I understand your problem. I have been seperated for almost 6 months. I hope that she will see that I am trying. Unfortunately she is up north and I am in the south.

GM--<P>I see that from your orginal post to now you have made some real progress in yourself and your thought, go back and read, take note of your growth.<P>To keep yourself busy, volunteering is always good, maybe seniors, they always need help in the yard or home projects and they so throughly enjoy visiting, they give lots of praise too and that couldn't hurt your ego, could it?<P>How about the Y or Boys Club? Kids give as much back as they get.<P>This is going to sound goofy I know, specially when you know where I am with all of this and my H....But my H is a very avid racquetball player, he plays three or four times a week and travels for tournaments once a month or so. The people that play racquetball are some awesome people, there is alot of camaradie within their ranks. It is mostly men with the groups that my H has played with over the years. There are some very good female players, that he has played with over the years, but they are there for the competition and level of play and nothing more. It might be something that you enjoy. And that is the key something that you enjoy, what are your interest? How could you get more involved in those things right now? Biking, that is one that my brother has done alot of. Bowling, people there to meet. Are there any festivals going on in your area? Get out, get your mind on to other things so that you are not thinking too much.<P>Good luck finding something to do!<P>Gods blessings to you, C ya Dawn

I do think I have made progress, especially with becoming my own individual and making smarter decisions. Today? I don't know. She called me around lunch and asked if I wanted to go swimming at her mother's house. I didn't exactly have any plans, and figured it couldn't hurt, so I went. We ended up making love, and then going to see a movie. It was wonderful. I know she is still sorting things out, and that is fine. I am going to a new church tomorrow and I am hoping to meet some new friends. But it was good to connect like we did today. I really think she misses me, and she is going to miss me even more this week, because she is going to have to think about what an awesome time she had today (at least she said she had an awesome time and sure acted it!).<P>My hobbies mostly revolve around cars. I love drag racing and working on cars, so maybe I'll hit the drag racing track on Wednesday and try to meet people there.<P>Thanks all of you for your help and encouragement. You're saving gallons and gallons of tears that would otherwise be used almost constantly.

GM,<BR>I started to say how lucky you are to be getting some response and affection from your W. I wish I could even get a hello some days from my H. I am so sad tonight. But then I'm not sure if you are lucky or not... I don't know - maybe it's just my sadness, but for your W to be taking you up and down this roller coaster worries me. If she is sleeping with you and the OM, is she getting her cake and eating it too? I mean,I guess we each have to ddecide how much we are willing to let our WS's walk allover us - I hate to see your W walk all over you. But my perspective is really off tonight. I'm missing my H very much, and wishing he would wake up. I'm kind of an all or nothing kind of gal, I guess. Either my H is on my side of the fence or OW's, but I want him off the fence. But then, I love to get some little indications now and then that I'm still in his heart. A joke, a laugh, a phone call.... it just makes my heart LEAP when I hear from him!!! I love it!!! I guess I just want you to be careful. I think you should stick to Plan A, but don't let her walk all over you either - I guess boundaries??? I'm not sure if Harley teaches anything about that or not. I hate to see the BS's on here allow their WS's to come and go from the house and their bed as often and whenever they please. But I know we're all doing the best we can. Maybe I'm just jealous or something that my H won't give me any attention (EN's) right now. It drove me crazy the 2 weeks my H was home and came and went as he pleased and was lieing to me about where he was. He kept threatening to get an apartment, and by then, I encouraged him to hurry up and get out if he couldn't respect me enough to call me or come home at decent times.<P>I don't know. Just be careful with your heart, ok? I'm just so sad tonight... I feel like giving up on my H. But I'm too stubborn to do that. I just get sick of believing in him and sending him love notes on his phone, and I get nothing in return. It hurts so bad.<P>Sorry to start venting on your post. Good luck to you. I know things will work out with your W. I can tell she loves you and is afraid to give you up, and she loves being with you. Hang in there and keep Plan A'ing - it must be working.<P>------------------<BR>Faith1<P>"Then Jesus answered, 'Woman, you have great faith! Your request is granted.'"<BR>Matt 15:28

Faith, don't feel like your post was out of place, or that you were venting instead of giving. Because in your venting, you give me so much. Not just thankfulness and gratitude that my wife does still have strong feelings for me, but by also helping me stand my ground and keep my place. It's also good to know that someone else has been *right* where I've been.<P>I know <I>exactly</I> how you feel when you say <P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Either my H is on my side of the fence or OW's, but I want him off the fence. But then, I love to get some little indications now and then that I'm still in his heart. A joke, a laugh, a phone call.... it just makes my heart LEAP when I hear from him!!! I love it!!! I guess I just want you to be careful<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>That is just how it is with me and my wife! When she was still home, there would be days I totally felt like her A was over and that we were truly on the road to recovery. Her expressions of love and desire for me gave me strength and hope. But like you said, then the roller coaster would peak and I'd find out about things she was saying to the OM and it would send me plummeting down, down, down...<P>But I did the same thing you did. I decided that I couldn't handle her being <I>on</I> the fence all the time and giving me this roller coaster ride, so I asked her to take some time and make some life-decisions and let me know when she was ready to come to this side of the fence. Even when we agreed to do that, she started crying and asked me if she could call me occasionally, just to see how I was doing. I said yes. This isn't Plan B, it is just time and space for thought. I am still going to Plan A. If I didn't, the OM sure as heck is going to Plan A, and if I don't, then she can quickly sway to the other side of the fence again.<P>But, again Faith, you were right when you said that she can't have her cake and eat it. That's how it has been and things will change. She isn't sleeping with him, since he is 800 miles away, but I wouldn't put it past him to fly down again. He has said, in emails to her, that one of his main regrets is that he didn't get to sleep with her one more time. I have this feeling in my heart, that if she does, that my ability to reconcile will go plummeting down to the depths. I am praying for her that she wouldn't take even a step towards that road.<P>Be strong, Faith, these low moments, when we cry alone at night, are times that make us stronger. This too, shall pass. And I pray that your husband wakes up and realizes just how much you love him and all that he has in you. I pray my wife does the same for me.<P>I am off to visit this new church near my house. I am nervous, since I am really bad at meeting new people, but I hope it goes well.<P>God Bless

Well, I didn't meet any friends, but church was nice. She called today, but seemed distant =(<P>Just glad today is over. Another day begins soon.

Thank you for your encouraging words!! So, I guess church went ok for you? I'm still a mess. My Dad is visiting this weekend, and this was the first time I had to tell him what is going on. I couldn't bring myself to tell him everything (the A), just the separation... and left it at that. SO that's the main reason I'm so down. He doesn't handle problems well at all, and is making me nervous and sad. he'll be leaving in the morning. Then I can get back on track of taking care of myself. <P>I haven't heard from my H since Saturday morning - just a financial matter. I keep going back and forth in my mind - "I miss him so much" and then "He's so crazy for giving me up - it's HIS loss - he'll wake up one day want me back and it may be too late!"<P>Thanks again for your encouragement. it's wonderful that we all have each other to talk to, support wach other, and learn from. (Sad that we all NEED it - that we're in the situations that we're in, but good we have a place like this.)<P>Hang in there, and give us an update if anything changes. <P>------------------<BR>Faith1<P>"Then Jesus answered, 'Woman, you have great faith! Your request is granted.'"<BR>Matt 15:28

Man, I'm even more of the same situation as you. I haven't told my parents, or even my brother, who is my best friend now. I want to talk to my brother so badly, but my wife pleaded with me not to, so I haven't. But I am still so alone and wish I had someone to turn to.<P>My pastor called me last night, though, and said that my wife's mother came to him and talked to him last night about how we have been separated since last Thursday. He questioned me only somewhat, but I told him that my wife wished that we didn't speak at the moment. I wanted to just let it all out, but that would make her out to be the "bad guy" in all this, and I don't want that to happen. I know she will be angry for me even talking to him, because she is so paranoid about this matter getting out in the open, but I have a feeling that it will get out in the open sooner or later, and I hope she doesn't hate me for it.<P>I have those same swings, Faith, from hoping and praying SO badly that she will wake up and realize what she has in me, to thinking about all the hurt she has done to me and how much more hurt I still have in store, and thinking it isn't worth it. To just give up.<P>I like to think that the ball is in her court, though, just as it is in your husband's court right now. You are there, and doing your part, but it is their move. And it is as if our entire lives are staked on this one move that just never seems to come.

Keep your hopes and expectations in God. He will never let you down. Don't look at what's going on around you, too unreliable, no matter what the circumstances are. Cling to your faith and rely on God's unwavering love for you. Don't let anybody use you--ever--or take your kindness for weakness, even if it is your wife... Go with what you KNOW. Go with what gives you the most peace, that is, what you can control. It's good that you realize you cannot control another person. I'm praying for you guys! I'm praying that the OM will do something really repulsive to her to give her a glimpse of what she is in for so she can realize what she has--a FORGIVING spouse! Who could ask for more?????

Haha, I've prayed the same thing! This OM is a player. He has several women going on at the same time and my W refused to think anything of it. She thinks the others are just people he "toys" with and he makes fun of them to her. But she still honestly thinks that he is a wonderful man, and if he didn't have a wife and a son, that he would make a great husband to her. I wish somehow, she would realize how wrong that is. I can't point it out to her, that's for sure, because she thinks the world of him, and that would just make her think that much less of me. So I am praying that God would reveal this to her. And soon =(

Godly Man:<P>Please review this <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum37/HTML/010555-2.html" TARGET=_blank>old thread</A>. You're yo-yoing again (Plan B to Plan A in a weekend). There are reasons that Harley prescribes a rigid plan---it's because it has a higher chance of success, as opposed to trying to wing it on your own with a combination of stuff.<P>You should be in Plan A. That's where you should stay---for the next three months. Mark it on a calendar. If the affair isn't over by then, go to Plan B (a real one, with no contact).<P>And I would highly recommend scraping up money for counseling with Steve or Jenn Harley (888-639-1639). They'll help you get the consistancy you need. And along with other's who have suggested it: no opposite sex friends. And that goes double for email---it's a very easy way to start into an emotional affair. Don't make extra trouble for yourself.<P>

K, to be honest, I don't think we are in Plan B, nor did we intend to be. Both this time and the last time. She said she needed time to think and that she needed some space, so I am giving it to her. I am trying to extract a commitment from her to try. This is kind of going back to the first post in this thread. She isn't committed to even try to let him go, and my hopes are that she will give it thought, and commit to an attempt.<P>I may take out the worn out credit card and call Dr Harley, but just not yet. I have to see how this works out first.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I am trying to extract a commitment from her to try.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Stop wasting your time! She has to be willing to stop the affair, and apparently she's not. You've made it clear that you don't approve of your wife having an affair---so there's no need to continue this tack. I would suggest your focus be on eliminating any lovebusters you are guilty of---and doing it very consistantly. Make the time that you spend with your wife pleasant and upbeat. Perhaps every fourth week or so, you might want to bring up a question like "Are you willing to drop the affair?" and "What can I do to help you end this affair?". Those questions will probably be received like lead balloons, so be prepared to drop the issue.<P>When the X on your calendar comes up, evaulate your need to go to Plan B. If you're close to crazy, and Plan A is wearing on you too hard, then YOU make the move. For maximal effect, it should have nothing to do at all with any isolated incident your wife has done---it's not a punishment or retaliation. It's simply a statement saying:<P>1. I wasn't the best husband in the world. I've worked hard to try to fix that over the last xxx months; and I hope that you can see by my efforts to do x, y, and z, that I can give you hope for the marriage.<P>2. I've done this under very difficult circumstances (the affair). The natural effect of this has been for me to lose a lot of the love I had for you. In order to preserve the remaining love I have, and to give us the best chance for our marriage being rebuilt, I must ask that you have no contact with me while the affair continues.<P>3. I will remain faithful to our marriage---I have great hope for it. I love you, and will be thrilled to work on our marriage with you, after you have ended the affair with Mr. Wankboy (wait---that's Chris's OM).<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I may take out the worn out credit card and call Dr Harley, but just not yet. I have to see how this works out first.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Don't wait too long. I got myself the Citibank Marriage Counseling Mastercard, and it was the best investment I ever made. I really believe that your situation is very good---but I think you're making it worse by YOUR behavior (sorry---just being honest). Steve would be an excellent coach for you, and he's way more tactful than I am...

Wow, K..... it does seem like you're being a little hard on GM - just like on the other thread. I haven't seen you be like this to others. I know you must be trying to help GM, but he may quit posting if he keeps getting fussed at. <P>GM - don't go away. Don't run away! Please keep posting! I know GQ has been down some today, so maybe you haven't run away, but just making sure.... K is just trying to keep you realistic, I guess, but we know you are just doing the best you can - just like we all are. It's so tough to know the best things to do and say, when we are sooooo in love and soooooo devastated without our spouses! Our heart sometimes gets in the way of the best strategy. you can only do what you can do, but take advice here with a grain of salt and know that it comes with best intentions.<P>I forget, GM, have you read HNHN, and SAA? How about Love Must Be Tough by Dobson? if not, please do - I think it will help you tremendously. If so, great - we're sort of on the same page, then.<P>I'm feeling better today about my situation. no real reason - I guess. Just the roller coaster. weeeeeee.....<P>Hang in there... give us a update. <P>------------------<BR>Faith1<P>"Then Jesus answered, 'Woman, you have great faith! Your request is granted.'"<BR>Matt 15:28

I'm still around. I know K is right, but to be honest, it is easier to take advice that is from the heart, than advice that is straight from a page. <P>I've just been feeling like a straight-constant-down the past few days. I am almost numb. Nothing matters. My parents are coming to see me this Saturday, for a week, and they don't know yet, and I just don't know what I am going to do. I'm still reading SAA, but reading it sometimes just drags me further down, so I put it down often. I do want to try that Dr Dobson book as well, being a strong believer.<P>My wife is going into the city tomorrow, to go shopping, but that is where she met this OM last time and I am scared to death that they are going to meet. =( Things aren't getting better. I have never in my life had to deal with such lonliness. Not just from missing her, but all my family back home. I was going to call my brother last night, but I lost his number, and since my wife still wishes that I didn't speak to him about this, then talking to him would just be too hard anyway.<P>For every shadow, there is a light, though. Right now, the only bright side I can pull out is that I'm losing weight and looking better. I bought some new clothes and have been going tanning and the attention I get is helping my self esteem somewhat. But the attention from a dozen women isn't worth nearly as much as just one smile from my wife =(

Faith:<P>The reason I'm being so "hard" on GodlyMan is that I've been down this exact path---and I see him making (IMO) mistakes that can easily be avoided.<P>GodlyMan:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I'm still around. I know K is right, but to be honest, it is easier to take advice that is from the heart, than advice that is straight from a page. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Agreed. But the issue is that your heart doesn't have a clue as to what will be effective. Your marriage is in this state <I>probably</I> in part to what your "heart" was telling you.<P>I'm a really, really bright guy. When I discovered my wife's affair, it hit me like a ton of bricks (all the typical "I can't believe it" reactions). The <B>absolute best</B> thing I did the first thing after D-day was to realize that I would probably screw this up if I tried to deal with it myself, following my "heart". Instead, I started to research affairs, in the hopes to find an expert to help me deal with this nightmare. When I found MarriageBuilder's, I really liked the philosophy. I called Steve Harley late on a Friday night (in the old days when he was actually answering the phone) less than a week later. It was the best thing I ever did.<P>I'm not telling you that you can't get through this on your own---because you may. It's just my opinion and belief that a marriage is probably the most important thing you'll ever do in your life---and it ought to be handled as such. <BR>

GodlyMan:<P>About your parents---be very careful about telling them. My folks love my wife, and my mom is like a mother to her (her mother died 20 years ago). We have an extremely close-knit family. With all that---I didn't let them know about the affair until I was nearly to Plan B, about 5 months into it.<P>Once you tell them, it may change the dynamics. If your parents can support you and the marriage through this---then that's great. If they come down on the "dump the wife" side, you're better off not letting them know. And you should probably discuss this with your wife, and use the policy of joint agreement to decide what you're going to tell them.

K, you and I sound very much alike. I also have a four year degree and consider myself to be a "bright guy". The very next day after I found out about my wife's affair, I did the same research you did and found this site. I've been on here ever since. What I said about advice from the heart, wasn't in reference to my own broken, confused heart, but yours. Much of your advice is pure regurgitation of things I am reading in the book. Maybe if you worded your advice in personal anecdotes, it would be easier for me to take them to heart. I hope you understand what I am trying to say. I don't want to make anyone angry or make it seem as if I do not appreciate their concern and help.<P>

I don't want to tell my parents. You are right, and my mother does love my wife as her own daughter and it would devastate her to hear this. But this is becoming a delicate issue because she isn't home with me now. And if she pretends she is ready to come home sometime this week, it will most likely be due to the fact that she doesn't want my parents to suspect anything is out of the ordinary.<P>But with the state of mind I am in right now, my wife coming home, for any reason, is a tempting situation. I just want to get started on rebuilding our marriage and it is hard to think we are doing that when we are apart.

GodlyMan:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Maybe if you worded your advice in personal anecdotes, it would be easier for me to take them to heart. I hope you understand what I am trying to say. I don't want to make anyone angry or make it seem as if I do not appreciate their concern and help.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Again, I understand your perspective. If you look under my "eyeglasses", you'll see that I have over 4000 posts here. And I have a regular job as well!<P>My older posts were very much more involved, "from experience" stuff. That's more what you'd get if you started counseling with Steve or Jenn Harley. You're getting me in my "here's what to do phase"---which is more like how Dr. Harley counsels. I have very limited time here, and I try to make the best use of it.<P>Sorry for the abruptness. The fact that I'm sticking with you is a good sign, BTW... <BR>