"This topic also posted on EN Forum"<p>All of the posts I read speak about Woman meeting mens need for admiration.
My WS told me yesterday she did'nt even realize how gerat her need for admiration was. I want to meet her needs and the Love Bank is open. ANy ideas on what to do or say (actions speak louder than words)? I don't want it to seem to contrived or trivial.

Admire her being a good wife or mom if she is a mom too.<p>Admire her for being intelligent and any accomplishments that go with that.<p>Admire her beauty and your awe at her beauty<p>Admire anything good she has done or been to you in your life... my H brought up something he did for me 10 1/2 yrs ago tongight and says he has always been mad that I did not really thank him.. I always appreciated it, adn thought he knew.. but he needs verbal expression and admiration for all of that...<p>I am trying... believe me my H wants to be admired like God's gift to women... I guess at times he can be.. but you who know I recently found out about even more than 1 PA... even if 1, to several nighters for sex only it is hard to admire that.. he has also been fianncialy irresponsible etc... and that is hard to admire.. too.. he finally started turning around,, and along comes another w seeing that he is doing well at a job.. 1st time in my life... and she wants to steal my H... O H MY G!<p>Thanks, HONEY

dadoftheyear,<p>Yes women need admiration too. <p>Let me give you some examples. Years ago my ex-h (V for short) and I went to dinner with some new acquaintances, Dr. S and his wife. V had just started in medical school. Well Dr. S and his wife fawned all over V. They asked him all about his aspirations, yada yada yada. Neither of the men asked either of us women anything about ourselves. To this day all I know about Mrs. S is that she is married to Dr. S and admires him. During the conversation I tried showing some interest in Mrs S but Dr. S immediately turned the conversation to himself and V. Dr. S kept going on and on about how I was so lucky to have nabbed the doctor to be, etc etc. V also never did say anything about me. Neither of us women even existed. At the time I was a very successful software engineer with my own consulting company. My annual income was in excess of what many family practice doctors make even today. I was the sole support of my husband and our infant son and was putting my H through medical school with no debt. By the time dinner was over I felt about 1 inch tall and invisible. Now some people would say that I am being petty, wanting the lime light… that is not the case. I just want to exist, be respected and be part of life.<p>Another example… during the years before we got married, I went shopping for some big ticket items… 35 MM camera with all the different lenses, high end vacuum, furniture, auto, etc. V as with me during each of these transactions. In every case the sales person knew I was a single woman and I was paying with my own money, yet in each and every case, at the end of the transaction the sales person shook V’s (my boyfriend’s) hand and thanked HIM for the business. In the case of the camera, the sales girl (sales bimbo I should say) ignored me completely and started flirting with him, explaining all about cameras to him. He is an amateur photographer in his own right so he did not need this explanation. I just stood there in awe watching her & V's game in action. This was the one time I had some fun. HE selected the camera he thought I should buy and had her ring it up and package it. They batted their eyes at each other through this entire thing. Then asked me for my credit card to pay for it. I looked at the sales clerk, batted by eye lashes at her, and said something like…. “Oh I thought you were selling him a camera. Next time you decide to crawl all over a customer make sure they are the one spending the money.” And I walked out of the store. The manager chased us out as it was a rather large purchase and I explained what had happened. The manager returned to the store livid. Wonder how long she kept her job? I broke up with V a few days after that for that reason and others. I should have never gone back to him a year later.<p>I could pull another dozen out of the air.. They happen to women all the time. Women are very often made to feel that they just simply do not count. That nothing they do is real.. .never as important was what our husbands do. V even went so far as to say it to me that my ‘job’ may have helped while he was in school but now we’d have a ‘real’ income to support the family. WHAT???? Why was my career not real? Why was my support of his education and our family not 'real'? Have never figured this one out.<p>The point that I am trying to make with these examples is that women often feel invisible and that their contributions are not taken seriously. If they work outside of the home, their work is not take seriously and usually takes second place to their husband’s career - even if she earns more. If they are stay at home moms they often feel that no one takes them seriously. With are the contributions your wife makes to your marriage and family? Tell her what is special about them and thank her for it. Think of what she does in her career (home maker or otherwise) that is better then most people and acknowledge it. <p>If you want to earn some real brownie points, be sensitive to the times when she is made invisible as in the examples I gave above and STAND UP FOR HER like you are proud of her. Do you know how much it would have meant to me if V had told Dr. S and his wife of my contributions to his medical career… instead he used to tell me that I had no value to him, that he could have gotten through medical school without me. He also told me that I contributed nothing but money to the household… that was a crock but I will not go into it here. I would have also meant an awful lot to me if V would have reminded those sales clerks that he was not the customer and they were thanking the wrong person.<p>I do these same things for my H… when he does something, even when it is something that I sort of expect him to do, I thank him. If he argues that it’s just what he should do, I tell him that I know it is but that I still appreciate it and want him to know.<p>Another thing that I tell my H is that I admire the way he has opened up to me and faced his daemons from his affairs. That I know it takes a lot of character to do this and my respect has grown tremendously for him doing this and for him helping me heal from the affairs.<p>I praise him when he has an accomplishment at work. He has worked very hard over the last few years to become the national expert in his field for the fortune 50 company he works for.. His skills are in demand all over the country. This is something to admire. <p>And then there are the obvious things… my H has a wonderful sense of humor, he is a great dad, he built a very nice deck in the back yard this summer, he is a very gifted writer. So I often praise him for these types of things when he does something praise worthy. <p>Remember, praise a person’s accomplishments not their gifts from the good Lord. Talents are not earned and are therefore not praiseworthy. But what a person does with a talent can be praiseworthy. <p>And to top it all off I tell him often how much I love and how cute he is. People really like to be admired for their physical attributes too.<p>Men and women are not really all that different in their need for praise and what they can be praised on. The main difference is that woman often feel invisible and very much under appreciated. I think that is why women have blossomed in the work place. At least they get some recognition at work… just like men do. I think that is what your wife has discovered.<p>I hope these examples help some.<p>[ January 01, 2002: Message edited by: zorweb ]</p>

Admiration is certainly my biggest need! My exH was a champion at it! He used to 'show me off' to his friends and co-workers and brag about my career accomplishments. My current H is not as adept, but I still just THRIVE on admiration.

z, those were great examples, and ya know, this is one of my "problems"...I like women (as people) and I am forever asking them about themselves and what they think, and encouraging them, or congratulating them, no wonder I get such enthusiastic responses, you guys are being starved by our cultural practices. At the time I didn't realize it, I was just being me, but the ow had been neglected this way for years, she is a bright, capable woman, whose self-esteem had not been nurtured at all (in fact the opposite), I had no idea the effect I was having on her by listening to her ideas, and encouraging her to blossom, I was just trying to be a good friend, it is what I do to everyone, male and female. Never was a problem before, but this one was different, and things got complicated, but then you allready know that. Now I know how all this works, so will not happen again, whatever the future holds. Everyone needs admiration, and it has annoyed me most of my life how we (our culture) treats females in this regard. We can admire you for your beauty, or sexiness, or even motherhood, but ignore your brains, and skills, and achievements, it's not right.

SNL,<p>Thanks, I was afraid that my examples would be taken for feminist babble. They were not meant that way.<p>Your point about how you got involved with the OW is interesting. Interesting because this is exactly how STL got into his affairs. He was just online chatting.. he was a single dad home alone nights and weekends with his kids.. just like any other single parent. He met people online. Few men would chat more then once or twice.. we probably have a good idea of what they were looking for and he was not going to give it to them. Sooooo, he ended up with female chat buddies. He was the shoulder the cried on and the one who encouraged them. He's a very good person that way. Well, these women were smitten by a nice guy who would actually talk to them and be supportive of them. When I found out about his affairs, talked to him and to the women it was clear. As I explained to him, the sexiest thing to a woman is a man who admires her, gives her attention (affection) and a shoulder to cry on. If guys only knew who easy it is... we don't care about the hair on their chest or how cool their lines are, we just want good friends who can love us. That's it.

babble....lol, hardly, I would say discussing how a fairly young woman started a software company and became financially successful as well would have been very interesting, I sure the "guys" just traded boring stories about college escapades and/or told sexist jokes, I woulda talked to you.

Thanks guys,<p>I could usWould it be seflish if I asked for more specific guestures??<p>Today I will send her an e-mail "admiring" her courage for condidering MB and working on M.

Thanks guys,<p>Would it be seflish if I asked for more specific guestures??<p>Today I will send her an e-mail "admiring" her courage for condidering MB and working on M.

Thanks guys,<p>Would it be seflish if I asked for more specific guestures??<p>Today I will send her an e-mail "admiring" her courage for condidering MB and working on M.

RE: Would it be seflish if I asked for more specific guestures??<p>No not at all..... I'll try to come up with more. Or do you mean if you ask her for ideas of them.<p>RE: Today I will send her an e-mail "admiring" her courage for condidering MB and working on M.<p>This is a wonderful idea.<p>One thing that comes to mind. You know that MB says that it is very important to ask as person what thier EN's are and how they wnat them filled. It is important to do this with admiration too. Do you have any idea what it is your wife feels she has earned admiration for? She has discovered that she likes to be admired. Did she tell you specific things she was admired for that felt good?<p>When you are in a conversation with her, a simple question about. "What are the things that you have done that you are the most proud of?" Perhaps you could both take turns asking and answering questions like this.. get to know each other better.

Z,<p>Thanks so much that is very helpful.<p>Sent the e-mail, no response.<p>"I'll try to come up with more. Or do you mean if you ask her for ideas of them." No, I ment from you wonderful posters out there. <p>"Do you have any idea what it is your wife feels she has earned admiration for? She has discovered that she likes to be admired. Did she tell you specific things she was admired for that felt good?" No and No.<p>"What are the things that you have done that you are the most proud of?" Perhaps you could both take turns asking and answering questions like this.. get to know each other better. " Great Idea!!!<p>Last night I was in bed by 10, Phone rang @ 12:09, 12:35 and 12:51, Caller ID showed Privacy directory. I didn't answer and no message on V-mail. I Have not heard from her today, should I call her to see if if it was her.

One caveat, don't make this like a game, the admiration has to be real, reasonable and not faked. One of the things that drives ws nuts is when their spouse starts a lot of phoney baloney, whether it be mushy little notes, telling us how much the appreiciate whatever, how much they love us, etc. etc..... I know this is a little tricky, but before you admire anything, make sure you really do admire it and are not just looking for something to check off the en list...ya know? This kinda goes back to the radical honesty thingy, and being real, and sincere, not manipulative. Pretty much everyone does something that they can be admired for, that pat on the back thing. We just take each other for granted and do not voice that we really did admire something, or we just kinda don't focus on it and let it slip by. Cooking for example, if your w (cooks?) and makes a good meal, tell her so...but also tell her what you don't like, or would like her to make etc..... and never never say something is good, great, if you don't really think so. If she tries to make something and it flops, admire the effort, taking the risk, etc. etc. there are lots of ways to admire. Even if someone fails at something admiring the hard effort (if applicable) or taking the chance, or some spin off benefit etc.

Sad,<p>Thanks, I realize it is a fine line, and she will be exceptionally sensitive to this. <p>Any thought on my question regrding calling her?

dadoftheyear,<p>Sure, call her. If you are on fairly good terms with her why not? I assume that you are in Plan A. It's certainly a good excuse to talk.<p>A thought came to mind. Sometimes we can show admiration (and respect) indirectly. Asking them for help is one way. Like if you are cooking your own dinners now, and she makes something that you really like. Call her, tell her that you always loved that dish (whatever it was) and ask her for the recipe. <p>What is her career field? There may be questions you can ask her… like if she is into computers ask her for help selecting software or with a computer problem. If she is in banking or finance, ask her for her opinion on an investment or an account. If she is a waitress, ask her about the different restraints to have lunch with a work friend, or what wines to use, etc etc. <p>Sometimes when people feel that thy want admiration, some of what they what is non-sexual affection. I’d suggest that you take a trip to the book store and look at the book 1001 ways to be Romantic by Godek. There are some thoughts and ideas in that book that might help you in this area. <p>To be able to give you more examples we need to know more about her. What are her hobbies? What is her career field? What was her latest achievement at work? Last promotion? Things like that. Tell us about her, brag a little while you are at it.

ZWeb,<p>Thanks, I go to the bookstore tomorrow.<p>She recently got a job as the office manager for a small commercial construction company, i don't even jknow her Job description or how large teh company is. She spends a lot of time working on spread sheets. <p>She play tennis, (I never said anything to her but she is not as good as she thinks, FIL and I have discussed this). And thats not really revelant to me. Just additionally commentary. She rollerblades and is a good mom. She is very pretty and since she left me lost about 10-15 pounds and got in good shape. (Looking for a new hubby).<p>She somkes, wihch is a major LB for me , 19 month son has severe asthma.<p>Goodhouse keeper but not a good cook. [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I'll post another update.

DOTY
I agree with SNL--don't make things too obvious .there is a fine line and you don't want to all of a sudden gush on admiration and look like you are "fishing" for other rewards.<p>H has read HN/HN and SAA with me, so he knows about MB guidelines. H and I have been "playing" a game it seems lately. One thing I am really good at is finding things.......If he needs something and I go out of my way to find it, I ask first "Is this depositing love units or is it just a waste of my time?"
Or I'll find whatever the item is and say"" How many units, honey?
Its a way to find out how important some traits,deeds, whatever are important to you and how willing your spouse is to do them for you. There is a cost to everything. So, if he nastily wanted something, of course, I would probably walk the other way and leave him on his own, however if he asked me for help in finding something, I make sure in a non-LB way that he knows and appreciates this service I am doing for him. Its reciprocal.<p>Yesterday I hinted I was cold and had to ask him to make a fire. He forgot for several hours and when I mentioned I was cold again, (not with the intent of him actually making the fire this time, just stating my feelings/sensations), he immediately apologized for forgetting to make the fire earlier and went and made it. Now I could have made the fire myself, but I was just too lazy to do it. I really appreciated him making the fire and when he did I told him so.<p>Other corny examples of appreciation that my H can say to me:
"Man, I love coming home to a clean house, it looks great!!! Thanks for making it special for me to come home."<p>"Wow, Thanks for getting the oil changed on the car. I know you have to take the girls and wait and all. I really appreciate it."<p>"Thanks for mailing out my expense reports and making copies. You know that is such a pain for me to get to the post office."<p>*Thanks for getting the car washed/vacuumed/...smelling nice as it was such a pit."<p>"Oh, I really loved that backrub you gave me"<p>Now admiration can be a reward in itself, but if you are looking to build up the love deposits, you can include an added "reward bonus".....an example would be:
"Hey, I really appreciated your ironing my shirt on such short notice, I was thinking of you and brought home your favorite cookies, (could be pop, candy, coupon for babysitting time of her choice--give her 2 free hours from the kids on the weekend)
other coupons could include:
Coupon would state: In appreciation of _________ you are entitled to:<p> * H would make breakfast on Sunday morning and clean up
* take her out to breakfast as an alternative if you don't do dishes.
* 20 minute body massage/rub (with no s*x if thats an issue)
*She can suggest a video and YOU will go out and get it to watch together.<p>ZORWEB I really enjoyed and agreed with your post. You can say it right woman!!! (two thumbs up for you!)

Mikkey,
Thats great, someof this would be easier if we lived together.<p>One example is:<p>She needs new eyeglasses, (5yr old broke them), A new friend of mine is a wholesaler for designer frames, I told her I could get them at wholesale cost, Just tell me what you want, I said. Still waiting since last Friday. <p>
I get it. I just have to pick my spots and be sincere.

Just wanted to say this..you said that she needs new glasses and 'you' offered to get them for her..WONDERFUL, but don't wait for HER to call you, Call her and ask her if she'd like to go on
such and such a date to get the glasses..<p>If you say 'your' going to do something, then you should be the one to make the move to do so..<p>example..my stbx had problems w/ 'his' computer..
he asked if I could fix it, I told him to let me know when would be a good time for him, to have me come over and look at it..he never did..then he got mad at me for not coming over to fix it..I was like..excuse me..I said.."Let me know when would be a good time for you" -- I felt it was 'his' computer if he wanted it fixed he could let me know when was a good time..it didn't affect me that he didn't have a computer..and I didn't just volunteer to fix it..he asked if I could..I didn't know his work schedule because it's changed so much recently, some days he's worked nights some days...I did ask him if he had it fixed..he said no..I asked him again, well when would you like me to take a look at it..it was rather funny, he said his sister in law had came down (she has her own company working on computers) and she spent like 3 or 4 hours trying to fix it..and never could..when I finally got it from him it took me an hour to fix it..what upset me, is that it's a company computer and he could have just taken it to them
and they would have given him another one..but, he was afraid they would have kept it since they don't know he even has it..go figure..<p>So if you volunteered to take her, then you should call and schedule a time w/ her to take her..it's the actions here that matter most..that you will
'follow' through with something that you said you would do..you can tell her to your blue in the face that you'll do it..but if you don't call her
to set up a time to do it..it means NOTHING!!!

Great Ideas Zorweb,<p>Admiration is one of my biggest needs too...and my H rarely filled it.<p>Admiration was also one of my H's biggest needs and we always noticed work he had done, accomplishments,etc.etc.<p>I don't know why I didn't have an affair!!!!! [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img]