OK , why the sick need to know? why still this OBSESSION !??????

I know the OW BIRTHDAY IS coming some time in AUGUST ,,, H has always told me he does not remeber .... BS(bull$hit) I don't know .

I mean all the years I know him the memory sucks with DATES .

I always had to remind him of every thing , sometimes his own LOL .

BUT when I spoke to OW I got a round about time frame now I know its sometime in AUGUST thats it though the rest is a guesss....

BUT whats worse is why do I care ,, I mean I am major obsessed with this ,,, with her ,, WHY ???

I keep going back to this , I try ,I relax, I think about the positive in our R & M , I just can't get away from this at all .

I am up again doing nothing but thinking about the sound of her voice, her look , her body, how she may have made love to my H , how she dresses, what fun she may have been ect......

This very sick list continues , I know its just not good , I mean do I fear ,yes I think always , would I care if they contacted one another ,,,NO & YES....

NO , if they or HE told me HONESTY is the key to that one .

YES, because I really thought he is committed to me .

OK I maybe not making sense I am so tired , maybe its the summer thing JUNE started the 1 year of N/C and then theres just the hole triggers of the summer all together and knowing the BIRTHDAY is around here somewhere .

ITS just the fear of UNKNOWN .

I find this stupid to bring up to H , cause he will really see this as WOW get over it already I don't know the B-DAY and don't care . I know the answers he will give .

I am even more concerned on my obsession I mean I even just did a back round check !make sure I know the number still she hasn't moved . BUT why care ????

any tips ? suggestions?

3iac - i find myself asking some of those same "sick" questions to my own H...i think it has to do with our own self-confidence - we want to believe that we're prettier, smarter, BETTER than the OW, but somehow feel that if all those things were true, they wouldn't have wanted OW...

Wish I had some advice for you, but can only say I know how you feel - and, it backfired on me recently, so all I can offer is this: you're H is with you, he's focusing on you, so you focus on being the best you that you can, and ask him instead of what was OW like, etc, but maybe how can I change x or y to something you'd enjoy more?

Good luck to you...

I can relate to your sitch ohh too well.
My W had an A with a guy almost 10 years younger than me who lived with his parents, had a cheesy job, no car and no concept of taking care of a family. I couldn't believe WHY she had the A and it haunts me from time to time. The OM is also in great physical shape, but the bottom line was none of those points I made had ANYTHING to do with WHY she had an A with him.

I think it was shattered dreams (SD) who shed some light on my W's actions. My W was in the A because she loved the way she felt about herself when she was with him. NOTHING MORE NOTHING LESS. Someones physical attributes, financial status or whatever has very little if anything to do with it. I now see that some of the dynamics of our relationship are what created my W's desire for her relationship with OM. I'm sure in their relationship the OM never:

1. Put her on the defensive for her ideas, or choices. He was supportive of any dream she dreamed.

2. I have a strong feeling being carefree and not dictating to her had alot to do with it. I have a strong personality and being in a R with someone who looks to you for advice might boost your self-esteem to Mt. Everest levels if your used to someone els always leading.

3. FUN! They had fun together. The OM didn't have the means to show her an extravagant time, but he had the attitude of letting it all hang out, which is a characteristic of most 21-25 year old guys.

I sat back kicking myself and LB'ing about how she could make such a immature choice in a partner until I realized my judgemental attitude was precisely part of what enabled her to have the A. Please don't look at it as physical. I'm willing to bet having a nice figure isn't enough for your H to have an A, but making him feel like he is TERRIFIC and HANDSOME is!

Hang in there, we all hear those little voices of jealousy and self-doubt and remember
"IT's WHAT's INSIDE".

Thanks you guys for the responses ,so sad that people can relate to one another on this level , but such is a part of life , not the upside to life but the bad comes with good .

FM- I tottaly here what your saying and in some cases maybe most very true .

BUT ya see , looks and age and fun did have a VERY large part to the A that took place .

Thats the killer , HE did find her sexually attrav=ctive and beutiful .. and the get up and go girl (ya know the type)

BUT also the running from responsiablity and getting to feel FREE again was it as well .

These are some things I explained to him I will not change and have NO control over .

I am responsiable and won't do foolish things so he can feel or we can feel care free especaialy when it puts our family in risk of liveing on the street ,,, That part he needed to fix himself understanding what being a grown up is all about .

THE BODY thiing well always working on this , yes she is 8 year younger and had her 1 child very early in life so the age and the body thing so definately on her side .

touching base on the self confidence issue , I 've had many posts around here about that .

I am more confident in myself then I ever was after this A ,BUT now I see I can't fight the issues still within myself .

I really s=do not think it involves him(H) much more I mean what could he possiable do or say at this point .???

YES he can listen but the explaining has been beaten to death over the past 2 years ...so it leaves little old me to deal ...

I got to go I'll be back , keep it coming .

Hey 3! I've been wondering how you're doing, seeing as how you didn't return my last email! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Look here girl. Everytime that little voice pops into your head telling you that maybe you're not good enough, making you think about how she looked and what she had that was so great, tell it to shut the he!! up! There has been NC for over a year. Your H is with YOU. Try to start replacing those nasty little thoughts with much nicer ones--think about good times you and H have had in the past year, how much better things are now. Think about anything that will take your mind off of her. Focus on you and H.

Seriously, unless there is any indication that there has been any contact, then you are doing nothing but making yourself feel bad, making yourself relive it.

Of course thoughts of her or the A are going to pop into your head sometimes (well, unless you have one of those Men in Black memory eraser thingies). But allowing yourself to focus on and become obsessed with thoughts of her is not benefitting you or your M in any way. Like I said, when those nasty little thoughts pop up, work on replacing them with good ones.

FM- I tottaly here what your saying and in some cases maybe most very true .

BUT ya see , looks and age and fun did have a VERY large part to the A that took place .

Who says you can't be fun? Recreation may be a very important EN for your H.

Thats the killer , HE did find her sexually attrav=ctive and beutiful .. and the get up and go girl (ya know the type)

Again, Your beautiful as well! Who says you can't exemplify your getupand gogettedness? Don't put yourself in a box. You can be just as vibrant and outgoing as anyone else if you so choose.

BUT also the running from responsiablity and getting to feel FREE again was it as well .

These are some things I explained to him I will not change and have NO control over .

Running from responsibility? You would have to explain what this means. Feeling free is one thing, but acting like a out of control teenager is another issue altogether. How about a happy medium, there has to be one.

I am responsiable and won't do foolish things so he can feel or we can feel care free especaialy when it puts our family in risk of liveing on the street ,,, That part he needed to fix himself understanding what being a grown up is all about .

I agree, but maybe there is room for negoitiation. My W was caught up in what seems like irresponsible behaviour as well, but we MUST find a medium, its obvious she needs FUN TIMES and Crazy Memories with me, not just the dredge of everyday life, you know pay bills, work and childen duties....Negoitiate.

THE BODY thiing well always working on this , yes she is 8 year younger and had her 1 child very early in life so the age and the body thing so definately on her side .

I understand physic, child birth but remember your beautiful as well!

touching base on the self confidence issue , I 've had many posts around here about that .

I am more confident in myself then I ever was after this A ,BUT now I see I can't fight the issues still within myself .

I really s=do not think it involves him(H) much more I mean what could he possiable do or say at this point .???

I agree again, this is about you NOT him, but I thiink if you could be more flexible and negoitiate to meet some of those EN's that you believe she met that your self-image would raise tremendously. Imvho, if you felt your were fulfilling at least some of those needs in him that you would feel more secure and the hurtful mental pictures of the OW would dissipate somewhat. That's just my opinion and I'm working on this issue myself. I cannot expect her to no longer desire those things she received from OM, and for me to feel confident that she will not stray I must find ways to meet her needs. I do not trust my W's WILL POWER to simply go without those EN's and mentally they are a stumbing block if I donot act.

YES he can listen but the explaining has been beaten to death over the past 2 years ...so it leaves little old me to deal ...

I undestand how you feel, I too want my M to be stable and comfortable again, but to do that for me means opening myself up to providing not What I think my wifes needs are , or whats best for her, but actually striving to provide what she thinks her needs are. Good luck to us both and I hope you see my point.

Hi 3! I have always admired your spunk and sense of humor. I think the A drained some of that out you, no? What are you doing with your time these days? Is there something different that you can get involved in, learn something new maybe? I would imagine you'd apply yourself to something that really interested you. What can you do for YOU?

OW bit the dust, remember? The 3 that your H married is still in there somewhere, you just need to find her again. You're just in a little pothole right now, it's not going to take as much effort for you to get out at this point in time if you try. Don't wallow in OW thoughts, she is SO OVER.

Think instead about you, what can you do for you and how you and H are going to benefit from your new attitude. 3, I KNOW you can do this, put your spunk to some good use. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Best, KB

YOU guys , LUV sorry about e-mail <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I'm so rapped into ME LOL

ALL great points LUV & FM.

Been through alot of them and to explain more FM about the FREE thing ...

It is just that , see thats what happened , he wanted to be free as in the spend what ever do and go fly by the seat of your pants kind of thing .

PROBLEM , we do not have it like that never did .

I want and do , do things fun but in the limits to our financal situation . Also I can have fun at a park playing catch and running around or coffee and cards at a freinds house suck down a couple of beers and kick it .

MY H started to find this as boring , wanting to spend spend spend witch produced 1-the start of the 64,000 (yes that is corrsct ) dept to date that we have gone through in the past 3 years and 2- the look of a women he wanted to show baot it with .

MY house had to bail us out through the first 30,ooo now another 30,000 later , that is because I try to change soooo much to fill the EN of SELFISHNESS ,,, he is the type looking for happiness that he thinks only money can bye (understand )

AND I always aim to please him and want to always strive to make him happy ... BUT I couldn't keep up the pase it never satisfied him .

WHEN he came home all these issues where talked out I explained what he was coming home to ,, I would fill the NEEDS of fun and being more get up and GOOOO GOOO GOOO also more in line for family watching our kids for us to DO things together BUT ,,,, NOT at the cost of DEPT and losing my home and being bankrupt .

HE came home crying and saying he FINALLY got it and knew that it was his issues of imaturity that created the prosona of me being BORING ,,,

ok so I gave ya some insight to the personality .

NOW back to the obsession ,,, I even do not sleep thinking about what color she pains her toe nails or dyes her hair , how long is it , did he get loud in bed with her ,, how does she clean her apt. does she pay bills on time ...

SEE I am nuts LOL .

ALSO to address LUV ,, no as far as I can gather there has been NO CONTACT ,,, but if not after this long 1 year and before then with the head way we supposedly made in the M why are there things missing .

WHY is he still not that tottaly obsessed H I had with the mad affection he once gave me .

IS he resighed to the fact that we should be some old Married couple who will never have that , WOW kind of love , that he had it with her the wild 18 year old thing and now he has to settle in the humdrum love of married people .. (make sense)

YOU no the preseption M sex that some people think ,,, not offten one possion and wam bam thank you I am tired now from the hole 15 minutes . LOL

I have expressed the need and the desire for a more exsiting sex life ... I mean theres a time for makin love and theres a time for lets rock and roll (to put it rated G LOL )

I'm 37 not dead !

$hit I want the screening yelling , baby oil bath , some food frenzy , all nighter !!!!

ya know , sorry if this is to extreme ,,,

BUT I say these things and he says oh stop , thats groose or stop it how silly ..

BUT I can't help thinking and knowing to a degree they had that so why not us ,, is it cause I am the wife ,,, you know the stupid image of that some men have .

TO me , I am a wife and mother but a SLUT in the bedroom I don't mind ...

So if you had that with her why am I diferent. I am open to anything .

I am not as body perfect as her , but $hit if I am the women ya love whats the problem it should be even easier ..or is it .???

Cause that person was the stranger , does it get the juices for that reason the unknown , the getting court , the high the thrill ...

he once told me your so obsessed with her you should go DO HER !

Hi 3,

Long time no C!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

My 2 cents: Your H needs to help you have closure. His flipant comments are not helpful.

What is he willing to do on a daily, weekly and 1 time (or several time) symbolic basis to help you get over this hump. See it is done in his eyes but not in yours. Recovery stages tend to bring out a lot of anger and more frustration with the BS. It is not the BS healing time, not just for the WS. The work for the WS increases and the BS steps back a bit.

Needy? You s/b. Give him the giver part and you do some taking. Read that book again. BALANCE!!!!

l.

KB - you make me feel good about me <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> TY.
Orchid - was I missed LOL , bringing up all my sick twisted things LOL

I know the giver in him that I am looking for is not there , am I saying he don't NO , but some here said long ago I think MEL ,, that he seems to just give enough ,, thats it in a nut shell .

REMORSEFUL , just enough , never to much never goes the extra yard , I have addressed it he says what JUST ENOUGH LOL

"Says I don't know what you want from me , I am affectionate , accountable , family oreinted , alittle more responsiable ,,, any more and I will be KISSING your A$$ "

Witch oh my , he never would do , maybe that and combed with the regret I have STILL not beating this HO's head in to the pavment is still the problem or is it the fact that I feel he is still chasing happiness himself .?

YOU the rich person thing all the money in the world , is nothing if you got NO ONE BY your side to share it with ,,, well thats my thing with him hes always looking for the next thing to do thinking thats going to bring him hapiness ,, mean while not understanding hes one of the richest people with the love of a great family kids, sisters , brothers , a desent job a house , and a women who would still through every thing give my sole for him .

SPUNK I got it back , have had it , and showed it but its not getting any where .

We are happy in his eyes and yes in mine but just .thats it not this GLEMING glowing wow life is good reall good .

ANY thoughts what the hell I am in search of except for HALE BERRYS BODY on me ! LOL

and bringing ow to hell for the rest of her life !

2 things I never will have . OK maybe thats it I have to settle for the things I can't have .

YOU guys really help me to clear my head don't go away !

Grrrrrrr Arrrrg! It killed my post! Oh well, let's have another go at this. I'm going to address the first post, because that was the one that struck me.

It has been my experience that when I am feeling obsessive about something...there is usually something related but unaddressed fueling it. My husband was willing to answer any Q about the OW and what they had done together and therefore *complete* the puzzle. I thought about it...weighed the gains to the losses...asked a few questions here and there but never felt any real satisfaction from it. The urge to dig vs the fear of what you will unearth...may be entirely irrelevent to your drive to gather information. When I realize that something is coming to a head in this way I usually set aside a time when I will not be interrupted so that I can pull the plug and see what comes out. I have found that for me writing it out is best. If you talk about it with a friend, your friend will likely empathize with you and the two of you will then loop and comiserate and remain focussed on what you say is troubling you instead of what is manifesting but not being expressed. Usually they will suggest ways to find out what her B day is..or try to convince you that it's better not to obsess [because you were thinking it was a really good plan and needing to have that cleared up. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> ]

Fortune favors the brave! I notice that the vast majority of your post is pretty nearly exactly the sort of outpouring that I myself use...so I looked at it dispassionately and what jumps out to me [keep in mind, they are my interpretations of your thoughts...may be waaaaay off, but hopefully still usefull as an example if nothing else] is how troubled you are by being stuck in the BS perspective. Your emotions are unable to process the reality of being excluded from an intimate experience involving your husband. Rightly so says I. You seem to want to know the things that would have been important to you if you had been included [B days etc.]. You yourself state that it is entirely in character for your husband to disregard things like that. What I hear being expressed in your words is 1) a heartcry: "I don't want to be left out! Your sex belongs to me! Your intimacy belongs to me! Those feelings you had with her are MINE by right! We are supposed to experience these things TOGETHER!". So, your little internal helper may recognize this and go about trying to collect as much info as possible to try and inject familiarity where you can't have intimacy. 2) The desire to know thy enemy. To build and guard and prepare. You feel exposed...she has infiltrated your camp and pilaged. You would like to close the gaps and be prepared for where you feel she is likely to strike. This is very difficult because from where you are standing..the playing field isn't level. You feel you can't compete in some areas and that's fine. You are correct, you can't.

I suspect that the reason you have zeroed in on her B day is because of the likelyhood that they shared something significant on that day, from which you have been excluded. I think that there is a *reason* that this is turning and cycling and grinding away at you. I think there is something to be seen that is unseen. I am gonna go out on a ledge here and presume that you have some familiarity with the MB concepts because you espouse their terminology. Those will be very usefull indeed with regard to the structural redesigning of your marriage. They can help the two of you lay down a foundation of sterner stuff so that should the big bad wolf huff and puff...your house will stand and mock her efforts. What they can not do is reconcile the actual betrayal and all of the fun contained therein. They can't give you back the stolen moments. Having someone try to reason with you about the futility of dwelling on your loss is irritating and unhelpfull. You already know that it won't fix things for you...if you could just stop thinking about it, you would. I have a close friend who has struggled for years with infertility..guess what people say to her? "Oh, just don't think about it." She told me she has the urge to stab them in the head with a butter knife and say "Well, just stop thinking about that !" You know what? It is impossible to not think about something that affects you every day. Something that you have to take into consideration with every decision that you make. The only choice that you have is to determine what position in your life these feelings will have. If you determine that they will be of primary importance..you will be ruled by them. They are fickle by nature and a harsh master, is there an alternative? I believe that there is. I believe that it is possible to say truthfully "I feel this way specifically about this right now at this moment, and that's fine...I may feel different in five minutes..or five days and yes it will color my perspective but I will not allow it to distract me from my objective." The objective is the recovery of your marriage. Feel like you can't compete? Acknowledge that yes..there are some areas of life that may be a strength for her and not for you. It is also true that there are areas in your life by which she is so completely unable to compete that to engage with you would result in her learning the meaning of the term "total domination". The playing field is not level..but you can use your strengths to your advantage to level the opposition in those areas. Make new memories with your husband from which she is excluded. Bind him to you. Remember your own history..the births of your children. The first time you made love. Go to the store for some chocolate syrup..I always feel more positive after a really good orgasm [or two]. Sex binds you and provides release if you let it. Do things together that are very fun and teenagery with regard to the whirlwind..but not irresponsible. Sit up canoodling and watching hokey sci-fi shows. Play strip monopoly. You will not begrudge the lost sleep..no one does, remember all the lost sleep..and how you looked back fondly the next day..as if your tiredness was a tangible keepsake of the pleasures the two of you enjoyed...you did it then, you can do it now. You are a wife and a mother..you are also a woman, an indiviual, a lover, a friend. You are not a domesticated animal to her jungle predator. You do have interests of your own..and therefore you are interesting. YOU are as different from she as she from you. He has chosen his flavor of preference..entice him with it. My husband too fights the desire to run from the daily grind..I reminded him that grinding can be fun <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> . He seems to have been fullfilling his EN's with her wildness, and your responsibility. Life does not allow both. If that was a feasable choice we would all do it. Seek our pleasure where we find it willy nilly. Remind him that while you are responsible..it is because you want to enjoy the fruit of your labors..not to toil and give and then lose all by dropping the ball. Life isn't meaningless..the effort is not in and of itself rewarding..the reward is what we expend the effort to gain. cheers, Noodle

NOODLE - all I can say right now is WOW WOW WOW!
TY for a really great post , for taking d=so much time to respond . You put alot into that and I really need to take the time and reread it I did that twice already but need to rethink some of the points you took the time to put out there for me .

YES I am very intune to MB concpts so yes it does help , but altering the fact that every WS as well as BS is different in there own way .

I do in a sense want to "level " the playing feild . And with respect into being APART of there FUN ,, well not that .

Maybe as I examime it it is what my H said way back that he feels I want this RACICAL HONESTY thing to use it as a tool in my own head to think that she means/meant more to him then I did/do .

EXample - I know he drove her every where always at her beck and call .. now on the flip side I drive and do not need him for these things , so I would get annoyed that I would ask him to drive me some where and he would say why? you always did that . MY response was well if you ran for her run for ME .

WRONG , I guess so . IN my head I was/am comparing everything if you left work early for her do it now for me , you called her 5x a day call me 6 ... you ate lunch together well now see me at lunch ,,, GET IT .

I do know again as I said before alot of this is my issue .. I knew these things and yes said I still wanted my M ... was I in a FOG denieanl thing he will bend over for me for what he did MAYBE .

MAybe the more I know will help me shut down to stop giving so that if she or he should start again I will be able to feel nothing for him ..

I am still in search for these answers .

In regards to turning back time in one sense and creating NEW memories in anohter ,,, I feel I really try ... I am rejected when ever it means being to intamate .

THIS part of the recovery /M has not taken any new shape .

ITS almost as if he makes love out of obligation .

If I initiate it I am turned down every time , then when I complain or talk about it , he will but if I don't I can count down the weeks that could go by .

BUT its not like he is avoiding being with me as far as affection or time alone just no real affection that may lead to anything else .

EXample like making out he use to love to kiss me really kiss ... now he does but just kiss thats it never a tongue involved ,, if asked he say stupid things like oh we are not kids or teens any more and thats so discusting . So what am I to belive that ow was better or he can't get her out of his head thats where the mind wonders to .

HE denies any of those things . HIS and her relationship was a mirrior image of me and him from the time we started dating till I got pregnant with 2nd child .

THE places they went the things they did even the things he said to he (she told me all the lines after awhile I would repeat them to her)

OW explained he couldn't keep his hands off her always eyeing her up and down making constant coments about how beutiful and great body she had getting jealous if anyone even looked her way . Always wanting to makeout any where in front of any one .

THAT was him in a nut shell ,, so heres the thing if he choose me then why has he not even come close to that .

HE of course says she lied and blew these things up to piss me off .... NO I know she was telling the trueth ,,, there was even nicknames that only he and I would know he called her all of them .

SHE discribed my life to a tea , she discribed my H's every hand move , sweet takin line exactly with no waver . BUT he still denies it .

WHY ? again so I won't expect it my way , so he does not feel I have any right to question it .
HER word against HIS .

And me left holding the trueth of what I have known from our past and second guess how messed up it would be if it is true then I never meant anything ,all our years together was FAKE .


I feel she holds the key to alot of my answers I feel she holds alot to my H heart , I need to know , fear that I never will leaves me in my own world of imagination and thats never a good place to be .

I also struggle with what she knows , I mean the way n/c accured was a bad deal I made and I regret that . Her never knowing he came home , her never knowing that while he lived hear I knew they where talking .

SO SORRY I got to run I will add more later .

Sorry to just drop out H came HOME .

TY again .

Wow. What noodle said. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Ya know 3, I tend to forget sometimes, that even as alike as these situations are, there are some big differences. The ow in my situation was someone I knew fairly well--she acted like a friend. Also, my H answered all my questions (usually grudgingly, but I got the answers nonetheless). So i'm probably not the best one to advise on that stuff.

However, the sex stuff--now THAT is something I know WELL! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> My H was a prude when we got together--let's just say I created a monster! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />
If there's anything you want to discuss about that, shoot me an email. I'll be happy to discuss any questions, ideas, etc.

LUV - your great at the advice or the say it like it is thing or the OPOIN ! LOL

BUT WOW AGAIN what NOODLE SAID, I'm still rereading .

Some angrey news on the front how I could have ben so stupid and forget . I was l;ooking through papers a minute ago from all my calander keeping days and snooping ... and OW B-DAY was in JULY <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

NOW I am really mad H played cards in JULY <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />
I didn't even check up on him , now the mind is racing , yes he called when he got to card game and when he left and came in early but dam , now I am thinking did I get fooled dooped !

Or am I looking for something not there ! or am I afraid there is something there ,, or do I want there to be something there ???

WOW my head hurts <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

H out tonight to a blues club with a very safe brother-in-law and sisters friends to see other Brother-in-law play a set .

WHY am I not there ? well last minute plans and no babysitter ! I don't leave my kids with anyone except family and 2 close friends all witch where busy and some had plans already . BUT I am ok with this exceot that I hate the fact he has that glow of hapiness on him more when he is going out then when with me .

Maybe there is something wrong with me ? NAH ! LOL

And as far as the sex thing goes he was never a prude ! never ! thats why I know it still has something to do with her . maybe not CONTACT but still in his heart or she opened something up that he can't get past ,, I feel sick even thinking about that .

ALL I know is I can't turn this off and LUV, MISSM ,and others know that I have tried oh lord I tried .

MAYBE to much I don't know . I feel like I am waiting for the show down like unfinished busness ..

Anyone experiance that , that there was unfished crap then after it was taken care of the dust finnaly settled .

ok going to read around awhile , check back in .

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Or am I looking for something not there ! or am I afraid there is something there ,, or do I want there to be something there ??? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Maybe, of course, and uh, NO! Are you sure there is no reason whatsoever for you to suspect something going on (and IMO, a gut feeling counts as a reason)?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> ... hate the fact he has that glow of hapiness on him more when he is going out then when with me . </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well, what about when you 2 go out together (as in a date--no kids!)? And how often do you do that? If you're like me, it ain't easy. I can't even remember the last "date" we had--closest thing to it was putting the kids to bed early and watching rented movies & cuddling (among other things <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> ). I'm in the same boat when it comes to babysitting. Once in a great while the kids will go spend the night at my mom's, but she's 2 hours away and it doesn't happen much. That's the extent of my babysitting.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> And as far as the sex thing goes he was never a prude ! never ! </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Didn't say he was, <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> but everybody can use a little "spice" every now and then.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> thats why I know it still has something to do with her . maybe not CONTACT but still in his heart or she opened something up that he can't get past ,, I feel sick even thinking about that . </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hmmmmmm...that's certainly a possibility. But certainly not the only possibility. That could stem from any number of things--guilt, stress, etc. He's the only one that knows for sure. I know it's hard with your H because he's not a "talker", but somehow the lines of communication need to be opened up with regards to that.

Agreeing with luvbird..something is rotten in the state of..uh..wherever you live <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Now before you panic..it may not be renewed contact or anything that extreme. Go with the gut though. If some nagging anxiety is keeping you up in the wee hours..pay attention. You have described symptoms..let's look for possible causes. You feel vulnerable and panicky because he's back, but not back , no? He was never a prude... until now so that would be on the list of concern. It probably has a lot to do with your body image issues. You are experiencing actual, bonafide rejection. His sexual response is off for some reason. To make the sauce even yummier..you have OW whispering in your ear [literally..what were you thinking discussing this with her?! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> ] that he was touching her..and kissing her..and [oops, just a sec, I need to vomit <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ] possesive of her...everything he is pointedly not doing to and for you. I see the "we aren't kids anymore" as an evasive tactic..but something else stands out..he said point blank that it is disgusting. Did you hear that? He said that he is feeling disgust or revulsion at the idea/thought/reality of physical/sexual stuff. Go back and reread that last sentance so we are sure not to miss it. Houston, we have identified a gap in the recovery. There are a lot of possible causes for this...but any and all need to be addressed. Please tell me that the two of you are seeking counsel? If not, stop whatever you are doing and get thee to the couch! He won't go? Excuse me? I'm sorry, was it a request? Is he in a position to dictate the terms? I believe that the pain/frustration/grief expressed in your post suggests that you would like to have a fully recoverred marriage. You want the whole enchilada. You want to be his first choice, not his consolation prize. Not something he settled for. If you are both committed to the success of the marriage you will both be willing to do whatever it takes, for as long as it takes. No more holding out allowed.

Next up..childcare ..recovery style.

In short? Get some. Make it a priority. Your husband needs to be associating you with his pleasure moments. He shouldn't be having his fun without you. You are his wife..not his unpaid au pair. MB says even if your childcare expenses are equal to your mortgage payment..make it happen. It is absolutely crucial in any marriage..but especially in yours [what was his draw to her again? Oh yeah, fun and freedom...'nuff said.] Do you see how this paradigm pans out? He leaves to go enjoy himself, and then..when he feels he ought to go home..there you are the end of his fun made flesh. And he isn't excited to see you? How odd....do you see why it is important that he associates his good times with you? You don't want him to merely feel affection for you..you want him excited by the prospect of spending time with you.

And also......

Information..what is the point of requesting it? I see three likely possibilities. 1)a reason to stay 2)a reason to leave and 3)the truth.
If your true intent is 1..sorry, he can't provide that for you with information about his feelings and his relationship with her. If it is 2..you already have it. Shall I say it again? You are already justified in leaving, no new info needed. If it is 3 though...you must be able to handle the truth. The truth may be very painfull for you both at times..he seems to be expressing a concern that you will use anything he says as a tool. If this is a valid concern, you will need to correct that in order for him to be comfortable enough to be honest about his feelings. What if he told you [now just using a worst nightmare scenario as an example..don't panic] that while he wants to remain in the marriage, he is no longer sexually attracted to you? Would you be able to handle that information? If you have been spending time reading MB..then you know that this is a surmountable issue. Something that can, with time and effort, be resolved...and yet it would sting like a death of a thousand cuts. Have no expectations regarding what he feels..focus on what he is willing to do. This is how he can make up for that drive to work, that phone call. Don't stand next to her in line and measure her portion to yours..chart new territory. You will both be doing really only what you should have been doing anyway. You are in a struggle with the flaws and vulnerablities in your marriage..and personal foibles...she is a symptom and not the apex..do not hand her that powerfull title.

In the meantime, may your heart be light, and your purse be heavy <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Noodle

I wanna be like noodle when I grow up. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Me Too!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Love in Christ, <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />
Miss M

ME TOO!
OH this is my thread LOL AM I aloud to just say that LOL

OK NOODLE , I am still processing again .

H asures me there is no NO NO contact , and from what snooping gets me I can't find a darn thing . YES could they be better at it , YEP , is H useually that savy ,,UM , NO .

MAybe I am making this to extreme , its just different , not the way I want it to be , not the way I thought it to be .

HES not nervous or on edge like when there was contact , he is accountable , and I don't want to give the impression that he is gone more then he is home .

WE are together , and yes when we date he is happy to be going out but I am not so sure thats its cause hes out with me , or the fact that we are out in general ...MAKING SENSE !

THE image thing , is played like this , if I say how come it ain't like it was when we where younger he'll say ,,, well things change .

THEN in some other way he will go back to the BODY thing .

EXAMPLE : I say you use to be all over me , always grabing and groping , he'll say well things change I say no we are still together and you love me I love you ... he'll say well you don't look the same .

SEE back to that , OK now you guys are going to think me very sick but .

I feel as if thats the missing link , my was xyz, then NOT THEN enter OW her is XYZ .

NOW he came home (2years) and the only thing missing is XYZ , to its fullessed .

Would this be to hard to belive , ??? WEll for me not really , I know him .

Although he won't come out and say I was with OW for this very big reason , HE has come out with , theres a chance if ya lokkin for me to be that "MAN" again you need to have that BODY again .

NOODLE to address some stuff , but not in depth , cause my story is very long and very complicated with my H oersonality .

I will address the counsoling thing ,,, NO there is none , no there probbly will never be any .

AND BTW I read one of your post 7/23 and I say chin up , also yes long road to recovey and those feelings you talk of deep inside are ones I've vented many of times ,also still keep under control deep inside .

feeling what ever cause hes back , well yes and no . I always felt and think most do feel open when H comes home ,, but I am 2 1/2 years with him home . So most of that is just going to be what it is .

IN a possion to dictate terms YOU ASKED ,, well not that he dictates lets say he always has a manipulating way of doing things his way . LOL

THATS the issues talk about early on , I not only took him back but with his terms . YES mine to . BUT mostly how he would end the A and what and how he did it the way he wanted . I stood by with support to a degree .

YES , I no OW in the ear was not heakthy but I would do it again if I could shed more trueth on anything .
YOUR answer to the trueth , I always feel the need to collect all the evedence and then make my decion . SO if he said , I am here but not sexually , well then see ya BUDDY !

ALL these things that is the part that in me says , he just , does enough to keep it a good M . and nice R .

om I'll be back , hope I answered some stuff

3! You just hit 1000 posts!

Will respond more when I've had my coffee.

Must......wake......up.....