one thing that I failed to realize in my selfishness was the ripple effect my affair had on everyone in our lives.....it is not easy facing people at church or socially when I know they **know** <P>I was, and am right now extremely weak.....and there are moments when I believe my husband feeds off that weakness....the affair is another tool for him to assault me with.....be careful what you say to your wife.....words can cut like a knife.....

Worthatry,<BR>I'm a bit late on the discussion, but had a thought that I don't think I saw expressed here.<P>When a spouse leaves there is a common self-deception that they are leaving the just the spouse, not the kids.<P>The betrayed doesn't get that thinking, neither do the kids. Ours were 10 & 13 when he left, now 2 years older. Even though my H saw or called them nearly every day, it isn't the same as dad at the supper table, dad in front of the TV, dad snuggling, dad praying with & tucking in for bed, dad sleeping with mom & there in the morning.<P>My H finally understood the kids felt abandoned when my then 14 year old told him in no certain terms what scum she thought he was, not only a bad dad, but a bad person and she hoped he would not come back. Ouch!<P>He has come back and is working to repair those relationships as well as the marriage.<P>But maybe as your wife misses out on those special moments...and they happen often, the inside jokes, the catchphrases, the kid just growing before your eyes...the knowledge that she also left her kid is trying to surface through her fog. And decent people *know* inside themselves that good people don't leave their families for sex with some OP. That knowledge has to stay buried or the betrayed spouse made a villian or the WS can't stand themselves.<P>------------------<BR>Lor<BR>"A gentle answer turns away wrath, but a harsh word stirs up anger."<BR>(Proverbs 15:1).

Another update: Her hostility now seems to be gone, but it'll be back. I can coorelate it to whenever I or someone else breeches the topic of her affair (which she still denies). So, I suspect that whenever it comes up, she turns hostile in an attempt to defend herself by going on the offense. Whenever the A is in the background, it allows her to act normal and play the part of a wife going thru a separation for other reasons.<P>At our son's counseling session last night (related to the loss of his brother), she explained to him that this counseling is for all three of us so we can heal as a family unit. I almost dropped my jaw! I think her idea of healing is pretending the affair never happened. Won't work. Any more good advice or insight? Thanks for everything so far.<P>WAT <p>[This message has been edited by worthatry (edited November 07, 2000).]

Once again, I relate fully to your points. My wife gets nasty when any unpleasant topics arise, including any papers related to separation, her new house, and of course the affair, which of course simply has not happened and never would happen. Then a day later she can be real nice.<P>What do you think your wife meant by "heal as a family unit"? Did that mean anything about your marriage?<P>Mine envisions not ever having to admit the affair either, at least in her current state. Like you, I say it won't work. Hopefully they might become reasonable in the future.<P>And as far as the hostility goes, and the reasons for it, we're just the logical place to aim the anger, because they want to justify leaving us, so any opportunity to be mad at us is welcomed and utilized, especially fresh off of any talk about the affair. I know that any given attack sometimes strikes a cord, at least it does with me. But now I am quicker to put it in perspective. In an odd way, if there wasn't periodic anger, I'd be more worried that my wife has found what she wants, but since she is up and down so much, I know things are not that great. So in that respect, I can put up with the anger spells.<P>Laying low and Plan A is the right thing to do.<P>Oh, I laughed at your analogy to watching our wive's moods being like watching the stock market (in your post to me). Sad but true!<BR><p>[This message has been edited by Rick37 (edited November 07, 2000).]

Rick - the "heal as a family unit" came out of the blue (or fog?). She makes subtle statements like this once in a while that I try not to place too much significance on. She was ay the house last night and she and my son locked themselves in the bathroom to discuss what to get me for Christmas. My son said he thought things were improving (he's 12). Who knows? Just let the A come up and it's her evil twin again.<P>WAT - seat belt clipped and snug