I once read in one of my A books that the WS may be so deep in the fog that it may take them leaving up to three times to be with the other person before they realize that person is not the one for them.

<small>[ February 08, 2004, 12:25 AM: Message edited by: Lovely ]</small>

I beleive tha d-rose had his WW leave him for the OM and later came back to him. From his latest posts it seems that he and his W are doing great as far as their marital recovery is concerned. I hope he pops in and gives you his insights.

Mine has been back and forth many times. He is still seeing OW though. I am in Plan B with a couple of slips.

Plan B is great because you get a clearer look at what is going on. Also you get out of the triangle and get your self-esteem back.

Diamond,

My lovely wife only left once. She moved out in April of last year and moved back in September. She moved with the idea that we would eventually divorce and to be alone. We split up the bills and arranged vitation for our daughter. She pretty much had one foot out the door since d-day in jul 02. When she moved out her intention was, as she told me, was to be alone and figure herself out. I figured once in her own place she and OM would start dating. It took a couple of weeks but they did start dating, eventually turning their EA into a PA. From her account, the OM had "troubles" maintaining.

I think that this was sort of a wake-up call to her. She was slipping back into the same habits she had for so long. She sent me quite a lengthly email talking about her life and how she felt about herself. Over the next couple of months she bought up moving back in. I was happy but at the same time hesitant. I never asked her to come back. I emphatically stressed that she be 100% sure that we were going to work on our marriage the right way. I wanted her to comeback because of me and out marriage not because single life was rough.

My counselor told me to make her wait. And I did for a while. Even while we were separated we still attended church together on sundays and for a while in our small group on wednesday's. Tere was a time when we didn't talk for about a month. I think it was during this time she did a lot of praying, reading and was seeing a counselor. She had directed a lot of blame towards me in the past but that was gone. She really started to see how her past really affected her present and what she had contributed to our marriage problems.

[B] How can I tell it's real this time?[\B]

$64K question right there. It is hard not to be gun shy and I am sure previously you thought he was "for real." I subscribed to the thought "show me, don't tell me." I saw the changes in my lovely wife because she chose to change and to show me thos changes.

What has your H showed you really?

He says he wants to come home and that he loves you, what has he done to prove that?

What has he changed?

He is still living with the OW. For all you know he got toff he phone with you, after professing his love, and jumped in the sack with OW. She goes first and then you can talk to him about the possibility of maybe giving him a second, 3rd, 4th chance to straighten his butt up. Until she is out of his life (or at least his apartment) I wouldn't allow him back.
I read a book called "hope for the separated" by smalley (i think) that really helped me.

Hope this helps. I am at work so this is a little brief.

God Bless

I looked that book up on the Internet.
It certainly sounds like a worthwhile read!

Our marriage has 'healed' however we were never seperated.
My husband has been FORGIVEN, and we no longer talk about his affair.

It would be WRONG of me since I have forgiven him.
Love, Julie


Hope for the Separated

by Gary Chapman
Chapman believes that the biblical ideal for a seperated couple calls for reconciliation. If you are separated, you may not feel like reconciling. You may not see hope for reunion. But through small steps, this marriage counselor, shows that your wounded marriage can be healed.
Media Type: Paperback
Copyright: ©1996
Size: 5.5 x 8.5
ISBN: 0802436366
Price: $11.99

My H left in June 03 and was back by August 03...pretty fast by MB standards (if there is such a thing).

I think what helped is that he had lied to the OW, she thought we had an open M...hah.

One night when they were both on IM I IM her and told her that I thought he was lying to both of us. She instantly got off, but I think that was enough of a seed to keep her at her distance.

I don't think things would have moved as smoothly if she had chased after him.

It's like being addicted to crack...what if the crack kept calling you and chasing after you after you had sworn it off. I think you have to make EXTREME precautions to get through the withdrawal. What if you worked with the crack every day, or saw the crack socially. One of the rules of rehab is you don't hang out with the same friends.

H got rid of IM on the computers, sent a N/C letter, and gave me the passwords to his email accounts.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Blessed TIME:
<strong> I looked that book up on the Internet.
It certainly sounds like a worthwhile read!

Our marriage has 'healed' however we were never seperated.
My husband has been FORGIVEN, and we no longer talk about his affair.

It would be WRONG of me since I have forgiven him.
Love, Julie

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Blessed I want to make a statement and I hope it's meaning comes through....

If the only reason you don't talk about the A is because it would be "wrong" then maybe you should talk about it some more. I don't think discussing the A is unhealthy. If one obsesses(sp) then it becomes un healthy.

You called attention to the word forgiven in reference to your Husband. Are you referring to God's forgiveness, your's or both?

Just asking..

God Bless

Diamond Girl,

Yes, my H left twice. Both times he was gone VERY briefly, his second trip out the door was about 3 months after the first. Both times OW would chase after him after he would return home, the first time after a very brief NC with her, he allowed the contact to continue. In my case, upon his first return, I thought he was home for good, and that he was done with OW (obviously) but very shortly after his return it was obvious he wasn't really plugged into our relationship. We couldn't even attempt to heal the M at that time, because he was back on the fence about her again.

How will you know this time is different? I agree with the others look for him to show you it is, not just words, but actions. He must maintain NC with OW, and be prepared to take extreme care to insure this. I would suggest you let him tell YOU what he will do this time, do not tell him what you expect, at this point he would probably agree to anything you say. In my case I noticed a huge difference in him the second time he wanted to come back, and once he was home this positive change continued. Is he willing to go to MC? Good luck to you!

I just don't know what to do

<small>[ February 08, 2004, 12:26 AM: Message edited by: Lovely ]</small>

Maybe you didn't ask for the details but I'm giving them anyway.

Warning...Long.

My H's first affair was for 4 weeks when I was away with our 3 kids in 1986. He went NC rather rapidly even though he thought he had fallen in love with her...our neighbor, who had just divorced her husband and had a daughter who had leukemia.

My husband did leave a few times and come back with the next A that lasted on and off for four years Mid '94 to mid '98. The last time with that OW, he had to get to the point of moving in with her and her kids. It was after her divorce was final. She made out very well in her divorce and was offering him basically a free ride if he needed it. She was always very generous with gifts to him.

At first with that A he went to a hotel, he came home after about 2 months (Jan '95). They were back at it and by July to Sept '95 she got him his own cellular phone. At some point in early '96 he got his own apt. with a six month lease. The OW cleaned it for him. He came home after about 4 months. That may have lasted another 9 months. He would just want to call her and find out how she was.....

He was back in contact again with another new cell phone by Feb 97, (I found it in his truck again) about a month before her divorce was final.

It did take him actually living with her April and May of 1998, for the bubble to burst, the fog to lift, and for him to realize what he was about to loose (he was well into loosing the respect of our kids and I was about to move on with my life...getting psyched up for it). It couldn't have helped his pride much to be a 'kept man'. Reality set in.

He moved out of her house by the end of May 98. I allowed him to move back home by the end of July '98. We both had IC and then a couple of sessions of MC. We went to an IMAGO therapy weekend. (Getting the Love You Want, by Harville Hendrick) He also went through the process to become a Catholic (I wasn't a practicing Catholic (since I was a teenager) at the time). After doing that we renewed our vows in the church...April '99.

He started a new friendship with another woman in 2000. Ended it when I found out about it and thought it inappropriate (it may have lasted a few months). H didn't know he wasn't capable of just being friends with a woman. Then she called him after her husband left her in May of 2002. They started a secret EA that lasted 8 months culminating in 2 admitted PA before I found out and had the proof. Cellular records again. How stupid can he get! (Although we've been practicing Radical honesty now I still don't know if I really believe that they only had sex 2X, I may never know.) I got all the typical denial and justifications. He had been starting to be very distant, angry and depressed around me for several months. He started coming home late. He started drinking more. I started believing his complaints about me and was trying to be better.

Then I found MB and plan A'd. I asked and got him to agree to NC fairly soon this time. We spoke with a priest and went to a few sessions with a rational emotive therapist that the priest had recommended. This was around Christmas 2002. We went to a MB weekend in March of 2003 and the followup exercises. We have had a full recovery.

I will say that at times I still wait for another ball to drop but that is my own paranoia.

I really think he gets it now. He cannot engage in any intimate conversation or expect he can have develop any female friendships outside of our marriage. We can have couple friends and he can have male friends. In a way it is too bad that it has to be that way, but hey, I can't either. There have been times that I have wanted to accept an invitation to lunch with men but haven't out of respect for my H. I thought that I could be safe with it but I don't want to put myself in any inappropriate situation either. There were times during his last EA that I was asked to lunch and I would turn them down meanwhile he was having breakfast and lunch with the OW several times a week.

It has been a rollercoaster. Sometimes I've felt quite the fool. I wanted desparately to keep my family together.

I don't know what he would do if he ran into either of the last OW's. I don't know if he will be able to withstand the temptation that satan can throw his way. I hope so. I do not want to live the rest of my life in fear of his having another A and me having to follow through with my not wanting to put up with it another time.

I don't like having to be too vigilant. I still worry if I can't reach him or if he is late and doesn't call. That is seldom the case now. I still check redial on the home phone if he's been home alone. I don't think he'd be that stupid to use his cell phone again but I check his bill every month. Only, the new company doesn't give the detail on incoming calls.

Otherwise, we are really doing great. Full trust will probably never return and I think Harley doesn't think it should. My H is very good at reassuring me of his love and commitment now. He has been very patient with me. I am much better about not LB like I used to and not wanting to be the cause of his unhappiness. I try to keep the inevitable triggers in check. I have to hold my tongue. Sometimes H can tell by my facial expressions or body language when something reminds me. I don't know how much he thinks of the past. He is a conflict avoider so I suspect he chooses not to go there.

My hubby left a couple of times. I can't remember how many now but it was only once to be with xow.

I think my hubby spoke about the times he left on MB. Please see the link in my signature. Warning, it's very long.

WOW.

I just read ALL the posts from both topics.It sure is long but I have been taking the time to read those extra long posts lately.What stories!

knewjie,

I hope for my WH to have the same "awakening" as yours did.It sounds like things are going well for you and your H.That's great!

O