Bernzini:<P>Having been in the military, you have legitimate concerns. It comes down to trust, and I can understand where that commodity is currently in short supply.<P>Not much, advice-wise, to give you here, except to say I understand and sympathize.<P>This is the problem all military spouses must face. Over the years I have seen it destroy many marriages (the divorce rate in the military is substantially higher than the civilian world ... a frightening thought, as the divorce rate in society is already way too high). However, I have seen good marriages, too.<P>Keep the faith, B.<P>Godspeed and good luck,<BR>STL

Bernzini,<P>I know you don't want to lose your H again, but, as difficult as it is to handle, you really have no control over that. All you can do is be true to yourself and be the best person (and Wife and Mom) you can be. And then, his choices belong to him. I can only imagine how horrible it must be to imagine all that he might be doing while he is on duty. But, do you really have any control over that? Can you control his choices? No, you can't. You can only control your own. He might truly recommit to your marriage and, as STL said, be one of those strong military marriages. On the other hand, he might not. Yes, he might not. And, do you know what? Ultimately, no amount of Marriage Building, Tough Love, Divorce Busting, Standing, or whatever will change that if that is his choice.<P>When something affects so profoundly, it is very, very hard to realize that we have no control over it, that something which has the power to devasate us so thoroughly could be completely beyond our control. But, sometimes that is the case. It's just one of those facts of life.<P>Try to turn some of the energy you are expending on obsessing over what he will or will not do to yourself and your child. It is a far better and productive use of it. I know it's hard to do. And, although I've never posted here prior to my now infamous thread, I've been reading for a long time. I can't be of much help to you, obviously. But, I have been truly touched by the amount of caring that is given here. So, just keep tapping into this source. And, stay focused on what you CAN control, not on what you can't. Hang tough.<P>JAL

JustAlurker believes, "And, like it or no, sex is the main path to intimacy between a man or a woman."<P>SO NOT TRUE! Actually, prayer is the main path to true intimacy between a man and woman...<P>Sex, ecstasy, and offspring were all the extra special gifts that came along with God's original idea of marriage from the very beginning. But first, He created man for relationship with HIM.<P>Selfishness is the opposite of love. When the level of lust is so strong that it overrides the voice of conscience and violates your mate's, then there is a problem with the person's character.<P>If something is right, we don't question it. Only when something violates our conscience do we question and wonder if it is right or wrong. When it's right, we know it in our knower. We don't have to ask anyone about anything.<P>JustAlurker has been an OW for NINE years? Ya gotta admit, this IS the voice of experience talking! (Yikes!) <P><BR>

BTDT,<P>I was incorrect make such a blanket statement. I would amend it to say that sex is an extremely important path to intimacy (only one of several) between a man and a woman. I think this is obvious. Your spiritual beliefs may tell you that prayer is the main path to intimacy. Please keep in mind that not everyone in the world shares your spiritual beliefs. If they work for you, wonderful.<P>I have never posted nor has anyone asked why I have chosen not to marry my partner or why he has chosen not to divorce. You would be wrong to assume that I am not proactive in my choice to remain unmarried. Not everyone needs to be married or even to cohabit (I do neither for reasons I have not shared but which are important to me) in order to have a fulfilling, committed relationship.<P>JAL

Don't you LIE to these people! <P>Love is the bond between a MARRIED couple. It is mutual and leads to more intimacy. There is no "Top" or "Bottom." Sex is an integral part of MARRIED Love. God loves sex. His first command to Adam and Eve was: "Go forth and multiply." That means that Mom and Dad made babies BEFORE the World knew sin.<P>Lust takes many forms. It is exploitative and secretive. It leads to separation and mistrust. Sex is an integral part of sexual lust. Lust is a cancer that empties out our soul. It expands our souls like a balloon. We become without substance.<P>A lust-full person may seek many objects other than sex. Money, Power, Ambition and Art are just a few.<P>I offer to you the chance to step out of the cycle. I know what you are going through.

Why he has chosen not to divorce? How nice of him to make that choice for his W! You speak like she is a non-entity; she does have choice in this matter. Hopefully she will divorce him she certainly has grounds. Has it ever occurred to you & your whatever that she may meet someone and want to marry him at some point? Making life decisions for other people is truly the epitome of selfishness. The thought that she contines to have any ties to him at all is truly disgusting! You and he are beyond help but I hope that she is getting some kind of professional guidance. Hopefully there are no minor children involved here.<P>

Jal,<P>All this talk about your choice and stuff. So I ask the question again. You mentioned about your being a 'good mother' and all. How are you going to explain your life choices to your children? Are you setting an example you are proud that they follow? <P>By the way, I was going to ask why your OM has not chosen to divorce. You make it sound like marriage is not important to you, then what is? These people that live together what are they doing different or better than those who are married? Do you actually know the purpose of being married? Maybe that is the point that we need to go back to. <P>You are advocating a lifestyle very different from the consensus here. You have that right. However, you are also advocating harmful results to not only those here but the future generations (your offspring). It is as if you are trying to drive without a license. It can be done, it is being done but is that what you as a 'good parent' should be doing or teaching your children? I could go on with the comparisons but I hope you get the point. Hm..... makes one wonder.......<P>Really JAL, how do you want to be remembered by your descendants?<P>L.<BR>

Invictus,<P>I am not aware of lying about anything. You appear to have a very strong set of opinions about this issue. I am sorry that you appear to have been affected negatively at some point, but glad that you have seen your way clear of what must have been detrimental to you. I do not recognize myself in your post. You, perhaps, will believe that this is because I am somehow blinded to my wrongs. Of course, the possibility exists as well that you are not completely correct? As I said earlier, it's a big world out there and there are many ways to experience it. Different doesn't always equal wrong. Food for thought.<P>Kal & Orchid,<P>I agree that it was wrong to remove his W's choice to either remain in a monogamous marriage or leave. It should have been presented to her prior to the affair. I absolutely agree. It still would have been devastating to her, but at least there would not be the added factors of betrayal and what that does to one's self esteem, etc. However, she now does have a choice. She can divorce him if she chooses. She has chosen not to. He has been truthful with her for the past several years. The timeline is nine years since the advent of the affair, nearly four years since she discovered it, 2.5 years since permanent separation. For the first year after discovery, he was so overwhelmed with guilt that he could not address the issues directly with her. She was suicidal, depressed, devastated, and he was overcome with guilt at having caused this. And, the situation was made worse by the fact that he knew, absolutely knew to his bones (plus he had had it confirmed in therapy by more than one therapists) that he could not remain in the marriage and be happy. Finally, he told her. She still did not want him to leave and begged him to stay. She even offered to just "put up with" the fact that he had a mistress. Throughout this period, I too sought therapy. I also made it clear to him that I would respect absolutely his request to end contact with me should he make it. He never did. You see, he had to make choices, too. Everyone did. So, as to why they are not divorced. He told her that he would never be back but he would also never divorce her. She has a great, great fear of growing old alone. Even though our relationship is not closeted by any stretch of the imagination, at this point her abandonment fears are still holding her back. She has told him this. She is in therapy. We do see progress. He has told her that he will always be there for her but that he cannot be her husband ever again. There are also financial reasons which concern both of them. He is very succesful and has very involved investments and businesses both here and abroad. Dividing all this up would be a massive problem and would also diminish their worth. His daughter works with him. She will someday take the helm. Neither wishes to diminish her inheritance. And, she trusts him. He will never, ever harm her financially. If she wanted a divorce, he would not contest for even a moment her fair share of their wealth. He has told her this as well. He really does hope that she will meet someone and perhaps wish to move on, he really does. He doesn't want to see her unhappy. It's just that he can't make her happy. She needs him to come home and be her husband and that is emotionally simply not possible for him to do.<P>Now, as to myself. First, I feel no "right" to any of his wealth. Yes, he does spoil me dreadfully, but these are gifts freely given and there is enough that no one else is diminished or harmed by them. I would never seek to marry him simply to gain for myself. I feel intensely emotionally bonded to him. We are intimately connected in so many ways. Some people feel the need to finalize such a relationship through ritual for spiritual or other reasons. I do not. I have children, as I have said. For those of you that are working to rebuild your marriage with your WS, do you expect for them to be forever morally harmed by your WS's mistake? If and when I discuss this with my children, I will openly tell them that I made a very grave moral error, and the fact that something good came out of it does not justify it. <P>And, then there are my children. They come first. Blended families are problematic at best and relationship-destroying at worst. When I have raised my children and seen them safely off to college, then I will make a decision regarding our relationship. He is more traditional than I am and will probably want a formal marriage, and that's fine. I'm happy to comply. But, he won't make me feel more in love or committed than I do at this moment, and I do so much. The fact that I have told him that cohabitation and/or marriage must wait a minimum of five years has not diminished his devotion to me. There was an article in Newsweek last week about single mothers. One was in the same situation. She was engaged but had no intention of marrying until her children were raised. So, I know I'm not alone in this decision. And, frankly, if he has such a great need for me to marry and/or live with him that he can't wait and feels compelled to replace me, it's for the best if he does!<P>I hope this has answered all the questions asked. If I miss any, please let me know and when I have time, I will respond. I only ask that our exchange be civil. The fact that you may disagree with my views or even loathe them is no excuse for mudslinging in rudeness. At least, that's what I think.<P>JAL

Okay, say my husband was in a devestating accident, was paralyzed, in a wheelchair, and could never have sex with me again. Would the relationship be over for me? Of course not. I made that vow to him that I would stand by him for life. And I will. Believe me--going without sex: I have put that theory in practice for the last two or three years, on and off, while my husband and I were separated due to his affair and I am still alive and healthy.<P>Mdme. Lurker, you have said that I need to stop obsessing over my husband and what he is doing and focus on me and my son. I have had no choice but to do the latter--when you are left alone with a little kid while your husband is out sowing his wild oats, you are the only one left to care. And the former. . .let's just say, if he would be straight with me for one single time, then I would not be guessing as to what his intentions are. Then I would not worry about him. <P>I feel as if he has drawn a circle around him and his girlfriend(s) and left me on the outside of my own marriage. If he were to tell me that he's divorcing me for whatever reason and let me go, then that's one thing. I can deal with that. I will walk away and get over it. But here I am married to a man that I am supposed to love unconditionally and bond with for life, and he's doing what he wants with whoever he wants. What kind of existence is that?<P>See, this is the life of a betrayed spouse--it's not mourning of loss. It's wondering just what in the heck is going on with the person you are married to. At least, when you have lost them, it brings some kind of closure. There is no closure when your spouse is having an affair. Especially when the main drive is for sexual addiction.

I offer this and then I will comment no more on this topic.<P>You do not have to believe something for it to be true.<BR>The truth is the truth whether you choose to believe it or not. <BR>You can bend it, color it, try and change it to suit you but the fact remains it is still the truth.<P>I know there are many out there that know EXACTLY what I am talking about.<BR>My prayers are with all, believers and non-believers.<P>

JAL,<P>You and I are alike in a way. Both of us have controversy and although we see ourselves as "here to help" we are seen by some as flaming an already raging fire.<P>I come here to share my story, and it is sometimes seen as "do as I say, not as I do" because I met my fiance while my divorce was finalizing, and his was just beginning (he lives in Canada, where you can't file until a year of physical seperation). We are both divorced now and live together, and will be married soon. But... when I first came here, nearly two years ago, it was as both WS and BS, in my ex-marriage. So, my history softens the blow for some, but to others, only illustrates how long and/or hard I tried/didn't try. You see the confusion, I'm sure.<P>What bothers me about your choice of lifestyle is, I suppose, the same thing that bothers folks about mine... the justification for everything. I don't care about the S&M or the sexual choices that you and your partner make, but I do care about the fact that he is married and has not divorced his wife, but stayed with you, for nine years. If he were single and you were single and did your thing, I wouldn't think anything about it. But it gnaws at me that neither he nor his wife wants to divorce but you are still in his life. I think I worry about YOU, to be honest. Nine years of your life with a married man. That's a LONG TIME. Is this what you want for the rest of your life? What if he dies and despite his wealth, you get nothing - which, since he's married, would be expected... I guess I just don't understand that. <P>I have thought of you often as I have read through this thread, and honestly do wonder what will ultimately happen with you.<P>I have been a BS, so understand that I could easily flame you for being an OW... yet, I have been an OW myself, and see how easy it is to cross that line. Still, I felt like a whore for cheating on my then-H and even moreso when I looked in the mirror. I don't have to ask you how you see yourself, for it is written all over this thread. <P>As far as the original intent of this thread, about how when sexual (possibly deviant, depending on the person's mindset) needs are not met that he/she needs to go outside a marriage to have them met... well... sigh... I do NOT agree. If that were true, all adultery would be acceptable ~ because~ don't you see, that's what adultery is: having sex outside of marriage.<P>I guess I'm just trying to get a handle on this... <P>I commend you for handling yourself with grace here, but I admit to not truly understanding your motives (and I mean that sincerely) for being here.<P>------------------<BR>~Sheryl<P>And we know. We who have seen. ~Pellegrino

Why are you really here? I too question your motivations. Your post about why they don't divorce is full of contradictions but I notice you ignore any question about inconsistencies so I won't even go there. And of course the picture you paint of his wife is very flattering! But in general that's what OP must do in order to justify their behavior. Additonally there is no way to know the truth about anything you say because of course you have your own agenda. I believe that what goes around comes around and both you and he will pay. It's just a shame there are children involved.<P>

Bernzini,<P>I know you feel like your H has stripped control from your life, but he has not. He is, though, presenting you with choices that you don't want. You want one of the choices to be a restored marriage with a full, mongamous committment. What if he doesn't offer this choice? You see, once we enter into a relationship with anyone else, we limit our choices. Some choices (such as the choice to be monogamous or to remain in a marriage) must be joint choices. Well, what if your H won't make the choice you want him to make? I know you want your marriage, but what your H does (because the OW is inconsequential in his choice) is really totally and completely beyond your control. So, you are obsessing, hurting, desiring, focusing on something that you really, really, truly have no control over. What you can do is control yourself. That is all anyone can do. And, for a limited time, you can control your child. But not your H. You know, it may be true that your H has drawn a circle around himself and the OW and denied you entry. Alright. That's awful, that's beyond painful, that's something that should never happened, but let's say it has. What can you do about it? Nothing. You are (maybe, I don't mean to categorize or generalize you) desperately seeking the "fix" through whatever book or theory might work. But, ultimately, it is your H's choice. Two must make a marriage. Both must want to be there. At some point, you may need to really examine whether your H is willing to give the type of committment you need in a marriage. And, if he's not? Well, then you will have to make a choice yourself. You are stronget than you think. Rather than simply thrashing about or instantly abandoning your H, you have sought a solution. You have sacrificed, you have faced tremendous fear and you have persevered. These are not the actions of a weak woman; rather, they are the actions of a strong woman. And a strong woman is strong no matter who circumstance. Don't give away so much of your power. Keep it in your own heart. And use it when you need it.<P>JAL

JAL,<P>I think that you opened up a can of worms here and have ruffled quite a few feathers. I think you meant well but it wasn't received that way - because of the topic and you being the other woman. This subject really hits home with me - you see I found out a little over 2 years ago that my husband had/has a very strong interest in S&M. I would really like to ask you some questions - maybe you could shed some light on some things for me. I was wondering if you would be willing to correspond with me? I could set up an email account so we could correspond. If you don't want to, that's okay, I just thought I would ask. You mentioned that you could recommend some books - please do - I really need to understand this thing. Thanks.

Kal,<P>I only submitted this post (and have responded to a very few others) after having visited here for well over a year because I thought I might, perhaps, have something of value or an insight to add. That was my sole motivation. Is altruism only the realm of those who have never sinned? I have made a particular effort not to be inflamatory and to be polite. If my input is of no use to you or to others, it can be left at that. I am happy to address any contradictions that you perceived in my posts. I try to learn from all responses and also try to admit it when I've been wrong. I doubt I'm always successful, but I try.<P>Nyneve,<P>As I said before, the D&S is only one aspect of our very loving and complete relationship. Obviously, I do not consider him "married" to his W in any spiritual sense. Every aspect of him is with me. You know, there are some religious sects who absolutely do not believe in divorce and believe anyone who "marries" a divorced person is actually fornicating, correct? Obviously, many people here are on their second marriages so they don't believe that. People tend, naturally, to difine no only themselves but all and everything around them with their own world view. The fact that I can feel spiritually "married" (and I use the term only because of the topic of discussion here) without a "formal" divorce (i.e. a very mortal judge declaring the marriage ended) obviously diverges from the mainstream view here, just as some would consider marriage vows to be for life and there to be no excuse for divorce. I notice I am often accused of "justifying" my position. I wonder about this? I am only trying to explain my views. What I think is that when my views to agree with the mainstream, then I am "justifying." If, however, I were to agree, I would not be "justifying." And, of course, then there is Heart's Cry who believes he is spirtually and divinely correct and has no need to even consider views that fall outside of the strict lines of his beliefs. No discussion is possible there, obviously.<P>It happens that I am quite capable of taking care of myself. Yes, I would be tremendously financially advantaged if I married him. In fact, I suppose, atthis point, I would even have grounds for a "palimony" suit. I woud never, never do this. I am a person who can take care of myself. What he brings into my life is welcome and gratefully received, but it is not expected nor demanded. And, somehow, it seems very freeing to him and makes him all the more giving in all ways. It's such a change from the traditional set-up.<P>JAL

JAL,<P>Thanks for your earlier response about when you and your partner first recognized your "orientation". I've been following this threat with continued interest. <P>I do have another question if you don't mind. I was wondering if, in your previous marriage, your spouse ever cheated on you. If you have ever experienced being in the BS's position?<P>Thanks,<BR>Z

One more and then I am done--<P>Naw, Mme Lurker, you are missing my point. <P>A little about my situation: I have been at MB for a very long time now, and the relationship with my husband has gone a full cycle. I Plan A'd the hell out of things while he was having the affair (and I didn't know what was going on, I just thought that he wanted to separate "to find himself" and I wanted him to stay.) The only reason that he and she cooled it off was that we came here to Japan (leaving her back in the states,) but he was going through withdrawal in which he was extremely hateful to me--and manifesting his new sexual expressions with me (instead of her.) Then I discovered the affair, which had become a long-distance internet affair in which they would send each other videos and pictures. I gave up and went home to mom, back to the states. After struggling for awhile to communicate with him, I turned to Plan B--I did not write, I did not call. And he started divorce proceedings.<P>He would, nevertheless, call me up every few weeks and ask to me come back. I made it clear that unless he was going to straighten up, I would not. Finally, I decided that it was in the best interest of my child, and for myself, to return--on the condition that the affair(s) were over and that my husband would not participate in the secretive sex life that he had been involved in. Anything else (his temper tantrums, ect) I could take, like I always had. He vowed that he and Miss Kitty were through. They were--but the "anonymous sex" was not, I was to discover.<P>I returned to find his webcam all set up and a whole lot of sick stuff on the computer that he tried to hide from me. He was enraged for my snooping. He left on his deployment with me huddled on my side of the bed crying.<P>The whole issue is honesty. See, I am OK with myself. My happiness in the grand scheme of things does not rest with whether or not my husband loves me or will provide me with security. I am not a baby about losing him--I have been married and divorced before, and while that sucked bigtime (I lost custody of my two older kids because I was in the army) I understand that he is another individual and I cannot outline his destiny for him. I cannot make him be happy--he has to choose this for himself. He is a grown man and he can do what he wants. I would not desire to control him. I can't make him love me, and I don't want to. I wish that he would love me, but I can't make him.<P>What I do not want is to be married to someone who has a secret second life. That is not marriage--it is co-existence. It is a lie. It is dishonest.<P>One of the key principles of Marriage Builders in honesty. If your spouse cannot share every aspect of his life with you, then that is dishonesty.<P>Like your partner and his wife--my husband did not share his desires with me until he just up and left me. He did not give me a chance or a choice. Had he told me that he could not absolutely live without his "sexual needs," would could have talked about it. We could have done something. Instead, when he told me that he was ditching me, he outlined every imperfect aspect of my being, real and perceived, to justify his leaving. But he did not express his true reasons.<P>When it comes to sex, I am a nice girl. Without getting too revealing and graphic, I will just say that I will do what I think will please my husband. Or what I thought would. I am not the Victorian Lady who schedules every other Thurday evening, lights out, long flannel nightgown pulled up around my hips--far from it. I did what I enjoyed and what I thought he enjoyed, too. To know that I did not, in fact, please my husband breaks my heart. To know that some skanky old witch with frizzy hair and cigarette breath did please my husband makes me sick. <P>To know that the great volume of love that I had for my husband made no difference to him makes me sick, too. I hope that you can understand that. The whole heart of this issue is: sexual expression is not worth destroying a marriage over. This is what all these people that posted on this thread are angry about. In fact, I would bet that most on here are open to a lot of the same things you might be, and would like to try them with their partners. However, it is the simple fact that you seemed to advocate a person leaving his marriage bed to find true expression that made people mad. Sorry--sex is not that important. It is a mere aspect of the love that two people should have for each other, not the whole reason for coupling. Like I said, if my husband and I could never ever have sex again, I would still love him. Having him hold me in his arms and speak tender words to me, stroke my hair, maybe even share a bath together, would be far more of an experience to me than having sex. Sex should never be a reason to betray your family. It is just not that important.

JAL,<BR>Your points are well taken, but you also need to keep in mind that this is pretty much a God-fearing website where many people posting here do actually share my spiritual beliefs regarding prayer. I was just hoping that you would be a little bit more open than you seem to be.<P>The fact that you mentioned that you have settled into a 9-year affair seemed obvious to me that this is the lifestyle that you have proactively chosen to commit yourself to and that is exactly what makes me say YIKES! You sound very well-adjusted and happy, but perhaps you are selling yourself a bit short? Don't you deserve someone's whole heart? I could be wrong, but you sound very proud to be able to give someone else's husband the type of sex that his wife can never, never, ever give him? And? Is that really so splendid? I mean, what are the REAL benefits? Terrific orgasms? Okay, that is great until you need another one and we all know that lust is pretty insatiable. You don't have to answer, but these are just some thoughts that come to my mind and I sort of already have my answers because of what I've been through in my past.<P>It seems to me that after 9 years you have obviously thought everything through and you are getting your payoffs which is why you consider yourself to be fulfilled and in a committed lifestyle. Fine.<P>The thing is that everyone has sin in our lives that we are all dealing with. The goal is to be able to stand before God on Judgment Day with a clear conscience. Now I know that you and much of the big wide world do not share my spiritual beliefs and I am very well aware of that fact. I have lived in this big wide world every single day and I'm no spring chicken.<P>Obviously you do not share my spiritual beliefs, that's quite noticeable. You have made your point (indirectly, nevertheless quite clearly), that people posting here seem a bit narrow-minded. Yes, it's a big world out there, no, I don't know everything, but one thing I do know--there is nothing new under the sun in this big, wide world.<P>Nevertheless, we will all stand before God and give account of our lifestyles, which really has not much to do with sexual orientation. If we have ever told a lie or stolen anything regardless of its value, we are guilty of breaking God's laws and we will give account for that sin in our lives. Adultery is one sin that can actually take place without a physical act at all, so no one is innocent of breaking God's Laws. God is looking at our heartfelt attitudes and motives. We are not 'good' because of anything we have done or not done, we are 'good' because Jesus shed His blood for the forgiveness our sins--past, present and future. <P>I fully recognize that you probably do not share these beliefs, but it's just something for you to think about and open your mind to. That's all. And, I'm sure you have probably heard all this before. Just like we have heard people who feel we use religion as a crutch. But, Jesus is not a crutch for me, HE'S THE WHOLE HOSPITAL. He is my peace. Yes, I'm a Jesus Freak. I'm proud of that just the way you seem very proud of what you are. And like you, this is not a lifestyle that I have chosen without a lot of thought and research and reading of several books, and all the while considering the big world I live in.<P>Some people say that marriage is only a piece of paper, well, so is a 20-dollar bill. It's according to one's values.<P>The definition of commitment is relative and directly connected to one's spiritual beliefs or lack thereof. Obviously when the word commitment is spoken of here, at this site, it is directly connected to being within the confines of the spiritual aspects of a marriage covenant--the promise we made before God and our partners. I don't believe you or anyone of us in this big old world can truly be fulfilled without having peace and a clear conscience with God. These are my narrow views.

Amanda Rose,<P>If you will post an email address for me, I will respond. While I know it is possible to set up anonymous email addresses (I have never done this but will do so in order to respond to you), I hesitate to post even an anonymous one here because I don't want to be barraged with hate mail. That might not happen, but why risk it?<P>It is important, VERY important, for me to add that the D&S/S&M aspect of our relationship is only one aspect of what is a very intimate and loving relationship. While it was the catalyst that led us to a deeper understanding of each other, it is not our only connecting point nor was the lack of it in his marriage (or mine) the only problem. So, while certainly this may be one important issue that you need to address, I really doubt that it is the only one. For that reason, I would encourage you to continue to post here where there are many who understand and can help you deal with the other aspects. There are many areas they can help you with that I absolutely could not.<P>Having said that, I will be happy to share more with you if you think it would be helpful.<P>JAL

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BINthereDUNthat:<BR><B><BR>Some people say that marriage is only a piece of paper, well, so is a 20-dollar bill. It's according to one's values.<P></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>That is the BEST analogy I have ever read about that piece of paper.<P>Thank you!! <P>