agreed one "fuses" to some extent when participating in a common emotional enviroment...is that automatically a good thing (just needing tweaking, or a bad thing needing surgury)?<p>1. Co-dependentcy...no.<p>2. Battered wife syndrome...no.<p>3. Stockholm syndrome...no.<p>4. religious cults...no.<p>In these cases the differentiation is to get the hell out of dodge, such is often the case too in marriage IMO....because the raw ingredients (2 people) are ill-suited for marital intimacy...although they may do quite well as friends.<p>Yes, cali, I know I am shooting in the dark a bit, thinker won't give me the book, and I am chomping at the bit to address these issues (from what I have picked up by others comments)...I may shoot myself in the foot, but if I do, I will recant.<p>cali... But have you ever analyzed WHY you want out? And, I don't mean the usual stuff... but the real underlying reason WHY you must leave your marriage to become a happy individual? <p>snl..Yes, I have, in detail. That is what you have been witness too for the last year.<p>cali...That is the crux of what Schnarch is saying. That nobody WANTS to or is really READY to be married...<p>snl...I would disagree with that.<p>cali...but that marriage is a place of growth... where two people learn to be INTERDEPENDENT, and INDEPENDENT as well... <p>snl...Life is growth, marriage no different. But you do not learn to be independent in marriage, you lesrn that by being alive no matter your circumstance. In marriage you learn to be willingly vulnerable....a very unnatural act.<p>cali...and, as you have stated, that doesn't occur in many marriages because we are wont to really get at the heart of who we are and why we do what we do w/out putting the blame and justification on someone else. <p>snl..True, introspection is a little practiced human behaviour...most folks live life reactively.<p>cali...It is when you realize who your are, why you are and how you 'dance' with your partner that you begin to differentiate . <p>snl...I guess I will have to read the exact definition of differentiate. But realizing the nature of the dance is crucial to resolution of relationship issues.<p>cali...You meet your crucible and go to the next level... or you run away to be separate and alone or to another who is at the same level of differentiation as you are.<p>snl...There is another choice, realizeing you have reached the highest level possible (for you both) and setting each other free, or settling for no more growth....but safety, comfort, contentment....a contractural needs based relationship.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>snl...There is another choice, realizeing you have reached the highest level possible (for you both) and setting each other free, or settling for no more growth....but safety, comfort, contentment....a contractural needs based relationship. <hr></blockquote><p>Yes... and I am "reaching critical mass" (subject near the end of the book) on that choice as well.<p>Cali

hey cali take it easy, one can disagree with what they think is being presented, as long as they realize they don't have the full picture...there were no disclaimers here about posting only if you have read the whole book....and even a paragraph is still saying things...plus none of this is new, it is all (IMO) pretty much the same theme through the self-help, repair marriage at all cost mindset (not saying that is wrong, just that it is a very common mindset)...the words change, the authors change, but really cali...how many different ways can we talk about marriage....it either boils down to you do it for the picture, cause you are married...or you focus on the mental health of the people in it...that is really all there is (and religion can be tweaked to support all viewpoints)....IMO it all eventually boils dowm to the same thing....you stay married if you want to, and you leave if you don't...the rest of it is just interesting details.<p>so is that critical mass referenceing the "discussion" about marriage...or your own life?....or maybe both huh....poor lexxy, bet she is still pulling the buckshot out of her as*..er derrierre.

For the record - SNL - I am reading the book, and you will have to wait till I am done. There was no statement that I won't give you the book. Please state things correctly, and quit criticizing me. Remember, being radically honest is your #1 need, and I am being radically honest [img]images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0[/img] .<p>Yes, SNL and I have a lot in common, that is why we dated, and did so many things together. Now SNL says, he doesn't love me, the age thing, the OW and her pleasures, the don't fit thing, the don't understand thing. This all goes down the same road, SNL and himself. SNL doesn't see the picture clearly, the wife (me) he hurt, the children he hurt, and the one son that read his dads e-mail that was graphic about sex. <p>This is where we do not fit. I would never in my life leave anything sexually unfit for a child to read, or for a teenager to read. Unless it was for the right of explaining sex, or the education of sex. SNL made it clear during his affair to let everyone know that he was talking to a woman and it was more than friends. How did our daughter hear him call his OW a special name, and he loved her. I would of kept it very private, but not the WS. Like I said, they care so little about their family, children, relatives. They care so little about all the pain, and disruptiveness that has happened. Even today, SNL is not remorseful or guilty about his affair. He said he will never be. <p>The book is quite good in explaining the differentiate thing. I am only up to 97 pages. I am so busy cleaning this house that I have very little time to post here and by the time I get to bed I read a few pages and I am done.<p>SNL seems to find time to post. Guess he always will, he is suppose to be fixing the house he is in so his mother can move in before she gets evicted out of her house. SNL get going on the house, your mother loves you and needs a place to live.

sorry, didn't mean to imply it was unavailable for malicious reasons, just not available.

Thank you for the correction, your statement has been accepted as an apology, apology accepted.