Chris, I replied on your other thread. I am so sorry. Better days are ahead. You have the resources here and your faith to make it through. (((Hugs))) Do you have any friends IRL who have been through infidelity, to get some local support, too?

You also may want to consider reading through the articles Dr. Harley has here on the use of porn in marriage.

Porn can negatively affect a marriage, as much as having an actual affair. I also think porn and affairs are similar in that they both encourage fantasy.

Any chance you can install a key logger on your computer, to see, exactly, what your husband is doing?

NO NED. I have one friend who had infidelity & ended up in a divorce. The other people I know choose to look the other way.

this is all confusing....I get that sex is good as I enjoy it also BUT with that said I keep thinking of how we are instructed to not reward BAD behavior...when my sons were small and one would begin pounding on the other I would seperate that boy for the other 2....time out...let him calm down and talk to him...then to his 2 other brothers....what I didn't do is give him a cookie and tell him he is a good boy for that behavior.

So I guess I equate meeting spouses sex needs in this way...he treats me with neglect and IB....no UA time whatsoever for yrs....but I keep meeting his EN for sex....so he never changes the IB or UA....his EN's are met and he has no motivation to change to meet my EN's....get my thinking?

Yet I agree with what all has been said here on both sides and the other threads too....there really is 2 sides to the coin here...I want him to change but I don't use with holding sex as a means to motivate him....but I see no result from being a very loving sexual partner to him either.

This last rift is 5mo's long and for the 1st time in our marriage I truly can't even force myself to touch him in a sexual way nor do I want him to touch me at this point that way....I would feel like that's all I am good for and he doesn't NEED me for anything else....heck you can pay a hooker $20 on the street conner and get it w/o meeting that woman's EN's...just a $20 bill.

Sorry I am ranting but oh well I am human and need to vent also.

My sincerest thanks for that suggestion. I will read.

I will admit that I look @ pornography too. He knows about it, so I didn't feel that it was causing any problems.

Oh - about the porn:

Neither of us are "addicted" to it. It's an infrequent thing. For example, since 2005 I found 4 free trial subscriptions to porn.

Also, he has always initiated sex with me. Sadly, I rejected him more than I should have. Since I found MB I vowed not to do that again if twe ever got back to a place where he initiated it. He's back in that place now & I am participating.

Good to hear about the porn not being an issue. Sometimes, it can get overlooked.

Well, there is the bigger issue...

Chris,

The good news is that the steps to bringing a spouse out of withdrawal and back into commitment to the marriage are the same with or without an affair.

I will also venture that he doesn't think he is having an affair because he has probably not yet decided that he is in love with OW.

Find out as much as you can about how often he had contact with her. Try to find FACTS that indicate how much he is invested in this. Examine your own commitment to saving the marriage and act from THAT.

I'm going to be out most of the day so I'm going not be of a lot of help for most of today, I'm afraid.

My take is that eventually you will have to talk to him about this. When you do come at the problem from the perspective of having come to realize that something has been missing from the relationship and you want to rectify that. Ask that he not have any contact with her in order that your own marriage can blossom as you work on fixing what has been broken for so long.

Maybe not the best words, but I hope you get my meaning here.

You have to confront without making it a do or die, line in the sand, accusatory confrontation that leads to war.

Does that make sense?

If you find that there is more than just smoke and that a fire is raging, then begin steps to expose what is going on. He probably does not see the problem with flirting. It is a problem because if he is getting his ENs met by someone else it will lead to a full blown affair eventually unless he chooses to stop before it gets there.

If you haven't already done so, look at the late Shirley Glass' website. Not Just Friends Look at the quizzes she has there. Many answers as to just how vulnerable your marriage really is can come from those quizzes.

Mark

Yes, that is good news.


That's going to be toughie...not sure how I can do that without exposing that I know what I know.

As far as my feelings, I am not sure how I feel yet. Right now I would like to continue doing the Plan A & collecting more info if possible.



Yes, it does.



Thank you Mark.

Chris,

Stay steady...breathe...listen to Mark and others on your SAA thread...know that you'll know the truth.

Just not this second.

You are gathering information to understand the truth. Kudo yourself and breathe some more. Might be part of his divorce speech, might not. You don't know until you get there, and you will get there.

Have no doubt about that. You're you.

Stay present in mind for right this minute...because your H has been doing marriage, love, support, reacting with love to your changes, and I believe, having loving feelings. I do believe you both have been mostly transparent with each other...except for the times you weren't...like when H didn't tell you he was unhappy and frustrated.

And then he told you. Stay aware and keep to your plan...I know everything seems different with your new information...and your mind is definitely widened to include what you didn't include before...and yet, until you really know, everything is not different.

Just like coming to MB...feels at first, learning all about the basic concepts, rules of marriage...everything feels changed. Nothing changes until you begin doing MB.

LA

Stupid me...This was 3/14 @ ~ 6 p.m.

Chris, the mods can combine your threads for you. That way, your ENTIRE story will be easily accessible for everyone here.

I asked ~ 15 minutes ago. Thanks OH.

Ok, good to know. I just saw your comment that they delete a thread; didn't realize you'd asked to have threads combined as well.

I think you'll find the posters here better equipped to respond to you and help you, once your story is on one basic thread.

Again, thank you for the suggestion.

LA,

are you saying to keep working MB Plan A (meeting ENs, refraining from LBing behavior) and not focuing on whether he may be screwing around?

LA, AIDS is real. I am now ethusiastically having sex with someone who may or may not have had sex with a third party.

Can you be blatant and blunt with what you are saying here. It seemed a bit etherial to me.

Sincerest thanks.

I would absolutely not have unprotected sex with him at this point. I don't know how to get around not having sex without letting on what you already know, and as you also probably already know, letting him know you know is a bad idea until you're ready to confront with irrefutable proof and nuclear exposure. Ya know?

Get tested for STDs, do not have unprotected sex w/him until he's been tested as well. You may have a few days of...oh, I don't know, a yeast infection?...while you continue snooping. Ew. Sorry! (for all of it, not just my icky suggestion)

If you listen to Mark and the others (spying 101), then you will know the truth. Just won't know it overnight.

Yes, AIDS is real. And having SF when you suspect an affair is a really tough call...no one I know of in my years on MB has gotten AIDS from their WS...a few and possibly more than a few, have gotten herpes and other STDs, though.

You seemed very sure about his whereabouts and that his possible A wasn't physical (yet)...I believe you're a person who doesn't hide from the truth, doesn't half-do their research, so I wasn't as concerned about meeting SF EN.

However, that doesn't mean your concern about AIDS isn't valid, 'k? Plan A verifies, exposes, and yes, you both get STD tests depending on what you find out.

And you shore up loose boundaries with the opposite sex (both personal and marital boundaries)...and you may not want to do any of that.

If he is in an EA (without the physical component), what do you want to do? Do you want to recover your marriage?

If he is in an EA/PA what do you want to do?

Your goals, what you set, matter. My prior post came from me remembering what I wanted to hear when I was where you are...my own fear for my high level reactivity, fear, anger and pain.

And me wishing you didn't have to feel a single moment of any of it.

LA

The problem is - everyone here says that you know in your heart that your spouse is having an affair. Mr W & Mark allude to thinking that he may be headed that way but hasn't quite sealed the deal...especially now with the turn around. In my heart I do not "feel" an affair. I feel ego pumping with flirting. The SIM card reader should confirm or deny in just a few days.

I've already had unprotected sex with him for 11 or 12 years...up to and including this past Saturday and last night.

What would be the point of having a yeast infection now? Spite?

The focus isn't his EA (or gawd forbid - PA) it's making our marriage the best option for him, no?

Anyway - if the SIM card reader confirms an affair, I am guessing that the vets will say I'll need to stop the sex and take other measures. Can anyone tell me if I'm right? And if so - what those measures may be?