Not the point, Suzet. I would say almost every WS and Op were normal people. That does not let them escape from the fact that while in the affair, they were immoral. Of course, they dont have to remain there. Just as I told Dorry once, now that she has ended her affair and repented, she is no longer immoral, no longer a WS. But while in the affair, they are both definitely immoral and definitely followign the plans of Satan.

Again, just because they spent their life as a pastor (for example...this is an actual example...the pastor who married my wife and I) and did great things serving God, does not mean that when they have an affair with another married woman that they aren't being immoral. At that moment, they are following satan, they are doing evil...they are being immoral.

The Op and WS both are equally immoral, equally held in Satan's grasp. The issue for the BS is that they are not responsible to the OP. The OP being saved, the OP repenting from their immoral actions is NOT the BSs issue or concern. But the WS is their concern.

Now, Matthew gives the BS an out, where they can also make the WS not their concern either. And just immediately divorce the WS. But the BS has no such decision to make with the OP. Since the Op is a threat to the marriage, it is actually incumbent on the BS to make sure that the OP is no longer a part of their lives. Whether the OP repents or not.

This is why a child molestor isnt allowed to be around children...even if they repent. It is because none of us can take the chance. Neither can the BS.

In His arms.

nabohio,
If the OW were truly a good person, they wouldn't have become an OW!
I guess this makes your husband far worse than the ow because she isn't married to you and didn't make any promises to you.

Most op really are your average person next door.
They make bad choices too and sometimes they try to justify them, others they step aside.

I'm not recommending being best buds or even communicating with the op but they are "normal" people too.

Personally, if I saw my ex's om with a flat tire on the side of the road on a dark, rainy night, I'd pull over, wait 'till he got up to the car and take off. Again and again...

Wow, I guess I opened up a can of worms, huh?

I've read everyone's replies, and must say I have learned a lot. I'm going to have to stick with my belief that she's a good person who made a mistake -- an immoral mistake that was "on satan's path", YES! It was an evil, wrong, deceitful, harmful, terrible mistake, yes. Does that make HER an evil person? I don't believe so. I believe that she's a good person who did immoral things and is working on changing. OW and OWH are in pro-marriage counseling, I know that for a fact. I see evidence that she is trying to change. Do I want her in my life (or, especially, WH's life?) NO!!! But right now I'm not able to completely avoid her, it just isn't possible. I feel better about myself if I'm kind to her and show her Christlike love. This does NOT mean I'm willing to give her my H or my family or be her best friend (or a friend at all, for that matter) give her a chance to insert herself into my marriage again or even trust her. I really do not trust her. But I don't have to trust her to have good feelings for her and be grateful for the efforts she's making. I know I sound naive, and I guess I am in a way. Not as trusting, though, as you might think. I still keep an eye out for evidence of ongoing A. I did a pretty good piece of detective work today, in fact, and found everything to be okay.

I guess I'm saying that I try to separate the person from the action, when it comes to judging. I can't judge the person to be good or evil, but I can judge the act and condemn it.

I have to agree with Suzet that ANYONE could find themselves in a similar situation. In fact, doesn't Dr. Harley say this in SAA? We are all vulnerable and capable. We just need to be vigilant for ourselves and our spouses.

WH may not be making all the efforts he needs to eventually make in our M, but I promise this will be short term. I'm willing to live with a less-than-ideal M (excluding A, of course) for a while until WH is ready to commit. I know many of you don't agree, but I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt for now. Eventually (Feb. is 1 year anniversary of Dday#1 and my goal for re-evaluation) being here and giving me a few "crumbs" won't be enough. But for now it is (like I said, as long as A is not ongoing, and it's not).

I do thank you all for your concern and insights. There are a lot of great people here!

Take care everyone and Happy Thanksgiving!

WOM

I agree with you Mortarman. I have never said that while the WS and OP are in the A, that they are not following the plans of Satan and not being immoral…of course they are! My point is just that good, faithful people with high morals & ethics can commit immoral acts as well... Just because people are good and/or faithful and/or having high morals etc. doesn’t mean that they are immune against temptations, weaknesses, sin, human failings etc.

As explained so well on TooSoonToBeComfortable’s thread – “15 Steps Of Unfaithfulness”:

“People don't just decide one day to hop in bed and be unfaithful to their spouse. Adultery is the culminating act of a dozen or more tiny steps of unfaithfulness. Each step in itself does not seem that serious or much beyond the previous step. Satan draws a person into adultery one tiny step at a time. And he does this over time so that our conscience is gradually seared. This makes it easier to take "just one more step" thinking such a tiny step won't hurt us.”

The above is so true and explains exactly how I've allowed myself to gradually and slowly became involved in an inappropriate friendship until I was on the bridge of “crossing the line” into a full-blown EA – something I thought I was not capable of and would never get tempted into… I’ve indeed learned very hard lessons from this. Before my inappropriate friendship, I was extremely judgmental of people who allowed themselves to become involved in A’s. And I’m very ashamed to admit today that, at the time, I even thought and believed that A’s could only happen to bad people with no morals and conscience. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> How wrong I was… My experience indeed taught me humbleness and that A’s (or the temptation to get involved into one) can happen to anyone if not cautious and careful; if not having strong boundaries in place; if not being aware of your own weaknesses and vulnerabilities; if not staying close to God and listen to your conscience at ALL times.

Again, I agree with you MM... The pastor in your example are indeed doing evil, following Satan and being immortal while involved in an A, but it doesn’t necessarily mean that the persons involved in the A are inherently bad or evil themselves. Actually, IMO, every person on this earth have a good side and a bad side within themselves. There is no person who is just good or just bad IMO… Even the murderer, child molester, criminal etc. can have a good side within themselves. And even the pastor or people who serve God and do all these great things can have a bad side deep down within themselves. My point is that, IMO, every person on this earth have the potential to commit evil if their bad and/or weak side are allowed to take over the best side of them… And again, I believe it's only through the grace and protection of God and our obedience in Him, that we can learn to become better and stronger people…to help us raise above our human failings, weaknesses and the potential bad and/or evil that rest inside every one of us.

I found out with my wife that the sin they commit really changes them. they become very deceptive and even try to hide it by making false accusations. Sometimes ones that other can't imagine to be true. They lose complete tuch with reality. The question is do they ever come back or do they stay lost forever.

RHM, this depends on every WS themselves: Some of them will return from their immoral ways and some not. Some will see the "light" and some not. And if they don't, it's indeed very sad... All one can do in such a situation is pray for the soul salvation of such a person and hope that they will not stay lost forever...

Someone does not have to be a "bad person" in order for any of us to determine that person does not belong in our life.

A "good person" can be toxic too.

Pepperband, "good observation!" There IS only ONE who is "Good," and it's none of us humans.

God bless.