</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by legato:
<strong> Hi options,

Just chiming in here. Good advice from all I think. I'm not sure about exposing at work since that seems a huge LB. But I do see the advantage of possible dismissal or at least making work environment less disrable to her. That would solve the problem of her not being willing to find a new job. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Exposure always angers the WS, but that is ok. It is a positive move that is necessary to end the affair. And I agree with your point about losing her job. She can't work with the OM if the affair is to ever end. Options, are they teachers?

Options,

Having just moved from the verge of DV to recovery, I can tell you that exposure was vital in getting my WW out of the A.

Don't expect it to be overnight though, I exposed in Nov, and we were within 2 hours of mediation to decide custody when the breakthrough finally took place this week.

Yes, she will be very mad, you will likely be called some vile things by her, do not fret, it is not your W saying it, it is the alien that is living in her body. If you get into recovery, she will not remember the exposure as being mean, but as being a loving gesture to save your marriage.

Be strong, your kids need that, and your marriage depends on it. Your wife will never return unless she can respect you, and you allowing her to continue her A is helping her to lose respect for you. Her seeing you ACTIVELY ENGAGED IN BATTLE for your M will result in her re-gaining respect & is actually making LB deposits.

You can do it.

yes, they are teachers. Which makes it harder I think. Why do you ask?

I see that I have been getting mixed advice her and do not feel comfortable with any one strategy at this point. I do agree with exposure (which is not debated here) now but am not sure what action to take and how to do it. With whatever I do, I need to feel darn sure it is the best thing to do.

All at once or in steps?

I could tell WW's mom today or tomorrow. Everybody in one day would be hard considering they work and my schedule. At this point I see the people with influence as: her mom/step dad, her two friends at school, and another friend that she will be with this weekend. I would expose to my parents for support to me but they wouldn't be an influence on her. They do not get along that well.

Also, I just came back from IC. My IC said to give WW the chance to expose to her mom first then if she doesn't for me to expose.

More help please.....

I think there is a lot of good advice in this thread. However, NC is not negotiable. Your WW is cake eating...and that just will not work. You said the reason she is still at home is because of the kids, well she can't have both the affair and a marriage and children. That just will not work. Either she honors her wedding vows and committment to you and your children or she continues the A. Do not negotiate with her, tell her no more contact of any kind period. You can not fix your relationship while she is involved with OM. If she does not agree to NC the expose. Remembere you are trying to save your marriage and your family. I hate to say this but I told my ww if you ever and I mean ever speak to om again then you are gone. Our 21 year marriage is over. You will not see our 14 year old daughter. I will tell her that you did not take her to dance class because you were having sex with om in a motel. Then DD would not want to see you anyway. You can pick your clothes up in the driveway. I will change the locks on the house. You have hurt me so deeply I will not be hurt anymore, I will not allow your behavior to affect our rerlationship or DD any longer. I told her this on D-day. She stopped all contact with OM that day. Stand up and protect your family don't be a door mat. Your family will surely be torn apart if this continues.

God bless you and give you strengh.

Tellmewhy

Hosea, thanks for your post. How did you expose and to whom?

options

I definitely would not threaten her with it. I wouldn't give her any kind of warning at all, just do it and like Melody says, get it over with. Don't give her any opportunity to spin it. I would definitely show whatever evidence you have to them so that she can't make you out to be paranoid; maybe even give them copies of evidence so that they can pull it out if she tries to make it that they're only friends.

<small>[ February 17, 2005, 12:31 PM: Message edited by: legato ]</small>

After I have exposed, should I tell her I have exposed and to whom or let her find out for herself?

Also, the more I think about it. I think exposing to her boss might be good. He might be able to help by moving one of them to a different school within the district.

Opinions?

<small>[ February 17, 2005, 12:52 PM: Message edited by: options ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

Also, I just came back from IC. My IC said to give WW the chance to expose to her mom first then if she doesn't for me to expose.

More help please..... </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">ok, let's consider this advice. First off, what makes the IC think that your W would willingly bust herself? The only way to acheive this would be to threaten her, a huge unneccesary lovebuster. And let's say you do browbeat her into busting herself to her mother, do you think your MIL will get the TRUE, unadulterated story? No. Your MIL will get SPIN. And the spin will most likely be designed to demonize you. The result will be that your MIL will then be neutralized and will be of no help to your marriage. If you go and try to correct the spin, it will be hard to be convincing since your W has most likely demonized you.

That is why it is so important that the story come from the one who is SANE and the one who is least likely to be untruthful in order to gain the maximum support.

Exposure is often useless when the WS is forewarned and this is the exact reason why. You will be throwing away the valuable benefits of exposure if you include your W in the exposure process.

And yes, you are getting different advice about exposure. You just have to use your judgement and go with what will work the best in the situation. You know your situation better than we do.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by options:
<strong> After I have exposed, should I tell her I have exposed and to whom or let her find out for herself?

Also, the more I think about it. I think exposing to her boss might be good. He might be able to help by moving one of them to a different school within the district.

Opinions? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">BINGO! He will have to split them up. The boss needs to know before a parent or the press finds out so he can handle it. If you don't tell him, the affair can continue at work UNIMPEDED.

And even if you did get her to agree to end the affair, the hell would never end because she would see him every day at work. The affair would be on again and off again for years. She will never recover until ALL CONTACT ends.

I think it is the best solution to tell the boss and let him work this out. If this news gets OUT, it will cause much more damage than if has an opportunity to handle it discretely.

P.S. I would do this exposure in person with evidence in hand.

Options,
Well it sounds as though you have gotten yourself thru the decision to expose and now the only question is the how: all at once or in steps.

As you know, I believe in the steps as I previously posted. So I'm in the Suzet, Starfish camp. BTW, I think this is the only issue where I've actually been in debate with Melodylane. Melody is a great lady and I respect her opinions (most of the time lol)

The reason I believe in steps is that some WWs will end the affair after it is exposed to their parents and the OM's W or GF.

For others it takes more. It takes telling their close friends who are "friends of the marriage" For some it even takes exposure to the employer. The reality is that there are even some who won't be effected by exposure at all. They'll continue and its on to Plan B.

My W ended her A almost as soon as I found out. It did take exposure to OM's W to insure NC. Her mother and mine were told after the fact to assist in recovery.

My W didn't need exposure to the entire family circle. Her brother and sister don't know. Her father (parents are divorced) doesn't know. The majority of her friends don't know. Yes sometimes I wish they all did know, but that's my vindictive side talking.

So in my case if I had done the massive one time bomb drop it would have been overkill.

Keep in mind the goal is to end the affair but you also need to keep your eye on the aftermath. A BS (and in IMHO male BSs especially thanks to society's double standards) have a hard time dealing with the humiliation of the A. Needless to say the more people who know the more difficult it is to deal with it.

I can remember a holiday party I went to when we were in recovery. Her best friend and the only one who knows about the affair was there. I was in a great mood until I looked accross the room and saw this woman. A huge wave of shame and humiliation washed over me and it was down hill from there.

I think you need to gage your wife is she really deep into the fog or is she feeling massively guilty and looking for an excuse to end the affair. My wife was the latter while yours may be the former.

You know you're wife so pick an exposure plan and put it into action today.

Mac

Thanks M. Makes sense.

Question though- Should I tell WW after I have exposed or let her find out from them? If I should tell her how would it be best to say it to make it least like a LB?
Also, what do you think about tell her boss?

options

PS

WAT if you are lurking out there I wanted to comment on something referenced above.

Star talks about your "concentric circle theory" Dude you stole my line. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> If I was an author I'd be in court.

Of course I'm kidding. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Being my usual sarcastic self here. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Hope all is well with you WAT.

Mac

I agree with Mel and with the concentric circle advice too in this way.

Expose to the people who will have the most influence on her NOW, in one fell swoop...boss, mom, and girlfriend. Then, as situations arise...family outings with extended family...church outings...expose to more and more people as the A continues (if it does).

Another reason exposure is important is that it bursts the fantasy, helps the A see the light of day, and when NC begins and withdrawal sets in, can be one more thing to help WW stay in NC...she knows the consequences, and other people will be watching her closely.


To change the subject, how is the other parts of Plan A going, how is that EN fulfillment? Sure you have the top 3? Are you making recognizable changes?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by options:
<strong> Thanks M. Makes sense.

Question though- Should I tell WW after I have exposed or let her find out from them? If I should tell her how would it be best to say it to make it least like a LB?
Also, what do you think about tell her boss?

options </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't know if I would tell her. She will, no doubt, find out you have told certain people and will come to you. Perhaps that would be a good time to tell her that you have told others, and tell her who. This is another good reason to get this all done quickly before she can pre-empt you.

At that time, be sure and tell her that you love her and are doing everything in your power to save your marriage. She will be angry, so it's important to NOT let her bait you into getting angry. Just stick to your points and STAY CALM. Don't apologize.

Did you see my post about seeing her boss? I think that is probably your greatest opportunity and I am thinking you should do that one first.

I didn't tell my Squid. She found out very quickly afterwards however.
She screamed:
" THANKS! We can be together now, OM and myself ! She's thrown him out ! You have just thrown away your last chance with me ! Why did you have to make OMs life **** as well as ours?

WHY did you have to be so nasty ? WHY ????"

I soaked up the spite for a minute or two then I fixed her gaze and said calmly:

" I told you I would do whatever I felt in prayer was the right thing to do to save our marriage. I love you, and I am scared at what this may do, but I did it because I felt it was right and that OM GF deserved to know the man her BF is."

She screamed and went to our room crying.

There followed two weeks of absolute poison from her. But OM told her to **** off so NC held.

After 2 weeks I asked her " Why are you here, Squid? You said you would stay and work on our M yetyou choose only to be spiteful to me and our children. I am not shackling you here. I want to you back, but I do not need you. Think about why you are here and talk to me".

Starting the next day she was a different person.

Since she told me that she thought my exposure was out of spite, then that her anger was awful because she thought OM GF would think she was a slut, she FELT like a slut, and felt hurt that OM chucked her out like cat litter once I exposed. AND that she knew it was all over and he felt I took it from her.

I like to think so anyway <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

And BTW, Melodylane kicked my *** into doing exposure so I blame her for my being in happy recovery now. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

( and incidentaly OM is in recovery too, and he wouldn't be without exposure).

<small>[ February 20, 2005, 11:17 AM: Message edited by: Justuss ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

And BTW, Melodylane kicked my *** into doing exposure so I blame her for my being in happy recovery now. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

( and incidentaly OM is in recovery too, and he wouldn't be without exposure). [/QB]</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You are an English KNIGHT!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> [no more serfdom for you, Bob!]

<small>[ February 20, 2005, 11:17 AM: Message edited by: Justuss ]</small>

Thanks all for posting and supporting me...

I think I am doing a good plan A. I believe I have made noticable changes. My faults in the past where (from WW point of view) not communicating my feelings enough (not opening up), not showing enough affection, and not spending enough quality time as a couple. I know I was guilty of those and have made a commitment to be a better husband/father. That is my only goal in life now. I have tried to meet those EN with WW but don't know if anything is getting though. She doesn't want to spend any time with me so I am having a hard time filling that one. I am spending much more time with the kids and she has noticed that. I am helping out around the house more but she is particular about how that is done so that one is hard to meet. Other than that, I have opened up my heart to her several times. She knows how I feel. I went all out for V-Day. And I have kept that LB down to a minimum if any. I have had no heated arguments with her and have always talked to her in a respectful way.

BTW, I do not smoke, and not abusive, drink very ocassionally socially, have a good job financially (and am having a hard time concentrating on), am handy around the house, etc...

The other thing that scares me is that the OM does not have GF. My W is his GF.....

I think exposure to the boss might be good too. They get along really good and it might help.

I am thinking about starting exposure tomorrow.
Her mom, her boss, her couple friends. Does that sound like a good place to start or what?

options

Excellent plan opt, and sounds like you are doing a great Plan A. You can ask her if she has noticed any changes. Let her know you are making these changes for good. Keep it up, the longer you can open up in the M, the more she will trust this will continue if/when she recommits.

Exposure is NOT LBing, it is being radically honest in your M. The truth may hurt, but it is NEVER wrong.

Hey opt,

I think your plan sounds good, and your Plan A sounds stellar. The WS may have a hard time trusting that these changes are for real, for good, forever. Time will tell, but you can tell her the changes are for a lifetime.

Be prepared for her exposure WRATH, but be calm...too easy to LB then.

Exposure is radical honesty, and never wrong.

The truth may hurt, but always the right thing to do...