For those of you who know about my past and remember that before I was a BS in a marriage that ended in DV, many years earlier I made my own mistakes, I have a question.

When, and how, (or do I) bring this up in a new relationship? The guy I'm seeing has shared a great deal about his marriage (I know she was the only person he had been with in his life until they DV 5 years ago, and then he's been in 2 long-term relationships since then (one longer than the other) that both eventually ended up being intimate. This has all come up since our discussions about sex before marriage and how and what we believe.

But the reason his longer-term relationship ended was because as he put it "She wasn't who she said she was. I couldn't trust her." He said, had she been the Christian he thought she was, they'd have been married today.

This guy is a really great guy, but given the fact that his wife left him for someone else, and apparently he had a trust issue with his long-term partner (though I don't believe it was with another person--I think it was more that she only lived a Christian life on Sunday mornings and he realized that she didn't really share his beliefs the longer he was around her), if he finds out that I was unfaithful to my husband a number of years ago, that might be a deal-breaker for him, even though the circumstances were totally different (nothing excuses infidelity, but I'm not walking into another marriage to an alcoholic, drug-abusing, porn-lover who was never home and was unable to open up emotionally to me). And there are things that happened that some of you remember having to do with a pastor that I really don't want share details of with anyone. It screws me up every time I think about it and I have to go through the whole "forgiving myself" thing and put it to the back of my brain and bury it again. I don't want this guy to even know about it. If, hypothetically, he could get past it and we ended up being together, it would just be one more thing to pop to his mind..."What if LL is thinking of this guy or that guy when she's with me doing this or that??"

I'm trying to decide what to do. Obviously if he asks, I will be honest. But is it something I just bring up to him? Or do I let it ride for now. It's not who I am now. If I tell him, is it for his good, or is it just to relieve some of my guilt. But I wasn't unfaithful to him; I was unfaithful to my ex. It's not this guy's forgiveness that I need, and actually it's not my ex's. It's God's, and I asked for that a long time ago.

LL

Leave it up to God. Somehow I see this whole experience for you as a tremendous opportunity to really transform from leaning on yourself, to leaning on God for your support and for the answers to your prayers...

As time moves on, the right moment will come, either from him being nudged to ask, or your being conident in your own mind that it's the right thing to do.

But don't rush it.

Now if you're asking if it needs to be squared away before you tie the knot? Yes, I think so, he has to know what he's getting himself into, just as you do. But that's a ways down the road, no reason to make yourself crazy this early.

(((Lordslady)))

IMHO it's good to have a "purge" talk fairly early on in the relationship. I have many things in my past that could have been viewed as stumbling blocks but I got them out there on the table very early so that we didn't trip on them later on. If I remember correctly it was within a month of us starting to communicate.

As a matter of fact, I think before we were officially an item, we had pretty much cleaned out our closets about anything sexual or otherwise that could be negative. I also think it's wise to do it all in one swoop making sure you cover everything. We did some of ours by e-mail and some by conversation on the phone.

If

LL, I struggle with this question myself even though I'm not dating. When to tell a date that I have herpes? Since I got it from my STBX, I never thought I'd have to disclose this to a man. EEKS. I'm thinking somewhere around the third date. There is no point in getting emotionally involved if that's a deal breaker. Personally, I may have to take out an add for HIV positive males who don't actually sleep around.

In your case, I think early on you should tell how years ago you had an affair and what you've learned. You can also tell him you are unwilling to disclose the details at this point.

However, down the line, I think you need to give your SO all the details, as painful as that might be. That's part of Radical Honesty. You might find your SO very helpful in the follow-up "forgiving yourself."

As for your SO wondering if you're thinking about this guy or that, come on! I know you will not get involved with someone that insecure. After all, you're not going to wonder if he is thinking about this lady or that one.

While I totally agree with telling things early on, I would say that it would be real hard for me if you then weren't willing to share the details and answer any questions. Furthermore, since you weren't willing to share, I'd probably ASSume some things and have things a lot worse than they truly are. I, personally, believe in being totally transparent.


AWESOME point GG..... LL there is so much truth in that statement. It's one thing to come here and share details with relative safety and quite another to look someone in the eyes while releasing these things. It is a WONDERFUL therapy tool that will aid in you forgiving yourself and moving on. The 12-step programs do that and it is a weight-lifting experience.....

The problem is, would either of you guys/gals (okay I'm not asking a gal to date me, but you get the idea) continue to date someone like me if you found out I'd been unfaithful, especially if you'd been left by your WS wife.

Oh, and there's more--found out today in his last email prior to his 4-day bikeride he left for this afternoon (so four days to think on this now before I get to talk to him again):

I asked what it was that he didn't trust in the woman who he was with for 2 years who almost became his wife. He admitted he'd sidestepped the issue when I first asked because he found it embarassing, but went on to say that first, she'd been married 2 times which bothered him, but then he found out that her 2nd marriage ended because she was seeing someone else.

He broke up with her after the first year (when he found this out and apparently found out that she had been in contact with the guy), then she begged him to give her another chance so he took her back for another year, because the guy she'd had the affair with was states away and he figured he'd never have to deal with him. But then the guy moved back here to Iowa and she was still in contact. So he did break up for good after 2 years.

So this poor guy has not been betrayed once (by his wife) but TWICE (by his only other very serious long-term relationship).

He's so excited to be around me--wrote about how glad his brother was to see him with me on Saturday and how happy we seemed together.

I am going to just blow this to bits when I share this with him! I don't even know how to share it with him.

I want to crawl in a hole, because I really, really, really like him.

LL

It's not going to be a wonderful therapy tool when this guy looks me in the eye and says, "get the f**k out of my life!" and walks away.

It's just going to prove to me just how badly I've screwed up my life.

LL:


More men feel this way than you may believe.


Let me answer your question - with a question. If you met a man who was attractive, articulate, smart, etc. and felt an attraction to him; in which scenario would you prefer him to behave:

1. To move forward with you in a relationship that leads to love and commitment - then find out in a few years that he was a former identity-thief who had completely ruined the lives of several families (with children) by stealing from them.

Or:

2. During your 1st or 2nd date - the instant he sensed that he had "feelings" for you, and vice versa - he said that he needed to talk to you about an important time in his life. At which point, he told you everything.

Which scenario would you prefer? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

FR

I agree with FR.
I'm for total honesty as soon as you start to feel attraction.

K.

Okay, so I'm convinced I should tell this guy everything. I really like him! I have little doubt he'll not be able to take it. This hurts me so much, because all I can see on here right now are all the people who won't ever, ever consider a WS because "once a cheater, always a cheater".

Short of murder, I can't think of anything else I could have done and screwed up my life so bad.

But whatever the case, I have a question.

I have a very difficult time explaining my situation, because I get nervous and tongue-tied and upset. So I thought maybe if I wrote it all down, and then gave him everything in person, but in letter form and had him read it that it might make more sense.

I ended up with 15 pages!! Because I basically laid out my life--everything--from the time I met my now ex-husband to the point I was at last week thinking I might be pregnant.

It all goes together--I don't know how to take anything out and have it still be me, or what I'd explain.

But is this a really bad idea, to give him 15 pages to read? How do I do it? Do I have him read it while I'm there, so that he can ask questions, or maybe look me in the eye with that look that's going to say "you wh*re"?

Or do I attach it to an email and then just cut my losses and start through the pain of letting go now, and tell him I'm sorry about not telling him sooner but that I understand he won't want me and that I'm exiting the scene.

This is not good. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

LL

My opinion??

I think you need to talk to him. Not a letter, not an email.

I think coming from your mouth is the best delivery.

I also think, if he cares enough, these "past" issues will not be an issue.

K.

What if I were to read him the letter, in person, but explain that it's written down because this is difficult for me and I want to stay focused and share with him who I am.

I really wish I had the opportunity because this is eating at me now. He's gone for 4 days and all I'm going to do is stew about it. I'm trying to be positive and think, "Okay, God brought me a guy who was willing to see me, twice, not knowing if I was pregnant or not. Maybe he can handle this, too". But I also am well aware that God has no obligation to bring me a partner.

LL

So, a bunch of us here were the people who made messes of our marriage and a bunch of us here are enduring the consequences of other people's choices.

My BF was a ws, went into no-contact and into therapy, turned over a new leaf and was married to that woman for many years after that. All because he realized what he did was wrong and hurtful to the relationship. Then, he was hurt when his wife began an EA/PA (I don't know which) with someone else and he then became the bs.

You know, if it happened, all you can do is be honest. He told me this before we developed any great feelings for each other - very early on in the relationship. You know, I know he knows how devastated and how devastating choices can be. And I think knowing how much pain you can cause because of your choices might make him a better partner. Do I respect him for telling me? YES. Do I respect him for what he learned and the fact he gave the inappropriate relationship up and worked on himself? YES.

Knowing both sides of the scenario just might make him a better partner.

Since you seem bound and determined to force the issue, then I would do whatever's most comfortable for you. You're looking at a lifetime of needing to work together, get started off on the right foot, or find out if he's going to freak.

Jaye,

It's all very confusing. I get answers both ways--don't rush the issue; no, tell him now, right at the beginning.

I admit, each time we share things with each other, I feel the nagging sense that I should just 'fess up. I am very afraid--I see this as probably much harder for him to accept than what I dumped on him last week (and it's something in addition to what he already accepted--it may send him over the top).

But I do have my 15-page letter. How will I tell him? I have several days to figure that out while he's gone and away from email. I'll probably either let him read the letter, or I'll use it as my crutch and I'll tell him personally.

I just hope some of you who think he may not bolt are right.

LL

LL, if he bolts, better now than later. You pointed out the two most important relationships in his life ended in betrayal and/or dishonesty. If he's not ready to trust again, you are better without him.

He may not be the one. So, really, nothing bad can come out of this. Unpleasant, yes. Really awful, no.

LH, I was just suggesting that if LL didn't want to go into the whole question of her Pastor, she could feel free not to. I don't think you have to name names early on.

First off, after two dates, she doesn't really know him. I wouldn't trust him too far. And for that reason, LL, do NOT give him anything in writing.

LL,

From a guy's perspective, I can tell you that you run a fine line between throwing out too much intimate information too soon and appearing to be holding back. Your judgement call based on your conversations so far with him and how you assess your closeness, but if it's only been two dates, sounds like topics are veering towards very serious issues very soon rather than more lighthearted bonding. Just trying to imagine how he is processing things you've already told him.

As for how he will respond to your history, that all depends on how sincere you come across. If he has an ironclad rule about this, that may tell you other things about him regarding flexibility and attitudes about personal growth and experience. If I were him, I'd be on guard, but also receiving vibes from what I gauge your honesty to be. In that light, coming clean earlier is better (not too many details needed). It is a balancing act, but from the image you've portrayed here, sounds like you can do it convincingly.

But I would relax a bit - he may not be the one and sounds like you're investing too much emotion too soon. You do risk scaring him off.

EXACTLY, great point GG. Truly LL, it would be a shame if you did get to the point where you were "invested" in a relationship and then when finds out he feels that you haven't been honest and forthcoming.


OK, I hear you. My only concern is that if LL were to say "Well I once had an affair but I don't want to talk about it", that would definately leave Mr. Man with TONS of questions in his mind.

LL, on a personal note, I had quite a bit of garbage in my closet. I knew this and felt it unfair to any potential partner or myself to keep it concealed. Within a month of 1st talking to my now wife, I laid all my trash on the table for her to get a full view of where I've been. Some things were left there and some required a little more conversation. Some lingered for weeks. That being said, she did the same for me and my response was the same for her.

I must admit, I have a distinct advantage in that I've dealt solidly with all the issue's in my past and there truly is no shame in my game. I think it was a lot harder for FHL04 to take that vunerable step and put everything out there, but I tell you what, once she did she felt a ton better.

If you've seen me on these boards you probably have a good impression of who I am. I could tell you some true life stories that you would have a hard time believing that I did. My point is this, all the life experiences I have had till this very moment have led me to the place today where I can choose everyday how I am going to live my life. People can clearly see what I am and what I stand for, if they can't accept the struggles it took to place me here, then I probably don't need them in my life.

I am just a visitor here but something struck me on this one - I think most people are open to honesty and change - your story sounds like someone would certainly forgive any mistakes you have taken responsibility for...that said - you might want to consider how much personal info you post here about this person - your honesty may include sharing with him that you chat here and he may want to see - he might not be so happy about personal info about him you share (some is ok - just not too much) - he is not connected with anyone here and might not feel the same way about it. Just a thought - would love to see you in a real loving relationship! Good luck!