I've noticed in many posts (and my own case) that infidelity is often a byproduct when spouses experience some sort of major life crisis. I'm posting this because I'm not sure that the MB material deals well with this issue.

It's not up to us to judge what may be a legitimate crisis and what's not. The common feature in all of them is that they cause us to drop back from the life we've chosen and re-evaluate everything. They shake us to our very core.

Is this who I want to be? Is this all there is in life? How did I get here? Is this where I really want to be?

I think another common feature of these kinds of crises is that they cause us to question our value systems. We often feel like we've been "good" all of our lives and done what everyone expects of us...only to see it bite us in the [censored].

So, we're left searching for new purpose with a degraded (or non-existent) value system. It's a painfully introspective time and can leave us feeling so confused and alone. We are changing, but we don't have a roadmap. We're afraid of where it might take us.

For the spouse of someone going through this, it can be a confusing a terrifying time. From their perspective, they are suddenly married to someone they don't seem to know...someone whose behavior and "values" may suddenly conflict with everything held dear. Like it or not, the spouse in crisis becomes incredibly self-absorbed. You can fight this or you can acknowledge it as something they're going through. It's easy to get angry about not getting your own needs met while your spouse "finds" himself. I'm not suggesting you sacrifice your firm personal boundaries, but I am suggesting that you avoid being judgemental at this point. This whole thing is really temporary and your objective is to survive it intact.

How do you recognize this in your spouse and how do you support them?

I'm not sure about the answer to this one but I thought I'd toss out some things I think might help.

• Stay close to your spouse. Acknowledge their feelings, even when they scare you. They need you more than you can imagine. They fear being alone.
  
• Never, ever tell them "Get it together" or "You have a problem YOU need to fix". This communicates to them that you don't care about them. You only care about maintaining your comfy status quo. If you shut them down, they may very well decide that you have chosen to abandon them. This is a first step to opening the door to infidelity.
  
• When they bring up wild ideas, don't panic. This doesn't mean they really want to move to Iceland, just that they want to talk about the idea. Go on flights of fancy with them. They are searching. Search with them.
  
• If they do decide that some changes are in order, acknowledge their feelings and start POJA towards making it happen. Yes, it's scary, but extreme resistance is interpreted as "non-support".
  
• Don't try to "educate" them why they are being crazy or silly. This is disrespectful.
  
• DO NOT remind them of "who they are" and "that you know them" because they are angry with the person they were. That's the person they want to change. It sounds crazy, but you don't want to be seen as an ally of the "old person". This communicates that you only love what they were and won't love what they will become.
  

My wife and I look back and see a lot of "If only..." opportunities.

Low

You always write such thought-provoking things straight from your heart but also sending it through your BRAIN for processing first!!!

Interesting... let me ruminate on this awhile.

Low,

I completely agree with you about infidelity being the byproduct of major life crisis. In certainly was in my WH's case. However, not all spouses will share what they are going through. My WH has only now (after DDay) told me of his desire to engage in risky behavior such as his internet affair and other behaviors he (thank God!) did not follow through on such as drug experimentation. Scary stuff to hear and totally out of character for him. I have allowed him to talk about these scary impulses without any judgmental feedback - I want him to talk to me because I hope that in itself will be a safety valve where he doesn't actualy have to follow through on the behavior.

You ask "How do you recognize this in your spouse." In my case, my spouse exhibited all the classic signs of depression. I did not suggest he go back to his doctor or seek a counselor and that is where I failed him. Sometimes, this goes beyond the power of a loving spouse to help the one who is in the crisis and professional help is needed.

How do you recognize when something is no longer temporary, but is now chronic?

I see many of my weaknesses in your post.

... still ruminating .... AKA cud-chewing <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

LO

Squid's affaor was brone of crises. Her mom being diagnosed with terminal cancer and Squid turning forty.

I was supportive of both those crises but not enough it seems.

Strange that teh worst crisis of my life, Squids affair, I had to manage alone. In truth she's never been much use in times of crisis. Her dad was a fussmaker when ill, so Squid has absolutely no sympathy for me when ill or troubled in case it makes me 'weak'.

Discussions in recovery lead me to believe this is because Squid so UTTERLY depended on me she couldn't face my mortality, or fallibility. She couldn't countenance my being vulnerable.

She could only be selfish and entitled if i could underwrite her, as I did for years.

Codependency can be a bad thing.

I have come to believe that we would have been divorced inside 2 years if Squid had not had an affair. Strange huh.

Squids mom is still limping on, full of cancer. I am fully supportive of Squid, even delaying some much needed recovery work 'til a more approrpiate time.

good, provocative post

LO,

I agree with you that support is very important when going through the aftermath of Infidelity.In my case,I knew early on that I would stand by my WH and do whatever it took to get through the crisis.I was willing to go to conseling with him a long time to discover what was going on inside of him to make him decide to cheat on me.

However,from what I have been told,there was no amount of support I could give to the man I married when his desires included seeing what it was like having sex with another woman(his words);not feeling that family was important anymore;feeling like he disrespected me and that I was no longer the worthy woman in his life(he chose instead to respect some homewrecker who was 8 years younger and lived with her parents),etc,etc.

There is a difference to me about seeking changes to better yourself or explore life in more depth than if it is an initiation to seeking out bad behavior,hurtful behavior or that which is not agreeable to both partners.I don't see compromise(POJA).The "old person" as you say,is what we all know and what we love.It's the "new" alien type person that scares us and makes us feel insecure while they go through these changes.At least IMO.

The common failure I see here is the choice of the WS to not make changes or seek other opportunities that cause severe damage and destruction to many lives.It's not only something as "simple" as say wanting to start sky diving.We are talking extreme risky(std) and hurtful behavior.

Now if this kind of newfound interest in someone occurred before making the choice to cheat happened,well,I personally have no issue with that.I am all for seeking out an adventurous life and making it fun and being open to new experiences but NOT at the cost of another's pain and suffering.Part of feeling secure with your SO though is some degree of assurance that they will be there for you and will discuss their interests and keep you a part of their life.In the case of adultery/Infidelity,that is ripped away and we are not a part of that decision in any way.We are only left with the fallout.

IMO,you cannot make committments to marriage,vows,family and children and then suddenly decide you are in a mid life crisis.Sorry but sometimes you just have to forgo some of the excitement if it means that your spouse and family will be benefitted most.I personally have made the choice to give up certain aspects of my life in order to be there for my children more,as an example.I do not regret putting them first,I love and care for them.I think that they should be first instead of,what I call,selfishly doing whatever you want anyway.This is exactly what my WH did and for that,I don't know that I can ever forgive him.Time will tell,I suppose.

I do hope you,your W and children are doing well these days.

O

? I thought Low was talking about the crisis that preceeded the affair ? The crisis that weakened one spouse's defenses enough so that he/she would later become the WS.

Am I wrong? confused <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

I read both Pep. The crisis that helped catalyse Squid's affair needed resolution afterwards if we were to have any hope of healing.

Low,

Thought provoking post. This is exactly what's has gone on with my WW. It pains me dearly that I didn't recognize this and pains me more that the WW could not talk to me about it. I know I am partly to blame for this because of my behavior in the past. Another tip may be to stop trying to envision the future for your WW and your M. Focus on the present or the next few days. When I start to talk about the future or long term goals with my WW, I spiral into educating her, telling her to get it together, etc.

Hi Pep. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Ditto what Mr bob said.I addressed both sides.If as LO said that A's are the byproducts of this newfound need for change,whatever that is(life crisis),why not include we BS's in that first? In my case,I was not included at all and much of what my WH wanted and "needed" was not something I could support.My WH withdrew,gradually I think,for some time before the A actually happpened.I can't say that I thought it was a crisis.I had no idea he was feeling badly or anything.He never talked to me about how he was feeling.I always got the standard answer"Fine".So even after he cheated on me,I was going to support him in his newfound changes,if I could.And as I mentioned,it turned out to be more than I was willing to support( I.e. sex with other woman.PUKE).

I guess I am hoping that before a person gets to the "point" they decide to cheat,I want spouses to be able to openly discuss(POJA) desires and changes they want to make in their lives without secretly,insidiously pulling away mentally,emotionally and spritually,etc and then have the bomb go off.This is the trend I see here reading and talking with people.


Does that make sense?

O

I'm not really sure, Pep.

I do know that a different person will emerge from the process. It may very well be that you won't like this new person...that "seeking" could become a part of their new character. In that case, both spouses would need to determine if the relationship should continue.

Sometimes it might take a while, but I can't imagine anyone wanting to live with the fear and stress this brings for any long period.

Low

Low ... I think I will bite this off a little at a time and make it work for me ... jump in if you see I have detoured far off the mark.


Speaking of events prior to H's A.... I went wrong here.

I felt repelled by my H when he was in his pre-A crisis.

I thought he needed to go "into his cave" ... a'la Men Are From Mars fame. So I let him. And unless he came out appearing pleasant and refreshed, I avoided him.

my selfishness ---> let me introduce you to <--- my ignorance

"stay close to your spouse" ... OKAY .... noted.

Do you think I need this as a tattoo? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Is it all women who are CRAP at staying close when its uncomfortable or just Squid?

If I EVER have rejected her , however gently when I've had issues, she's gone " f'k you then, I wish I hadn't bothered ! !" until I sucked up over days/weeks.

Thats all changed post A.

Women are allowed to be as unreasonable as they want under pressure and men are expected to know 'they don't mean it' and stay close.

yes theres a hint of anger in this !

I told you it was a provocative post LO !

Can you elaborate on this bob? I am interested in what you just stated.

O

I had not actually intended this to apply to post-infidelity, but hoping to discuss some pre-infidelity conditions that can take the spouse in crisis down the road to infidelity.

Sometimes, the infidelity itself can shake the BS to recognize that they could support their spouse more fully. In my wife's case, she suddenly realized that she had been dismissing my requests for respect and began taking me seriously.



But it's worthy to explore HOW the WS got to the point where they gave themselves permission to behave this way...and to determine if there is any way their spouse could've helped keep them from going there. The CHOICE to destroy other's lives does NOT occur in vacuum. The WS has to convince himself that others don't really care about him, so he's justified in finding someone who will.



Respectfully, OG...of course you can. No one really "decides" to be in a mid-life crisis. The fact that these commitments exist contribute greatly to the turmoil of someone in these situations because they believe they can't go on living the same way, yet, they don't know how to change it without upsetting someone's world.

Lastly, no one could expect a spouse to support the other in pursuit of adulterous behavior. That is not what I implying at all. In fact, the supportive spouse must be clear that all behavior is not "ok". But the supportive spouse SHOULD be ready to support discussions about things that could challenge them...exploring a new religion, perhaps? I wanted to explore different veins of Christianity and my wife did her best to shut this down, I felt controlled and disrespected.

Low

LO

I'm a little confused as to what you mean.

How you define a 'life crisis'?

Do you mean that the other spouse's supportiveness should include (time-limited) tolerance of infidelity?

TogetherAlone

actually Bob ... I think you've UNDERstated this!

Women (me too) say this to a man:

"Tell me how you feel."

and the man does ... and it is not pleasant or pretty

OFTEN ... this then results in the man being punished ... mostly by nefarious means like:

"You're selfish."

or, my personal peeve right now

"You're trying to control me"

(I have learned to be HIGHLY suspicious whenever any woman says her H is"controlling" ... often this means he is trying to be HEARD AND ACCEPTED ... and it ain't happening.)

Me? ---> guilty as charged

The crisis places the spouse in a kind of "survival" mode. The LAST thing on their mind is trying collaborate with the BS. They find themselves grabbing at straws.

A spouse in crisis mode is not functioning normally. You cannot expect normal POJA or PORH form someone whose operating at this low level. Therefore, it's incumbent on the spouse who is still sane to provide support if they can.

I think of a drowning man,,,he's swallowing water and flailing around. Do you wait for him to say "Honey, please throw me a line?" or do you get proactive and throw the line to him on your own?

Low

before dday, when I said tell me how you feel-it really meant-
tell me what I want to hear (even if its not true)
then let me doubt your sincerity
then I can say you are not in touch w/ your feelings
you are not "deep" enough for me
and I had my reason to shut him out and pretend I didn't need him.

And he found someone who did..........

I intentionally didn't give you examples, because I wanted to make the point that deciding what is or is not a crisis for your spouse is not up to you.

As I said earlier, I believe it's any event that triggers the spouse to re-evaluate their lives and values systems.

Low