This thread really has me thinking today. This post is more about me sorting things out for myself then anything else. I do appreciate any of you who take the time to read this and respond. You have all helped me here today. My husband's posts have been good food for thought for me too. <P>Since reading "Surviving an Affair" and the other Harley books, my husband and I have spent countless hours talking about our relationship, his affairs, and our needs. We have examined each of our contributions to both the good parts and the bad parts of our relationship. This reflection has brought us closer. We now have a better relationship then we did two months ago when I discovered the affairs. We have both been in a lot of pain over the affairs. But we are now on the right path. The pain will heal given time. One side affect of this is that we have become each other’s confidants in a much deeper way then before. I know that many people would not understand this, but I do know that the people here on MB’s will.<P>Sheba, you hit a few things on the head. It was “the contribution of my husband's divorce and my unwillingness to look at things that were amiss.” The only doubts I had about our engagement and marriage were based on my concerns that our relationship started as a long-distance one and whether or not he had healed sufficiently from his divorce.<P>As for your question about why he is divorced. He is divorced because his ex left him for another man. Why did she leave him? After 14 years of marriage they were not meeting each other's ENs and did not have the skills to repair the marriage. That's the short story but the crux of it. I do know both sides of the story. His ex has made sure that I know her side. There was no mention of him having affairs or being either physically or emotionally abusive. Believe me she would have told me if there were. <P>I do believe that my husband's "needs" were "still a bit askew from his previous marriage". That a good part of his being with other women, so many women, had more to do with him healing from his previous marriage then they had to do with our relationship. I think he was trying to come to terms with the fact that he is still a lovable and attractive man after his wife’s affairs. Like so many men, he keeps his feelings close - this inhibits healing. Before becoming engaged and marrying, we discussed his marriage, divorce and healing at length. He seemed to be doing fine. In all of this discussion he had ample opportunity to tell me - hey by the way, I'm dating other women and am not ready to give that up. During these discussions I even asked him outright about any other relationships. He reassured me that I was the only one.<P>When we first started to date and during our engagement my husband lived in MD and I lived in NM. We became engaged in 3/1999 and married in 6/2000. He and his children moved to NM in 7/2000. We both knew that long distance relationships were a big risk. Discussed it at length and agreed that we would do whatever it took to make this work. We took extraordinary measures to make sure things worked. We talked on the phone and in chat daily. Shoot we cleaned house together – on the phone – every weekend. (I had Sprint’s “Unlimited Weekend Calling for $25” deal. I think I’m the reason they no longer offer the deal – lol.) We visited each other twice a month for long weekends and as many week long visits as we could fit in. We involved each other in our daily lives, making daily decisions, dealing with our respective children. We emailed each other at work daily. So on and so forth.<P>And again, Sheba, you got it right with this…… “Maybe you are meant to be evaluating your own character assessment skills, observation skills, communication skills, etc......”<P>There were a few times when I got odd feelings about things. Each time I asked him and he reassured me that all was ok. Each time he assured me that everything was OK. That if there were a problem he would tell me. For the most part, when he was in MD, I was not there to see/feel what was going on. For instance, he came out to NM in 6/2000 to get married. He returned to MD the next week to pack his house and move to NM. What he did not mention to me is that he had a date already set up for the next weekend. He spent it, in a hotel, with another woman. He told me that he was invited to a friend’s house on the bay for a good-bye party. That he'd spend the night there so that he did not have to drive the 1.5 hours home after drinking. My gut said “what?” and my head said “Go have a good time. Enjoy your friends.” I have found out since we started discussing all of this, that each time I had a weird “vibe” I had been picking up on something real – even at the a distance. I let him reassure me that all was ok. So I discounted my gut feelings. <P>When he moved to NM last July he took a job that requires him to travel about 1/3 of the time. Since he moved here, most of his activities with other women were done when he was on travel. There was a lot that I could not see. However, eventually I found out about his affairs because I was picking up more and more things that were not right. <P>I have been working with my counselor on my tendency to discount my reactions when I feel that something is amiss. I actually have very good instincts but discount my reaction.<P>It may seem odd for me to say this… but I still think I married a “good man”. I believe that even the best of us can make some pretty stupid and hurtful choices under certain circumstances. Only time will tell if I’m right about this. With the help of the MB philosophy and the support of this web site I’m willing to give our marriage and my husband the time to find out if I’m right. I still love him very deeply and respect him. If I had to pick someone to go through this type of mess with, he’d be it. Recovery will take time. It will take me time to learn to trust him again. Marriage is a work of art in progress.<P>Even in the best marriages, each spouses’ needs are not met all of the time. If unmet needs are the only cause for affairs, then why did we both not have affair? My husband may have had needs that were not met. Needs that he did not tell me about. But I also had needs that were not met. And I did tell him about some of these (such as a need for recreational companionship) – but he chose not to meet them. So why did he have the affairs and not me? Because each of us made a personal choice based on our life circumstances, level of commitment to our relationship, and who knows what else. Under different circumstances I may have had the affair(s) – though I like to believe that I would never do this to the man I love. I am becoming very afraid to say that I would never do such a thing. I am afraid that as soon as I say it, the Good Lord will make sure that I get the opportunity to eat some humble pie.<P>So you can see that I do take responsibility for my part of the current state of our marriage. However, I do not take blame or responsibility for his affairs. The MB approach is not about blame "... it's about self reflection, spouse reflection and the reflection of the marital atmosphere and behaviors of both parties. It is not just one factor that we all are dealing with. ... but rather an accumulation of many!!!”<P> My husband and I are here at MB to reclaim our marriage. To do the work to make it what we wanted it to be from day one. People always say that marriage is hard work. Yet, until we found Dr. Harley’s books we did not know what work we were supposed to do. Without the knowledge and skills, our relationship was doomed. We know that now. But we have been given the gift of another chance. This is the third marriage for both of us. We both want to have a good marriage. Neither of us wants to go through the pain of divorce again. We are aware that second and third marriages have a very high failure rate. I married my husband with a lot of blind faith and only after a lot of praying. I do believe that my prayers are being answered. The answer is a lot more painful then I ever expected… but if this is the worst of it, it is worth a long, happy marriage.<P>I am here to “Survive an Affair” and “AFFAIR PROOF YOUR MARRIAGE”. <P>Z

Whew...I guess iI honestly expected this to become a hornets nest thread...<P>I think I have all my BS's and WS's ironed out...<P>Pepperment, you made me go back and see how I wrote my original post to this thread, and I can see how it was construed to make it appear the BS's are to blame...Again that wasn't my intent...<P>For the last time I reitterate once more that the WS is ultimately the one to make the <B>choice</B>.<P>For the record...The WS <B><I>contributed</I></B> in creating an enviroment in which their spouce <B><I>could</I></B> have an affair...<P>Maybe I am being to harsh on the newcommers, but all I know is tough love. Sorry if I seem crass. I did tell themselves to give themselves a break and I do totaly empathise with the raw feelings....I remember the agonizing pain!<P>My whole point with the out of the blue comment was in no way a negative connotation to Sheryl'sthread...please see my reply to it...It is a very harsh generalisation to the the new touchy feely aspect this board has taken on....That scares hell out of me...As someone that has a basic understanding of MB principles it is incumbent on me to give back what was given freely to me...<P>Learning Lovebusters and how I drained my exes Lovebank and how LRB filled it by meeting her Emotional Needs, is paramount to my recovery...This is the point I am failing to get across...I contributed to my exes need for having an affair...It was her choice to have it!!!<P>My only hope is that all the BSon this board learn to figure out their part in the creating of the situation...Not to take responcibility for the WS's actions...Can I make this any clearer??<P>Now with that said <P>You all know I love each of you and I am glad you're in my life, because you helped save it <P>Bill<p>[This message has been edited by WilliamJ (edited May 19, 2001).]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WilliamJ:<BR><B><BR>I think I have all my BS's and WS's ironed out...<P>... make it appear the WS's are to blame...Again that wasn't my intent...<P>For the last time I reitterate once more that the BS is ultimately the one </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Not quite sweetie... isn't this backwards? <P>WS= Wayward, BS= Betrayed... right? <P>Sometimes I get it all backassward too!! <P><p>[This message has been edited by Nyneve (edited May 19, 2001).]

Dammit I did it again LOL LOL LOL<P>I hope I got it staight now LOL

Bill, <P>I found that board about two weeks ago - so I'm relatively new here. Even I can see what you are saying about much of the posting here not following the MB philosphies, that their are a lot of knee-jerk reaction postings. This concerns me too. I know I need guidance, that's why I'm here. It's just that it is not easy to tell who has the right MB perspective and who is just giving opinion. <P>Thanks for caring enough to be here<BR>Z