Hello All,

Just under a month ago I discovered that my fiance has been having an affair with another woman. We are long distance and have been together for 7 years. I am a significant number of years younger than him (I'm in my mid twenties and he is 40).

I learned that he has been seeing a woman for 6 months when I went to visit him. Based on what she has stated and what he has told me, they have not had sex; it has been an emotional affair of sorts. He agreed to end it and said he sent her a goodbye email but last Saturday I couldn't reach him for hours and called the affair partner's phone. When she answered I heard his voice in the background and later learned that he spent the day helping her move into a new apartment. He says he was just keeping his word. On Monday he forwarded emails he sent her ending things to me but I doubted that they had actually been sent. However, after he "sent" them she began texting me, after me having contacted her many times, and she stated that she was through with him but then stated that they were never involved - she made several contradictory statements like this throughout her text and also called me a b-tch several times so I don't know what her angle was. However, today my fiancee told me that the affair partner emailed him asking him to meet her for a hand off of some tools that he left at her place.

My fiance said he plans to use the contact to allow me to physically see him send her an email reiterating his disinterest in being in contact her ever again and explaining that she can keep the tools. I'm happy that he voluntarily told me she contacted him and that he is working to make sure I see him officially tell her that the affair is over. I'm concerned though that this meetup request from her is a last ditch effort to get him back and since I am in another state I wonder how long my fiance will be able to stay on the road to moving forward.

The affair partner told me several inconsistent stories during our text messaging but the only one that bothered me was when she mentioned that my fiance stated that he wanted her and not me. Should I hold on to this? He says he never told her that but that he didn't make her think he didn't because he wanted to keep her around. He has stated repeatedly that he never intended to leave me for her. Do cheater says things to the other person like that and not mean them?

What should I ask him to say in the email to her before we send it?

OW is not your problem.
Your cheating boyfriend is your problem.
He's a liar and a sneak.
Not exactly a great catch.

Dump him.

Welcome to MB.

We say that dating is an interview for marriage. He failed the interview.

Why do you want to Marry him? You're young. Move on dear and leave him.

Do you have any children? Together?

Why are you separated?

This means, this dude was dating you while you were still a teenager, correct?

You need to gain a lot more experience in the world.

Date other men who don't treat you this badly.

Please read.
Buyers, Renters and Freeloaders

I guess I'm struggling because when we started premarital counseling he wasn't cheating and our therapist said that I had emotionally checked out and was keeping us in limbo for years. He was really upset that I wouldn't fully committ or make a decision about being with him so while he was wrong I know exactly how we got here. I left emotionally so he sought it out.

Dr. Harley would tell you to date at least 30 men.

Sweetie. He's still a liar and a cheat.

My daughter is about your age .... if a dude did this to her .... watch out for mama-bear.

What do your parents have to say about this?
Tell them everything.

Yes, I was in my teens. I do feel I need more experience. Will say that he was big on not stealing my youth so I've lived abroad completed college and grad school and pursued all my dreams with his full support during our relationship.

Anony, did you graduate from college? Do you have a career?

I see you answered my question while I was posting.

Dream big.
Dream beyond this man.

Will look into that, thank you.

You're probably right. I told my mom and she wants me tokeave him.

That's why you will find someone worthy of your worth. Your fiance does not deserve you.

You deserve so much better.

Please read.
Preparing for Marriage

Your mom sounds wise.

Moms know best.

x 1000

Be grateful that you know this BEFORE the wedding and children. Do not sign up for this sort of heartache when you have PROOF of how he is willing to treat you. Sorry for your pain but I would walk and cut my losses.

ETA: And it it HIGHLY likely there is sex involved. I would trust this being an EA as far as I could throw a house.

You will have a broken heart for awhile.
It hurts like hell, but it will get better. And, you'll get smarter with this experience.

That therapist is an idiot.
You were a teenager for most of those years !!!
Teenagers are not yet fully brain developed.

I hope you did not pay any money to listen to that horse manure.

EDIT TO ADD:
There is nothing wrong with you that a break from this dude won't repair.

You can do much, much better than this, dear. You can find someone who doesn't cheat and lie. You can find someone local [versus long distance] with whom you are not emotionally checked out. You should find someone you are emotionally ATTACHED TO. That is the person you should choose to marry.

Dating is a job interview for marriage and this interview has failed on many levels.

I was 23 when we saw her and she is my personal therapist so she tends to veer toward what is best for me but she was right. I was pretty immature and I counted on the fact that he loved me more than I loved him. During session he'd be practically begging me to committ and I wouldnt because i thought I might be missing out on something else.

Thank you Melody, I'm really considering ending it but I know I had a role

Not ready for that at all.

You're correct. You were not ready. Good instincts.

He always says he doesn't deserve me. Does it matter that I started an EA after I suspected that he had?

No.

You are not ready to marry anyone. And, that's OK!

Date. Date a lot.
Have fun.
Mature.
You can get married in 4-5 years.

I guess I want to marry him because he's always been my best friend and supporter. He gave me independence and was always willing to go without to see me taken care of. We don't have kids, in fact - believe it or not I'm waiting until marriage. He's never pressured me to have sex and has always supported my decision. Which is why I was shocked when the OW said he wouldn't have sex with her.

When I asked him why he didn't have sex with her, he said because he's waiting for me and only wanted female company that wasn't antagonistic and she was that.

Yeah, I'm preparing to get a terminal degree and I don't think I'm prepared for marriage. I feel like I need to work on my self worth because my therapist says I don't know how valuable I am.

Ok, so you've had your mom and your therapist and many anonymous, wise women on MB tell you to break up with him.

So will you?

You want a best friend and supporter who lies, cheats and deceives you? You have an EA on your best friend and support? You are not ready for marriage. Marriage right now and with this guy will be a total disaster.

I don't know. I'm afraid to but I feel relief thinking of never having to worry about lies again. He said if I leave him we can't be friends and I see him as my advisor and constant. Sometimes I tell him he's been like a father figure. He also had a bit of a temper and that concerns me too. He was married when I met him, I had no idea, and he divorced her so he always says he's given more to me than anyone andwill hate me.I just feel bad because for years he wasn't cheating and I wouldn't committ so he's not evil but this situation is causing me to be anxious 24/7

True. I don't want marriage right away. He wants us to go to therapy and see if we can salvage this.

He cheated on his XW and see what he's doing with you?

Do you see a pattern?

I do. I guess I dont get what I'm giving him because he's never slept with me.

His willingness to deceive you started day one.

He's quite manipulative.


This is a manipulative hook. Trying to guilt you into staying with him when, in the deepest part of your soul, you know you don't really want to.


Irrelevant. He is not the right man for you.
That is the only reason you need to give, as you say "Good-bye".

Probably he is not.

He is the wrong man for you.

You already know this.

I know you are right. I guess I make a lot of excuses and hope he'll change.

A woman he can continue to manipulate, sorry.

Please leave him before he manipulates you MORE. You need to break free of him.

He sought it out. Hmm. I guess I'm okay with him seeking out women to meet as potential partners. I'm not okay with the fact that he didn't share his decision with you. In other words, he had some concerns about his relationship with you, but chose to be with another woman instead of working on those concerns with you.

He has the hallmarks of being bad marriage material. My suggestion would be to exit this relationship and find someone else who is open to the concept of being honest with you.

As far as your premarital counselor? Please understand that there are therapists will find "something" that requires you to go to counselling. Just something to keep in mind if you plan to depend on therapists to tell you about yourself.

May I ask why, at the tender age of 23, you have a personal therapist?

Yes, I started seeing her through my college's student psych center for grief after the death of a close family member and continued seeing her. I started suffering panic attacks related to my grief.

Once the issues arose in my relationship I felt comfortable seeing her because he seemed to feel comfortable speaking with her and so did I. My therapist was right, I was checked out and she was telling me to make a choice because I saw my relationship as not a big deal but he has a child who he has full custody of and I had them move to be with me and everything and my therapist was trying to get me to understand that even though I was young, I was going to need to put my big girl panties on if I was going to be in a relationship because a kid was being impacted by my indifference. She's straight no chaser and saved my life during my grief. She was NOT getting paid for her work with us because at the time we could not afford it. She saw us because she cares about me.

My issue has always been indifference in our relationship and even though my partner seems like a monster I will say that he put up with quite a bit from me and my own therapist mentioned that while his EA was wrong, she warned me that I needed to make a choice so she is not surprised that we both sought out other people. I really don't know what I want. I like the new guy I talk to - he's my age but at the same time I feel bad that my partner lost 7 years on me. In that time I never made him feel great and I often went out of my way to make it clear to him that I could easily be with someone better. So I'm not totally innocent. I guess it took the EA for me to see just how low he felt about himself.

He did not end up seeing the OW. He actually randomly asked me to log into his email and when I did I saw that he had composed an email telling her to keep the tools because he is committed to his relationship. (Tangent: The other woman sent me a nasty text message sharing that she was in it for a green card and has asked him to marry her so that she could get one and she stated that he would not.) He asked me to click the send button. Before anyone asks, it's her real address because she contact me from it. It was a good gesture but I just feel like we have so much damage and baggage. If we were married I might be certainly sticking around to recover but idk. I feel it's been a great learning experience but I'm not sure I am willing to do the work that would be required to fix things. I don't think I ever was and before I knew it he was turning 40.

Just to clarify, we met on an online forum so he didn't know my age when he fell for me and didn't realize it until I met him in person. We live in different states. He does not normally date women as young as me. In fact the woman he cheated with is older than me (not by many years) but he normally dates women in his age group. I wasn't preyed on. In fact he didn't actually want to be affectionate with me until I was 21 because he felt it was odd to be any earlier. The age gap is not a huge issue- my godparents are 12 years apart and have been married 30 years, I think our combined immaturity has.

What led to the EA's was a summer filled with extreme misbehavior by his son and police and cps intervention. Ultimately we learned that his son was doing all of the lying and misbehaving because he felt I would steal his dad when we married. The child has since come to like me and after months of therapy his behavior is much better. However, while he acted out my partner and I fought terribly and crossed lines with disrespect that neither of us ever thought we would. I mean it was horrible. We could not cope with his son's behavior and we took it out on each other. Now his son is happy to see us together and we are a mess.

Hi Anony.

welcome to the board.


Did I get this right?
You are having an exclusive long distance relation with a father +child for the last 7 years and from what I read YOU have been 'freeloading' the whole ride. You are not getting your needs met and neither is he. You are both seeking out emotional connections outside of your relationship now.

Have you read:
freeloaders, renters & buyers?
His needs, her needs?

Yes, I have been freeloading. I didn't realize there was a name for it until now.

How often do you see your fiance?


This is my opinion, but there is no excuse for ANY type of affair. I lived in an emotionally abusive and sometimes physically abusive marriage and I never once strayed. Both of you need to work on yourselves individually. If it's meant to be, he will still be there for you when you fix yourself. If not, there is someone out there far better that will meet your needs.

Did he tell you he was in his mid-thirties, married and had a kid?

What online forum hooks up teenagers with old married men from different states?

How and where did you meet the first time?

Sounds exactly how the a former poster here "preyed upon" his ex-wife. Offer some young troubled girl online support and comfort for a long enough time to establish an emotional connection before hesitantly meeting them and allowing them to discover that they are much older than they realized or even considered but by then...they are in luv.

You are 23...you have no idea now but someday you will come to understand that you WERE preyed upon. He likely flipped it around on you...like your youth was a problem for him being with you but that was just an act. He knew what he was doing the whole time. A thirty something guy KNOWS when he's conversing with a teenager on a forum.

Move on. Find a husband and not a daddy.

Mr. W

Oh yeah ..... It does sound familiar.

Married man having affair with a teenager online and now 7 years later. I'm sorry, but this is only the tip of the iceberg. You've never slept with him? I can only imagine that he has had several girlfriends in the meantime while you have been abroad. A man who cheats on his WIFE will certainly have no loyalty to a young girl at a distance who he has never even slept with.

Have you met his ex-wife? Do you even know if he is actually divorced?

On the other hand, he was married when you met him. As much as this hurts you, it is probably nothing compared to some poor woman who may or may not know her husband was trolling for teenage girls online. Consider it karma and move on.

Thank you for your advice and the kind way you offered it to me.

I'm not 23. I always knew his age and that he had a son. He lied about being single.

It wasn't a dating site, it was a well known q&a forum and he IMed me because I was a top rated commentator. He had no idea I was as young as I was because I didn't advertise that lest I be taken less seriously on the forum by people regarding my knowledge of law and politics.



We met in my hometown and he had to agree to allow my older brother to stay with us the entire time. I asked him to meet. He admitted that he just thought we'd remain chat buddies.

We actually didn't begin dating until years later when I started graduate school. I didn't want to be a step mom very young.

I agree that he likely appreciated and used the ignorance that came with my age. He was sloppy though because I found the marriage certificate when I performed a background check on him online. I decided to look it up after I tagged along to check him into a hotel when he visited me and was called his wife's name by the desk clerk. I then confirmed it with his mom. He had already given me a copy of his criminal background check, he was totally honest about that.

I did meet the wife and despite his story of them only being legally married, I apologized to her and I told her I had no idea. She was mean to me but I told her that I understood I was the outsider even if I was lied to. Eventually she said she respected the way I approached her and that she knew I had no ill intent. She warned me about his temper and said that she would co-file for the divorce to make it easier for us to be together because he had told her and his family months ago that he was in love with me. She said he didn't keep me a secret from her and she was only interested in keeping her relationship with his young son, since she was the only mom he knew. I verified the divorce with the clerk and didn't allow him to contact me for the 90 days it took to finalize it. He is legally divorced.


I don't believe it's karma because I approached his wife with respect and I had no idea he was married. He never even got a hug from me until the divorce was final. I respect marriage. To this day she and I are fine. I also think I was very nice to her because she's old enough to be my aunt and I respect my elders.

Respect is terminating the relationship when you found out he was married and carrying on an affair with you. At that point, all that has happened since then, is a lifestyle that you have accepted. Believe me, I am not speaking to you as an ex-wife, but a young girl who was in your shoes a decade ago. How can you say you respect marriage when you continued a relationship with a man who was married? That is ludicrous. You are in your own "fog" to believe such a thing.

RE: Karma

The saying is old but very wise. You left a job opening when you became his "official" woman.

anony, I honestly believe you were tricked into this relationship. You were lied to from the beginning.
The fact you have been freeloading for 7 years, is proof you do not trust the situation you are in either.

It took a lot of guts to approach his wife and to be honest with her. I respect that. But WHY are you NOT being HONEST with YOURSELF?

You were lied to!
Your relationship is based on a lie!
The kid already has a mother who is willing to sacrifice her own needs and relationship.
To an outsider, like myself, your fiance is changing in is his aging wife for a new younger version.

Why don't you trust your gut feeling?
This is wrong and you know & feel it!

I appreciate your comment. I did leave, I immediately went no contact and didn't resume with him until the divorce was final. It was about 3 months before I started taking to him again. From what I was told by his family, he and the ex wife were only legally married and both seeing other people. So it was more dating before divorcing. Still I would not continue without proof of a dissolved marriage and speaking to his ex wife. I didn't create karma. I will admit he used my age and ignorance because what teenager will think to check marital status?

I really appreciate your comment. I agree, I was tricked. I feel like my ability to choose was taken away.

His ex wasn't his son's biological mother, the bio mom has no parental rights.

Im stuck because I've been here so long and he is all I know while the new guy is young and just great. I want to believe I fell for a good person.

The women he cheated with is older than me.

Anony,

It's not because he got the paperworks done now, your relationship will not be based on a lie in the future.
You cannot erase what has been done in the past!
multiple affairs, kid, ex-wife, bio-moms...

I think your doubts are sincere and you should trust your feeling. Cut contact and date this young guy (and plenty more like him)

Something I learned:

You do not have to *hate* the person you are dating in order to recognize that he/she is not the right one for you.
Dating for a long, long time is not a valid reason to remain with the wrong person.