My heart is very heavy and angry right now. I have been flitting around the computer, and I stumbled on a thread on the Christian forum where I post. It was made by someone whose H cheated twice. There were several encouraging posts about him being honest and needing accountability, etc.

THEN this guy posts this long diatribe about how nobody ever bothers to find out WHY cheaters cheat and how usually both spouses are responsible because something that the BS did or didn't do can CAUSE the cheating spouse to HAVE to cheat. Then he went on to the whole what if you got no attention or affection and lived in constant sexual frustration, and that his own wife was unfaithful to HIM in this way and he was dying of loneliness yada yada yeah yeah.

I responded with a play by play of my choice and what was going on in our marriage and how infidelity was still not justified, and how I was the one who had cheated. That my BH real or imagined shortcomings in no way mitigated my responsibility for breaking this most sacred vow. Comparing DH's busy and distant neglect to my sharing a bed with another man....is like comparing driving 55 in a 45 zone to driving my car drunk through a daycare.

I am not sure who I am writing to. More to BS's, even though I am not one. Don't believe the lie that an affair is your fault. Don't believe that if you had done this or that different;y it never would have happened. Marriage is made up of two imperfect people, but neither of those people get to deal with that imperfection by "rutting" - as Mel says. If you're reading this as a BS, yes, you are a victim. But because you are reading it here you are an EMPOWERED victim. You have a team of people who have run and are running the race. You are in good hands. And one of these days YOU will be those good hands. You are strong. Many people cower and cry in their rooms, never telling another soul for fear of embarrassment or shame. You found these forums and bore your soul. Some of the advice seems crazy, but when you argue, they set you straight. If you wimp out, they 2X4 you. But you still come back. You are in boot camp for an army nobody wanted to join. But an army who can be That friend, that relative, that colleague, who helps someone else through their adultery.

As I was ticked off by the doofus' posts, and as I was firing back, it occurred to me. This is one of THOSE things. This is a passion. Waking people out of the fog, holding their feet to the fire. I feel like one of those ex-drug addicts that they send out to schools to tell kids not to do drugs. I wish I could talk to foggy people before they take that awful, reversible step.

It makes me sad, really. I try not to watch movies involving adulterous directors (Avatar comes to mind) or who have cheating stars...so I have to miss a lot of movies. It's depressing. It's EVERYWHERE.

BRAVO to you, lurioosi2, great post! You are one of the fighters in the trenches and I am glad you are here to help fight for marriages where we don't take "lie down and die" for an answer!

Congrats lurioosi2

You have truly earned your "F" in FWW

For what it's worth, I am proud of you!

Big ditto on that, Luri .......Wonder whos WH posted on there...prolly mine..

luri, this was excellent. Thank you for posting it.

Luri,

That was an awesome post. And it's all true.

But I think you know that it's not how it feels to BS's.....and especially to me.

I know that her decision was not my fault -- she's told me that numerous times, that it was all her.

But I still want to go back in time and b!itch-slap that idiot that I was 40 months ago. If I had been taking care of business on my end of the street, with personal changes that were truly simple and oh-so-minor, I could have headed this off at the pass.

For many that post here, that's not the case. But for me, what she did was so unlike her, so against everything she's ever stood for, and so far outside her basic character, I know deep down that this never would have happened.

My confirmation for that feeling comes from the way D-Day happened. About a month before the big confession, I sat down and told her that I felt we were losing touch with one another and needed to go do something fun. I suggested a trip to a popular tourist spot that she'd always wanted to go to -- and that I'd never found the time to take her to. She agreed readily, and we went and had a good time. And we did -- in all ways.

A lot of walking was involved, up and down centuries-old stone staircases, and up lighthouses and such. Oh, yeah, I should mention that I was scheduled to have hip replacement surgery due to disintegrating cartilage three days after we got back. I didn't complain about the pain, and just kept going and made sure we both had a good time. And we did -- in all ways.

The confession came three weeks later, and she never actually had physical contact with him after that trip. See what I mean? If I'd woken from my personal slumber in time -- who knows?

Of course, the What-If game is guaranteed to cause insanity. I know that. But, truthfully, it's hard not to indulge in it. I dwell on it less and less as time goes on, but I know I'll never escape that feeling, and that realization, that I could have stopped the train from going off the tracks.

Yeah, she made the decisions, and that's all on her. But I made my own stupid decisions, and that's all on me.

I'm making it my life's task to make sure that option never seems to be attractive, ever again.

A therapist told me a very wise thing: it's not your job to make sure he is faithful. Not the last time. Not if it happens again.

I tried to stop the affair. All it got me was a broken arm. The affair hurt worse, and I needed three surgeries for that arm.

Over the years, and it has been years, what I have learned is that he did not guard his heart. He did not lead his heart. Instead, he followed his heart.

Cherished

thanks for the post............ as a BS......... I also think that we sometimes think if we had only been a better spouse they wouldn't have strayed.....my logic side tells me that I'm only responsible for my decisions and what ever my husband did or thinks is his responsibility...
The fact that they chose someone else to love and have sex with is very hurtful. We always think that we weren't good enough, pretty enough.......A lot of self doubt goes with the way we think now....
I think it's a very pointless, hurtful way to end a marriage......why would anyone want to put this kind of hurt on another person.......
what ever happened to Respecting one another......what happened to honoring someone else.......
Thanks for telling your side and trying to make us BS's understand it really wasn't about us......

Jeremiah 17:9 (New International Version)

The heart is deceitful above all things
and beyond cure.
Who can understand it?

Thanks for posting that ML.......I just think that, hell, soooo many of my needs were not being met also, I wasnt jumping for joy over my M....I was busy taking care of a toddler, while WH was out with OW....Cheating never even crossed my mind, I stupidly assumed this was just the way marriages were after you had a baby...I just thought it would get better when DS got a little older....

Cherished, I am so sorry that happened to you. We just seem to be living in the era of Judges where "everyone did what was right in his own eyes."

I know exactly what you mean in your posting. Most betrayals are not initiated by the clash of cymbals, but more like the build-up in Ravel's Bolero. They begin incrementally, first crossing one faint boundary, then a darker one, then eventually the most severe and supposedly rigid ones.

I thought about this long and hard as my fWW and I were agonizingly enduring the worst periods of the reconciliation/recovery process. I'm not the type to join causes ("Nuke the Whales" or whatever) but I do care very much for my family and circle of friends, and would not want any of them to have to walk that painful path if I could prevent it. So, as a start to my own "Think globally, act locally" campaign, I sent the following e-mail to my daughter and son-in-law, with the attached admonition that neither my wife nor I would answer any questions about its genesis.

They are bright people, and I hope they realize how valuable, wise, and loving, those words can be to their future lives.

That is a very interesting analogy.

There is a story that at the primier of Bolero in Paris a woman in attendance declared Ravel insane. When he heard that he commented, "She understood the piece."

You are absolutely right, so let me rephrase my earlier post just a bit:


I'm making it my life's task to make sure that option never seems to be attractive, ever again by taking care of my side of the street. From what she's shown me, that should do the job nicely.

I knew I liked Ravel! Us insane people like each other! And I like y'all, so guess what that makes you!!!!

My bet is dollar to dounts that this guy is/has been wayward himself.

I got something similar after I did exposure from a friend...just found out recently that he was wayward himself...big shock.

And I like you.... .....Wait a minute does that mean im insane too? I KNEW we had a lot in common.

If the smiley fits......

I would wager your right!

AheadOfTheCurve,

Honestly, I think I tried to hard to be a good wife. I tried to support him in whatever he wanted to do, and it got to the point that I finally got upset when he and this other women were going out to fancy lunches. She took him to the most highly rated romantic restaurant in town to celebrate the birth of our fourth child. When that child was colicky, the rest is history.

There needs to be reciprocity in marriage. If there isn't, I think separation is in order. The best decision I made was to boot him out.

I was taught, too well, that my job was to look out for my husband's needs, and his role was to look out for mine and the better I look out for his, the better he'd look out for mine.

It's not true. It's betrayed spouse fog talk. That's why your post caught my eye.

Cherished

Luri,

This post was awesome!!!!! You are truly a warrior in the marriage world. It matters not to me how you became so.......
I ESPECIALLY loved this......
If I walk away from this trial learning only one important thing, it was that. I loved becoming empowered. I had lost that. Here, I re-learned it. And that, was the most powerful thing of all........



Not2fun

Great thread!! Just wanted to add my 2c worth...

It is ASBOLUTELY NOT the BS's fault the affair happened. That comes from weak boundaries and not protecting your marriage. However, what person could have a truly happy, healthy marriage where they were completely fulfilled and STILL want to walk away from it? That would take either a serial cheater or a true narciccist. I will be the first to admit - prior to this A, I was a crap spouse. I didn't meet WH's needs, and didn't listen when he tried to tell me about it. I just went about my own business and figured he "should understand" my actions.

So, while the BS should never be blamed (after all, there are many ways out of an unhappy marriage other than an A), we do need to take some accountability for the marriage falling apart. I think.

When I said to SH the other day that WH seemed to have the attitude of "I"ll just sit back and let you do the work, because you have all the problems, " he laughed and said I DID have problems, but that's what this program is about, fixing them!

As a FWH in an EA with a co-worker, I would have to say that the EA was just simply the most selfish way to get what I (Mr. non-confrontational) wanted / needed. I knew it should have stopped, but it felt too good. I was not willing to do the hard work (and much more rewarding) of reflecting on our marriage and repairing it. It does take two to repair it, but I didn't even give that a good try. I let my boundaries flex, and it cost me dearly.

Dday occurred and I suffered a coward's reward by having it revealed to my BS by 'chance'(God). Thank HIM that it was, and I now have a chance to build a foundation with her that will last. We both needed to change, and we both have recognized it. But it was not me telling her. I now had no right to tell her anything. All I could do was love her. She came to her own conclusions. Now we grow together.

Almost 4 months now since Dday, and I never want to go back to our pre-Dday marriage.

But man, some days it is still very hard for us both.

Restartmyheart, did you leave that job? Have you ended all contact with your OW?

This is the BARE MINIMUM a WS needs to do:

Confess with NO "explanation" or "justification"
Answer all questions in he above manner
Complete NC for life, even if it means moving, changing jobs, quitting a job, whatever
Get rid of ALL affair memorabilia
Repent - that means be sorry enough to QUIT and to make amends
Expose
Give unlimited access to all email, cell phone, credit card records, and install a keylogger on your computer
No opposite sex friends on fb for at least two years and then only relatives or those your spouse has agreed on
No private working conditions with opposite sex
Some sort of MB friendly counseling
Read Surviving an Affair and Fall In Love, Stay In Love
BE PATIENT, NO DEFENSIVENESS, and only an idiot would ask anything remotely close to "Aren't you over it yet?"
Humility is not optional
Thank God for every moment your BS stays....because they could have walked out the door and never looked back

As a WS with quite the "jerry springer" type story, I must say, while I know in my head that my husband is sick, and it wasnt my fault, I still cant get passed the low self esteem because of what he did. Not only with women but men too. I still have feelings like "was I so awful, he really had to go to men?) But then I remember, I was a damn good wife, I truely lived my life for him and the kids. Everything I did was based on if it would make him happy or piss him off, so when I think of how I lived my life strictly for him, and how good he really had it, I get sooo soo angry, and then stop blaming myself. I am only 4 months frm dday so Im sure it will take a lot longer for me to deal with all this. I am sure glad I am here to read such good posts, and get such wonderful advice, just when I get lost in my racing thoughts, then I read posts like this and it puts my feet on the ground for a few minutes to try to get my head on straight. Thanks guys:)

navewife, the only choices in life you ever have to apologize for are any choices YOU make. My marriage wasn't perfect, but DH is a GOOD MAN who did not deserve what I did. And you know what? Even if he wasn't a good man....I was still 100% wrong to cheat.

For some reason, a lot of WS's seem to want to rush their BS's into recovery (I use WS because if you are pushing your spouse to be okay, I am not sure the F is there yet). My DH forgave and healed, but he did it at the pace he COULD. He knew if he rushed it and tried to stuff down his hurt just so he could get over it or get "back to normal," it would never really be resolved.

Two people could have the same injury or disease, and because they are different, they will heal at different rates. So again, the FWS's job (one of many) is to be patient and lose the sense of "recovery entitlement." I keep saying this because there seems to be a "when will he/she get over it, how long do I have to do this" attitude coming through on some of the threads. How long? As long as your BS needs you to. Period.

Yes, I know what you mean. I have learned the hard way that I cant push my feelings aside just to find some sense of normal. I have come to terms with the fact that I will NEVER be normal or completely happy ever again. I am just trying to find a way to deal with that fact. I am just going to be myself from now on and if WH doesnt like it, I have told him to get out immediately, and not string me along. I mean what I say when I say if it happens again, its over. I cant do this again, that is for sure. He is doing his part,(at least what I see anyway) so I try to keep it together for now to see how long he will be this way. I hope and pray its for good. Thanks for your perspective, it does help, especially seeing a WS being so diligent in confessing that no matter what, its wrong. Thanks