Bear with me folks, this is gonna be long!<P>First a bit of background for those not familar with my situation. H had long term affair with OW. Affair went on 8 years before he moved out to live with her (1997). He lived with her for one year before he moved back home (1998). He stayed a year and then moved back with OW again (1999). He returned almost a year later swearing to me it was all over. He told her he doesn't love her and he is here forever. No more moving out, no more affair. So this whole ordeal began almost 14 years ago, although discovery will be 4 years come this July.<P>Well here it is 8 months since my H's latest return from living with OW, for the second time. Things went splendidly the first 4 months or so after his return. Then through a bit of snooping on my part I find out H is in bussiness with OW. OK, he fesses up but only because he could not deny things he knew I saw with my own two eyes. Insists it is strictly bussiness, didn't want to hurt me by telling be etc. I believe him on the surface but not so much to turn a blind eye to his track record.<P>A few things have been suspicious, since then. He leaves for work at 8am and sometimes doesn't get to work until hours later. OW is still good friends with his family and she spent Christmas Eve with them, and I find this odd because if he had told her it was *really* over I would think she would find a better way to spend her holiday then with the family of a guy that dumped her. Had a few bills rerouted to the bussiness rather than have them vome to our home. Last week I intercepted a voice mail from OW to my H's cell that said, "Hi Honey, just checking in, call me." You'd think that would be enough to convince me there's something rotten in Denmark. But NOOOOO! I just keep thinking she's trying to get him back without his cooperation. I also check his cell phone bill every month and he talks to her EVERY day for over an hour on his cell phone. There were other red flags too, but I think you all get the picture.<P>The doo-doo hit the fan the day before yesterday. A long time friend of ours was working for H. Well, he got fired on Mon. So on Wed he calls me and spills his guts about what he knows. He tells me OW and H refer to each other as *honey, dear, sweetie* at work. H doesn't show up to work until as late as noon and OW shows up the same time or within a few minutes, and this goes on 6 days a week. OW's daughter comes into work when OW doesn't feel like coming in and the daughter is an authorized signer of checks for the bussiness, just like her mother (this is something that H never told me about the bussiness)! This friend says it is obvious that the affair is still going on or my H is stringing her along to keep the bussiness afloat (he needs her contacts and used all of her savings to start the bussines). I swore to this friend I would NEVER tell my H he called me. I can NOT break his confidence. <P>So I figured I'd approach my H with the concept of me coming to the bussiness to help out to see his reaction. We have discussed this on several occasions, in the past, and he keeps telling me eventually he'd love for me to help out but always has had a reason that it would have to wait a few months. Well, bussiness is lean and I figured I could come and do simple things like answer the phones, etc to free him or others up to do the actual work. He starts telling me there's nothing for me to do etc. Then as I continue to tell him how I could help he starts getting angry. I know it was a LB, but after all the years of this crap I'm at the end of the whole mess. I keep telling him how I want to help, be a part of that portion of his life and he tells me all I am doing is pushing and being a pest! There was a side issue as well. Our daugther had to go into the major city, the next night, we live near and I can't drive the expressways after dark due to panic attacks. So I suggest I drive her to where she needs to go and then come by his bussiness and we go back to get her in the dark together. He tells me NO that I'd end up having to drive in the dark to his bussiness, I ask him then what does he suggest I do and he tells Not to go. I tell him not going is NOT an option since this is a really big opportunity for her. Then he suggests I drive her there and he'll take a taxi to where we will be and drive us home. The taxi ride would have cost around $40! For a man whose bussiness is supposedly not doing so well this was an absurb thing to want to do! I couldn't believe the extent he would go to to keep me away from OW!<P>I end up so angry, I just can't speak to him. Of course I can't tell him what I was told but I know he knew I knew way more than he thought I did. The next morning and yesterday I just could even look at him let alone speak to him.<P>He gets home tonight and says we need to get this out in the open. I tell him if he had nothing to hide and all they have is a bussiness relationship there should be no porblem with me being at the bussiness. He says she couldn't handle it, it is all she has left in her life, since she no longer has him. I tell him we will not make it as long as she is still in the picture. He tells me I have nothing to worry about. That she has to be around for awhile longer and that I just have to have blind faith in him. He says he can't just throw her out because of his guilt of taking the past 14 years of her life, her money and he feels responsible for her quiting the job she had when she quit because he left her to return to me. I tell him, because he has not been truthful with me as recent as a few moths ago, I can not have blind faith in him. I tell him he will have to do somethings for me to begin to trust him again.He agreed and said he can compromise. I told him he needs to stop talking to her on his cell expect for bussiness reason(they are on the phone with each other about 1200 minutes a month, besides working together). He said the time talking is getting less and I will check it every month. I plan on telling him he also needs to call me every morning when he gets into work, from the bussiness phone, not his cell phone, so I know he is actually at work, and not at her house. I need to think of some other things I need him to do to regain any shread of trust from me. Anyone have any suggestions?<P>The really difficult part of all of this is when he is at home he is WONDERFULL! He does nice little things for me, like leaving a rose on my car window this past Monday and cooking for me when I was sick last week to showering me compliments and attention. When is here he is dang near perfect as a spouse! But, no matter how perfect he is when he is with me, I will NOT share him with an OW.<P>So, he wants blind faith. I want to hire a PI to trail him for a week.<P>As much as I want to believe him I don't. I need to know the truth. Am I crazy for wanting to know the truth of what is going on more than I want to keep my head in the sand and save my marriage? <P>I guess I'm getting tired of all the lies, BS, etc. I am prepared to confront him with anything I find out from a PI and am also well aware that would be a big enough LB to send him running back to OW who is waiting in the wings, so to speak. But you know what? I'd rather not be married if I have to be married to someone who values me so little they could continue an affair after they know how it has hurt me and his children.<P>So unless someone with greater wisdom can convince me, I guess I will go with the private eye and not the blind faith.<P>Any responces would be very much appreciated. And I know it's the weekend and less people are posting. Why does my life consistently fall apart on Fri, Sat., or Sun.????<P>FC<P>

FC-<BR>Let me preface my response by saying I am truly sorry for all that you have endured in your marriage and pray that you will continue to gain strength daily. <P>What concerns me most is your H unwillingness to CUT ties with the OW. I understand that they are in business together, but...this can be kept to a minimum. I feel strongly that in order for two people to jointly work through the issues of infidelity, they need to be willing to remove anything that causes them to stumble or gives SP a reason to question. Trust is something that can be restored in a marriage. Your H is asking you to have blind faith. My first question is, how blind does he want you to be? Then I ask you- is he wanting to live two seperate lives? Have his cake and eat it too? <P>As for a PI? Do you really need to go to the expense? I think you already know the answer to the questions that you have. Ask yourself what it is that you want. What are your EN and how is your H meeting them. He surely is a great guy for leaving you a rose on your windshield, cooking for you when you were not well. BUT....(the big "B") How "GREAT" is this guys that he is not willing to welcome you into the part of his life...that includes the OW. It could be that he is trying to protect you. I question that. Write on a piece of paper what your emotional needs are, then which ones he is meeting. What obsticals do you see present that inhibit him from meeting your EN. Then communicate them. (You may have already done this.)<P>You are correct, major LB if you hire the PI. I cannot tell you with good concience to hire a PI. I have a very strong faith and when Iam faced with issues that I cannot truthfully answer, I ask God to help me know the right thing to do. "Trust in the Lord with all thy heart, lean not unto they own understanding." I promise you, if you ask him for his guidance...remember it may not be what you want to hear...he will show you the way. "Rejoice" in all things...perhaps this is the biggest test you will encounter...have faith! I will keep you in my prayers.<P>Rejoice <BR>

FC,<P>An hour or so after he is supposed to be at work, could you show up there and wait for him? Could you wait for him outside the OW's house? <P>What would happen if you absolutely insisted that you start working in his business?

Fc,<BR>Seems like you are not talking normal affair anymore, but more of a parellel mariage situation. I think you need to think hard and deciede what you can live with. If you can continue like this with him being pleasant and a good husband you will have to have the OW in your life too. If you can not tolerate that I dont think more Plan A will make him make any kind of a change.<P>If you decide to play hard ball, I think you should go all the way including getting proof and info on how much of your marital assests ar invested in that business. A good plan B moving into a divorce for half his assests may wake him up a little.<P>We do know for some reason that their affair does not work without you in the picture too. Do you know why that might be? Maybe she does not really want a full time commitment, does not like having him around the house where she has to put up with taking care of him, or maybe you provide him with some of his needs or he is afraid to make a move or thinks he will loose financially. I dont mean to leave out that he may love you both and be unable to make a choice.<P>But it is now up to you to deciede what you can live with. He will not give her up by you working at the business, or confronting him or making it just a little harder for him to see her... they will find a way.<P>Good luck, I hope you can make your way through this mess. (((Hugs)))<BR>Lora<p>[This message has been edited by Lora (edited February 10, 2001).]

~Fingers~<P>I'm so sorry for your pain..... unbelievable.<P>Your H has two wives (sorry, it's true). He feels as much loyalty to "her" as he does to you. (He's a schmuck!)<P>Do you need a PI? Perhaps ...... I was thinking that a smarter, more logical approach would be to seek an attorneys opinion. Your financial risks are VERY high here. <P>See an attorney ..... ask the attorney if you need a PI (more to investigate the financial holdings than to prove an affair).<P>YOU already know the ugly truth ..... it's too painful for you to face ..... she will never be out of his life. I'm so sorry.<P>------------------<BR>~*~*Yesterday~*~*<BR>all my problems seemed so far away~*<p>[This message has been edited by Yesterday (edited February 10, 2001).]

FC you wrote:<BR>"He says she couldn't handle it, it is all she has left in her life, since she no longer has him. I tell him we will not make it as long as she is still in the picture. He tells me I have nothing to worry about. That she has to be around for awhile longer and that I just have to have blind faith in him. He says he can't just throw her out because of his guilt of taking the past 14 years of her life, her money and he feels responsible for her quiting the job "<P>He's not figuring you into this at all. He is stating clearly that her state of mind is more important to him than yours is. You should be "benefitting" from his guilt, not her. She chose to do a MM for 8 years...she's not a victim.<P>Quite honestly, I don't see how any of you can consider the affair over..."Honey, sweetie, dear, just checking in..." He may be treating you better, but she is definitely a part of his life--and he is telling you that isn't going to change real soon.<P>Where does he say he is from 8am to noon? Or is that part of the info you received that you can't reveal?<P>I'm so sorry you are still in the midst of this. You know he is lying to you, you're assuming he's at work...he is not, and even when he is, so is she. Does he talk to you 1200 minutes a month?

Hi FC,<P>I am sorry for the pain you are continuing to endure. Everything that has been mentioned above is right- this man has two wives! Unbelievable!<P>I absolutely think the PI is the right thing to do. In your heart, you KNOW the affair is still going on. What the "friend" told you is further proof of it (but if he was really a friend he would have told you sooner).<P>But you need EVIDENCE. I know you want to believe your husband, but HE IS LYING TO YOU. You need the best PI AND ATTORNEY that you can find. If you have lived with this for four years and for fourteen years, you can play it cool for another two months and get things in order. GET THE ABSOLUTE TRUTH, and you will NOT get if from your husband. It is essential for you to know what you are dealing with. You need the power to BE in control instead of BEING controlled.<P>Once you find the truth, you can decide if you want to give him the opportunity to REALLY be married to you, or you want to take your fair share of everything (including the business he and OW are using to continue their relationship), regain some self-respect, and start a new life without this man. YOU CAN DO THIS!<P>If I have doubts for one minute that my husband is being unfaithful again, this is EXACTLY what I will do. Please consider it.<P>Peppermint

Rejoice<P>He said in our converstaion, last night, all I need to be concerned with is what goes on between H me and the children. Nothing else should matter and he intends to do what ever he has to do do make a living for his family. <P>How blind does he want me to be? Totally blind when it comes to anything outside of our marriage. <P>I have no doubt he wants to live two seperate lives, and that is what he has been doing for many years and is still doing. <P>My reason for the PI is my H is the kind of man that unless you have unrefutable proof, in his face,he will talk his way out of the accusation. You know the kind that would say even if you catch him in bed with an OW just keep denying as you put on your clothes and walk out. Without actual proof I will never get him to admitt to what he is doing. And for some reason I want and need him to admitt it to me. Yes it isn't cheap but I feel it is well worth the investment. He has tried to convince me sooooo many time I'm making stuff up in my head that this final time I want him to eat those words.<P>One of my biggest EN is honesty from him and he already knows that but has ignored it even though I have told him how important it is to me. I just don't think he is capable of telling the truth. He has had a problem with telling the truth since he was a child from what I understand. Another of my ENs is to have my H as only MY H. He knows this to, and ignores it as well. Another one of my BIGGEST ENs is security in my marriage and the need to know my H will be there at my side in my golden years. That one doesn't look too promising either, does it? I guess there are others, it's just that I have been so involved in meeting his ENs, for the past 4 years, that I haven't paid attention to mine unless he hasn't been meeting them. Thanks for the idea of making the list, it may help.<P>I know hiring a PI isn't the best thing for a BS to do. Especially one that wants to keep their marriage. But, I only want the marriage if there are only 2 people in it, him and me. If he expects or wants to have OW in his life, then it is time for me force his hand. <P>And I say force his hand because I will NOT file for divorce. I will not throw him out. He will have to do all of that. I have given him every opportunity to make things work. I have done way more than most BSs would have done to get back and repair their marriage. I will NOT be the one that my daughters go to, as adults, and ask why I ended the marriage, why did I not give their dad every chance to be a husband and father. <P>Yes I look to the Lord for answers. I think the Lord has answwered me, this time, by helping me realize my tollerance for a 3 person marriage is at its end.<P>Thanks for your reply, Rejoice. <P>Nellie<P>Yes, I could do either of those things, but they will cause a scene at in public, and I want this to be entirely between H and me. <P>I'm not sure what he would do if I insisted or just showed up come Monday morning at the bussiness. Probably a big scene. I do know she is an integral part of the bussiness and if she leaves the bussiness is so fragile right now it would certainly fold.And if I go there she will leave the bussiness. <P>Last night he also told me that what he has been doing is climbing a ladder one rung at a time to get out of all of this mess. And when I am happy and supportive he is making progress, but when I am miserable and things aren't right at home with me he falls off the ladder and has to start climbing up from the bottm again. I know it's add way to think, but he has told me this many times in the past.<P>Thanks, Nellie. <P>Lora<P>I think you hit the nail on the head. I too look at him as having too wives. He even told me he lets her order him around at the bussiness, although he says it's out of guilt and the desire for her to NOT take her own life, he says she has been emotionaly unbalanced sine he left her again last June. He is a VERY macho type of guy and has never let any woman order him around before.<P>I also agree no more Plan Aing will end his affair. Not that I'm LBing all over the place, because I'm not a LBer by nature anyway.<P>The PI will be the spring board to the game of hard ball in all of this. I had hired an attorney when this all started close to 4 years ago. The guy is a hard nosed lawyer that takes great pride in his work. I never pulled my retainer back from him, even though H moved back home, as I have never really believed or trusted much of what my H has said since this all started.<P>There is a problem with the assests. He told me the bussines is in her name. She set it up that way in case we divorce. I'll get none of the bussiness. But that isn't that bad. You see I have enough information on his dealings in bussiness (over many years) and with government agencies that he will hand over all of our personal assests and support me and our children as long as we need him to or his only contact with OW will be on visting day and through a glass window on the other end of a phone. <P>Interesting question about why the affair doesn't work without me in the picture. Basically my H's life deosn't work without me in it. I guess it doesn't work without OW either. One real concern I have about all of this is there is a distinct possibilty that my H will commit suicide if I force his hand. He tried it to kill himself when his first fiancee dumped him years before I met him. The guy who he fired that spilled his guts to me happens to be first finacee's brother. He even told me he thinks I need to check H's insurance benifits before I lower the boom, as offing himself maybe his only way out of the pain. I don't want that to happen but I am not willing to sacrafice the rest of my life to missery to keep him from killing himself.<P>I know OW never faltered in her attempt to be perfect and take care of my H. She wanted him to marry her. H told me this. He also told me she could do all of that but if he didn't love her and loved me no amount of pampering could keep him living with her and away from me, and I do believe that. You see I have kids at home. She doesn't. She lived and breathed to do for him. I have more than just him to be responsible for. I have prided myself in being a great mom, and the last thing my kids need now is for their mom to ignore them and be up the butt, all the time, of the man they only tollerate in their lives at this point.<P>I agree he will not give her up by me working at the bussiness, it will just drive them further underground, if they could even get any further at this point. So the only way to end the affair or the marriage is to show him proof of my knowledge and tell him to pick one once and for all. He would have to do the whole no contact thing that he ignored when I brought it up when he moved back last June, make him 100% accountable for every minute he isn't next to me, have detailed cellphone bills sent to the house, etc. Of course I doubt he'd ever agree to any of that.<P>Thanks for your insight, Lora. You are pretty much on the money about it all. Now all I have left to do is play it all out. <P>Yesterday<P>Thanks for your kind words and sympathy. You are right, like Lora, in that he basically has two wives. But I will not accept that any longer. He can deny till he is blue in the face. But I will give him enough proof that his denying is as empty as the promises he made to me.<P>Another thing he said to me last night was about one of his bussiness associates. I have known all along the guy is Italain and well connected, if you know what I mean. He has had a marriage of for over 30 years and a mistress for at least 20. He earns his living in an, let's just say, unique manner. H said last night this guys wife just had to learn to have blind faith in her H. That is what he wants me to do, as it will be best for everyone concerned. I guess what he really meant is it will be best for *him*, and apparently if everyone doesn't put his needs above everyone elses, including their own, they just don't cut the mustard with my H. :: <P>Thanks again too all who responded, so far!<P>FC<P>

Lor<P>I agree the affair is still going strong. I did tell him I feel he is more concerned about her feelings in all of this than mine. His answer was she has nothing he took everything form her and I have him. He also said last night this whole thing is HIS fault and that she can't be faulted because he led her to believe he was living me regadless of her. I told him while that may be true she still is guilty of being involved with a MM with two children and he agreed with that.<P>Yes, the accountable morning time is what I learned from our friend. That is why I want to hire a PI. That way I can confront him with it without breaking my friends confidence.<P>I told him he doesn't talk to me and the kids together for 1200 in one month, but manages to have that much to say to her. He says she calls him and whines about how he destroyed her life. Of course the messahe I heard with my own two ears with her calling him honey and just checking in doesn't back that up. But I can't let him know I heard that because thenhe would know I vroke his cell phone mail password.<P>I agree the whole thing is a loose loose situation for me. He is either with her at work or with her elsewhere. I feel like I have been rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. I guess it's time for me to find a life boat and hop in asap.<P>Thanks Lor<P>Peppermint<P>I agree with everything you have said, as well.<P>As for the friend. He had to get pretty pie eyed to even call me. He said he hadn't called earlier because he just didn't want to be the one to tell me. He said his long time g/f convinced him it was the right thing to do. He kept appologizing for hurting me and I just kept telling him he did the best thing he could have done for me as a true friend. Isn't it funny how men and women see something like this so differently?<P>I guess I'll be calling the PI first thing Mon morning. You know it's odd how things happen in my life. Just yesterday there was an article in the local paper about a PI who does a lot of work for suspicious spouses, right in my area! Coincidence? I think not.Too many things just seem to fall in my lap at the right time. Perhaps God is a bit more new millenium then I gave him credit for. <P>As for the attorney, I'll call him after I see any evidence the PI hands over. But before I lay it on the table with my H.<P>I have not only considered your advice, Pepperment I am taking it, along with a lot of what others have said. <P>Yes, I am strong. I will make it. I just never thought after going through all of this I would end up without my husband. Well looks like there will be another 50 year old single woman out there starting her life over at ground zero. And to think I had the opportunity at 46 to start over, and threw it away and instead put trust and faith into a man who didn't deserve the time of day from me. What a fool I have been. <P>Thanks again to you and Lor.<P>FC<BR>

Hiring a PI & snooping is NOT a Lovebuster. In fact, if you read on this very site, Dr.Harley is FOR snooping!<P>Your H is taking advantage of you...using family money, playing with your emotions for many many years. You need to put a stop to this nonsense.<P>Your H is crazy if he thinks that you should trust him. He is only fooling himself. He is asking you to have "blind" trust in him, because he knows that what he is doing is wrong. He knows it! He just doesn't want to get caught!<P>The OW is NOT a victim here. She is a willing participant. Remember that! Your H needs to realize that, but he is in so much denial, that he believes his own lies!<P>You know what you need to do to get your life back in order. Don't allowing your H to treat you like this.<P>Good luck!

Hi FC,<P> Get yourself an attorney and a good one ASAP....you are being played big time. The main thing to be concerned about is you and your children.....find an attorney who will dig , it wouldn't surprise me if there are hidden assets.....You need to take your time and like someone else said ,don't rush it, get things lined up .. <BR> <BR> ((((((Fingers Crossed))))) LU

Survivor<P>I couldn't agree more with you. This nonsence will stop as soon as I have all my ducks in a row.<P>I know Harley believes in snooping. It's just that it is a REAL big LB in my H's book, gee I wonder why? LOL<P>He doesn't just want blind trust from me he wants me to be toatlly blind to all his actions. Well, he's not going to get it much longer. I will put on a nice show for the time being but it will all hit the fan in just a short matter of time.<P>You are so right about him. He no longer has any shread of an idea about what the truth is. I guess when you have been a liar all of your life you eventually buy into your own decpetions.<P>I will not continue to be treated this way. I know I deserve more, or at least deserve an entire man in my life and not just half of one.<P>Thanks for your support<P>Lu<P>I agree. I have an excellent attorney that already has a whole bunch of info on H and if he lies or falseifies any info my attorney will have him by the short hairs pronto! This attorney, the last time we spoke, had suggested a froensic accountant to go over H's entire finacial holdings. And because of the adultery OWs finacials can be investigated in the same manner. The way the attorney put it was, "We'll stick a microscope so far up his a$$ that he may never sit right again. Not to mention the Alienation of Affections law is still on the books in the state I live in. I might even pursue that.<P>And don't worry about me rushing things. My patience and tolerance levels are way up there! In fact I may end up enjoying leading him to believe I am falling for all the lies and treating him like the king he thinks he is, while all along plotting the biggest kick in the gut he has ever had. I know that sounds pretty nasty, but you know what they about Karma. <P>My biggest concern is really my kids. They have had 4 years of hell because of their father. He has literally taken most of the fun out of our oldest daughters high school years. He has destroyed our youngests middle school and high school years too. But they take after me and they'll be survivors like their mom. <P>One thing I know for sure is after it's all over I will not just be gone from this marriage but gone from this state. The girls and I will relocate to Southern California, and live out our lives in the sun and away from the dark cloud my H, their father, has hung over our lives for way too long. <P>Now the oldest was just accepted at Purdue, U of I, Ohio State, Michigan and Northwestern. I just hope she will be willing to transfer to UCLA, USC, or Berkley for her 2nd year, as I don't want her to be too far away from me! And based on how he ignored his kids when he lived with OW in the past he wouldn't have any time for her and she certainly wouldn't have anything to do with him if she had to even be in the same house as OW.<P>Don't get me wrong, he can see his kids any time he is willing to come to them, providing the kids even will consider speaking to him after they find out exactly how he has decieved us all. And yes, they will be told the truth.<P>Thanks again Lu.<P>I just feel so much love, support and carring here at MB, I could just cry.<P>FC<P>

{{{Fingers Crossed}}},<P>Enough...<P>You've gotten the best advice you can.<P>You need to <B>protect</B> yourself legally (and/or financially)... I usually make the recommendation of finding a <B>good</B> attorney. A good place to start off is at the <A HREF="http://lawyers.martindale.com/marhub/form/by.html" TARGET=_blank>Martindale-Hubbell Lawyer Search</A> site. Do a search within your county... look for only "family law" specialists(>80% in divorce/custody/etc.)... make sure they do a lot of "family law committee work"... if they know the judges all the better... You can normally find a few that will give initial counseling free of charge.<BR><A HREF="http://www.uslaw.com" TARGET=_blank>USLaw.com</A> (an alternative search site)<P> <P>Jim

FC:<P>As I was reading, I was going to suggest that you get a forensic atty ASAP - but I see your lawyer is advising the same thing. You could be held legally responsible for your husband's business - you are treading in dangerous waters!<P>It isn't a LB to protect yourself legally. I'm with everyone else, get a PI and get on the phone with your lawyer. <P>((hugs))

NSR!!!!<P>Jim, it is so good to hear a responce from you. You were the first one to reply to me when I found MBs and will always value your advive, support and guidance.<P>Your'e right, as always. Enough is enough.<P>I will check out the site you have reccomended for lawyers. Just in case the one I have on retainer doesn't end up being as good as I think he is.<P>Hugs to you Jim!<P>PS If you ever are in the Chicago area again let me know. I'd enjoy having a cup of java with ya!<P>Bramblerose<P>Thanks for your support. Yep a forensic accountant is needed in my situation. Wait until he finds out how much this is going to cost him in the end. Loosing his family and so many of his assets is going to throw him for the biggest loop of his life.<P>I am not very worried about being held accountable for his bussiness dealings as my attorney assured me before I fall under the innocent spouse catagory. The goverment could take a lot of our assets but only H would end up behind bars. But as long as he agrees to my demands he can live his life out missing me and his children with OW trying to sooth his broken heart as a free man. Or as free as a man, who makes such bad decisions in life, can be. <P>If we would have made it we would have been celebrating our 23rd wedding anniversary this coming June. He still has no idea how much he will be giving up. And if he ever does, it will be too late. Infact it's probably too late right now.<P>Thanks again<P>FC<P>

FC,<P>You are such a strong person! Your strength just beams from your Post!<P>I love ya! Stay strong!<BR>Survivor

I am known for going against the "tide" of opinions. And, for the most part, I agree with EVERYTHING said here, but something is bothering me...<P>You said, "A long time friend of ours was working for H. Well, he got fired on Mon. So on Wed he calls me and spills his guts about what he knows."<P>Is it just me, or does it seem like there could be a possibility that this guy might think he had some justification to make up some of the "facts"? People who get fired could be vengeful... Vengeful enough, even, to lie.<P>FC, I am NOT saying that is the case here, but it bothers me. The other thing that bothers me is this: You know things about his business dealings - we won't go into what they are, but you know things. Perhaps OW ALSO knows things. Perhaps some of what he is telling you is the truth, that it is because of OW that he keeps her in the business. How about this slant on things? "You want your wife? FINE. Stay with her, but we'll play the rest of this game MY way, or I'll make sure that you spend a lot of time behind barbed wire..."<P>And one last thing that concerns me: You - your safety in this. If your H has the kind of business acquaintances that I think you are saying he has, I would worry about you. And if OW is as big of a fruitcake as it sounds like she is, I worry about you. Keep yourself safe... If you hire a PI, make sure it's a good one... someone with lots of experience - you don't need a mistake on the part of the PI to endanger you.<P>:: I was so hoping that his return was true, because it was the RIGHT ending for your story. And, I guess it is the eternal optimist in me that continues to hope that most of what he is telling you is the truth.<P>Is your husband Italian? Mine is. Not very "well connected" in THAT respect, but very "Italian" in many respects. If he decided to come back to me in the future, I truly believe that he would consider all of the "details" of the affair and/or break up of it (I am SURE that there will be a break up of it ... not as sure that he will want me at that point, but ... well, that's a whole 'nother issue) as "none of my business" just as he considered it "not their place" (his friends) to tell me about the affair. If your husband has any of those same characteristics, he may truly believe that you don't need to know the "whys" and "hows" - just what the end result is or is going to be. Just another thought.<P>I'll quit while I'm ahead. PLEASE keep us posted ... do you have my email address?<P>------------------<BR>terri<BR><B>Courage</B><P>Whatever course you decide upon,<BR>there is always someone to tell you<BR>that you are wrong.<P>There are always difficulties arising<BR>which tempt you to believe that your <BR>critics are right.<P>To map out a course of action <BR>and follow it to an end <BR>requires courage.<P><I>Ralph Waldo Emerson</I>

FC,<P>I strongly concur with Terri's take on this. Is your H with the OW out of "love" - or fear? I remember your posts about her, and from what I know, she seems like a pretty ugly customer. Perhaps the kind to threaten to hurt your H - or even you or your children - if he stopped seeing her.<P>My concern would be getting you into a position of safety. If your H is so indebted to this OW that he has to worry about getting hurt (which is what I think, reading beween the lines), then perhaps you should move on and protect yourself and your children. <P>I also think that getting a P.I. might be a good idea at this point.<P>belld

FC,<P>If you do go the PI route used all the previous PI advice and make sure you identify (tag) your husband in person with the PI. Also agree upon the form of evidence (pictures, video, audio) before you agree to hire the PI. <P>Good luck,<BR>Mike<BR>

FC,<P>I asked you to give me an outline of your story on my thread, but you needn't do that now I have just read it all here. Where on earth have you found the patience to go on all these years?<P>Don't bother with the PI, save yourself the money. You are already seem to know pretty much everything that is going on. As to the financial ins and outs, if you decide to take that road, all the dirt will come out in the wash when you have your date in court. <P>The only other thing that has struck me, and I may well be barking up the wrong tree here, but it sounds as if the OW may be using emotional and finacial blackmail to keep the affair going. The guy has a lot to lose emotionally - you and his children, and financially the business seems to be tied up with her connections and her money. <P>What line of work is he in? Is it something that would allow him to move (preferably to another state)? If he decided to leave the business how much of his investment can he get out of it? <P>I'll bet she has been giving him a really bad time since he came back to you 8 months ago. <P>If it were me I might do some indirect snooping. Why don't you ask if there is any paperwork maybe you could help with and if he isn't happy about you being in the office suggest you do it at home. He can bring it home, you can do it and take copies of anything you think you attorney might like to look at, and return it to him with a smile. <P>Hope