Hello All,<p>I have never used the internet, quite behind considering my age and profession.<p>But, I've decided to post my story as I am finding myself at a brick wall. About 3 mths ago my BF (boyfriend) of 9.5 yrs revealed to me that he had been unfaithful again! I know 9.5 yrs is a long time to try to summarise, but it is filled with much joy and sadness, and I believe you can only advise me if you get a concise picture.<p>I am 26 yo and I am of Asian descendent. My BF is a year older and he is of European descendent. We were high school sweethearts.
I will set the information out in chronological order, but that is not how it was revealed to me as I found out about the recent incidents first with the exception of two other periods.<p>Apparently, very early on in our relationship, he cheated by kissing three girls at a sleepover B-day (I only found out about this just two days ago).
Then, about 1-1.5 yr later when it was legal for him to go to club and drink he had a period of cheating (again only kissing). He told me about
this straight away, but still it was probably a mth or 2 that this carried on for before he told me (now, I just found out from his best friend that it may have been for a longer period, and my BF led me to believe it was only over summer break).
He said the group of guys he went out with used to cheer him on. In particular, there was a high school friend, who had admired me for over 5
yrs, constantly encouraged him to do so.<p>Three years in, he did it again. This time, it stopped because he had intercourse with a friend’s sister (who had admired him for
many years).
He said it was only 5 minutes since he pre-ejaculated.
Around this time, his stepbrother was having an affair and bringing the other girl home every second day. Also, his father was having marital
problems. When he talked to his father, he was advised to f*** everything he could (I only found this out 1 mth ago).<p>To explain about his past some more, his father left his mother when he was 4-5 yo for another woman. They had no contact till he was 8-9 yo. But, he did not talk or stay with his father till he was about 12-14 yo. His father has had many women, one after another, and he talks about sex all the time.<p>I thought that was it until 3 mths ago. We started having many arguments just before Christmas.
Apparently, he started having sex with prostitutes 3-4 yrs ago, with the exception of one girl he met.<p>To take a step back, I moved States 2 yrs ago, and he followed he 3 mths later. (I just found out the best sex he had with any of the prostitutes was at the start of this 3 mths apart, as SHE offered it without a condom and she had a decent body). He said it could never be anything like what we share or as good, since he was always drunk when he did it and it was just sex.<p>We had not lived together until a yr ago.<p>Anyhow, we tended to argue about things like him going out too much, and me not going, or him being in debt for all of his adult life.<p>So, he asked me to move out to give him time and space. I did it without knowing what he had been up to the past 3.5 yrs.
I don’t know if he would have volunteered the information on his own like previously, but he said he was about to tell me after a big get-together with our friends back home.
I don’t know why I asked him such questions, but that's how the truth came out. <p>At first he said he had a prostitute in our place the weekend I moved out to give him time and space. Then 3-4 days later a guy dumped a female “friend”.
She asked him to go for drinks and he ended up inviting her over for dinner. He said he didn’t really want to, but felt sorry for her, and
she had listened to him on many occasions when he needed to unload his thoughts about his confusion with us.
He said they got really drunk, but I know how much he needs in order to get drunk, and given how much they polished up, I don’t believe she was drunk.
The reason is that the first time I met her I didn’t like her. Perhaps, it was because he said she tried to pick him up.
But, he told her about me, and every time after that all he talked about to her was me.
He said she was trying very hard to be seductive and suggestive, and he felt that due to our recent arguments, we would break up eventually.
He said he did not try to please her at all, and
it didn’t finish. He said she was quite foul physically.
He said he was never attracted to her. Is this possible? ( Hmm, the pain. I just found out the real truth a few days ago. He said he had thought of her sexually on 2 previous occassion when they went out on pub crawls. He was very drunk and she was being very nice and leaning against him all the time).<p>Well, then 1 month ago after my constant talking and regular emotional outcries, he said he has been going to brothels or having prostitutes over
for the pass four years. In total, he does not believe it was any more than twenty times, and it was erratic. <p>He never saw any of them more than once, with the exception of two.
He asked for the 2 again because it might have been an ego thing because they were attractive. The Caucasian one offered to have unsafe sex because she saw a photo of us next to the bed, and the Asian one was extremely attractive, and she offered him her cell phone number and said to call her when he wanted to outside of “work”. He deleted it a week after she suggested this.<p>He does not recall the very first time.<p>He said he had wanted to put it all in the past when he relocated to be with me, but when he got here a work colleague and him joked about brothels.
They'd go visit for a joke and both did not meet up again that night. This happened 4-5 times.<p>He tells me that he had no feeling for any of them, “it was just sex”.
And,he said he did it with prostitutes because he didn’t want any emotional connection.
"It was not like picking girls up in clubs".
He ,ade a decision to stop and "tell" me after that "friend".<p>About a week ago, after many weeks of emotional rigors, he said he had an epiphany. He now realises what a special person he has in me for I have stood by his side through thick and thin, and I have always been the one who helped him out of every trouble (especially financially). Also, I found out from his mother that his stepfather (whom his mother divorced and has since died) was a sex maniac with pornography and prostitutes. He didn’t know about the prostitutes, but he was made to watch pornography when he was about 8-9 yo.<p>We had our first counselling session a week ago. But, I am now stuck as to whether I can forgive him and move on. I forgave him for the past because he had not gone so far, and I’ve said to him on many occasions not to do such things.
I feel so disrespected and degraded (especially for the ones that he brought into our bed)?<p>He said part of the reasons was because he stopped trying to sort out our differences with regards to sleeping over, living together before marriage, getting married, sex before marriage, him not being welcome to my family functions, going out, having people over, etc. Furthermore, he denied to himself that it ever happened, as he was always so drunk (with the one exception with the last prostitute because he said he thought he was ready to end it with me).
Is he being honest?<p>I have standards for how I want to be treated and this is not it. He reassures me that he does not want to ever do this again, but I don’t trust
him and I can’t stop thinking about or imagining him in the act. He admits that he may have fallen out of love with me at one stage, but he never
stopped loving me. What does that really mean?<p>I have many questions for him, and he will only answer some, even though he said I could ask him anything at any time.
However, I have found him to be trying to avoid giving time to do this by planning activities.<p>Also, I realy want to know exactly when he did these things so I can see how often, and if he used EVERY opportunity when I went home to visit my sisters when we were living together.
I guess this will show me if it was pre-meditated or whether it was a regular normal reaction (a havit or addiction to escape pain). That is, she is not home tonight, that means call
an escort.<p>I can't stop myself from asking (nagging), and this has driven him to lose it with me and break up a few times.
Do I have a right to demand to know everything?<p>I would love for you to help me as I am now at a loss.<p>eli<p>PS: We had our 3rd counselling session, and he keeps trying to remind me that he loves me and wants to be with me.
As to my constant thinking about it, he says I should try to occupy myself with others things.<p>PPS: I having been drifting deeper into depression and when he revealed about the girl he knew (not just a prostitute) at the beginning, I lost it and attacked him. Scratch scars to show.

I think you are dealing with a sexaholic. This man doesn't seem to respect your relationship. But, he is addicted to this behavior. <p>Have you been tested for HIV lately. Has he?<p>Now, I know this is not the most MB post and, perhaps, not the most kindhearted one BUT I'd drop this man in a heartbeat and ask my counselor if there is an S-Anon group in your area. <p>S-Anon is a family group for people who have family members or other loved ones who are sexaholics. It is a 12-step group very much like Al-Anon. Their international headquarters is in Nashville, TN. I don't know the telephone number but I have been a member of this group in the past and it was very helpful in helping me see my x's behavior in a new light. No matter how much he said I was responsible for his actions and feelings, they were his and he needed to assume responsibility.<p>Remember, 'No Glove, No Love' as my nieces used to say. No sex is worth dying for. And don't say it couldn't happen to you. One of my best friend's husband died of AIDS. <p>BE CAREFUL!!

Thank you for your response, however, our counsellor, and friends who know about this, all believe I have good reasons to stay.<p>I painted the picture in terms of events, but I didn't show what a good person he is. With the exception of these lies (which he tends to come forth with), he is kind, generous, and giving (as well as selfish, then who isn't?).<p>He could have easily just broken up with me and denied everything, and not confessed at anything.
Instead, he chose to lay it out so I could make my choice to move on with him as he confronts his mistakes, or leave him.<p>As for the STD test, yes I have and it came back negative.
I know he initiated the prostitution encouneters, but he was so drunk every time. Our counsellor and he recognises that he was an alcoholic.
As for the two girls that he knew, they were the ones that came onto him. I know he could have said no, but I've seen girls like these come onto him when he was not drunk. In fact, many of his friends and other work colleagues who at the first times that they meet me, told me they thought he was gay becuase he rejected many great advances.<p>Please consider some of the things I wrote such as his father (unfaithful womanizer), step-father (sex maniac), "friends" (other motives), and fundamental differences. <p>He said he was confused about "us", and since we got together so young, he never got the male experimental phase out of his system.
I was his first and he is my only.<p>As I said, everyone that knows believes he is for real now, and that he was brave to be honest with me. In fact, I think that is the main reason why I am still around. He has never lied to me, except for this one secret.
[img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img]

You are his co-addict just as many family members are the co-addicts of the alcoholics. The enablers. They don't hold the addict responsible for their behavior and their choices. <p>You may have had a test - but has he. How long has it been since you had sex with this irresponsible boy?

Come on eli,<p> You said he was honest with you? Where do you see that? He has lied to you for years. He is still lying to you with his silence. If what he says is for real he would tell you everything your heart desires to know about the infedilities. He would be accountable for ALL his free time and there would be NO secrets from you. <p> His friends say he is for real? This time? What does that mean? <p> Another poster has said it. He has a sexual addiction. Can you live with this? Does that mean you will accept this type of behavior in the future because he is not well?<p> Another main concern I have with this is you have stated that you are/have been there for him financially. What will his life be like if he doesn't have your money? Does he know this?<p> You must not accept this. You must insist that he get help for his addiction. He is to commit to working on his problems or there will be consequences to pay. He will be expected to stick with any programs the 2 of you come up with. If he refuses, that is his problem. You deserve better. End of story.<p> Do not be fooled by what his friends or he himself says. Actions are what speaks to you now. They are the ONLY thing that will save your relationship. Actions, not words. Make him aware of this and stick with it.<p> I wish you the best.<p> jd

[img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] Yes, he has been tested and is fine too.
You should have seen how tormented he was when I was waiting for my results.
He said he didn't care about his as much as mine because if mine was positve with anything at all he would have killed himself, and if his was positive, he would have ended the relationship (and consider killing himself).<p>I hear what you are saying, but can you tell me a bit about yourself?<p>I am interested to know what road you have travelled in life.<p>I haven't decide what to do, hence the counselling and browsing through this site. However, as my counsellor said "if I make it through this, it is my heart that will grow bigger".
He also said I should set boundaries and if that is crossed then I stick to my plan.<p>It's been 4 mths, and he has done practically I've asked some, he accounts for every minute of his day, after some soul searching he said he believes that part of him has absolutely died, and he has abandon his old ways and started setting goals. Something he has never done before.<p>I read some of the posts by WS who feel the pain for what their actions have caused. He expresses this to me often, and says anything I do or say is completely deserved by himself. Believe me, I've dished in out in my moments of pain.

Hmmm... Maybe since you are not his wife, he feels he can do whatever he pleases. I think if he breaks up with you again, he would be doing you a tremendous favor! No, you are not unreasonable to demand to know everything, but he disrespects you so much that to me, it seems clear he would continue to LIE! Of course, he has a sweet, believable side to him, but he also is a drunk. It doesn't sound like this relationship is healthy for you. At some point ya gotta ask yourself, what is so unhealthy about YOU that you would stay with such a sick person??? I know there are two sides to every story, but just going by what you state here in your posts... Also, it makes me wonder how come he never married you? It doesn't sound like he really wants to be committed to you after constantly cheating on you for almost 10 years! Wow! [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img]

Eli,<p>I am sorry that you are having to go through this. But you have come to the right place.<p>I suggest that you start by reading the material on this web site and the book "Surviving an Affair".<p>Like the others, I am concerned about your BF's history of infidelities. He has been putting your life at risk. It's one thing if he wants to put his own life at risk, but quiet another to not care enough about you to protect you.<p>Another book I would highly suggest is "Out of the Shadows". It's about people who have sexual addictions. I'm not trying to diagnose your BF here. That is of course up to a professional. If you will look at my signature block you will see that I a lot of experience with serial adultery. Both my 2nd and current husbands did this. <p>My counselor suggested this book to me. Even though I do not think that either of my H's exactly fit the sexual addict pattern, the book taught us both a lot about the whys of his behavior. It also gave us some guidelines on how to stop it. It gave me some insight and guidelines that have been invaluable.<p>My H's history of affairs was over a 2.5 year period. It was not a long-term life style.<p>Your H has a very long history of this. It seems that his father taught it to him. And he chooses friends who encourage the behavior. Does he have any friends who value commitment? Are the friends who say that you should stay together the same ones who engage in this behavior with him?

You do not have to live with this behavior. You deserve better. Please take care of yourself.

Thank you BINthereDUNthat and Zorweb,<p>You seem like you tried to really read my posts and though it is hard via this mode to really grasp the whole picture, you have tried.<p>There are 2 sides to every story, on mine it would be my traditional background (closed off family that never accepted him and my aversion to sex b4 marriage), my personal high standards for conducts and values. You've heard it b4 how some men say their partners don't want it as much as they'd like it, etc.<p>BINthereDUNthat, you are spot on wrt him being a drunk. He was drunk (to the point of not really knowing what was real, and not remembering every detail. I don't know, I've never been drunk). He has stopped since he told me.
Also, he was not committed to me. He didn't want to be since my family never accepted him (yet his did accept me), also I always said to him that if we got married andhe divorced me, I'd kill myself.
He admitted to me recently that that scared him from wanting to be with me.
I know it makes no sense, given what he allowed to happen.
However, I read in Dr. Harley's Radical Honesty that dishonesty will kill any relationship, and that is what his lies came close to doing. The point is,since he told me he has had many enlightened moments and ha said that he wants to now plan for marriage. He has begun this through his actions, such as repaying debt (from bad investment decisions), only going out when I feel like going out, not spending as much when we do (as he doesn't drink), and telling me he loves me more often.<p>To Zorweb, I can really feel you empathizing with me. I will read those books you suggested.<p>I don't want to make excuses for him, yet I don't want to be rigid. He was 17 then 20 when he kissed other people. And he sleeping with prostitutes he has admitted he had (and working on) an addiction to both alcohol and sex. Don't they say that most men think about sex all the time, espeically at that age? And as you pointed out he had all the wrong role models in his father and step-father and his "friends".<p>To answer your questions:
He doesn't hang out with those that encouraged him any more.
His current friends are your typical 20-30 yo who struggle with finding the right person, making the big committment (ie Marriage). Only one has decided, and that was only 2 mths ago. In fact, when we got that news he came out and confessed this whole thing.
As for the friends who advised me to give it ONLY 1 last chance (and set a definite boundary that if he does it once more it's gone for good), no they are not the same ones who encourage him.<p>It is hard. Part of me wants to know everything, yet because of my last reaction to something he told me, I feel that perhaps somethings I should not know?
Though, I agree with everyone who has said that I have a right to ask and know anything I want to. I wished someone could make him see that.
As I said, he struggles with the bad things he has done, and he has contemplated suicide many times when he thinks of it.<p>Which is worse: Having an affair (EA & PA), or paying for PA with people you don't care the least about and hardly ever repeating it with the same person?

Which is worse: Having an affair (EA & PA), or paying for PA with people you don't care the least about and hardly ever repeating it with the same person? <p>It's generally worse if there is a large emotional component to an affair. It's harder to break away. <p>But the use of prostitutes and other sources of one-night-stands is more likely expose you to life threatening diseases. <p>I don’t think either is better then the other. They are both distrustful and hurtful to you. If I were you I would not try to weight these. Instead just handle this as him having repeat affairs.<p>One thing about using the prostitutes and one-night-stands a lot is that the behavior gets closer to what it described as addictive behavior. Reading Out of the Shadows was really an eye opener for me.

Hi everyone,<p>I've been standing back a bit to do more perousing of what people had to say. I guess, I was starting to feel that I am wrong to love him so much, and wrong to want ot give this one last try given what some people had replied.<p>He has admitted to me that he had an addiction to sex. A very small part of it is to do with the experimental side of someone else. As I said, he is my first and only (just the person I am I suppose, though in my lowest moments I wished I didn't hold onto my values, morals, and standards so strongly), and I was his first.<p>Are there any other guys like that out there? And, was it difficult around the ages from 22+ ?<p>Anyway, I found some threads where BS's felt they needed to ask question and know painful truths.
I am so glad to have read that from 2long, Blondblossom, Replaced, & co. It made me realised that what I wanted and needed was normal.
I don't know if I will be blessed enough to have my needs met like Blondblossom, but I hope so.
Then again, the counsellor did say that life is not always fair. I try to be sooo good becuase I hope to have good things come to me, but it doesn't necessarily work that way.<p>That leads me to my next point.
My partner has been acting kinda weird lately. Then, I found out the counsellor said to him that he had told my enough, and not to say anymore.
This was after he saw the scratches I had given him.
I know it was wrong, and I am truly sorry for my stupid outburst. Trying not to make excuses, but it was after he told me about a very old incident (3.5 yrs ago), someone he met (as I said this was 1 of 2 that he knew, the rest he didn't), the only time when he was not drunk, and it was so dark I could not see his eyes. Previously, I had felt this rage one other time, but did not attack as I saw the pain in his eyes.
Still, I am feeling like I am a bad person, and can't really see the fog lifting even though he now acts loving in every way he can.<p>I am annoyed at the counsellor now, for validating his permission to with-holding details from me. I will express this in the next meeting.<p>Finally, Zorweb, thanks again for bringing the topic of addiction to my attention. I want to learn more about it now. If I am what is called a "co-addict or enabler", then I want to learn how not to be one.<p>Cheers.<p>PS: Does anyone know if Dr. Harley and the other therapists read this forum?
I tried emailing him via the front page to this forum, and I just get told to call the radio show or do phone therapy.
I find this difficult as I am not in the USA (huge time difference) as well as currency difference, so I can't really afford it.
I've order the books "Surviving an Affair" and "Out of the Shadows", but it would be nice if he could give me some feedback, since I am feeling so lost, stupid, and unworthy of my dreams (i.e. the love I thought he had for me).<p>[ May 28, 2002: Message edited by: eli ]</p>

Eli,<p>Glad to hear that you are coming along with all of this. Your frustration with the counseling is understandable. It might help if you call Harley's office to see if anything can be set up for counseling that will work for you.<p>In the meantime keep coming here. When you get the books, I'd suggest that you start with "Surviving an Affair" as it will go a long way to show you that what you want is normal and very reasonable. And it will give you a road map in handling this situation. After that the Out of the Shadow's book will give you a lot of into on the addictive behaviors and the codependency.<p>I do want to give you a caution about the idea of 'sexual addiction'. It is not an addition in the sense of a drug addition. Generally a person will die,or become violently ill, from cold turkey withdrawl from an addiction. <p>No one has ever died from cold turkey withdrawl from a "sexual addiction". It is really as behavioral issue. The 'sexual addict' greatly enjoys the feelings they get from the sexual experience. It is often that they feel inadequate and the constant sex and different sexual partners goes a long way to make them feel that they are lovable.<p>It is mostly bad behavior that a person needs to learn to resist. There are some componenets of the sexual addict getting a 'chemical high' from the chemicals the body pours into the brain. This is much like a runner gets.. .we call it a "runner's high". So do not accept an excuse from him that he is a victim of this addiction and therefore he cannot control it. It is perfectly contollable with behavior modification. The 'Sexaul addiction' label does not excuse what he has done and the hurt he has caused you.<p>That said, there is wonderful information in "Out of the Shadows" and the other books by the same author. They should help you even if a professional would not classify your BF of having a sexual addiction.<p>Hope I did not confuse you here. Let me know if I did and we can talk more.

Eli,<p>I am a sexual co-addict. My husband's behavior has been similiar to your BFs, only my husband doesn't use prostitutes -- he picks woman up in bars. <p>In addition to the books already recommended, I would also recommend "Back From Betrayal" by Jennifer P. Schneider. <p>Regardless of whether your BF is diagnosed as a SA, he fits that pattern of behavior and, to be blunt, the fact that you can excuse that behavior and are looking for reasons, and JUSTIFYING both his behavior and your staying with him points to your being codependent. Being codependent, you are, in ways, just as sick as your BF and need to address those issues and start your own recovery. The decision to stay with him is yours to make and there is NOTHING WRONG with that decision. Another good book is Melody Beatties "Codependent No More". And I'm sorry if I'm being harsh -- 4 months ago I was in a process of discovery myself and it is a painful, horrible thing.<p>And no offense to MB, I personally think the concepts are great, but I've also come to learn (the hard way!) that when you are dealing with compulsive behavior, they DO NOT work. I made the mistake of outlining the principals to my sex addict husband. Now, he uses them against me. When he gets into a state, every unreasonable thing he expects from me is a NEED and so I MUST provide it. For example, during a recent altercation he informed me that he NEEDED a femininely submissive woman, it was a NEED not a WANT and so he just had to have it and if I wanted to "keep" him I'd better supply it. <p>I also want to say, again no offense to MB, but you're not likely to find the support you need here. If you're interested in on-line support you can e-mail me at dedex1@mchsi.com and I can direct you to a site.

Dedex1 ,<p>RE: And no offense to MB, I personally think the concepts are great, but I've also come to learn (the hard way!) that when you are dealing with compulsive behavior, they DO NOT work. <p>If you read the MB material you will see that Harley says that when there an addiction of any type going on, it must be dealt with first before marital recovery can even be addressed. Addictions have the affect of causing a lot of emotional abuse. And sometimes even physical abuse. He suggests that the couple separate while the addiction is being worked on. When I called Harley’s office for a session with him and explained my situation, they told me that when there are multiple affairs, or sexual addiction, it’s a hard case that can seldom be turned around.<p>The reason I suggested that she read SAA first is that it says a lot of this. It also gives a description of what a person should expect in a marriage. Nowhere in MB does it say that a relationship should be saved at all costs. It gives a framework for getting through the minefield.<p>RE: I also want to say, again no offense to MB, but you're not likely to find the support you need here. <p>Gee, what is this all about? Thanks for the insult. <p>
RE: If you're interested in on-line support you can e-mail me at dedex1@mchsi.com and I can direct you to a site.<p>If you think that people here do not understand what is needed in these cases, maybe you could help everyone understand. It would help everyone.<p>If you know of a web site that is helpful to people dealing with sexual addiction like issues, why not share it openly? Many people here would benefit from it.<p>Seems that we ought to let Eli decide if she is getting what she needs here.

Zorweb, I am sorry if I offended you. That was not my intent.<p>I have read the material on this site and I have read Surviving an Affair. The only place I have seen it mentioned that the addiction needs to be addressed first in here on these boards. I admire the MB concept, but it can really only work if both partners are mentally healthy. Obviously, an individual who suffers from sexual compulsion is probably less than mentall healthy as is the individual who would stay with such a person. I made a HUGE mistake in reading this material and trying to apply it to my situation -- particularly since the concepts are so straigt forward and, in a way, brillant -- however, in my case they do not work. I could be perfect in every way, meet every need my husband ever had, he could be head-over-heels in love with me and he would STILL cheat on me. He doesn't cheat because of what is missing in our relationship, he cheats because that is how he copes, that is what he does. And for me, as a co-addict, to follow MB principals could be potentially damaging. Although there are certain rules I still try to follow because they are good common sense (no love busting for example). <p>I have encountered many, many helpful, good-hearted people on these boards. And I did not mean to be insulting. It is not your fault if this is not the right place for me to find support. <p>Again, I did not mean to offend, I was simply posting from my point of refrence -- I am involved with a sexual addict. I know what it is like to be involved with someone for many years and to have this bomb dropped on you that this person that you thought you knew has had multiple sexual partners and may continue to do so. I know what it is like to STILL be unable to leave the relationship, even in the face of this. I see some similiarities between my story and Eli's and I also see *alot* of myself in her defense of her BFs actions and her defense of her decision to stay with him. I was simply trying to help by offering her my experience. <p>And, frankly, your response indicates part of the reason why I can't truly find support here -- I was offering help and advice from my point of reference and I stated I meant no offense and yet you jumped all over me for having a differing opinion and offering other means of support.

Thank you for showing you care ladies.<p>I now know a little of both of you and your passion indicates to me that you both have very good intentions.
I choose to take all your advices onboard.<p>Zorweb, you said your H is not an exact SA. I think my BF is a SA simply because he said it, but he has gone cold turkey. I believe him when he says he has not done it since the last time.
Reason being, he only does it sometimes (erratic)when he is drunk (has not been drunk in the past 4 ths) and he only does it when he has been out with the boys and end up alone. He has stopped this lifestyle all together (only go out when I go).
Also, I have found a pattern. It normally shows up as to how well he does at work. The times that it happened, he would have extremely bad things happen at work (e.g. left job on bad terms in one, and lost respect from senior managers in another). He is doing extraordinarily well now.
I'm not saying doing bad at work causes him to act this way. But rather, vice-versa i.e. he sabotages himself at work for what he does to himself and to me in these mistakes.
Finally, on his own free will he said he decided that he would not even masturbate since he came clean.
As I mentioned, though he has cheated in the past with a few kisses, this is all really tough to handle and know what to do for oneself.<p>All of you (no sorry, most of you) have been fabo btw.
Having said so, I understand the ones whom have been extreme in their feedback because that is a trait of mine too. Something I am trying to work on for myself as it shows a lack of empathy and compassion, I think (I say I am good, but I'm far from perfect ;-) ).<p>Thanks.<p>PS: Am I setting myself up for wanting to know all the gory details?
He doesn't remember everything tiny winy detail being so drunk when it happended, and some so long ago (3 yrs).
PPS: Pls no debate about remembering as he does have a worse memory than I do, and I can't even remember the mths that he moved into his previous 2 properties (3 yrs ago).<p>[ May 28, 2002: Message edited by: eli ]</p>