This comes from Surviving Infidelity by Subotnik and Harris

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"How can we tell whether serial lovers are sex addicts or philanderers? According to psychologist Shirley Glass, sex addicts are driven by a compulsion to relieve their tension and anxiety by their extramarital sexual behavior. By contrast, a philanderer takes sex when it is available.

Although most addicts do not recognize it, according to Carnes, their addiction is rooted in anger. The excitement and the trance-like feeling present during the sexual behavior blocks the anger and, thus their psychic pain."

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I thought this was interesting after viewing Dr. Phil yesterday .... I became curious about someone with 19 affairs under his belt in a marriage ... so I did a little more reading.

and so it goes ....

Pep <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Very interesting, Pep.

As I read it I thought that maybe Dork fell into the sex addict category. The A's that included intercourse occured (at least to my knowledge) during his deployments.

Then, I remembered all the other instances of cheating...kissing, groping, making out that I knew about and more that I have recently found out about.

I'd have to say I had a philanderer.

Interesting.

BTW, since I'm on your thread I thought I'd tell you how much your guidance has meant to me over the last 8 months. You really and truly make a difference in the lives of many people, Pep, mine being one of them. Thank you for being you <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I was thinking the same thing while watching Dr. Phil yesterday. Judging from the description my WH is an SA.

I don't know what to categorize my ex-H as. Perhaps the philanderer because he loved the drama of falling "in-love". And based all his decisions on his FEELINGS.

The last therapist we saw told me that my husband, who is a serial cheater, considered me the sick one because I stayed with him.

So, I'm wondering how a BS is supposed to know, short of becoming deputy-wife throughout the marriage equating to zero trust, if their supposedly recovering-WS is lieing to them and good at it.

Believe me, if I knew the truth I would have not stayed with him.

BTW, I saw Dr. Phil last night and that man is so much like my ex its scarey! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

Lv,
Jo

Not speaking of your situation in particular Resilient, but this is the topic that perplexes me.

The person that knows all of this about their spouse, they do it right in front of their nose and they remain married or wait (sometimes YEARS) to see if they will change.

While time and life marches on.....

Susan <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Here is the books description of a poor risk partner:

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Another reason for infidelity is that one spouse is a poor risk partner. The poor risk partner is most likely to have serial affairs or one-night stands.

Some poor risk partners are very self-absorbed. They have a constant need for admiration. {hello Mulan, you reading?} They view all events narcissistically in terms of the events impact on them. Their behavior is often impulsive. These individuals may be completely lacking in empathy, unable to see anything from another person's viewpoint.

The behavior is more than a lack of self esteem. It goes to the very core of the individual's personality and is a pervasive aspect of their lifestyle. This personality flaw prevents them from keeping marriage vows.

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NOW ... we are NOT talking about the average joe or josephine run of the mill affair here... no one panic!

Pep

This hasn't been an issue for me personally (why do I feel the need to state that? haha). Anyhoo, this is a questionnaire that tries to help people identify whether they are a sexual addict or not, that was published by a counseling center in Houston. The more "yes"s, the more likely sexual addiction is an issue, although it's very important to remember each question below SINGLY does not mean sexual addiction.

Hope it's helpful.

1. Do you frequently fantasize or think about sex?

2. Have you made promises to yourself or others to change or stop some of your sexual behavior, and then broken these promises?

3. Does your sexual desire cause you to associate with people you wouldn't normally be with or do things you wouldn't usually do?

4. Has frequenting sex sites on the internet for sexual stimulation become a habit for you?

5. Do you frequently engage in sexual chat in sexually oriented chat rooms on the internet?

6. Is masturbation a frequent activity for you?

7. Do you have or have you had an extensive collection of pornography or other X-rated material?

8. Have you gotten rid of a pornography collection and then started collecting it again?

9. Do you with some regularity rent (or buy or make your own) X-rated videos?

10. Do you like to "channel cruise" on TV to find sexually stimulating scenes, or do you subscribe to cable in order to view sexually explicit programs? Or do you stare at scrambled (blocked) sex channels for the occasional fragments of clear images of sexual material?

11. Are you attracted to phone sex?

12. Do you frequent topless clubs?

13. Do you frequent modeling studios for sex?

14. Do you go to massage businesses where you are able to obtain sexual massages?

15. Do you frequent adult bookstores for sexual excitement or sexual activity?

16. Do you frequent, or have you frequented X-rated movie theatres?

17. Do you frequent other sexually-oriented businesses?

18. Does your regular sex partner frequently complain about the amount of sex or the type of sex you desire with him or her? If you really think about it, could your demands of your partner be excessive or outside normal limits? Or, do you suspect that your regular sex partner submits to your requests that may be excessive but doesn't tell you?

19. Have you violated your marriage or other relationship by having sex or affairs with others?

20. Are you especially excited by sexual behavior that includes a risk of being caught?

21. Do you get a sexual thrill from exposing your private body parts to unsuspecting onlookers?

22. Do you have a habit of trying to get forbidden looks at people that give you sexual excitement?

23. Is anonymous sex with others a frequent indulgence you seek, or one you periodically return to?

24. Do you take advantage of opportunities to touch people sexually that you find attractive by touching them in a way that makes it seem accidental?

25. Are you an adult who engages in sexual activity with children?

26. Are you an adult who forces other adults to have sex with you against their will?

27. Have you been, or could you be arrested because of some of your sexual behavior?

28. Does some of your sexual activity cause you to have a secret life hidden from significant others?

29. Does your sexual behavior or fantasy sometimes make you feel hopeless or depressed?

30. Have you been told by someone that your sexual behavior is excessive, inappropriate, or out of control?

Sorry for the second post, but I found this questionnaire on Sexual Addicts Anonymous page, which seems better. Last post from me, I promise, and I'll get out of the way. Kinda targets the secret/shameful nature of this addiction:

1. Do you keep secrets about your sexual or romantic activities from those important to you? Do you lead a double life?

2. Have your needs driven you to have sex in places or situations or with people you would not normally choose?

3. Do you find yourself looking for sexually arousing articles or scenes in newspapers, magazines, or other media?

4. Do you find that romantic or sexual fantasies interfere with your relationships or are preventing you from facing problems?

5. Do you frequently want to get away from a sex partner after having sex? Do you frequently feel remorse, shame, or guilt after a sexual encounter?

6. Do you feel shame about your body or your sexuality, such that you avoid touching your body or engaging in sexual relationships? Do you fear that you have no sexual feelings, that you are asexual?

7. Does each new relationship continue to have the same destructive patterns which prompted you to leave the last relationship?

8. Is it taking more variety and frequency of sexual and romantic activities than previously to bring the same levels of excitement and relief?

9. Have you ever been arrested or are you in danger of being arrested because of your practices of voyeurism, exhibitionism, prostitution, sex with minors, indecent phone calls, etc.?

10. Does your pursuit of sex or romantic relationships interfere with your spiritual beliefs or development?

11. Do your sexual activities include the risk, threat, or reality of disease, pregnancy, coercion, or violence?

12. Has your sexual or romantic behavior ever left you feeling hopeless, alienated from others, or suicidal?

After his first affair and into recovery I was "deputy-wife" for 18 mos. He did EVERYTHING I required for recovery and same for me. But, looking back he was lacking in empathy for how bad I felt about myself caused by his affair, which for new MB members resulted in 2 OCs with 2 OW. He was remorseful when we were in negoiations for recovery, but after that he was indifferent.

After 18 mos I stopped all deputy-wife activities. I felt strongly that we were recovered and back on track. Please also remember this was pre-MB. Then 7 years later D-day #2 occurs and who knows how long he had been cheating. I believed him in all he told me. He was an expert in manipulation and lieing [therapist's words] come to find out.

I guess I didn't sufficiently learn my life's lesson the first time, so I had to endure it again. What did I learn you ask? I'm still trying to figure that one out. Perhaps it's simply marriage is not right for me.

Jo

Thanks for the info, Pep! And, all this time, I thought I was married to an "ordinary," run-of-the-mill man-slut!
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Don't feel alone Jo, I am still trying to figure out what my lesson was/is.

I can't figure out if my ex-fiance is an ex-philander who is changing, or just the worlds greatest manipulator/liar.

And how the heck would you know if the change is permanent or temporary?

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

I absolutely hate that saying.

Now that's funny! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

It was not YOU that did not learn your lessons, but HIM. I don't think it was your lifetime duty to serve as deputy or police.

More like that marriage, but primarily that partner was not right for you and marriage.

Susan <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Watching Dr. Phil ~

Dr. Phil says "why is it HIS CHOICE?" Why are you "waiting on HIM? Like saying to him pick ME, pick ME... Is your self-esteem that low?"

Dr. Phil says is there a point when you say "I deserve better than this?"

Hey, who are you talking to? Me?

If me, than I am not waiting on anybody! I wait for no man! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

And if you are not talking to me, my mistake. I think everyone is talking to me, I can't help it. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

~LOL~ No Weaver, I'm not talking to you.

I'm just talkin...muttering to self. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

Susan <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Hm...

I always thought that addicts going through withdrawl get all sweaty and shake uncontrollably.

I must not be a SA, because I do those things when...

...never mind! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

-ol' 2long

Weaver,

Just cause you're paranoid it doesn't mean people aren't talking about you.




A very old bumper sticker. Had to use it with your perfect set up line <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Hey Pep,was my WW's picture( not the one in the K-mart veneer frame) included in this article??????????

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />