Renters believe Our relationship is temporary. You may be right for me today and wrong for me tomorrow.

Buyers believe We are together for life.

Renters believe Our relationship should be fair. What I get should balance what I give.

Buyers believe We both contribute whatever it takes to make our relationship successful.

Renters believe As needs change, the relationship may end if needs are difficult to meet.

Buyers believe As needs change, we will make adjustments to meet new needs.

Renters believe Criticism may prompt me to change if it's worthwhile for me to do so.

Buyers believe Criticism indicates a need for change.

Renters believe Sacrifice is reasonable as long as it's fair.

Buyers believe Sacrifice is dangerous and to be avoided.

Renters believe Short-term fixes are fine.

Buyers believe long-term solutions are necessary.

Love that - wish I could print it off & give it to WH!!!

Kim

Pep, can you post the definition of a renter and a buyer? Thanks. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Freeloader is unwilling to put much effort into the care of his or her partner in a romantic relationship. He or she does only what comes naturally and expects only what comes naturally. It's like a person who tries to live in a house without paying rent or doing anything to improve it unless the person is in the mood to do so.

Renter is willing to provide limited care as long as it's in his or her best interest. The romantic relationship is considered tentative, so the care is viewed as short-term. It's like a person who rents a house and is willing to stay as long as the conditions seem fair, or until he or she finds something better. The person is willing to pay reasonable rent and keep the house clean but is not willing to make repairs or improvements. It's the landlord's job to keep the place attractive enough for the renter to stay and continue paying rent.

Buyer is willing to demonstrate an extraordinary sense of care by making permanent changes in his or her own behavior and lifestyle to make the romantic relationship mutually fulfilling. Solutions to problems are long-term solutions and must work well for both partners because the romantic relationship is viewed as exclusive and permanent. It's like a person who buys a house for life with a willingness to make repairs that accomodate changing needs, painting the walls, installing new carper, replacing the roof, and even doinf some remodeling so that it can be comfortable and useful.

According to Harley

most happily married couples have worked their way up from Freeloaders to Renters and finally to Buyers.

He says the problem arises when partners do not eventually become Buyers.

Thanks, Pep, that makes great sense. AGree that Dr Harley is a very smart man.

Some more Willard to chew on:

"The real commitment of marriage is not a commitment to stay regardless of how you are treated. It's a commitment to care for each other regardless of the circumstances you find yourselves in."

also....

"Marriage means that each spouse is commited to make a GREATER effort to care for each other than they were making BEFORE marriage, a GREATER effort to meet each other's intimate needs."

really something to think about for all of us ....

... which brings us to POJA

which is adopting the Buyer's strategy

means you must consider both your interests ~and~ your partner's interests

up to the point of bilateral enthusiastic agreement

which means NO ONE sacrifices their happiness for the other's .... you seek mutual happiness

The good doctor says that couples who do not practice POJA skills gradually develop incompatable lifestyles....

Good job Pepperband!!!!

J
7y recovery <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

At first I was thinking you were talking about lemonman.

I do not have this book, but tonight I pulled out Give and Take - The Secret to Marital Compatibility.

Suz

Freeloader/Buyer relationships

most are remnants of a relationship that had once been Buyer/Buyer

if a Buyer becomes a Freeloader, it's usually because he or she has had an affair

(this is directly from Harley's book)

"even though a Buyer is commited to an exclusive and permanent relationship, that dosen't necessarily mean he or she can't fall in love with someone else"

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> ... which is ~why~ this board exists !!!!!

"By becoming a Freeloader instead of a Buyer, they are able to keep an affair alive while still offering hope to their betrayed partner."

.... we recognize the cake-eating fence sitting alien-brained babbling WS anywhere ....

next comes the REALLY interesting stuff

waiting
tap tap tap

so now the former Buyer/Buyer agreement has become Freeloader/Buyer due to an affair

the Freeloader is trying to make up their mind about which relationship they want the most

Harley says: "Their new beliefs bewilder the betrayed partner."

.... duh.... we KNOW that Dr. Harley !! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

"The betrayed partner tries to argue from the Buyer's perspective~ 'How could you even think of having another relationship? We are together for life!'

The confused unfaithful partner shakes his or her head and finally says ....

'I guess we were not meant to be together.' ....

Harley says that what we need to understand is that the affair TOTALLY changed the WS's agreement.

Harley sites research that says

it is easier for most people to change their beliefs and values than it is to change their behavior

I REALLY DON'T LIKE THIS !!! I must say .... but we have to deal with what is true and not with what we like ... back to Harley...

He says when beliefs and values are in conflict with behavior .... guess which one wins ~~~> yep, you guessed it ~~~`> behavior wins .... the beliefs and values are scraped in order to accomodate the behavior (the affair)

yuk!

Harley says that the Buyer/Buyer agreement CAN BE restored when the affair has finally ended.

BUT .... you ~knew~ there was gonna be a but didn't you?

this does not usually work if the unfaithful partner was NEVER a Buyer

hmmmmmmmmmmmm

Remember it is easier for most people to change their beliefs and values than it is to change their behavior ... which is why it is DUMB to try and "talk" a WS back home.

Harley says this is Plan A time .... the betrayed Buyer does his or her best to treat the unfaithful Freeloader with care, even while the affair is going on. ~~~> because "most affairs die a natural death"

Which is why after a reasonable amount of time has passed, Harley recommends Plan B .... which turns the faithful Buyer into a renter !!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

Plan B is a renter's plan .... makes sense, doesn't it?

This is a fresh look at Plan B for me ...thinking of it as a fundamental change for the faithful/Buyer spouse ~~~> transitioning into a faithful/Renter position.

Harley says "The relationship between Buyer and freeloader is a disaster for the Buyer."

"When a Buyer and a Freeloader are in a romantic relationship, the most sensible solution, which is to end the relationship with the Freeloader, is not an alternative. That leaves only two reasonable options."

"One is to convert the freeloader back into a Buyer restoring their mutual care."

"The other is to convert the Buyer into a Renter or Freeloader, which allows him or her to leave the relationship."

I think this is pretty darn interesting....

I can think of many MB posters who are the Faithful/Buyer, married to a Renter or a Freeloader ...

and they are loath to convert his/her self into a Renter in order to ease out of the painful dilemma of being married to a non-commited spouse.

What an awful place to be .... it is as if the Buyer has to change ~their own~ beliefs and values in order to avoid a life of neglect and painful betrayal.

but remember what Harley said ...

it is easier to change your beliefs and values than it is to change your behavior .... especially those dearly held values dealing with marriage and commitment....

Now ... if you are a betrayed spouse

go back and re-read the first post on this thread ....

this time thinking Plan A = Buyer

and Plan B = Renter

.... perhaps this will help ... I hope

here it is.....