Orchid,<P>How goes things as of late with you, hubby, and son? <BR>Hopefully... Things are much smoother, and better over all.<P>Take care <P>Hugs from our family to yours.<P>------------------<BR>Prayers, Hugs, and Strength from both of us. Things do and can get better. Keep hoping, learning, and growing. Take care of yourself.<P>[H] and Knewjie

[H] and others,<P>BAD DAY. Maybe OW is still preg. The dummy spotted and cried miscarriage earlier last week, called up to yesterday and informed H of spotting but he dummy still has not gone to the doctor since she spotted. Now she is a spotted dummy!~~~<P>I am so angry. H was not suppose to take her calls. Yet he did. H convinced her that she may still be preg again without proof and while I don't have the details of their conversation, H said she is still trying to convince him to go back to her. This infuriates me. <P>I have started packing his clothes. I even said I would take it to her house and the other woman's house. This scared him and he yelled at me. Now I am just angry and crying. I want out of this mess. Just out. <P>I finally got him to say he wanted out also. Then he said he knows we are better than she is. No more fog. I don't want the likes of her in my life. If he needs to communication with her then he needs to be out there. Firm rules!!! Can't go back on my word, just can't. <P>He threatened that OW could have me arrested for bringing his clothes to her property and that her 2 German Shephards might bite me. Oh, I thought it was against the law for dogs to bite people. Oh well maybe not Bs's. <P>So I conceded not to take the clothes to her house. YET! Maybe UPS? Hope the dogs wont bite the delivery man. Hm... give him a camera.... Ok, more bad thoughts. Good thing for them this site is here. Hey but bad for me. I need an outlet. <P>No H around to comfort me. He is at work giving a group of people a 'wine tour'. Am I pitying myself? I hate that. <P>When I choose to do something and I am upset, I don't warn, I just do. Yet I am warning H and instead of taking the warning he gets upset. That just makes me want to do it more. But I have blown my cover. Gotta think of something else. <P>Need to go.<P>L.<BR>

Orchid, I would take the husband's clothes to the other woman's house and dump them there. I can feel what you are feeling. It's ridiculous. Your husband needs a shock to wake up. That shock might be for him to be with the other woman forever.

Hang in there...I am sorry the OW is stringing your H around and you along in the process. <P>I pray that she is no longer pregnant and your H will stop buying into her lines. Plan B time?

I am so sorry about that woman... I pray, and I mean at this moment as I write this, that she isn't...<P>(((((Orchid)))))

Orchid...<P>You hang in there...we are all here and praying for you.<P>Cali

<<<<ORCHID>>>>><P>Just wanted to give you a big hug. Your words were so helpful to me on my other thread, and the fact that you were there for sadandalone, means so much to me. I really feel for her and you.<P>Yes, you need firm rules, but I honestly don't know how you enforce them. Maybe packing them up and getting them ready for UPS would be enough...

I've been in hiding all weekend, just got back and read the post. I'm so sorry. I feel your frustration. Stay strong and very firm with him. I don't want you to get hurt again. <P>Hoping for happier days ahead...

Orchid<P>You've been so busy taking care of us here at MB, despite your own pain. I hope you are remembering to take care of yourself as well.<P>I don't want to sound like a mother hen but are you eating and getting enough rest?<P>Take care of yourself.<BR>You are special to us.<BR>Maezy

Thank you all for your support. I have been talking to Sad and Alone. My problems seem smaller tonight. <P>Roger, I will let you know when I need a driver to deliver those 'boxes'. <P>For the rest of the great gang, thanks. Today has been my therapy day. Yes, I went for a wild ride with S&A. I hope our collective efforts to help her work. She is resting now and we will be checking on her in the morning. She has expressed deep appreciation for all of you here so let it be known that all your efforts are appreciated. <P>For me also, yes I am having some difficulties. Not more than I can handle just more than I want to deal with. Does that make sense? I no longer am the all loving will take any crap lady. I am getting picky about where and what I choose to stress over. Stressing over OWs are no longer allowed in my book. OW now has a big red circle and a red slash through her name. That felt good!!!!! <P>Time to call it a night. I am trying to finish the last batch of cookies. Anger makes people do funny things. I bake. LOL <P>L.

<B><BR>I am trying to finish the last batch of cookies. Anger makes people do funny things. I bake. LOL<BR></B><P>Nothing wrong with that. I actually had one of the cookies you sent Knewjie. Me of all people... Last time I had a cookie I was like 12 or something. Unfortunately they are all gone now. As I had the second to last cookie. Anyhow good stuff be proud, I couldn't resist Orchid's famous cookies.<P>------------------<BR>Prayers, Hugs, and Strength from both of us. Things do and can get better. Keep hoping, learning, and growing. Take care of yourself.<P>[H] and Knewjie

Hey Orchid I'm out of cookies!!!!!!! <P>How about sending me some of those "angry cookies"?!?!? <P>Hang in there dear friend. We're here for you! <P>(((((((((((((((((((((((((((ORCHID)))))))))))))))))))))))))))<P>K

Hi all,<P>Well today is no better. Actually quite rotten. Only piece of good news is that S&A is doing ok. I just spoke with her and she sounds much better. <P>For me, ok gang here goes another wild ride but this is another one for the book. Where is that book anyway? We got as far as the chapters but then all the writers disappeared?<P>Well here goes: <P>Chapter 17: Ws goes to jail?<P>H decided to talk. Wanted to go back to the beginning of our marriage. I have heard this before but was a bit impatient this morning, asked him to speed it up to the present. I called in to say I was coming in late so H & I had about 2 hours to 'talk and save our marriage'? <P>Time well spent? No. H cried bottom line is that while he admits we are better than anything or anyone else out there, he can not seem to movtivate his 'heart' to want to be with his family. Ok. So the decision is to leave his family. He even said it. Ok. I already had 1 garbage bag filled. I went to fill the other one. Oh, H wanted to do it himself on his own time. I said, no decision made needs to be out now. I have to go to work. <P>I did get a little sloppy in the rest of the packing. Suits and shirts hanging in the closet made their way down the hallway and eventually out the door on the porch and lawn. Hm..... Why? H wouldn't take his stuff out quick enough. He wanted again to daly around. No more, I am too tired for this game. If he is going to be with another woman tonight, he needed to be out before I leave the house never to return as a resident again. Final decision. Or was it?!?!?!!?<P>Oh, so confused and angry. Yes, I was angry. Clothes remained in tack just in piles on the floor and out the door. H was furious. How dare the neighbors see this. Ok, now he was getting 'pushy' literally. Kept bringing the clothes in and pushing me back in the house. A bit of a struggle. <P>Get this Sad and lonely...... <P>Anyway, H decided I was out of control and had no right to move his clothes out the door. He wanted it in the garage and told me I was making decisions for him again. Oh no, only decisions for me. Out the door, that was his decision. <P>So, H called the police. Claimed I was throwing his clothes out of the house. The police asked why, he said because he was leaving. During this time the dispatcher kept hearing me say stuff like 'don't push me and let go of my arm. I am not making this stuff up, he was pushing me and strong arming me back. Now my H is not a violent man by nature but his priorities were really screwed up and he was mad. How dare anyone else see what he is really up to. <P>Hm....... So when the police arrived, they saw him pushing me. Based on the laws here, they have to arrest him for domestic violence. That was a horrible scene. They talked with both of us separately and handcuffed him. I cried so hard but there was nothing I could do. My hands are numb now just writing this. It hurt so much to watch my husband be put in the squad car. Oh I hurt sooo bad. He was angry and told the officers off. The 3 officers that came said H had a bad attitude even with them and he needed to spend a night in jail, visit the judge tomorrow and stay away from his family for 1 week. H will be reqired to go to counseling and be on probation for 1 year. <P>I tell you all this not to hurt my H but to warn all those out there. Uncontrolled anger is a bad thing. Just because one can get away with hurting their family with the A, it is just a matter of time before others are involved for various reasons. <P>Would my H have gone to jail if I did not remove his clothes that way? Maybe not or may yes. You see, his anger had been growing in other areas anyway. H has blamed others for his mistakes, not just me. It was just a matter of when. <P>All you Ws's out there, PAY ATTENTION. What you are doing to yourself and your families, all the confusion you bestow on your loved ones is DANGEROUS. It could kill you. GET IT??!?!? PLEASE HEAR ME, DON'T PUT YOURSELF IN A POSITION TO DAMAGE YOURSELF AND YOUR FAMILY FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE. IT IS JUST NOT WORTH IT!!!! <P>Is jail or the OP better than your family? You all claim not to want to hurt your famlies yet that is what you are DOING. So you DO what you don't WANT? Make some sense here WS's. You are confusing the sane world and it is giving us a big headache!!!!<P>You know it may be 'my' fault that H called the police, just like it is my fault that OW is pregnant. Hm...... go figure that piece of fog logic. Maybe I should go to the jail and offer to exchange myself for H. Is that logical in fogese? <P>If some WS is kicked back to reality by this post, I will be happy. For now there is not too much else to be happy about in this home. You all out there, think about it. The local jail is not a pretty place. It is not a country club. I shudder to think what H is thinking and seeing right now. <P>L.

Hi Orchid,<P>You did the right thing. No husband can treat a lady like you in this way. You have taken enough abuse. I would have done that a long time ago. Cheers for you. It's not funny but I don't think you need to feel bad about the whole incident at all. Who caused it all anyway? He did. Not you. It would be nice if the other woman and your husband can both be together in jail for awhile.<P>

OMG Orchid!! I'm not sure I know what to say. Part of me can relate to your feelings of hurt and anger (specifically, b/c of my going through calling the police on my H... although, he never got hauled off to jail).<P>Another part of me (the really bad, nasty, LBing side) is saying WOOHOO!!! That SOB deserved it! After all he has put you through!! You've been such a patient person... far beyond most of us on here... and he still continues to hurt you!<P>As if you haven't given him enough warnings, he was obviously still surprised at your reaction. What the **** goes through their heads??? Is it that they just want to say those words, "I've made a decision and I want out", just to hear themselves say it??? I certainly hope he will take the opportunity during his overnight time tonight, to REALLY think about what a mess he's made!<P>And you know what? I'm surprised you've lasting so long with his waffling.<P>I'm glad to hear that he has to stay away for 1 week. It'll be like a mini plan B for you... should you choose it to be.<P>AUGH!!! I am so angry at him right now!!! Whatever your mood is right now Orchid, please.. come on here and vent it out... I'll keep on checking to see that you're okay.<P>Karen<BR>

Orchid,<BR>Are you all right? Consider yourself hugged.

Hi, <P>Still shakey. I have received some strong and supporting calls last night. I had to inform our son that dad was not coming home. He cried and said but dad promised, why mom? It broke my heart. Then he said 2 prayers each time asking God to please, please bring back his dad to live with us. <P>Oh, more heartbreak. Well, we supported each other last night and today he went to day care. My son said he would be there for me. That little guy he is really a good kid and only 6 years old. He is still asking for a good dad. I can't even talk about that now, I feel like I am depriving him from his right. <P>I have sent a letter to my H, he won't get it until he gets out and the arraignment has been set for tomorrow afternoon so I am going to go to work later today and go to the arraignment tomorrow. The OW has not called his work cell, so I am inclined to think that she knows where he is. YUCK. <P>Here is where I feel I need some help, advice or opinions. My H has been having fluttering chest pains. Not all the time but sporatically. They are strong enough where he loses he breath and it wakes him up from his sleep. We looked up what it might be but he knows he needs to go to the doctor. He does have medical coverage but his priorities are not on himself. In addition to that he appears to have a slight tremor in his hands. I want him to go to the doctor and fear it may be serious. <P>My question to you is that I want to tell the OW that I fear for my H's health and to please keep away so that his stress is reduced. Ok, she may be pregnant, she needs to get her support elsewhere otherwise if he gets sick or dies how can he be there for anyone? Those of you that know Psyco Babble know she can be difficult. Yet should I contact her anyway? I am worried about my H's health. I do so very much still love him and want to help him but I feel so helpless right now. Yes, he pushed, shoved and grabbed me yesterday which is very wrong. He needs anger management counseling and needs to clear his mind so that he is not confused. I personally feel that the OW lends to his state of confusion by requiring him to carry her selfish requests and his desire not to hurt anyone is actually hurting everyone. <P>Is any of this making sense? I don't know. My neck is so stiff from all this thinking and stress right now. I just can't let anything happen to me. There is no one for my little one to depend on in our family but me right now. Oh, this is every hard. But I know I will make it. <P>So is this venting? I am not sure. While I am still upset over the whole ordeal, I am also very scared. I don't quite know what will happen but I do know that too much speculation or curiosity killed the cat. Can't afford that. <P>H's best friend will come with me to the arraignment tomorrow. H's truck has been delivered to another location so that he can pick it up. That is all I know for the moment. I have to go to work right now and get some things done. <P>See you all later. <P>Thanks,<BR>Orchid<BR>

Hmmmmmmm....If my opinion is useful I would say you did just fine with the hauling off to jail scene. He knows he messed up, and shouldn't really have any long term anger over it. I knew everytime I struggled (the few times) with my wife I was playing with fire. If he had any sense he would have walked away from the "anger" as it built, he obviously has no sense. But what I heard loud and clear is he knows this is all messed up, and that he is the one messed up. Your actions were confrontational, but (and I am not fully up to speed on your story) only after a lot of patience and effort, he knows this too. I suspect he is pushing you to see how far you will go, trying to gauge the depth of your (you and him) relationship. I have done this with my wife (not on purpose you understand, I am just self-analyzing some of my strange behaviour), I have pushed on her (figuratively) hard, very hard. I want to see what she is made of. Now many of you would lynch us ws for that, and maybe rightly so, I don't know. But the point is, we left for a reason, and we need to know if we come back, things have changed, permanently. Anyone can talk the talk, and throw out a few crumbs, but we ws are a very suspicious lot, and we need a lot more proof, stressing you is one way to get it. I am of course referring to marriages with legitimate and serious problems, some of you are just married to certifiable a**holes, and frankly I don't know why you don't cut your losses and run. Whether you supposedly "love" em or not, many people have serious enuf personality disorders they should never be married to anyone, and the sooner you divorce them the sooner you can live a sane life. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that a serious BS fog exists too, maybe stl can address that in his dictionary. As for you orchid, only you can say, but from what I see your H is borderline marriage material, and even if you somehow get him through this, I can't help but wonder when the next episode will occur. But for now, a night in jail is just what he needed to get his attention um......... focused. DO NOT TAKE any responsibility, he did this himself, you had nothing to do with it, throwing ones clothes out the door might be a tad annoying, and make one angry, but it does not empower him to lay a finger on you. He got EXACTLY what he neeed, a real world consequence for his choices, I love it.

Girl, you did the right thing. You have to set your limits, and he crossed them. It was not your intention to have him thrown in jail, he knows that, it's his own fault that it happened. <P>As for talking to the OW, don't do it. It will only cause you more grief. Do you really think Psycho-babble will be rational enough to do what you say? She'll just be like "it's a trick, blah, blah, bit**, complain", and screw with you some more. Does your H have another friend you can confide in about his problems that he may listen to? Have you talked to his doctor yourself? <P>I am so sorry your little guy has to go through this! It is not your fault Orchid! You are doing the best you can, you have put up with so much already, you are an amazing woman. Yes, you will get through this. We are here for you. LOL<P>HbH

Orchid,<P>I am sorry about the fight. I can vouch for the anger stuff. I grew up with a dad who had a temper problem and I will be the first to admit that I have problems with mine. It's funny about your H.(not ha-ha). But, whenever I would get really upset my counselor said to leave and walk it off, but my H. never saw it that way. I have hit him, kick him and bitten him to get him to let go of me. I hate feeling like I've lost control. I am a little opposite of your H. though, because when I got to the point where I couldn't stand to be around my H., I shut down and he could say and do whatever he wanted and I would laugh and walk away. I am sorry that you are going through so much. I wish I could change it. You all will be in my prayers