Friday AM

After a somewhat heated conversation last night from WW, I have finally decided to dial up some legal advice.

WW is now putting all her chips into the "you told the kids and that was unfair and selfish of you" pile. Since WW cannot get approval from family, friends, or children for leaving me because of OM or because of homesicknees, she is now using this as her hammer. Again, states that she will never be able to get over what "I" have done to our kids and really wants they to know that "we" would decide to break up.

Of course, I piped up and said that I would never agree to this "we" thing were the children are told that it is a mutual decision, simply because it is not. I said that YOU are the one that wants to end it, not me. You are the one that wants to separate, not me. She then attacks me and says I am selfish because I am putting a wedge between her and our children. I am selfish becasue I cannot see that what is best for the children's future is for them to see that it was a joint decision.

So, she is now beating that drum and beating it good. This appears to be the staw that will eventually break the camels back.

Given that, I have been reading a book on divorce and separation that was written by a local lawyer and pertains to the laws of my state. It comes complete with worksheets and everything one needs to know about the entire process. So, I gave him a call and have an initial consultation next Wednesday at 10:00.

I have to protect myself at this point and if my WW bolts, I need to know what I can and cannot do leagally.

Wishing all a Merry Christmas although I know quite a few in here will not have such a "merry" time, but I am convinced that better days are ahead.

p47d

All but over now!

After a terrible christmas (WW has already taken down our Christmas decorations) WW has finally decided to move out.

We had a big family meeting on Monday and she basically reiterated her position that things are to far gone. That I have done to much damage and there is no real hope of her forgiving me. Oh yea, did I say I'm the BS here and she is the WW?

She stated 4 issues that she cannot get over and guess what? They all are about me and what I have done, and what I have said over the last 5 months. That's just for starters and doesn't even cover the initial reason for her A, which I also caused according to her.

Anyway, after discussing it, she believes it is now in "all" of our best intrests if she moves on. I steadfastly rejected that and again said that it is not to late, but her simple response was that it was to late, and what is done is done.

Yesterday, she spoke to a lawyer and got the separation paperwork started. She has some details to figure out for the lawyer, but I will be served sometime shortly. She wanted us to use the same lawyer saying it would make things better and cheaper.

I didn't buy that and have talked to my own lawyer who advised me against this. My only solace in this matter is that my WW is willing to walk away from everything. She will leave me the house, cars, and basically all the marital assets, including our debt. That to me is fair and generous on her part seeing that her lawyer thinks she is nuts for not pushing for half the assets PLUS alimony that he says she is intitled to! My lawyer has scoffed at that idea and says that in cases like these because of the length of the M, that the judge would split everything 50-50, but I would not have to pay alimony.

Last night, she was still talking about giving me all the assets. In our state, separation must be for 12 months, but we can sign the agreement now saying that this is what she wants to do. Then over time, if she changes her mind, it will be tough for her to do that.

She informed me last night that she has found a furnished home and will probably move out Jan 1. Her mother is footing the bill for the entire 6 months down here and her best friend (aka the tick) has bought her a cell phone and will pay that bill for the next two years! This is her Christmas gift to my WW!

WW has gone as far as speaking with my daughter about the beneifts of divorce and that she will be part of a new family now (OM is relative of best friend). She will have new brothers and sisters too!

Painful to say the least. Why not just rip my heart out with your bare hands?

Son was meeting with our pastor this morning to talk with him. Our pastor thinks WW is nuts and has lost her mind. She also will not be attending our church any longer and has informed me of that. Basically, she said she could care less what they (church) think. She will attend another church while she is still here.

So, this journey is near an end. Not a happy one, but at least an end is near. I will start a new life shortly. My wildest imagination could not have come up with this situation and now that it is finally here, it is just incredibly painful to see 28 years be wiped away so quickly.

Anyway, I would just like to thank all those here at MB's. I have learned a great deal not only about marriage issues but about myself. Special thanks need to go out to Mortarman and MrWonderings who have stuck by me and my situation for the last few months. I'd like to say that it has been fun, but it hasn't.

As for the future, I know that it is not over until the divorce is final. I know that there is still hope that given our separation that she would realize what she is losing as opposed to what she thinks she is gaining. She has admitted that it is not totally over and that "maybe" things will change and she will realize she cannot live without me afterall.

So that is the thread I will hang my hat on in the future.

Don't know how much I will be around in the future. I'll just have to wait and see. Right now, I don't feel like I could add much to any thread seeing that I could not get my own house right and so what right do I have giving advice to others.

Again, thanks to all. It's not something I really want to remember, but I will remember those that lent a hand.

p47d

P47,

You can advise others. My marriage may even yet fail. That doesnt mean that I havent learned somethign from this.

It isnt over yet. My wife also changed from the pre-affair problems, to things I did and said while she was sleeping around. This is a natural thing, all a part of the fog.

She may wake up, she may not. Not your choice. You and your kids (and God) have watched you be the Rock and do everything possible to help your wife. And them. And your wife? She continues to run around. She says she will attend another church. Well, I wonder if she expects another God at that church. I believe that God is the same everywhere!

I sent you some Scripture in an email, and I will post it here also. While we dont know whether a person is saved for sure (we dont knwo their hearts), we can judge whether Jesus is i ntheir life by their fruits...by their actions.


I dont know your wife, I have never met her. But by what you have posted here, I can say that it appears that she was never saved. No one that continues sinning has either seen Him or known Him. So, going to another church is not going to change her problem. She has an eternal problem. She isnt rejecting you, she is rejecting Christ. And that is a whole lot bigger than a 28 year relationship! We are talking eternity here.

You have really done all you can. You have been a good and faithful servant. The blessings from that obedience will flow and He will take all of this and work it for your good. And the good of those awesome kids you have!!

He also will let the fruits of your wife's actions fall directly on her. He will not protect her...He will not help her. She wants independence from God and His laws...He will allow it. She is about to understand what the term "He!! on Earth" really means.

I had a pastor say once that ALL Christians are disciplined by God. When we run astray, He gives us the "spanking" we need to get back on track. The pastor said some people have come to him and said "Well, I'm a Christian and I'm still ...insert continual sin here...and nothing bad has happened to me." Well, the pastor said, then that person has a different problem. God only disciplines His children. So, if there is no discipline coming, then that can only mean that that person is not His child...that they are not saved!! And if that is true, then the punishment they will get will come later...and will be eternal!

Remember, in the end, your marriage is just a blip on the radar of your eternity. Your focus has been and should remain on Christ. He really is all that matters!!

I told my wife, when she asked that I just work with her to separate and divorce, that I will only do this His way. If she thinks this is God's will, then God is going to have to tell me. Tha tshe should go to the pastor and get him to tell me where God says that I should do this. If she can find it, then I will work with her. But if she cant, then she does this on her own.

As ForeverHers likes to say...there can only be one person on the Throne. Your wife has herself there (and probably always had just herself there). Jesus wotn allow that. he wont come into someone's life and give up His throne. We must relinquish our throne to Him...or He will not enter.

Stay close to Him P47. He will give you joy, even while you are not happy. And as I said, the last chapter has yet to be written. Dont go away. You can help, as well all help. Use what you know. Use what you have learned. Use what God is telling you to help others thru this same stuff.

You see, not all marriages get saved on here. And even the ones that dont make it, those BSs still need help and direction...and an understanding from people that also went thru the ending of their marriage. Should mine end, I would come here and seek out those that have been thru that to help guide me and tell me what lies ahead.

God bless to you and your family. And for your wife, I pray the very dangerous prayer "God, please do WHATEVER it takes to get through to Mrs. P47. WHATEVER it takes!"

In His arms.

I'm still at work even though I was supposed to be off this week and before I head out, I thought I would check back in after I got your email.

>I dont know your wife, I have never met her. But by what you have posted here, I can say that it appears that she was never saved. No one that continues sinning has either seen Him or known Him. So, going to another church is not going to change her problem. She has an eternal problem. She isnt rejecting you, she is rejecting Christ. And that is a whole lot bigger than a 28 year relationship! We are talking eternity here.

My WW is saved no doubt. Part of the reason why she did not just up and pack it away 5 months ago was because she knew it was wrong. She still believes what she is doing is wrong, but as we have said before, it is a spiritual battle inside her and right now, the dark side is winning.

She is very aware of what Scripture says and she is deeply convicted of it. Yet again, with this addiction, the pull is so strong.

I have started some reverse tactics with her the other night when I mentioned that I will have to speak with our pastor and find out if I am able to remarry if we D. I told her it is very likely that I will not be able to remarry under scriptural guidelines because of this divorce. She then began to question that and I was very matter of fact in asking her to tell me exactly how I would be able to remarry. I also asked her if she wanted me to follow the Word of God or not. Did she want me to disobey God? So, instead of directing it at her, I directed the issue at me. She went pretty silent and all she could really say was that so many others were doing it. Nice try, but since when did we start following the crowd?

>You see, not all marriages get saved on here. And even the ones that dont make it, those BSs still need help and direction...and an understanding from people that also went thru the ending of their marriage. Should mine end, I would come here and seek out those that have been thru that to help guide me and tell me what lies ahead.

Right now, I am numb. I am getting my house in order, but right now, I am numb. I will need help and direction, but I also fear that continuing to participate here might just bring back to many bad memories. It might just rehash all the bad feelings I have right now. If in the future, she D's me, then the last thing I want to do is go down memory lane revisiting issues surrounding a wayward spouse. I'm afraid it will only result in more pain.

Do I have something to give here? I think so, but right now a part of my world has fallen apart. Could things be worse? Of course, but this is right here, right now.

I have a long way to go and won't just pack and go. I'll stick around because I have no one really around me right now for any kind of support and I am solely dependent upon the Lord. I realize that this is the most important thing, but it does help to be able to actually speak and share with others.

Anyway, it ain't over til it's over and I will press on by the grace of God.

thanks,

p47d

Maybe you are correct...but dont discount so quickly what I have said. Jesus said many will come to Him and say "Lord, Lord..." and He will reply "I never knew you." Many people, thinking they were saved, thinking they were on the right road, found out too late that they were no different then those that out right rejected Christ. P47...it is a SMALL path to follow Jesus, not the wide highway that everyone else takes.

Your wife is convicted of her sins. She knows they are wrong. Okay, I can accept that. But here's the rub...so far, there is no repentence. Look, even criminals know they are wrong when they got caught. The problem is that their sorrow is not one of repentence but one of getting caught. That's why the Bible admonishes that you will know His people by their fruits.

If Jesus is inside her, then the dark side cannot win. Jesus cannot lose. Like I said, the proof will be in the punishment. A Christian, who is a child of God, will be punished for their rebellion. Not just convicted. They will be lovingly corrected in order to get them back on the right road. If that correction never comes, if that discipline never comes to the person in rebellion...then the Scripture I cited (and others) point to the fact that they were never really saved.

You can convict your son of something. Like "Son, you know pulling that girl-down-the-street's hair is wrong." And he will know it is wrong. But, if he goes on pulling her hair, even though he knows it is wrong, then discipline will come. Why? Because you love your son and you are responsible for him.

Now, if the neighbor boy was pulling that girl's hair, you wouldnt discipline him. He isnt your son.

A person who says they are a Christian, that is in rebellion (I am not just speaking of sinning...I am speaking of open rebellion) and is not disciplined, is not of God's family. Which means they are not saved.

So, if your wife is saved, then you can expect a severe butt whoopin to come on her. It wont be pretty. But if it doesnt come, then you know that she has a bigger problem here. Hebrews 10 speaks clearly to this. Wha thappens is she becomes an apostate. I found a good description of this online, which I will mention here:


If your wife is saved, then she is in good hands and will be brought back into the fold (that doesnt mean necessarily your marriage will be saved). If she isnt saved, well....you know.

In His arms.

As Mortar suggests, you've done all you can, and now you need to leave the rest in God's hands.

I will keep you in my prayers.

P47-

I'm not sure whether or not I've posted on your thread. I just wanted to let you know that you do have much to contribute.

I have been impressed and humbled reading your thread. You have certainly shown your wife Christs love in every way since this has happened.

In my first marriage, I was a WW. I had also been saved since I was 8 years old but I grew away from God during this time. What Mortarman tells you is correct. Your wife should she divorce you will be severely punished. Her children siding with you is the tip of the iceberg.

I justified what I was doing in the fact that my exhusband never worked on our marriage- which was true but that still didn't justify what I did.

I can only tell you that once you come out of the fog, the guilt of what you did is almost unbearable. I'm not sure that I will ever get over the guilt even though all of the marriages problems were not my fault.

God punished me, and I was pulled to my knees more than once. I have asked for forgiveness and I do feel that He has forgiven me.

I have remarried (and I see that you do not agree with this) and I come here to give support to others who have been through what I've been through and because perhaps my words as a FWW will help explain a bit of their thought process. I guess I could feel that as a FWW I do not contribute much, but I keep coming to learn and to see if I can contribute.

My heart aches when I read your post. If my exhusband would have approached keeping our marriage together such as you have- there is no doubt in my mind we would have stayed married. I just wanted to let you know again that I am humbled by your devotion to her under the circumstances.

P47- I have not ever posted in your thread and I will not address any spiritual issues here.

My story is one of a fwXW (former wayward EX WIFE) who had a PA, after it was over I got the "I am not in love with you any more" speech. I begged, groveled, etc and it looked like she changed her mind. Then came an EA she had with someone at work. I did not know what they were, I had one of my own...we went to counseling... We separated, she looked for legal separation, I would not agree to terms wanted to work on M, we got divorced. It was ugly, brutal. I was devastated. Found out about her old PA from her friend who wanted to be my "date". I went Plan B after our divorce when she started to have PA with old EA guy from her office. I was gone and had to find my own life. I dated, I dated a lot. She was mad!! Anyway....after about a year she tried to be nicer to me and I always "left door open"...I never reminded her during Plan B...I just had told her that prior to it me getting away from speaking to her EXCEPT about my boys...after a year, me with a gf...she asked me if it "was still open"...where I told her.."I do not cheat on my gf"...set her back weeks....

Anyway....you will be OK...I have immense respect for your faith which will guide you. You will find someone who will appreciate you. You will find love again and actually laugh at STBXW and her pathetic life.....I mean that...I did...I actually gave her crap about how others in her office talked about her, the chief financial officer dating a salesman....how she was the butt of jokes and how I knew she never wanted that to happen. When she wanted to know exactly who it was I told her and she did not believe me...and my response was just like when xxx came to my house at 11 PM and invited herself in and told me about your PA 4- 5 years ago...again..I was a liar...all it did was make me feel better about my new life....I had lost a lot of weight...looked great and was really having a great time...

So...I do not tell my story to give you any hope...because I know I never had ANY hope after I plan B'd...NONE...now...we're getting married in the presence of our sons February 18....in the Bahamas...never say never...do not despair....

I come here for my own reasons....best of luck to you....

Well, since you've tried everything else, you might try Dobson's approach -


Only those who have been rejected by a beloved spouse can fully comprehend the tidal wave of pain that crashes into one’s life when a relationship ends. Nothing else matters. There are no consoling thoughts. The future is without interest or hope. Emotions swing wildly from despair to acceptance and back again. Nothing in human experience can compare with the agony of knowing that the person to whom you pledged eternal devotion has betrayed your trust and is now involved in sexual intimacies with a “stranger”… a competitor ... a more beautiful or handsome playmate. Death itself would be easier to tolerate than being tossed aside like an old shoe.

If one word must be selected to describe the entire experience, it would be something equivalent to panic. Just as a drowning person exhausts himself or herself in a desperate attempt to grasp anything that floats, a rejected partner typically tries to grab and hold the one who is leaving. This panic then leads to appeasement, which destroys what is left of the marriage.

Let’s look for a moment at the other half of the relationship — focusing on the individual who wants out of the marriage. What secrets lie deep within the mind of the woman who has an affair with her boss, or the man who chases the office flirt? Surprising to some, the desire for sex is not the primary motivator in such situations. Something much more basic is operating below the surface.

Long before any decision is made to “fool around” or walk out on a partner, a fundamental change has begun to occur in the relationship. Many books on this subject lay the blame on the failure to communicate, but I disagree. The inability to talk to one another is a symptom of a deeper problem, but it is not the cause itself. The critical element is the way a husband or wife begins to devalue the other and their lives together. It is a subtle thing at first, often occurring without either partner being aware of the slippage. But as time passes, one individual begins to feel trapped in a relationship with someone he or she no longer respects.

Now we begin to see why groveling, crying and pleading by a panic-stricken partner tend to drive the claustrophobic partner even farther away. The more he or she struggles to gain a measure of freedom (or even secure a little breathing room), the more desperately the rejected spouse attempts to hang on.

Perhaps it is now apparent where the present line of reasoning is leading us. If there is hope for dying marriages, and I certainly believe there is, then it is likely to be found in the reconstruction of respect between warring husbands and wives. That requires the vulnerable spouse to open the cage door and let the trapped partner out! All the techniques of containment must end immediately, including manipulative grief, anger, guilt and appeasement. Begging, pleading, crying, hand-wringing and playing the role of the doormat are equally destructive. There may be a time and place for strong feelings to be expressed, and there may be an occasion for quiet tolerance. But these responses must not be used as persuasive devices to hold the drifting partner against his or her will.

To the reader who is desperately in need of this advice, please pay close attention at this point: I’m sure you would not have dreamed of using these coercive methods to convince your husband or wife to marry you during your dating days. You had to lure, attract, charm and encourage him or her. This subtle game of courtship had to take place one delicate step at a time. Obviously, it would not have been successful if you had wept violently and hung on the neck of your lover saying, “I think I’ll die if you don’t marry me! My entire life amounts to nothing without you. Please! Oh, please, don’t turn me down,” etc.

Coercing and manipulating a potential marriage partner is like high-pressure tactics by a used car salesman. What do you think he would accomplish by telling a potential customer through his tears, “Oh, please, buy this car! I need the money so badly and I’ve only had two sales so far this week. If you turn me down, I think I’ll go straight out and kill myself!”

This is a ridiculous analogy, of course, but there is applicability to it. When one has fallen in love with an eligible partner, he attempts to “sell himself” to the other. But like the salesman, he must not deprive the buyer of free choice in the matter. Instead, he must convince the customer that the purchase is in his own interest. If a person would not buy an automobile to ease the pain of a salesman, how much more unlikely is he to devote his entire being to someone he doesn’t love, simply for benevolent reasons? None of us is that unselfish. Ideally, we are permitted by God to select only one person in the course of a lifetime, and few are willing to squander that one shot on someone we merely pity! In fact, it is very difficult to love another person romantically and pity him or her at the same time.

If begging and pleading are ineffective methods of attracting a member of the opposite sex during the dating days, why do victims of bad marriages use the same groveling techniques to hold a drifting spouse? They only increase the depth of disrespect by the one who is escaping. Instead, they should convey their own version of the following message when the time is right: “John [or Diane], I’ve been through some very tough moments since you decided to leave, as you know. My love for you is so profound that I just couldn’t face the possibility of life without you. To a person like me, who expected to marry only once and to remain committed for life, it is a severe shock to see our relationship begin to unravel. Nevertheless, I have done some intense soul-searching, and I now realize that I have been attempting to hold you against your will. That simply can’t be done. As I reflect on our courtship and early years together, I’m reminded that you married me of your own free choice. I did not blackmail you or twist your arm or offer you a bribe. It was a decision you made without pressure from me. Now you say you want out of the marriage, and obviously, I have to let you go. I’m aware that I can no more force you to stay today than I could have made you marry me in 1989 [or whenever]. You are free to go. If you never call me again, then I will accept your decision. I admit that this entire experience has been painful, but I’m going to make it. The Lord has been with me thus far and He’ll go with me in the future. You and I had some wonderful times together, John. You were my first real love and I’ll never forget the memories that we shared. I will pray for you and trust that God will guide you in the years ahead.”

Slowly, unbelievably, the trapped spouse witnesses the cage door vibrate just a bit, and then start to rise. He can’t believe it. This person to whom he has felt bound hand and foot for years has now set him free! It isn’t necessary to fight off her advances — her grasping hands — any more.

“But there must be a catch,” he thinks. “It’s too good to be true. Talk is cheap. This is just another trick to win me back. In a week or two she’ll be crying on the phone again, begging me to come home. She’s really weak, you know, and she’ll crack under pressure.”

It is my strongest recommendation that you, the rejected person, prove your partner wrong in this expectation. Let him marvel at your self-control in coming weeks. Only the passage of time will convince him that you are serious — that he is actually free. He may even test you during this period by expressions of great hostility or insult, or by flirtation with others. But one thing is certain: He will be watching for signs of weakness or strength. The vestiges of respect hang in the balance.

If the more vulnerable spouse passes the initial test and convinces the partner that his freedom is secure, some interesting changes begin to occur in their relationship. Please understand that every situation is unique and I am merely describing typical reactions, but these developments are extremely common in families I have seen. Most of the exceptions represent variations on the same theme. Three distinct consequences can be anticipated when a previously “grabby” lover begins to let go of the cool spouse:
1. The trapped partner no longer feels it necessary to fight off the other, and their relationship improves. It is not that the love affair is rekindled, necessarily, but the strain between the two partners is often eased.
2. As the cool spouse begins to feel free again, the question he has been asking himself changes. After wondering for weeks or months, “How can I get out of this mess?” he now asks, “Do I really want to go?” Just knowing that he can have his way often makes him less anxious to achieve it. Sometimes it turns him around 180 degrees and brings him back home!
3. The third change occurs not in the mind of the cool spouse but in the mind of the vulnerable one. Incredibly, he or she feels better — somehow more in control of the situation. There is no greater agony than journeying through a vale of tears, waiting in vain for the phone to ring or for a miracle to occur. Instead, the person has begun to respect himself or herself and to receive small evidences of respect in return. Even though it is difficult to let go once and for all, there are ample rewards for doing so. One of those advantages involves the feeling that he or she has a plan — a program — a definite course of action to follow. That is infinitely more comfortable than experiencing the utter despair of powerlessness that the victim felt before. And little by little, the healing process begins.
This recommendation is consistent with the Apostle Paul’s writings in 1 Corinthians 7:15, “But if the unbeliever leaves, let him do so. A believing man or woman is not bound in such circumstances. God has called us to live in peace.” Paul is not authorizing the rejected spouse to initiate a divorce in these instances. He is, rather, instructing a man or woman to release the marital partner when he or she is determined to depart. The advice I have offered today is an expression of that scripture.

believer:

>Well, since you've tried everything else, you might try Dobson's approach -

This has been tried with my plan B letter back in early Nov. She was holding to the letter with NC to me and then I told my kids and she paniced and came home unannounced to as she says, file for divorce and win back my kids. She never filed and she has not been able to win the kids back or should we say, get approval from them.

Now though, it might be time to go back to the plan B approach of NC. but see my update for more information on my current status.

p47d

Update Jan 2, AM

WW has now moved OUT! Packed up all her stuff yesterday and hit the road. She still has a few items of clothing and stuff left which she will get today. She could only fit so much in the car so she had to make several trips to her new home.

WW's mother is footing the bill for her new home for the duration of the 6 month lease. Her best friend, aka the tick, has bought her a cell phone and is going to pay that bill for the next two years. Of course it came complete with her new phone number that has the area code of her family's area, not our current area code. How sweet. So, the enablers are all in place.

House is definately different without her. Stuff is missing from the walls and kitchen and of course, she is gone. But as she says, only 10 minutes away.. She will continue to take my daugher to school and have her over for dinner a couple of nights a week which is fine.

If there is a bright spot in any of this it is the fact that she does feel somewhat broken. I have told her over the last few days that she has destroyed me. Broken me in ways she will never know. She has also said that this does not mean it is final or over. There is still a chance that we can work it out and for "me" to not burn any bridges. This means, don't get me P.O'd or I will never come back for sure.

So, when she left, I made sure that I told her I still loved her and if she could just remember one thing, that would be it. That I can and do forgive her and that I still love her. I also reminded her though that to protect what love I have left for her, it might mean that I not see or talk to her any longer. I have told her that this is her choice and her's alone and that she must come to grips with what is going on in her life. Not a threat as I said but I did tell her that there is no guarantee that in 6 or 9 months, I will still feel the same way as I do now. The day you walk out I said, is the day I start to prepare myself for "my" future. I told her it was just to painful to continue to talk or want to see her.

Of course, she is crying her eyes out since she KNOWS what she is doing is wrong and has stated so, but cannot come to a place where she can forgive "me" for what I have done. Again, it is all on me, nothing on her although she knows again that what she is doing is hurting a lot of people.

Anyway, at 1:30 AM she calls and wants to talk. Says she feels horrible that I am hurting so and can't live with that fact. I tell her not to worry about me, and instead take care of herself. She is afraid I will not make it. Again, my WW has a rescuer personality and she wants to rescue everyone and that is what attracted her to the OM in the first place.

So, she talks to me for about a half an hour explaining her feelings and that she is in turmoil over this. She is already not liking it, but feels that if she does not do this then she will never know if she is staying for the right reasons.

She says there are two voices speaking to her. One is telling her to stay, forgive and rebuild, and the other is telling her to move on and start over. I told her that one of those voices is God and one is not. God does not give conflicting messages and she needs to decide which voice is from God and which is not. Of course the other is from the pit of ******, but that is the one that has her so decieved.

I also asked her to find me scriptural justification for her actions seeing that there are plenty that show otherwise. She is still on the kick that God will still love her and bless her and use her even if she chooses to move on and D. I know as well as others in here including my pastor that say no way no how will she ever be blessed in this issue unless she repents. In fact, my pastor has said that God will not be mocked and that there will be no peace until there is justice.

So, it is clear that she is under some severe condemnation and conviction, but at this time, I'm not sure which one will win out. She will not be going to church and with the enablers now eating away and supplying all the cake she can eat, she could easily continue on with her deception.

Today I will speak with my pastor for some strength and guidance.

A special thanks to all that have replied and shown some interest. Your comments no matter how small have had a very positive effect on me.

Actually, today I feel pretty good. Not that the weight of the world has been lifted from my shoulders, but today I feel a lot better than yesterday.

Now I'm just waiting for the separation paperwork to be completed and delievered to my lawyer. She is confused at doing all of that too! She has to fill out a bunch of stuff and really doesn't know where to begin. Oh well, this IS what YOU wanted!

I stated in another thread that here in SC, you don't need formal paperwork to separate, so our separation is official as of yesterday regardless of paperwork. All the paperwork will do is state that she will relinquish all rights to the marital assests. She wants to give me everything and so this should be put in writing seeing that when she moves back to Mass., her family and friends will try and tell her she is nuts and to go after a 50-50 split.

So, I still have hope and will even up until the D is final. Right now, my solace is that she is being put in a vise and being pressed with her convictions. Hopefully, God will do a mighty work and remove the fog.

I also realize that she will indeed suffer the consequences of her actions at some point, and I also know that God will not spare spanking her even if she comes back and repents. It is not a question of if, but now just when along with the severity of it.

But, I AM pressing on! Once the paperwork is signed, the I can get my house key and keep her out of the house which will only cause some more heartache on her part.

thanks again to everyone.

p47d

just what I needed to read today ....

amazing ~ <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

P

So sorry your situation has deteriorated so, however, it does appear better than the status quo. It even appears she knows she is going to get a Plan B letter, quite soon I suppose.

Is your daughter going to Plan B her as well? Do your kids like these "enablers" that are interfering in your marriage?

Get to the Y and work off your anxiety...you'll be in great shape in no time.

Good luck,

Mr. Dubya

Actually I think it may be better that she has moved out. Now she will have to face more of the consequences of her decisions.

I think I would put some stuff up on the walls. I always like mirrors, and maybe a couple of pictures - but something DIFFERENT. When my WH moved out, I painted, and completely rearranged the house. I removed everything of his, and put up stuff I bought at the garage sales. It looked so different that when he came by, his eyes popped out.

Also get the financial agreements in writing right away. They ALWAYS change their minds. I've only seen 2 cases here where the WS gave the BS and kids everything. My WH said I could have everything, and even put it in writing, but when my attorney wrote it up, he refused to sign it. I have over $2,000. in attorney's fees, just trying to come to an agreement - not counting any of the divorce paperwork.

Wonder:

>So sorry your situation has deteriorated so, however, it does appear better than the status quo. It even appears she knows she is going to get a Plan B letter, quite soon I suppose.

I doubt I will do another letter. I've sort of just said that I will not contact her and really don't want to see her. She of course has said that we still need to talk as this is not over. Right now, until that paperwork gets signed, I'm on my best behavior. If she signs over everything to me, then I can go to extreme no contact. Right now, I can take her calls as long as they are only one a day or every other day. Like I've always said, I'm not after a pound of flesh here. I'm trying to leave the door open and at the same time move on while letting her know, I am moving on.

>Is your daughter going to Plan B her as well? Do your kids like these "enablers" that are interfering in your marriage?

No, she will not do that. They have to be encouraged to talk to their mother. They are not the cause of the problem and I can't encourage them to do this or that. They did encourage her to leave now instead of in 6 months though. I know they are not happy with this crap, but at the same time, they are still called to honor their mother and father.

>Get to the Y and work off your anxiety...you'll be in great shape in no time.

Went there every day last week. 10 million dollar facility just opened up and it is tremendous. So, I've been putting energy into getting back into shape and hopefully in a couple of months I will have lost some excess baggage. Since I now have plenty of spare time on my hands, I will attempt to use that time to lose my spare tire!

p47d

>Actually I think it may be better that she has moved out. Now she will have to face more of the consequences of her decisions.

This is what I am hoping. Right now she is suffering with tremendous guilt. She said she won't come back right now, but she is hoping that this time apart will confirm her decision to stay and work it out, or leave and start a new life somewhere else.

>I think I would put some stuff up on the walls. I always like mirrors, and maybe a couple of pictures - but something DIFFERENT.

You know, that is a great idea. I think I will search out some small items and put them up. All the refrig magnets have been removed and she took most of the photos with her and the kids, but I think I will remove some other stuff too.

I did mention to her that I was probably going to move her dresser out into the garage and move mine out of the walkin closet. She was upset over that and continues to tell me not to go crazy and start throwing everything out.

You should of seen her face when I asked her is she was taking our marriage photo album! I said you will probably need or want this more than me! She then said something to the order of this is not over yet and don't go crazy. But I think you have a good idea and I might start to change some things around. Moving some furniture might be good to even if it is just moving it slightly. But I think I will go shopping this weekend for some new things! Thanks for the idea! Maybe something like even changing the bedspread! Cheap, but it could be effective!

I do know this, my wife wanted to start an interior design business because she is quite good and our house if really nice if I must say. So, messing with her design might really effect her. No, I'm sure it will have an impact seeing that she always wanted things just so.

>Also get the financial agreements in writing right away. They ALWAYS change their minds.

My lawyer already said that she would change her mind over time, so I know the paperwork needs to be done, but she has a lot of stuff to prepare for it and she is already saying it is really confusing and she is lost with all the information that is needed. Oh well, this is what YOU wanted dear!

If she does not give me everything, I will certainly go for it and then it will get really messy. My lawyer has already said that he will file for habitual drunkeness and physical cruelty along with adultery. WW drinks much more now (about a bottle of wine a night) and has hit me. He says we don't have a prayer with these two counts, but it will show the other side that we are prepared for WAR!

He said that because of the length of our M, that the judge would just go 50-50. I might get 60-40 or 70-30, but that would be pushing it because my WW doesn't have any means of income like a career job.

Anyway, we will see. Thanks for the advice. It could possibly turn out pretty good shopping for some new stuff with my daughter in tow! We can then get some much needed bonding time in, and start to purge out the old stuff. Or in Jewish terms, remove the leven from the house!

p47d

Well, if she likes decorating, it will work even better.

I'm a female, but think of it as kind of "marking your territory".

I did the whole house over and it cost less than $200. Our sun porch used to be full of his junk. Now it is done in a Japanese decor.

I took new pictures of the boys playing football on the beach at twilight - black and white. I had Kodak blow them up and framed them and put them up. Added some mirrors - moved things around. I did the bedroom all in dark purple - which my WH would hate, but who cares - he's not there any longer.

I wanted to show him that while I preferred our marriage, I was perfectly capable of having a nice life without him. It made a difference in my feelings about myself.

Hi P47D,

I admire your resolve. You will be fine in the end; however your sitch turns out.

God Bless

Maybe we should have a online swap meet. Everybody post the crap in their house they want to purge, and pick out new stuff from others cast offs.

I redid my bedroom, painted, new linens and rearranged the furniture. I haven't changed much else, it seems to really upset my OD when I do something. I just sorta quietly box stuff up.

So it just upsets OD and has no effect on WH at all.

UVA:

>I admire your resolve. You will be fine in the end; however your sitch turns out.

Thank you so much, but there is nothing much to admire in me I'm afraid. My M has failed and it always takes two and therefore I feel like a failure.

But thanks again for your kind words. And yes, time does heal all wounds, but the scars will reamin and be a constant reminder I'm afraid. No plastic surgeon can remove these scars. They will remain for a lifetime.

p47d