I am really at a place where I could use some help.

2 weeks ago on Monday, I discovered that my husband of nearly 21 years has been having an affair with another woman. The affair lasted for 9 months. Started as a drunken night in February when he was out of town (in a town that is 3 hours away, for our son�s hockey tournament). Then a month later, they got together again and the affair started.

They met several times a week in hotels and such, he taking a �late lunch break� from work�I have no clue how she was able to constantly take these 10 days away from work and her kids and drive here for a 1 hour tryst.

He says that at first, she really wanted him to leave me and was truly disparaging toward me. Then at some point he said that he didn�t want to leave me and they began planning a polygamous marriage together. Then, they began introducing her to me and pretty much shoving her down my throat, �she wanted to be my best friend.� She has fallen in love with our family and loves hanging out with us and having good times together.

I was a little trepidatious, however, I accepted that she is a single mom, she needs �family style� friends and truth be told, I could use a few more friends myself. I kept wondering why her feelings were so overboard, and why was my husband pushing her on me so much?

Meantime, our youngest daughter and her youngest daughter hit it off famously, became friends and gave us another excuse to constantly get together.

I still didn�t feel right about everything, but kept saying, �why are you being so suspicious? He is simply being a good fried!�

He began to help her look for a house to purchase near us so the girls could play together, I helped too, and found a really cute house for her�because �she has been thinking of moving here� her kids play sports here in town (something my husband helped set up for her).

All the while, I am getting e-mails from her, how much she loves me and my family and is so glad that God has brought us together�and I never knew my husband was sleeping with her.

Now, I have had some health issues over the past couple of years (3 exactly), for the past 12 months, I have been getting better and better, my Dr.�s and I have been working hard at it and truly seeing great results and recovery, something my husband couldn�t see because he was so blinded by the affair and their scheming.

She found bible verses that supposedly support the lifestyle they were planning�so much literature and planning�and this was not the type of polygamy where each wife has her own house, this was where the 3 of us would share a bed and a house and our big happy family with all of our kids running around�she said she would have more kids for him, since I only gave him 3 and 2 of them are daughters�and on and on�.

There are really too many details to go into�

So, I found out on Monday, he presented this idea to me and was very upset that I didn�t accept this plan they had developed over the past several months�because they were doing this �for me,� so that I would have someone to take care of me and look after me if husband should die, and because she wants to be able to take care of me and my health, provide massage therapy and such to help me heal.

I cried for hours and the hurt of when I finally drug the truth out of him about the affair, well, I know that everyone here understands that.

The emotional roller coaster has been utterly amazing, I had no idea I could feel so many things all at once.

We went to see our Pastor and we are seeking counseling. I have made a choice to forgive him and we are moving forward in an effort to make our relationship work. This website has been helpful, lots of good information.

He has cut off all contact with her (except for the times that we HAVE to see her at our kids� sports activities�and now I make sure I am ALWAYS there). He lets me know immediately if she contacts him. He forwards to me any texts, or e-mails and tell s me if she tries to call. He says that he is not responding to any of her attempts. I am choosing to believe him, although I still don�t trust him and am so afraid that he is actually contacting her and laughing at me and my emotions�

I�m sure you can see so many questions in this glimpse of a story�not the least of which is whether anyone else experienced this type of affair where their spouse wanted and planned a polygamous relationship? I sure could use some support because this seems a little different than other situations.

My big problem right now is how to deal with the e-mails she keeps sending�she is closing on her house which is just 2 miles from ours and is e-mailing my husband every day about how much she loves him and misses him and wants to be with him and have him be a father to her kids...

I don�t know how to deal with my feelings, because when I read the e-mails, I just feel overwhelmed again.

I don�t know how to tell her to stop; husband and I both agree that if she knows these e-mails are bothering me then the floodgates will open.

How do we get this to stop? What steps should we take? What types of things should I expect from her? I know she regards herself as married to my husband, but she must realize that is not true.

What types of things have the other person done to try to further drive a wedge between a husband and wife?

I feel like I need to brace myself, but I have no clue what to expect�or how to get her to stop.

I am sorry for the long rambling; first post here, but I could really use some support and advice.

Thanks,

Intears

I am sorry you are here. Your marriage is not going to make it unless they end ALL CONTACT. That means everything, even if you have to yank your kids off the sports teams and move to another state. Your marriage will never make it this way because he will never withdraw from her.

In order to recover, he should send her a no contact letter fashioned like the one in Surviving an Affair and commit to NEVER EVER seeing or talking to her again. He should change his email address and give you his cell phone TODAY. Telling you about contact is worthless because it does not undo the damage of the contact itself.

Secondly, every one should be told about your H's adultery. Your children, all of your parents, everyone. Your children have been introduced to his adultery and as a result, have been taught that wrong is right. Your kids need to know that OW is their enemy and they are to steer clear of her.

If there is anyway you can sabatoge her house buying, I would do it, because having her 2 miles away will mean a death of thousand cuts for you. Your H and you will be perpetaully triggered by this skankho. Just seeing her children at school will trigger you both. That is how 1 year affairs become 10 year affairs.

Please get the book, Surviving an Affair, because that will help you understand what you are dealing with here.

I'm so sorry you are here. He has TOTALLY lost his mind. Give him a while w/ plan A, but if he doesn't halt this crap go PLAN B/D!!! DUDE

You came to the right place to help save your marriage. The vets will be along soon but you need to do a few things first.

1. Click on "notify" at the bottom of your post and ask the mods to move it to "Surviving and Affair". You'll get your best advice there.done!

2. Buy Harley's book "Surviving an Affair"--read it, read up on all his basic concepts and begin working the program.

3. Have your husband immediately write a NC letter (samples are here on this website). You approve it and YOU deliver/mail it to make sure it got there.

4. Have him give you all passwords, cell phone bills--everything. Put a keylogger on his computer. A GPS tracker in his car. He needs to be totally transparent for you. Trust, but verify.

5. No contact means no contact. Your kids will have to play in a different sports league.

More I'm sure, will come if the mods move your thread.

Being at sports activities misses the point. And she should NEVER contact him. He is responsible for ensuring that there is no contact EVER.

Please read these links:

How to Survive Infidelity

Requirements for Recovery

Exposure is your most powerful weapon against this affair: Exposure

Dr. Harley: http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5060_qa.html


My advice is to write a final letter in a way that the victimized spouse would agree to send it. It should begin with a statement of how selfish it was to cause those they loved so much pain, and while marital reconciliation cannot completely repay the offense, it's the right thing to do. A statement should be made about how much the unfaithful spouse cares about his spouse and family, and for their protection, has decided to completely end the relationship with the lover. He or she has promised never to see or communicate with the lover again in life, and asks the lover to respect that promise. Nothing should be said about how much the lover will be missed. After the letter is written, the victimized spouse should read and approve it before it is sent


[from SAA, pg 58]

OW, I want you to know that out of respect and love for my wife and children, I have come to realize that I must never see or talk to you again. My relationship with you was a cruel indulgence that BS did not deserve. While I cannot completely repay BS for the pain I caused her, I will do my best to become the husband she has been missing. I care a great deal for my family and I would not want to do anything to risk their happiness. I will not make any further contact with you and I do not want you to make any contact with me. Please respect my desire to end our relationship.

Sincerely, XXXXX

My sympathies.
I don't mean to be facetous. But, seriously, is your husband of normal intelligence? He sounds, well, impaired.
I cannot imagine anyone, fog or no fog, being offended/surprised by a reaction such as yours, if he had any semblance of an intellect.
This guy sounds a few standard deviations(at least) away from normal in any respect.
I think you should briadcast this to anyone close to you and let this nutjob of a husband deal with the reactions.

Two standard deviations at what confidence interval?? I think he is the tail end of the empirical rule!! DUDE

Dude, have you ever read anything as bizzare as what this guy proposed? This makes the folks on Springer seem like Ward and June.

Zelmo, we have seen this before where a very wayward wayward will make up some cute name like "polygamy" or "3-D marriage" or "swinging" to white wash their adultery. These are usually the very manipulative WS's. I don't know if that is the case here, but I suspect there has been alot of gaslighting going on.

Damn, I live a sheltered life. This strains credulity. Not just the planned polygamy, but the genuine surprise/disappointment he displayed is mind boggling. I wonder if he is somehow related to Manson or Rasputin.

Thank you for your fast replies...I will stay here and listen to what you are saying.

MelodyLane--I am in the process of reading your suggestions and Ourhouse--purchasing the SAA book is next on my list...

I know this is a most crazy situation...and I truly am at a loss.

What is "gaslighting?"

Thank you,

Intears

You are in excellent hands with Melody. Listen to her and do what she says. Your best chance of saving your marriage is to follow Dr. Harley's advice and Melody will give you that advice unadulterated.

And if you want to go the counseling route once the affair is OVER (and it must be over...), phone counseling with the Harleys or even better, a MB weekend, is great.

May help you navigate the advice you'll be getting...
http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2251936&page=1

Thank you for your quick replies...

I am reading the website and the SAA book is my next stop.

Writing a letter may be difficult, but I know it needs to be done.

I am still spinning from everything, so I will keep on reading your suggestoins...and thank you for your support!

InTears

intears, welcome to MB. Here is an old MB thread on gaslighting:

http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/u...in=146375&Number=1954184#Post1954184

To Zelmo and others: As Melody said, WS trying to foist this kind of lifestyle on their BS is not all that uncommon. Google "swinging" or "polyamory" or "polygamy" and be prepared for your jaw to hit the floor.

My XWH never tried to push this on me, because he wanted two separate lives for himself: one where he was married and one where he was single. But this "swinging" stuff is not as uncommon as you might think.

FYI, Will Smith and Jada Pinkett-Smith are reputed to be into this. Don't know for sure though, but there have been rumors for years.
Mulan

No way - I can't believe it - the fresh prince of bel air - no .

Intears,
Sorry you are here - great advice from everyone. My only caution to you is to make sure you understand what it takes to R a M. You don't want to make the mistake of false recovery because you go by what your WH is telling you or falsely acting the way he thinks you want him to act. Be on your toes and pay attention to everything. Make sure you understand what you need and want to make the M work. The length that your H went to did kinda shock me. I just find it hard to believe he is so quick to turn around - that's why I question his (possibly) pretend behavior.


Gg

He's still fielding e-mails from her? That means he hasn't cut off contact with her. Cutting off contact means a No-Contact letter with "Extraordinary Precautions" [read about 'em on this site] that YOU can verify. Change the e-mail address or cancel the account. Same with the cellphone numbers.

The house thing is a little creepy. I know you've got enough on your mind, but you'd better make sure she's not a bunny-boiler. I did some bad stuff during my A., and am not one to cast stones, but this is really weird.

Hello Intrears, Im so sorry you are going through this
All the above advice is great and i know you are trying to take some of it on board but there is some advice that will need to be implemented immediately to avoid further complications.

The immediate action is EXPOSURE, you need to expose the affair to everyone you can because this might just be the ticket to keeping OW from moving to your town/area. Yes i know it brings embarassment etc, but the more people know the more people will keep eye on them, the more people know the more peole can shame her and she might just decide not to move.

The above are aimed at OW but there is a great side to Exposure that hit WS too, it will make him think about what he has done if he had more people to answer too, he may be able to get around you because you are emotionally drained right now but he wont be able to get round others (like his family and friends for example). I can guarantee you he wont like the idea of you telling everyone and he will be angry with you but you have the great excuse that your doing it to keep OW from coming to your town and beleive me its good for him to be questioned about his actions from everyone around him.

Good Luck

Like Gloveoil pointed out, he has most certainly NOT cut off all contact with her.

I've been to a swingers club once(Not knowing)..I can't imagine people exist like that. What is a marriage anyway? People are just F UP!! DUDE

First thing - block her email address. Your WH shouldn't be getting any emails at all.

Secondly, your WH needs to confess to others (friends, family) so he has others to hold him accountable. I might contact OW's family to hopefully get someone to talk some sense into her on her end.

Thirdly, you should not see this woman at all. If your kids are in sports together, find somewhere else for them to play. If you can move, then move.

It has been 3 weeks yesterday since D-Day. I am still going through so many feelings...I hope someoone has a bit of advice for me on this one...

There is one feeling that I could really use some help with...I am trying so hard not to hate the OW. I know that is not a productive feeling to have and i am truly trying to focus on making our marriage what is should be...WS is doing good right now. I am still monitoring everything he does, cell phone, e-mail, etc. and counseling is going well, we have an appointment later today.

Sometimes I feel like we can make this work, but then I start thinking about why we are going through such emotional turmoil, and then the thought that I hate the OW pops into my mind. Like I said, I know this is not a productive feeling. Hatred is not an emotion that is a part of me, it is not who I am. In fact, I would be hard presed to even think of someone in this world that I hate.

How do I refocus this into something positive? Or should I even bother...and just let the feeling be?

Thanks,
intears

Don't bother...hating the person who tore your life apart and emotionally raped you is completely normal. If you DIDN'T hate her, I would be more worried.

Eventually that will fade to ambivalence...you will not care anymore. But for now, it's absolutely normal. You are very early in this process, I am sorry to say.

I am sorry you are here...stick around and you will get a lot of support.

(((intears)))

Like you i had those feeligs to,i kept reading and understanding why afairs happen that seems to work for me and i decided to give up the energy i used for haterid and apply it to solving my issues aswell as my wifes.
Monitoring e-mails ,phone,etc uses energy and time and will disstract you from more important things ,it will also drive you nuts.
good luck

burro,

Checking up on a wayward is recommended here on MB.

If nothing else it helps a newly betrayed spouse feel more secure and tells you if NC is still in place.

When you have been in recovery for awhile, you don't need to check as much, but I think most of the BS's here still check up occasionally. I do.

Best wishes for your recovery.

Love in Christ,
Miss M

intears,

It is completely normal to dislike the ow. Hate even. You will get better as time goes by and you get further along in recovery.

I understand. There was no one I ever hated before ow. It is hard, but you will get thru it.

{{intears}}
Welcome. We've been there and we'll help you. It is normal to feel hatred for the OW. Understand that an outsider to your M has violated your life in the worst possible way. You are a VICTIM. That hatred will probably diminish as you process the A. Expect to feel some anger/rage toward your WH if you haven't yet. It may get worse before it gets better - that's normal. As a matter of fact, it may get worse, then better, then worse, then better...that's called the rollercoaster. Expect it. Don't be afraid of your feelings. They are there to help you.
It is normal to monitor and snoop. Keep doing so - it will help rebuild your trust in your WH.
Read everything on this site and listen to the vets on here. You'll get all the help and tools you need to get through this terrible time.

Thank you. I appreciate the support and hugs.

I keep finding intersting informaiotn on the site and will keep checking in with questions...

intears

intears, there is nothing wrong in you to have such emotions, do not worry. And it is normal and absolutely necessary to check and verify long after D-Day. False recoveries are quite common here.

I know I have only posted here a couple of times (but I do read), I am the woman whose husband had an affair after nearly 21 years and during the affair the OW and he had developed a plan for a polygamous marriage, which, after coming here, I learned is not all that unusual for a WS to come up with some kind of swinging or "open marriage" type of plan.

Now, we seem to be doing okay, he did have a short period where he broke no contact via texting for 2 weeks, yet during that time, I *knew* something was up, but couldn't quite catch it if you know what I mean...that was in January. Now we have been 2 months with no contact, counseling is going well. We are working on issues that had been present in our marring before the affair.

I hope that I'm not sticking my foot in my mouth when I say that. I am still so unsure of myself and what I am seeing in our relationship. I hope that one day I will begin to feel confident again. He swears he is having no contact, that he is in love with me and only me and that he wants us to continue to work together to strengthen our marriage�I tend to believe him, but I am definitely not sticking my head in the sand...

My question has to do with the OW�how long does she typically hang on??? I mean in a simplified version, there are people having affairs all over the world, and BS finding out, then there is either reconciliation or not and when there is reconciliation, the OP goes away at some point, right? (like I said, VERY simplified version).

For us, it has been 5 months and she is still hanging on. She no longer texts, calls or e-mails my husband, however, she is e-mailing me�through my work account, which our server there does not have the capability to block her e-mails (I checked with my IT person). These e-mails to me are a constant reminder of her, the affair and all that goes with it�how she believes she is married to my husband because they had sex (apparently, I�ve learned, there are some polygamous Christian groups out there that are proponents of this)�and now the e-mails are turning into love letters to me! How she is attracted to both male and female, how much she loves me and on and on�and the flowers being sent to my office (huge bouquets)!

I never respond to the e-mails, in speaking with our counselor, we had decided that was best, however, after our most recent session, I decided that after the next e-mail arrives, I will send her a very specific cease and desist e-mail letting her know I will be seeking legal consult to obtain a restraining order.

In my heart, I just want o reply F* off you crazy B**! But I think that would only escalate things.

Anyone here have experience with this type of behavior form the OW or can you point me in the right direction for support? How long does the OP generally hold out? I feel like I am in some weird stalker movie!

It feels so good just sharing this with someone else!

Thanks,
intears

Absolutely! She is mentally ill so I would get a restraining order against her.

That's what I'm thinking! It's hard because she and I were becomoing friends before all of this, but I had no clue she was so off balance!

If you're using Outlook, you can create your own rule to automatically trap and delete those messages.

Find a more competent IT person, blocking junk emails and spam is huge business, easy and should be part of any work environment.

If you have Outlook, right click the message. A menu box will appear. Scroll down to Junk Email and choose Add Sender to Blocked Senders List.

I do it all the time for stuff our firewall doesn't catch.

And this chick is nuttier than squirrel poo. I'd file for the RO like, yesterday!

They can hang on for a long, long, LONG time...years, even. 5 months isn't that long in bunny-boiler OW's timeframes, unfortunately.

The good news is the longer they hang on, the crazier they look to the FWS (your H may begin to feel worse and worse for what he has done while she is showing her "true colors"...that is a good time for you to be able to comfort HIM which is very healing in recovery).

While stuff like this is annoying, it can work to your advantage as your FWH cringes more and more at what he got involved with, and YOU end up looking more and more like the gem that you are!

Not saying this to scare you but a big YES on that RO. Make sure you are saving all of the emails/receipts/pictures of the flowers, etc.

Thanks, I appreciate the feedback...and I completely agree that she is crazy and have been saving all the e-mails, took pics of the flowers, etc. The RO is only a step away...

I sooooo just want her to go away. Just leave us alone, each time she contacts me, I feel as if it is two steps forward, one step back. At least as far as my healing is concerned. My next big step is learning how to focus and not let her pull my attention away from our healing process...

I was hoping though, that someone might say, oh yes...the OW usually goes away and starts her own path of healing within a few months of realizing that it is over. But I knew in my heart the answers I would find...just grasping at straws...crazy I know!

Maybe you can get the RO for both you and your H because if you put the RO on you alone she might go back to stalking him. That will kill 2 birds with 1 stone (and save a bunny)

save a bunny.... haha

yes, I am looking at putting all 5 of us there, she has also showed up uninvited to my oldest son's sports games... that one actually scared me a bit (understatement of the year there)...

Have you considered paying an attorney to act as your counsel to write a cease & desist order and threatening legal action if she doesn't comply? That might alarm her enough to make her back off.

But be ready to go forward with the RO if she doesn't.

My only question is what are you waiting for??? Need to get this done today. She is unstable...truly.

Wow. Just wow.
Flowers?

If you're not telling (F?)WH about these attempted contacts you should. He needs to know about her craziness too; you don't want crazy OW to contact him and him be kind of blindsided by it all.

Other than that I think I would talk to an attorney. They shouldn't charge much for drafting a letter on scary attorney letterhead stationery. Like others said though... if you threaten legal action be prepared to follow through. Otherwise this will look like Fantasy Island before she's done.

This might be a TJ

Is it possible to file a sexual harrassment claim against someone you don't work with?

To me, this stinks of SH....I'd say sue the socks offa her, but she'd prolly like that...

It appears to be vaguely sexual in nature, but I don't think it fits the definition of 'sexual harassment'.
It DOES fit the definition of harassment, though. And the fact that she has shown up around your children makes it imperative that you get some legal advice. IMO.

Wow, I experienced for the first time, a response to a trigger...but this was the absolute craziest thing I have ever heard of...I was making dinner, which just so happened to be be the same dish that we had prepared together in my kitchen when I thought the OW was my friend. I was alone in the kitchen slicing peppers and onions and somehting about it must have caused me to start thinking of the entire affair and all that has come with it.

I didn't even realize what was happening...but by the time my husband walked into the kitchen to join me, I was nearly in a state of panic. He immediately saw what was happening, and helped me to relax and comforted/reassured me.

I just thought it was a little crazy though...I have been prepared for and experienced responses (although nothing to this degree)to different things, restaurants, hotels, even the clothes he was wearing on D-day...but Fajitas???!! Who would have thought those innocent little peppers and tortillas would have thrown me into a panic?

Amazing how can something so simple can upset me so much...

As a way to understand this it is quite likely to do with the smell of fajitas in association with the event and emotions experienced.

The smell triggered you.

The sense of smell can be extraordinarily evocative,
bringing back pictures as sharp as photographs of scenes
that had left the conscious mind.
-- Thalassa Cruso,


Here's a blog on it. Sense of Smell

Mr. W

So sorry this happened to you.

Something similar happened to me years ago, but it wasn't sense of smell. My grandfather used to babysit my sis and I from time to time. He always had these little lemon meringue tarts. Anyway, he died when I was 22, I was sad and life went on.

A couple of years later, I was at a bakery where I saw the little lemon pies, and just burst into tears. Really a strange feeling. But shows how powerful memories are.

I'm sorry if this has been asked before, i have searched and can't find this answer. Is there a way to do a reverse look up on cell phone numbers? I've tried some internet searching, every site I look at I'm afraid is some scam.

Does anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks,

I think you can do it on intelius.com. They don't charge unless they can ID the #.

thank you, perhaps I'll give that one a try.

I've used intelius.com and several others. I didn't find any of the to be a scam.

One of them even help me locate the new cell phone number of the other woman. The day I found out about the affair, the first sign for me that it was someone I knew was that the OW changed her cell phone. I used Phone Search Central
sales@phonesearchcentral.com. They were able to locate the OW new cell phone number by getting the transfer information from her old cell number. They were very helpful and I would use them again.

I've used www.emailfinder.com and www.peoplelookup.com. In addition in installed a keylogger, which was one of the best things I could have done. You can also get a automated voice recorder. I've become quite the detective.

This one has been helpful to me:

http://www.phonenumber.com/reversephone

I don't know if it will give you everything you need to know but, for myself, it has given me many answers when I need(ed) them.

Good luck. :-)

If all else fails, have your friend call it and ask who it belongs to. Or social engineer it out of her.

"Hi! you have won a free get away for two nights for you and one person at the Wolf resorts in Timbucktoo. All we need is confirmation of your full name!"

Just a little update....

We seem to be moving along fairly well. Sill in MC, which helps so much.

OW hasn't contacted me since March, no more flowers or anything...thank goodness!!! She has tried to contact WS adn left 2 voicemails, which he of course, listened to with me. you know the drill, she *needs* soemone to talk to because she had a friend die...or the last one was they were being evacuated from their home due to a forest fire...

That one turned a little difficult to deal with because then WS was focussed on her safety adn such, which opened him to start thinking aobut her and the affair.

which then caused me to trigger about hte whole thing. I am proud of us that we were able to talk it through. And the thing is, I did pray for her and her family, and for all the families affected by hte fires out there...but other than the caring on a basic level of I wouldn't wish the destruction of anyone's home...I really just don't care. I don't care about her or her kids or her family. I don't want anything to do with her...and i don't care what she does, as long as she stays away from me and my family.

I know that it is strange that I understand he is going through a phase of getting over the affair, he talks wiht the counselor about it...every now and then he talks about why we can't all be friends, I told him when he says things like that, it tells me that he doesn't really understand no contact and why we have to have it. That he doesn't understand just how deep the hurt and betrayal go for me.

Here's an odd question...does recieving a voicemail mean that no contact was broken on WS part?

Thanks for just letting me talk a little...it helps so much knowing there are others out here who understand...

One Day....

One day, I KNOW all of this will be better...one day, I know I won't hurt so much...but, right now is today and for some reason, today is a rough day...feelings can be so overwhelming...one nice thing though is that my fwh (I will call add that Formerly there from now on...although he keeps on having to earn that designation) could tell I was having a bad day and walked over to my office from his office, picked up lunch on the way and we had lunch together...(we normally have lunch together, but due to scheduling issues, I wasn't able to get out of the office today...)

I know he is working on learning to meet my emotional needs, which is such a positive step (in my mind)...

Just wanted to let you know, I read your thread and really am praying for you. I found out my husband had affair with ow and also men, and found out a month after giving birth to our son, its been 4 months since Dday and I still feel like its day one. My H is doing everything to be transparent, and going to counseling, but I am just so angry and hurt. I really really wish you well, and hope we both make it to the Full recovery thread one day. Take care ((((intears))))

Thank you so much, I appreciate your thoughts and prayers. i have read your thread too...I find it difficult ot post because i am a rather shy person and I don't know why, but it even translates here...it does help so much to know there are others out here going through the same things and working to re-build their marriage in a healthy, stable way.

I understand completely what you are saying too, sometimes, even though he is doing everything to be transparent and accountable to me, some days I am still so hurt...and my mind can wander and think of about a thousand different ways he could possibly be in contact wiht her that I would never be able to find out about...

Here's to full recovery!!!!

Wow...nearly 8 months now...who would have thought I or we could make it this far. I know we still ahve so far to go, and I feel as though we are at a critical point...one where we will see if the principles such as MB and counseling have relaly started to take hold in our marriage, or if one (or both) of us will fall back into old habits...I am so hopeful for us...he seems to be as well and has stopped one LB behavior (where he was using me to talk though his feelings of 'overcoming' his addiction to her)...talking ot a ocunselor aobut it rather than me...certainly helps my peace of mind!

I am glad to hear that you are doing better. It is hard to break old habits but as long as you constantly try to improve, you will make stride towards a new you each day. Are you using all of the parts of MB? Is your WH on board with it?

Yes, I am. He has read through the website,but has not joined/read the forums...and we are awaiting the arrival of HNHN to read together. We ahven't done that one yet...

He is on-board with recovering our marriage, at least that is what he says to me and I see it in the way he is acting, spending time together (although we aren't quite to 15 hours, more like 10 a week)...he is being accountable and transparent...however, I still have what I call 'trust issues'...but mainly feeling that I have to keep making sure he is staying on track...like I said in one of my earlier posts, just that feeling of there's probably 100's of ways he could probably be in contact with her...but I suppose trust has to come at some point, I have to look at the positives of his behavior and how he is working to earn back my trust...

It's great that your WH is on board with MB. You really do have to get AT LEAST 15 hours a week of UA. Not only is this time that should be spent together, but also meeting the four most important needs of Conversation, Sexual Fulfillment, affection and recreational companionship.

There are 100's if not 1000's of ways that a WS can contact an AP. It is up to the BS to ensure that there is NC.

Have you two discussed his EP's that he will put in place to ensure that this will never happen again?

THanks for the support! I htink we'll make it to the 15 hours...I know now how UA is really so, so important...and you know, he told me the other day that he is "falling head over heels in love" with me again. and that literally gave me those little flutters in my heart that I used to get when we were dating so long ago... I think part of that is because we are spending so much time together getting to know each other all over again...

We did discuss EP's a long time ago (although not in those terms--before finding MB, but we discussed them wiht our counselor), and I ahve been thinking lately that we should revisit them.

I have read some other posters say that the feelings for their spouse go down when they are NOT meeting the 15 hours MINIMUM. Even DrH won't council couples if they don't commit to meeting the minimum.

It sounds good to discuss EPs again. You have to know that your WH is doing everything to protect you and your marriage.

Thanks, I suppose I needed to hear that...we will meet the 15 hours from here on out...every little step counts...and I don't count things like our communting to work time (that's over an hour a day) and such because I don't think that meets the requirements to be UA...we will make it to 15.

Here we are, almost one year out from D-day...I still pray we are doing well togehter, have been working on meeting each others needs, 15 hours Ua, etc... Counseling is going great... I am hesitant to say we are in recovery, mostly out of fear, which is something I need to work on. I am still hyper-sensitive to any signs of continuing the affair, and see none (although, in the back of my mind, I hear myself saying...but you didn't know before when he was having an affair...how could you possibly know now???)....

He is being so accountable to me, and working to meet my needs...and I see so much constantly improving in our relationship...

But right now, I am triggering big time on every little thing. I am not over-reacting, just getting sad and have difficulty wiht some activities right now because of hte memories... I am hoping it is because of the time of year, the fact that we are so close to the 1 year mark...but I find myself wondering, will this always happen?

Do I have to look forward to being emotional and remembering past events everytime this particular date comes around? Or does it really get better with time?

One year today... so far I seem to be handling it far better than I thought I would. Just a few times of stray thoughts, remembering where we were last year. It was not a pretty place. And, right now, I am about 30 minutes away from the actual hour that I found out about the affair. Fortunately, our counseling session just happens to fall on this day and this hour...

One good thing is that the OW hasn't attempted contact today...which is something I am 99% sure she will try to do. She does still try, although all e-mails are blocked as are phone numbers (and I say numbers because she constantly gets new phone numbers in an attempt to call)...

I think I am stronger now, not fearful as I was, I know I can handle anything that comes my way, even if I have an initial emotional reaction. I am even 65 pounds lighter than I was...so my health is better...I just want to continue to improve.

We are in such a better place now. I know that there will be a day when we look at this date not as the day our marriage nearly collapsed, but as the day that we starting re-building it stronger and better than ever.

Thanks to everyone here,reading your stories and suggestions have helped so much this past year!

Well, I knew it was too good to be true...we have had a good day, but she did try to e-mail us (not read) AND she sent me yet another bouquet of flowers..."with love and friendship" I absolutely dispise this POSOW...

cannot even begin to express in writing how she makes me feel...adn I believe she is doing this on purpose...being cruel and manipulative... I can't wait until she finally lets go of the affair...

Can you file for a restraining order?

Sapp, you can't take out a RO against someone because they sent you flowers.

I'd suggest taking the flowers to someone you know who would enjoy them. Don't just throw them in the trash. Make goodness out of badness.

But you can file if someone is threatening your marriage by trying to contact when you don't want them to contact you. When I mean threaten I mean trying to destroy it by trying to stay in contact with the WS.

P.S If the OM tried to contact me and wheels every single day, there is no doubt we would be filing for a restraining order to get him away from us.

Thanks,

I don't know if I can file for a restraining order. I will be doing a bit more research to see if it is a possibility. I am so frustrated by the whole thing...I hate that I am even in this situation...if he had never had the affair, we wouldn't be dealing with this...not having such a good day today, my mind keeps replaying events and everything I would say to her if I had the opportunity. And I am restraining myself from just letting loose and sending her an e-mail...

intears,

Whatever you do, do not contact the OW. She want's a reaction and you don't want to give her that satisfaction.

How about using a little peer pressure? Write up the story of COW (crazy OW) and your husband's affair, including their wacky ideas as to how you were all going to be the next "Big Love." Don't justify, excuse or condemn their nutty behavior--just lay it all out. Keep it short and save it in a file.

Now every time she contacts you or your husband, add on the latest stunt to the file--so you have the sordid story of COW, plus "now, a year later, she has sent me a huge bouquet of flowers and an email saying "I love you", to my workplace. Get ready to reexpose.

Send it to her FB page, any relatives that you can find, her coworkers, all your family. Everyone who might be interested in COW's secret (not any more!) little life.

Right now it's a lot of fun for her to mess with you or maybe she really is crazy enough to think you are all sister wives. Make it not fun for her anymore by shining a light on her icky little activities. You need to get serious by making it uncomfortable for her every time she pulls a stunt like this.

And stop being "nice" and praying for her soul. That kind of attitude is giving her hope that she can get back in bed with your husband and--er, you, lol. Let God sort her out--you need to get working on your marriage boundaries!

so, I know i don't write as often as I should, but I could really use some feedback right now...

I have been speaking with the office of crime victims about the possibility of getting a restraining order. We have blocked her e-mail addresses from both of our work e-mails, etc. and she yet again gets a new e-mail address and sends more e-mail... we don't respond, and block the new addresses, but then a new address pops up...

here's the latest treatise from her(I have changed the names, but I am still worried aobut posting it in case she is lurking on this site as well)...but I just need to hear from someone else, that she is absolutely crazy...I am getting so tired of all of this...my husband says he loves me and only me and we are working so diligently to heal our marriage, our counseling is going good, and we are working to ensure eachothers needs are met and out time that we spend together is wonderful, things feel so positive most of the time...but she won't go away...
sorry what you are about to read is so long...

Dear Intears,
I would like to invite you and Intears� husband to have coffee with me this coming Tuesday, December 14. It has been over a year since you and I have met and then separated paths and I miss you and your friendship. I know that it started off under false pretenses. Obviously that was wrong. However wrong that was, what is right though, is my feelings for you and desire to develop a lifelong friendship based on trust and the love that Christ has given me. You are an incredible person who has a calling to help others and heal those who have been hurt emotionally; I need your wisdom, your love and your prayers.
This coffee is important to me for more than just being with you and Intears� husband, it represents to me all the teachings of Christ and His commandments to love thy neighbor as one should love thyself; as well as to forgive those who you have created ill will with. My heart is heavy and I would consider it broken because I have hurt you; I need this time with you and Intears� husband for healing, and forgiveness. Our lives are too short to remain enemies over actions that Intears� husband and I did. I am sure you need healing as well as the pain for you must still be there.
In the past year I have developed an incredible prayer life and relationship with God that would have never occurred if was not for you and Intears� husband. I am lead by Him to develop this more and reach out to you. The call that is in my heart is not one of living in sin and of fear and hiding, but that of joy, healing and bringing peace to those who seek it. We are not called to live in fear but to live in truth with a sound mind; I can no longer ignore this call and I know from when Intears� husband and I discussed religion and God, neither can he, and I expect you can�t either.
Intears, one reason I pray you accept my invitation is that I am seeking to keep the Lord�s commandments concerning faith, forgiveness, and trusting in Him and I believe that the three of us need to meet not only for my spiritual walk but for Intears� husband�s and yours as well. I am seeking to build a heart of love and character, to break out of the shackles that have been placed on my life by others and by Satan. The Lord wants us to live a long life of peace and health; making up with you will give me peace. Intears, I am also seeking to make love and faithfulness of the Lord the essence of my life. My life of broken relationships, lost friends, and the death of a dear past friend of mine last summer has shown me the absolute importance of healing our relationship. Just last week my son and his friend were lost in the wilderness and I so needed to hear someone tell me that all will be fine and I am praying for you. I texted Intears� husband the situation and I was crushed that he did not respond. I am tired of not having you as a friend, and I hurt knowing the pain I have caused you.
My life has been one of bouncing from one relationship to another and that has kept me from focusing on allowing me to trust in the Lord with all of my heart. I have seen and clearly understand now that God has absolute providence over all on earth; Intears, I need you to be my friend and have a relationship built on trust in Him as I know you were brought into my life for a purpose. I need you to understand I am approaching you with humility and grace, not lust after you or your husband, not earthly desires, not a service to Satan and his lies, but of service to God.
Finally, I seek this time with you because of a strong calling to have a generous spirit toward you and Intears� husband. Intears� husband has one of the most generous and gentle spirits I have ever known, I honestly did not know a man was capable of this, but his Godly character that is the core of his being opened my eyes to what He seeks in our lives. There is a season for all events and this time is the season for forgiveness and building relationships that are important beyond what you and I might understand.
Our lives here are too short to live in fear, to live in hate, and I am certain you have struggled as well over the last year. I am sure your feelings to me are along the lines of �why can�t she just go away and leave me in peace?� I honestly cannot imagine a life without you and Intears� husband and the kids.
My love for God, for you and Intears� husband, for your family, for my family and for a life for all of us that is far more productive than what we lead now simply calls too much to sit on the sideline anymore. I miss you Intears, I miss your smile, your laugh, your intelligence, and your courage. Please allow healing to occur in all of our hearts and grab your husband and have coffee with me. It is time!
In Christ�s Love,
POSOW


So, what do you think??? Is she crazy??? WTF I am not a swearing person, but this is ridiculous, isn't it???

Of course it is ridiculous(and I didn't even read it all because I started to hear, "Wah wah").

Why don't you just change YOUR email addresses to ones that she doesn't know. Then she can make email addresses until the cows come home and you will have NO CLUE.

I truly wish I could change my e-mail address...she is sending them to the corporate e-mail address ... we just keep blocking and, of course, my file demonstrating harassment just keeps on getting fatter and fatter!

thx...

intears, does she read here?

Melodylane...I don't think she reads here, but she is an internet junkie, and as you know from what I have shared, with the stalking style behavior she has exhibited in the past year means I wouldn't put it past her.

She is a nut. For her to use the BIBLE to pursue contact with your H really makes me queasy. I hope you get a restraining order against her. Did your H ever send her the standard Harley no contact letter?

Yes, we have sent N/C however, we sent by e-mail.

It really turns my stomach too...using God to try to manipulate us into having a "meeting" with her and developing a friendship? We had become friends before I knew of hte affair, but we were introduced because of the affair...not a real friendship...you know, I just really want it to be over. I have prayed, and I have forgiven her for her part in the affair. That was part of my personal recovery process...but the fact that she continues on...I just am reaching a point where I don't know how to cope anymore.

I would strongly consider going the restraining order route. That might wake her sicko self up.

You are not crazy.

If she was truly repentant as she claims, she would respect your and your H's boundary of NC, which was necessary in part because of HER actions.

She is using the name of Christ as a cloak to try and cover the evil in her heart.

She wants, besides to have that pesky NC dropped, to be able to feel better about herself by winning approval and approbation from her fellow criminal and her victim. Then she can say, "See? It wasn't so bad. We're all friends now."

Someone with a true relationship with Christ understands the nature of sin, accepts the depths to which they had fallen, and the heights to which He can lift them. Never, never, never do they try to minimize or trivialize it as she is trying to do.

Good luck with the R/O. I recommend moving. If your company is large enough to transfer somewhere far away, that would make it easier, but even if you have to both find new jobs I still recommend it. You can't IMAGINE how much lighter and fluffier you'll feel when you're far away from her, and have changed every shred of your personal information.

Someone as sick and twisted as she is might still pop up from time to time, but it's much harder to stalk from far away.

Yep, she's using the Lord's name in vain, here. She's still foggy and it's still all about her.

Please change your email addresses so this self-absorbed lunatic will leave you alone.

I see moving as surrender. Don�t move. She�s so crazy she�ll simply follow or contact you at the new place.

There is a case that can be built on patterns of behavior. I�m sure stalking laws that protect celebrities apply in your case. There�s also the possibility of suing on the grounds of intentional infliction of emotional distress.

You need to gather all the emails, write out all the weird events (like showing up at your kids games) and document all the flower deliveries and bring them to a lawyer�s office.

A competent lawyer can establish a pattern. This woman may be so crazy that she might try to kidnap your kids to try and get you to talk to her.

These are serious things that many judges wouldn�t want to have on their records. Get the restraining order. I�m sure there�s some law out there to protect you, but you must consult a lawyer and do the papers.

Yes, she's crazy.

Don't read this drek.


I would feel extremely creeped out for someone of my gender to tell me they had feelings for me. Especially if they'd committed adultery with my spouse.


Translation: I need you, so you have to help me, because Jesus wants to be nice.

Bull manure.

How dare she lecture you about what God wants you to do. Is she your pastor? Does she have a degree in theology or Bible or something?


The coffee is the teachings of Christ, huh? Delusion.

She should study similes and metaphors in school. She hasn't got the knack of it, yet.


I am incensed and enraged.

She's lecturing you about the commandments of Christ.

She's demanding forgiveness. (AND reconciliation, which she's equating with forgiveness.)

She's trying to tell you how to have a walk with Christ when she's barely figured it out herself, if at all. (I doubt she's figured it out at all, actually.)

And then she says YOU'VE CREATED ILL WILL WITH HER?????? This is YOUR fault??? How dare she!!!! She hasn't hurt you enough, now she has to say you caused it? Is this like when a rapist tells his victim she brought it on herself?

By the way, Christ does not command you to have a relationship with everybody on earth. It is simply not possible.


Poor thing, she feels bad. Looking for sympathy because she feels bad. She's oblivious to your feelings, but she feels bad, and you're such a good Christian (DOORMAT!!!!) that she's pretty sure you'll feel obligated to take her hurt away if she pushes the right buttons.


It's all about what she needs and wants. You need her to leave you alone, but her needs are more important.


It's nice of her to tell you this and straighten you out.


Yeah, it was just a little fun. Trivial. It's not worth you leaving me here feeling bad over.


But certainly not if it means I can't get what I need!


No, God is not the author of confusion. Anybody can lie and say God is leading them.


You should thank GOD that he's put such a strong Christian woman pastor and theologian in your life, huh? You are so lucky to have her!!! I think I'd kiss her toes in gratitude every time I saw her.

And note that she says leaving you in peace would be "sin" and "fear." What bull crap.


In other words, she has no control over herself at all. She can't stop herself from doing what she wants to do.

Take a look at this:

1 Corinthians 1:32,33

"The spirits of prophets are subject to the control of prophets, for God is not a God of confusion, but of peace"

She can't control herself, so this must not be due to God's leading (prophecy).


This is an attempt to guilt you into thinking that you have to have a relationship with this woman.

Ever read what Jesus said about casting your pearls before swine?


She thinks her obedience to God is contingent on what you do. Ridiculous. She'd better figure out how to serve God and do what is right no matter what other people do.


"And I'm seeking to do it while continuing to partake of my addiction."

Guess she hasn't read what the Bible says about fleeing from temptation. Why in the world would God lead her to put herself into temptation's way?

Satan is powerless, but his sword (temptation) can destroy us. We have nothing to fear from Satan, but if we stand there and let ourselves come in contact with his sword, we'll be ruined.


God wants me to be happy.

God wanted me to be happy before with an affair.

Now He wants me to be happy that I got away with it.

Isn't God wonderful?!!!


Yes, we know.


Go get a church. There's only a million of them in the U.S.A....


I am seeing red at this.


Cry me a freakin' river.


Obviously she doesn't know that her continued presence in your life causes you pain.

Thank God you don't have to educate her about this, because it doesn't sound like she'll ever learn it (or care). All you have to do is stay away from this abuser.


Now I know all the lessons God was trying to teach me when I was unfaithful. Now I'm sure that since I've learned what God was trying to teach me, He'll make everything just like it used to be and there won't be any consequences for my actions from me not listening to God the first time. I'm pretty sure this is how it works. I need it to.


Trust Him, and trust me when I tell you what He's thinking. I figured out God yesterday, and God and I are like THAT! I know everything He wants. You need me to explain it to you. Aren't you so lucky to have me? I promise I'll never leave you!!!


I'm going to vomit.


Good thing I know what time it is.

There's no room for differences of opinion on this. There's only my own personal objective truth, revealed straight from God. You'd better accept it.


I am sure you have feelings about this, but my feelings are more important.


If you don't do what I think you should do, there's something wrong with your heart.


Everybody knows people eventually get over this stuff, so why don't you get over it and trust me already!


Can't add to that.

Oh, I forgot to add something:

Dr. H considers moving a necessity in many cases, even where the OW is not a stalker.

I've only been here a year, but that's the worst case of fogbabble I've seen in that time. Especially due to the misuse of the name and faith of Christ. And what a horrible time of year for that, too.

Some people need to be just a little bit more fearful and respectful of the Baby in the manager...

Markos

[Co-signed]


Proverbs 3:5 says, �For the lips of an adulteress drip honey and smoother than oil is her speech.�

W

She is more than a nut.
She is a stalker.
She probably has a personality disorder.
Do NOT delete her emails.
File them away .... just in case.

And, NEVER, NEVER EVER respond.

Thank you for confirming my feelings exactly

I really appreciate the translations... I was almost duped by some of them, but not anymore...

Thanks for the strengthening thoughts!!!!

Agree.

One of the things I worried about with the "explanations" I posted above was that you might try to explain all this to her. Don't do that.

Nope, I will not respond to her...I like your translations because they confirmed and put into words what I was feeling...that's what I appreciate about coming here and reading others perspectives...helps calm my nerves and remind me not to react

Dr Harley say's it's best to move far away from the OP. I think you need to re-think your position on this. I have seen many a recovery on MB stall until the move was made.

Definitely get an r.o. That letter from her is beyond bizarre, and honestly frightens me. Please keep yourself, H and kids safe.

In the letter she sounds as if she wants to start up again and is freaky to say the least w/her biblical (really just a twisted mind) rants.

Fwiw, my wxh's ow, monkeyho, took my then wh to a marriage seminar on how to strenghten a marriage. Who in their right mind takes an ow to that? He got busted there by friends of ours in our sunday school class.

OP will twist and weave words and even religion to get their way. Never underestimate the crazy that can come from an om or ow.

Agree w/the others here, do not respond with anything BUT a restraining order.

Where to begin...the last 4 weeks have been harrowing, to say the least...here's a short novel updating you...it feels good to just write it all out...

I found out that he has been in contact wiht the POSOW since October (at least) he was just really good at hiding it...again...and this stupid so called christian polygamy idea came up again...she has been doing some sessions wiht some so-called pastor who tells people how to be good christian polygamist...and my husband even talked to this man (who, by the way has child abuse charges against him)...and I found out he had input into the e-mail she sent me...

how I found out was that we had talked about a response to her e-mail asking for a meeting. I finally broke down and told him that he could reply wiht a no...she responded to both of us, saying that yes, he had already told her that and sent me his orin=ginal reposonse to her in which he was talking aobut how he wanted to bring his two wives together and such...
I was so overwhelmed...he called me immediately...that is when he talked aobut the contact they ahve been having and all that bs...i told him, I wanted to leave, I was very harsh that I don't want anything other than our children and it is over...it is either her or me.

He sent a reply to both of us, saying it is over, he is sorry...that polygamy is wrong and that he was wrong to even think about it...and so forth...

AFter some "emergency sessions with the counselor, I decided to stay through the holidays as our oldest some was coming home and I didn't want to hurt the kids at Christmas...

On the 23rd of December we went to a book store and were buying a book for our son. WH said, under his breath�don�t look to your left�I didn�t understand what he was saying and said, what? And started walking down the aisle, when I looked up, I saw that she has blocked our path and looked like she wanted to say something, I held WH�s hand and he was saying to her, �Just going from store to store�� we went to the car and a talked for a few minutes. He said he was angry over her showing up when we were having such a nice day. He was angry over the whole, I don�t like being rude thing again�saying he just needed to say 4 or 5 more words to her, and then he wouldn�t feel so bad�I told him to go, find her and tell her those 4 or 5 words. He said no, if I did that, I may as well sign divorce papers�I said yes, that�s right. We also talked a bit about why he feels like he has to be so nice to her. I have him a hypothetical situation, I said, if some hockey dad that we were friends with raped me, would he still have to be nice to that guy in public because he had once been friends with him? He said no�I asked well, do you have to be friends with someone who hurts me? And do you have to be nice to someone who is trying to hurt me or someone who is trying to tear apart our marriage? He said no, and that is a good perspective to place it in. he also said that at least he just sort of brushed her off, so maybe she got the message�I said no, what she saw was me leading you by the hand out the door while you were turning toward her and trying to talk�
So, we went over to Wal-mart, he had one item he wanted to look for. We went into the electrical section of the store, he was looking at digital converters, so I thought I would walk forward a couple aisles to the game section and see if there is a game our son might like�I was walking, looking at items, and suddenly, there she is�right in front of me�she says �can we talk?� I said �no.� She asked me if WH and I had been communicating, because "she and him had been communicating over the phone and over the internet. I said we have been communicating, a lot. Then she said the �only reason he sent the response that he did was because of the harsh things I said to him.� I just looked at her, and didn�t respond�after a little bit, I said it is time for this to be over, I need to go and take care of my family. I started to back away when she whirled around and starting waling straight to WH�I had no idea where he was at that time, and he had come up to and was standing at the end of the aisle where we were. Of course, my first impression is that [censored], they set this up�I was immediately so angry�and so upset�I know she may have seen him walk up out of the corner of her eye�but really? Anyway, I walk over there too, and she says we need to talk about this.

WH says, let�s do it this way and put his arm around me and says �this is my wife, we have been married for 22 years and have three children together, I love her and want to be with her. POSOW, please go and have a nice life.� She said, that�s it then? Have a nice life? And she reached to shake his hand and said okay, have a nice life too, then she looked at me and said in a very mean, aggressive tone �are you happy now?� you win� I said, no, you do not get to do that. She said �I have loved him for 2 years� (it will be 2 years in February) I said, �I have loved him for 22 years and you do NOT get to do that� then the next thing I know, she had walked away�

Since then, WH has been walking on air, saying it�s over and he is free and he feels so good and he knows that we have our love and we can rebuild our relationship�I still don�t know how I feel�there is a part of me that wonders if it was a set-up, that they may have arranged that so that they could start up the affair again without my knowledge, if I was thinking it is all over�

I am so hurt from everything... I went into shock for a little while, I couldn't eat or sleep or even feel anything...I was numb...the feelings have started coming back and we are talking again...he still swears it is over...I am very doubtful. I feel like we are back to square one, and that all of the so called work we have done to rebuild our marriage over the past year was all a lie...I don't know anymore what is truth...how could I not see any signs...again? Iknow I did, but then I would tell myself that I am learning to trust and that I need to try to look at these things objectively...so stupid, right?

I hate hearing the things I am finding out...the things that so-called pastor tried to get my husband to do to "force" me into polygamy...it was like he took a page right out of the domestic violence handbook and renamed it how to force your wife into polygamy....to WH credit, he did not follow through on any of those suggestions...he said he could not abuse me in that way...

I have told WH that there are no more chances...one e-mail, one text, one phone call and I am gone...I will not stay married to a man who refuses to stop an affair...to his credit, he has changed his cell phone, completely blocked her from his e-mail accounts, and started a group therapy men's group...which were the first 3 steps I insisted he make.

I am still feeling so lost...I have hit bottom...I am back to taking things one moment at a time...my feelings one moment at a time...this is almost worse than when I first found out about the affair. And nothing seems to address this type of issue...no books out there addressing this situation.

I know if you've read all of this you are probably sitting there speechless...but if you have any encouraging words for me, I would appreciate it...

I have to believe that there is someone you can report this so-called 'pastor' to! This is sickening!

I know, I just can't think of who to report to...I do know he is already under investigation for child abuse, etc. due to his "lifestyle"...sickening is the right word for it...it turns my stomach...I have looked at his internet site...just to see....and I just have no words to describe the feeling...

thanks...

False R sucks big time. He knows what he has to do to keep you: NC FOREVER!!!!!!!!

Personally, I would recommend moving as a condition of continuing R. You don't want to live your life bumping into OW like that. You and WH will never R, or even heal individually.

Keep snooping, and big hugs to you.

Possible MB heresy coming, so if hearing highly conflicting opinions on matters of import troubles you do not read further.

There appears to be only one person capable of eliminating this problem and protecting your sanity and the health and safety of your children, and that's you.

Your WH (note: not FWH) is an extremely sick individual, the whatever-you-want-to-call-it equivalent to a female drama queen.

He ALLOWED CONTACT FOR THREE MONTHS, knowing that this b1tch was a few apples short of a pie, that she was electronically stalking you, that her actions were bringing you pain and emotional trauma. (Go back and read your posts over the past year. I just did, and I'm shaking with rage.) He is ENJOYING this litlle pas-de-trois, Trust me on this - HE'S ENJOYING THE FACT THAT SHE'S ONCE AGAIN ABLE TO INFLICT PAIN ON YOU!

Absorb THAT! Now, give me any reason why staying in a marriage with this scumbag has any value. Because he.......what? occasionally goes "quiet" with his fixation on a three-way life with you, him, and a certifiable mental case? Just long enough for you to find a comfort level before "bunny boiler" and her "pimp" drag you back into the cesspool?

You've been more understanding with scum-hubby than any woman should have been, obviously. LAWYER UP, INTEARS! HIT HER AND HIM WITH RESTRAINING ORDERS. Get him the HELL away from your children before his ideas start seeming less repugnant to them.

This is not enough.
WH gets ZERO credit for changing his numbers.
For all you know, he has secret accounts already, or will next week.

What OTHER conditions have you required as necessary to even TRY to recover from this mess?

STD testing?
Both of you must do this.
Go together.
Have WH ask the Doc in front of you for a complete STD screening because of his infidelity.
This is important that you hear/see WH ask for the test and explain WHY it is necessary.

This is a simple "step one".
If WH balks even a little, it's curtains for him

You got that?

No warning.
No saying to WH; "If you don't do this I am filing for a divorce."
Nothing.
Just observe WH's attitude about following your reasonable request ....

WHATEVER IT TAKES FOR AS LONG AS IT TAKES <~~~ should be WH's attitude for the next few years.

Here's what you say to WH:

"WH, I made an appointment with Dr Welby. It's (day) at (time). We will go in together to get STD testing. You will request this STD testing and inform Dr Welby that we both need testing because of your continued infidelity."

Then, be silent. Wait for his response. Say nothing else other than, "This is something I need from you.".

I hope you follow my advice.


If WH gets squirrelly about this simple & reasonable request, he lacks the mettle necessary for recovery.

Make no announcement.
Get an attorney instead and let the filing make the announcement for you.

NC alone is not enough.

NC is requirement number ONE, but is never enough for recovery.

You have endured a FALSE recovery.

You must set the bar higher after a FR.

MUCH higher !.

I am going to bump up another thread about "FR" false recovery.

I "bumped" the FR thread.
Please go look it over.

On the FR thread, a FWH (HerPapaBear) responded.

PLEASE READ his response carefully.

Sexymamabear made this list. THIS is how Plan B should end.

Your H has not ended this affair. The OW told you to your face that they have been communicating, that they have been in contact, multiple ways, multiple times.

Your H�s reaction was a show for you. To pacify you and give a false sense of security for the time being. I am afraid it will happen again, and again until you stop this.
The meeting was a set up that your husband orchestrated. (He brought you there).

The �plan� is to bully you into accepting this nut job as another �wife� in your household, with the complete coercion of her affair partner, your WH.

They are mentally and emotionally beating you down. There can be long term effects for a victim of being exposed to this type of abuse.

Although the situation is unusual, this type of coercion is commonly found in the domestic violence/abuse realm (Google the wheel of abuse/domestic violence) although cruel, it is highly effective in wearing down victim.

WHY have you not exposed this situation to the community? With the cyber stalking, the repeated requests to leave you and your family alone, and the flowers, emails and contacts attempting you to be coerced into this illegal arrangement, you have all the terms needed to file a restraining order.

<edit>
I re read your thread. You were advised 11/04/09 to expose this A. As far as I can tell you have not taken this advice.

You were also told to get a restraining order the same time.

As far as I can tell, you have not done many of the reccomended actions, just have popped in here and there for crazy time, squirell-p@@p updates.

Why have you not protected yourself from this A? False recovery has not happened, because the A probably never ended, imho.

You have been along her long enough to know the drill.
EXPOSE
Expose
expose.
Get an STD test.

Thanks for the responses.

I confess, I haven't read the false recovery thread, mostly because I haven't wanted it to happen to us. Fear, I suppose, but I will look at it now.

I have emotionally been through most of hte points that have been brought up so far...

I have confronted WH on domestic violence issues, I am stronger and I refuse to be abused emotionally or physically. Now I am more in control of what I know I am feeling and sensing. This will not be tolerated.

I have also been in contact wiht the office of crime victims in our state and at that time the restraining order wasn't something I could do...although that was before the latest incident, so I may be able to obtian one now.

I have exposed the affair, although, only a few people and family members know of the polygamy aspect.

We have gone to the STD testing...(and a side note of something that was appreciated by me...our family physican refuses to see him because she is seeing me and she does not care to cross those lines in situations involving affairs).

I have several requirements for the recovery of our marriage at this point. And others arise as my emotional state recovers to the point of recognizing what needs to be done next.

Right now I am thinking things through and making sure that I am confident we can recover our marriage.

Thanks again for your words of support and advise...that is why I come here...

And I am sorry for the here and there type updates. My job doesn't allow for me to be on message boards often.

Off I go to read now...
thanks again...

If you were tested before the last known contact with OW, STD testing needs to be repeated.
No matter if WH thinks it is necessary or not.
It's part of the consequences of a false recovery.
Even if WH says they were not physical.
Waywards are proven liars and not to be believed.
STD testing is always a requirement after any secret contact is discovered.

so true...

thanks...will have to follow through...

I gotta say though....I do so wish I wasn't ehre...I read the FR thread, lots of good things to continue to look for...

I do find myself losing hope lately, I am not approaching the thought of recovery with as much enthusiasm as I did before. I just don't know in my heart anymore that we can make it.

A part of me truly hopes so, but a part of me is just so sad and becoming very hardened. I love him so much, but I am afraid that his actions over the last few months have all but killed that love.

I think this is normal...I hope it is...I read the other threads and see that same sentiment coming through, only in different ways...

Your note seems strangely at odds with the story you've related.

I have confronted WH on domestic violence issues, I am stronger and I refuse to be abused emotionally or physically. Now I am more in control of what I know I am feeling and sensing.
No, you HAVE been abused emotionally. What you are doing is denying the FACTS of what is happening to align more closely to what you want to have happen.

This will not be tolerated.
With the consequences of his ongoing emotional abuse being WHAT, exactly? More tears from you? Another discreditable line in the sand? Yet another false recovery followed by a repeat of the laughable "surprise" meeting?

I have also been in contact wiht the office of crime victims in our state and at that time the restraining order wasn't something I could do...although that was before the latest incident, so I may be able to obtian one now.
...and you will do so with the assistance of legal counsel first thing in the morning, right? Or is this just some plastic snake you're going to wave at WH and his AP, saying "Boo!"?

I have exposed the affair, although, only a few people and family members know of the polygamy aspect.
And the reason for your lack of fortitude in this arena is......?

We have gone to the STD testing...(and a side note of something that was appreciated by me...our family physican refuses to see him because she is seeing me and she does not care to cross those lines in situations involving affairs).

I have several requirements for the recovery of our marriage at this point. And others arise as my emotional state recovers to the point of recognizing what needs to be done next.
Okay, share them with us, right here, in print. We will assist you in formulating and refining these, if necessary, and hold you to enforcing each one of them, with the previously defined penalties for violations by WH Scumbucket.

Right now I am thinking things through and making sure that I am confident we can recover our marriage.
AKA: WH has me bamboozled right now that he's not actually planning his dream tag-team arrangement. I don't DARE rock the boat, so I'll assume the "thinking" position.

Intears, you must see how this looks to us - ineffective, weak, vapid. And your WH sees it all the more clearly.

The frog story..

Proven fact (but not by me.) Gross, but I learned this in a group session for women...

If you put a frog into a beaker of hot/boiling water, it will immediately jump out and struggle for its very existance.

If you place that same frog into a beaker of cool water and slowly raise the tempreture degree by degree, it will sit there until it perishes.
Small abuses add up, bit by bit they become insignificant but the end result can be horrible.

No one here wants to pile on you. We would like you to pick up your staff and protect your family.

But by allowing the bar to be so low, you are playing a part in the FR.

I can no believe 2 years later ,(One year past D day) and the OW STILL thinks she has a chance? This is encouraged by your current WH, you know.

IT;
This woman wants YOUR LIFE.
This woman is trying to use squirell p@@ thinking/rationalizing to incrimentally move you out of your BED, HOUSE and Marriage and current life.
No, She does not want to "share the wife role with you" (nor give you the right to insurance that -- I am guessing -- your H provides for you as stated in your first post.) Insurance will only pay for one wife, sorry.

She is not using a sword to force you out. If she were, you would identify this pick up your shield and staff and DEFEND yourself. She is using flowers and God. The motive is the same.

Quote
"I found out was that we had talked about a response to her e-mail asking for a meeting. I finally broke down and told him that he could reply wiht a no...she responded to both of us, saying that yes, he had already told her that and sent me his orin=ginal reposonse to her in which he was talking aobut how he wanted to bring his [b]two wives together [/b]and such...
I was so overwhelmed...he called me immediately...that is when he talked aobut the contact they ahve been having and all that bs...i told him, I wanted to leave, I was very harsh that I don't want anything other than our children and it is over...it is either her or me."

end quote..... uhhhh.


Hold the phone....What the heck is this? When was the last time your H was talking about his "two wives?"

"I was very Harsh?"
Dude.

Repeat after me...

I want your pension.
Child support,
the house/car and investments.
Alimony
FULL LEGAL CUSTODY (why would you let this nut job sleep anywhere around your children...what if God "wanted" her to have sex with them, too? Would you sit back and tolerate that?)

Protect your family. while you can.

Take her last "explanation" email, to an attorney.
Take with it your husbands "two wives" reply.

consider it an investment in your sanity.

Tears ....

Be careful of your own thinking patterns that keep you stuck.

You have a tendency (I suspect) to resort to wishful thinking when you feel sad or hope is waning.

Am I correct?
Please, let me know.


This is a direct result of a FALSE RECOVERY.
This is a DIRECT RESULT of your HUSBAND's adultery and continued failure to protect you.
This is NOT due to some personal weakness of yours.

Got that?

MarriedForever had a terrible time summoning up any enthusiasm after their FR. A terrible time.

It will be WORSE for you if you wishful-think yourself into a second FR.
Your enthusiasm for life may be effected, not just for your marriage.

Are you on anti-depressants?
You might need them.
Ask your physician to give you the depression/anxiety test.


I am worried about you.

FR is a call to action. The results don't have to be instantaneous, but immediately begin to make your plan (we can help), and once that is done take steps toward carrying it out.

You are the one in charge here, not WH. It's time to get your life adultery-free. Are you ready?

PS Please read Pep's post many times and absorb it. She's like Robin Hood - not only does she most always hit a bullseye, but she also splits the arrow right down the middle.

Thank you for all the responses, some are hard to read and really think about...but I am.

ANd pep, thanks so much for your concern...and to put it mildly, I have lost a bit of my enthusiam for life...I am trying not to, but it is hard...I am already on anti-anxiety meds (had been thinking of coming off of them before this go-round, but now thinking of upping them).

And yes, to answer your question, when I feel sad or lose hope, I tend to cycle my emotions and focus on myself or my percieved personal faults. I know that about myself and I try to be aware of it, but sometimes I revert to that pattern of thinking. Then when I am more alert, I KNOW that I am a strong person and that I can do what needs to be done to protect myself and my children.

So, where I am right now--what I have asked for so far and he is doing (and I am working to verify)--

1) absolutely no contact
2) change cell phone number..done
3) blocked all internet access...he worked wiht IT dept at work to have her completely blocked
4) Attending and participating in a men's group therapy weekly as a means of accountability to someone outside of our marriage.
5) MC is continuing and additional IC
6) I have asked him for two letters. One is a letter in which he is expressing what he has done, how deeply he has hurt me and what he will do to make sure that it never happens again and another letter...and I know this is silly, but I want a love letter, I want to know just how much he does love me and why. I want him to think about that and think about the other letter.
7) There is a firm understanding that I will be requesting more from him and expect it to happen, no matter what.

Last night we did have a good long conversation, we did talking aobut the affair, some questions I had, and how to move forward at this point. From what he says (although I take eveyrthing he says with a grain of salt--well, maybe a whole grain elevator full of salt )...anyway, he says that he is scared that I will leave him, that we may not be able to recover this time and that he has hurt me too badly. I can only tell him that it may be true. Only his being able to demonstrate that he is absolutely committed to our marriage and to me will determine whether we can truly recover our marriage.

I am glad that he is scared that I may leave him...if he realizes how much he loves me and our marriage and our family, then a little fear of losing me over his affair and his behavior isn't a bad thing. I have a plan in place for if I reach the point that I feel it is over. I know where I would go and how I could get there. No lawyers yet, but if he cannot do what is necessary to completely end the affair, then I know who I would call for a referral.

I have one prayer now...I have prayed for clarity so that I see what is happening and the decisions that need to be made, that I am able to make the decisions and that I have the strength to follow through on those decisions, no matter what they are.

So, in a nutshell, that's where I am now...and thinking about the next steps (#7 above).

There are some other things he could do to make you feel safer in this marriage.

A post-nuptial that gives you all marital assets if he should ever resume this (or any other) affair.

A polygraph so that you know you finally have the whole truth.

So this jerk is scared you'll leave him and that you're recovery won't work BECAUSE HE has been in contact with his lover yet again?

How narcissistic of him to worry about how or what you feel. He is really a very scary and destructive person and how you are living day to day WITHOUT getting a restraining order against the ow is beyond me.

Please, please protect yourself and your kids from the psycho woman. And she probably wouldn't be pursuing things AGAIN unless YOUR WH is starting things up. Poor wittle wayward. He is worried his wife will leave him because she's so sad and upset that he feels he HAS TO YET HOOK UP AGAIN WITH THE OW as a backup plan.

Have you thought of it as that? Did it occur to you that's what he may have done? Formulate a backup plan. I also believe you were ambushed by the both of them at walmart (what a place do to that huh?). I personally would have had her arrested for stalking me and filed charges against her THAT DAY.

How long do you have to live in a life with a man who needs constant scrutiny day to day to just keep him from cheating?

I do agree w/Lexxxy in that you need a post-nuptial agreement to protect you. Personally, I'd be done with this harmful man.

I wish you the best, but he is probably been contacting her for quite some time. It doesn't sound like an accidental meeting with her, and obviously HE has LED HER ON. That means their affair never ended.

Why should it now? How exactly are YOU PROTECTING yourself and your children right now? I posed this question to you quite a while back and didn't really get a response on that. Are you getting a restraining order against the ow? Is your WS going to go to MB counseling WHEN the affair is over? We all know here that counseling will not work if the ws is still in the affair. And he is. It might have gone further underground, but you my friend, are simply going on the words of a liar, rather than doing proper recon.

Is there a var in the vehicle he drives or gps? Is there a keylogger on the computers? Do you have passwords to his cell phone?

Seriously, the whole thought your wh could go along with that crazy situation in a 3way marriage is just nuts to me and harmful to any family.

The phone and email are a good start.

But what about if she does try to contact him? Proper answer- He does not respond to OW contact, but tells you 100% of the time.

The "love letter" may make you feel better, and a cake eating WW will write one off in a flash!, but you need to work on real consequences and litnus tests.

If you ask - people here will help you.

Why have you not exposed this abusive relationship to people?
TURNING on the LIGHT will send the cockroach scrambelling.

intears, hope you are doing ok. I was thinking about you last night.