Well, she has switched from Paxil to Effexor, so we will see if that helps. Also, we start counseling on Monday. I know that won't get her in the mood, but maybe that will help her "get it" as to what i am feeling and force her to work on some things.

Heck, i am happy to work on anything she would seem to think i need to improve on.

Just tired of feeling like a nanny/accountant. That is what i feel like in this marriage.

uni:

No underlying issues? My spouse was fairly open to sex until someone at an ACOA meeting said "I was abused when I was 2". That got everything thinking they'd been abused and when the spousal unit let it sink in she thought it too. No sex for 3 years after that. I tried everything then gave up.

One night she asked me why I didn't ask for sex and I told her that she seemed to have lost interest in it and that after 3 years I could take care of myself. She was shocked and said I didn't try hard enough. I was asking monthly during the times when she'd normally give in, nothing. No contact at all. Not even a "no sex but I can help you take a shower". Nothing. I thought it was me so I hit the gym hard and lost some weight (I was never overweight).

She did counseling during this time and after 6 years of it I asked her to try something else. I had changed jobs and the new insurance wasn't going to cover her old treatment (which didn't work) and this new stuff was going to be free (traded the guy for computer work). She went and in 2 months she changed. It was like night and day. No more meds, nothing.

She never did get past the abused as a child issues (that she could never verify, her doc told me he doubted them because the details conflicted and her sister didn't recall any of the wide open stuff that happened all over the house). No touching at all, if she's not ready then it's not happening.

Good luck on your counseling.

UPDATE: Also, she has no abuse issues, that already came out in the first counseling session.

She has been only taking 10mg paxil and 75mg effexor now to switch over. Seems to be going ok at this point. Soon to be completely switched over. Oh would I be a happy camper if this was all just a medicine issue!

The first counseling session didn't do too much for us (as i figured it probably wouldn't). Just asked us how we learned about sex, if we had any abuse or rape, etc. etc. etc. Our homework is to spend 5 minutes looking into each other eyes and go through a list about these 11 things and how we feel each other meets them (trust, respect, loyalty, etc. etc. etc)

Next session is monday, hope to continue on a good path. I have noticed the last few days my wife has FINALLY been a LITTLE more affectionate towards me.....still not sex, but cuddling and holding and kissing has been a bit more. I am not sure this is because the medication switch is working or if the counseling is in her mind FORCING her to deal with these issues that i have.

She did say one thing in counseling, she said that she always tells herself "she will start tommorrow." She will start loving me more tommorrow, having sex with me tommorrow, etc. etc. etc. Counselor said that is bogus and it won’t just happen naturally, you gotta make it happen.

She still openly admits that she simply does not like having sex, she just does it to make me happy. My question is, she USE to like it… WHAT CHANGED???? I don't like the fact that she does not enjoy it, if that were the case, i would not want to do it either!!!!

NCFunGuy -

could your wife be dealing vaginismus????? I would highly rec her or you looking at that sight, vaginismus.com

This may not be what she is dealing with, but it could be.

If she has never enjoyed sex, this could be a real possibility. I throw it out there, because I dealt with it, and 4 professionals didn't know what my problem was, so I felt like the biggest freak for a long time. Finally a few months ago, I found a name for what I struggled with. I have been married for almost 9 years and overcame 4 years ago, but thought I was the only freak in the world, till a few months ago.

She may be dealing with this and it has nothing to do with being abused in her past. That isn't necessary. I just really recommend looking at that site.

Honestly.. I hate to say this, but no sex with your wife may end up being better than your wife giving you sex just because she perceives it as one of your needs.

During the last year of my marriage, my wife had sex with me 2-3 times a month, if I was lucky. Not because she wanted it, but because she knew I wanted it and needed it. Every time was absolutely horrible. I don't enjoy sex unless my partner is enjoying it, too. And she wasn't enjoying it (little did I know that she was off having affairs and definitely enjoying sex at the time; she just lied to me and said she didn't like sex at all anymore), so I felt miserable after we were done.

I don't wish that feeling on anyone.

I am back, it is September and still no sexual relationship with my wife. I have tried multiple times to initiate only to get pushed away or told flat out no. I have offered massages, baths, trips to spas, have engaged more emotionally in the relationship. No change. She keeps saying she has no desire, feels ugly (even though she is gorgeous and has the greatest boobs I have ever seen, a little bragging there <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> ), says it is too painful for her, etc., etc. I have been MORE than patient about this whole thing, I just celebrated my 30th birthday and this seems to have magnified the issue. I do not know how much longer I can hold out, I am considering asking her to attend an intimacy retreat with me, which I doubt she will do. I desperately need some excitement in my life!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am always curious when I read posts like yours. WHAT WAS SHE THINKING WHEN SHE DECIDED TO MARRY?

Having sex IS what marriage is. You wouldn't go to a restaurant, expect to sit at a table and refuse to buy and eat any food. You wouldn't go to beach if you were allergic to the sun.

I always wonder in situations like yours why a woman would feel entitled to accept an invitation to marry without the sex part.

Did you ask her this?

I have her asked why should I stay married to her or why she married me if she has no interest in sex. I always get the guilty "because of our daughter". But we did not have her before the marriage. Dont get me wrong, my daughter is the world to me, but I am, and refuse the blunt-ness, horny as all get out. Lately when I ask her anything (i.e. Do you realize you have not even touched me (down there) in over 2.5 years?, Are we ever going to have a sex life?) she hears me, but never, and I mean never says a word. I guess that is better than her typical canned answers. Masturbation is getting extremely old to me.

That is a problem because you need to get her to open up to what her problem might be. Otherwise how can you fix it?

How can you get her to talk about it?

She says it "hurts?" Are you really big? Or did it start hurting after a vaginal birth?

And if the only reason is because it hurts, then touching you wouldn't be a problem, would it?

I know, I try opening up to her in hopes to get her to talk, I've even tried writing letters to initiate the communications.
I am (and I hate to talk about it) very big, but I dont think that should be a factor. I am very gentle with her (when we were active) and allowed her to be in the drivers seat so to speak.
Good point...I have no idea what is to be honest with you, I feel completely helpless.

Sorry, honey...

It is a very big factor (no pun intended) for many women.

I have had sex with no one but my H for 30 years. He is average size and we have great sex.

But as a single woman I had others. So I know a large penis can be unplesant. At first I thought I would like it on the large size but it started to cause problems that eventually turned me off to it.

You need to ask her if this might have something to do with the problem or at least contributed to it in the beginning.

Thanks Pieta,
At least this sparked a conversation with my wife.
I asked her if it was a factor, and she said that although I am very big and it was a bit uncomfortable at first that she preferred it to be large and said that when we were active it gave her more pleasure. Unfortunately it did nothing to re-ignite the flame. She still made it clear that she has zero desire and feels it is mostly "in her head" and she knows it, yet she will not do anything about it.

Well, in a way that is good news. You know you can be effective and give her pleasure. I think most men would rather be ineffective than lied to on that matter.

I have this theory that many women get bored with sex when it becomes predictable. And if we're bored, it's hard for us to orgasm because we need a lot more mental and physical stimulation than a guy does to topple us over the edge.

And some of these women expect their husbands to second-guess her every desire and know what she’s in the mood for—-like he has some kind of super radar or crystal ball. Others will hint at it or ask once or twice and then feel humiliated when her codified request is not fulfilled. These woman (the ones that do not find sexual excitement elsewhere) gradually lose interest in having sex with their husbands. She may even develop resentment or harbor a grudge.

Of course her sexually alienated husband responds unkindly to the situation and a downward spiral ensues. The wife becomes further entrenched in her decision to not have sex with her husband.

Perhaps your wife will be open to a discussion of this topic also.

Thanks Pieta,
It is reassuring in a way I guess. She never had a problem reaching orgasm back in the days when we were active.
I think a lot of it now has to do with the way she sees herself since the birth of our girl over 2 years ago. While I stress how hot I think she is, she thinks much less of herself.
I will try to talk to her about this again this evening and see what reaction I get, we are going on a 'date' tonight as we were able to land a sitter for a sleep over. Keeping my fingers crossed!!

Hi, just wanted to relay what happened to me. My wife and I had an ok sexual relationship at the start. I would say she wanted sf maybe once per week, and rejected me when she didn't want it.

After we were married for about 2 1/2 years, she told me she didn't like the way I kissed. Hmmm. I asked why, and she couldn't really tell me. I have to wonder why she would marry someone she didn't like kissing. So after that, every time I thought about kissing her, I remembered that "she doesn't like this". So I pretty much stopped kissing her. I asked her if we could work on it, practice, etc. She wouldn't do it. Heck, I asked her to lie to me and tell me it was ok, but all she could say was "that was a long time ago, can't you forget it?".

She decided she wanted kids after 4 years of marriage - she took clomid (sp?) for ovulation, and she cried every month "do it, it's our only chance!". so our first daughter was born about a year later.

After the first kid, no sf at all for a long time. She told me that she'd rather have a piece of pie than have sex. I pretty much gave up trying, 'cause I knew I'd get rejected. I'm actually amazed that we ever had a 2nd kid. After the 2nd, there was never any good time, we were too tired, etc. Oh yeah, and the baggage...

So she used to hog the bed really bad - I'd end up sleeping on about 1 foot of the side of the bed. We bought a house with a really big master bedroom, so we went out and bought a king-size bed. After that, we hardly touched each other. I tried to be affectionate, but it was hard when she acted like she hated me. Plus the whole kissing thing.

I was frustrated with the lack of sf, and discussed it with her. She told me about her friends who rarely had sf - I should be happy that we had it once a month. Finally, I got the Harley book. It was kind of an eye opener. It appears to me that she got all of her most important emotional needs met elsewhere, and I didn't get mine met at all... I wanted to work on all that, but she wasn't interested at all. Turns out she was having an affair. What a slap in the face that was - little or no sf all that time, and she goes out and has an affair.

When I found out about her bf, she quickly decided that we had to have a separation and then divorce.

So we are back to square one, after ending our 2+ year hiatus from sex with a few nights of activity it has started all over again. It has now been several months since the last occurence, we have not even touched each other during this time as well. Each time I attempt to touch or anything I get the roll over in bed or complete brush off. It has now reached the point where I am seriously contemplating divorce, the thing holding me back is the thought of waking up in a different home than my daughter, I do not think I would be able to handle being away from her.

WOW! My brain feels like it has been run through a ringer just reading this post. Read the WHOLE THING, never did before. NCFG, if you and your wife did actually have decent sex at some point then there is definetely something missing - some need she has that is not being fulfilled. I went through that with my xh. We stayed celibate until we were married. Well, when we got married I was ready to go - he wasn't! That didn't sit real well. I had never been with a man that wasn't. I had been married before and never really got anything out of it, but I never said no to my h. I did go through counseling because of abuse (every kind there is) from my mother, father and older brother. After the humiliation of not being wanted by him and having him tell me I wasn't doing it God's way, I never got my drive back (with him). I tried testoterone shots and that helped before the other problems that developed in our relationship took over. But once that happened even the testosterone shots wouldn't work. We went to one of Harley's seminars and my h expected that to do the trick. He wasn't into doing the work that Harley said needed doing, especially the POJA. That is what finally ended our relationship. But I do remember him saying about a week before we split permanently that he wished I was the way I used to be (horney). If he had been willing to work on the relationship itself and follow Dr. Harley's advice things probably would have eventually gotten better.

That said, after two years of being divorced I met a man that kept chasing me. I told him I wasn't ready for a relationship and he gave me his number and told me where he lived saying we could be friends. I agreed. Well, when he started meeting my emotional needs, my drive kicked back in full force. He was ecstatic. Our big problem was that I felt guilty having sex with him without being married and wasn't ready to get married until I knew we could apply the poja to our relationship. And know that he would be willing to meet my emotional needs on a consistent level. My guilt drove my drive back down and then I found porn on his computer. Things just got progressively worse. To make a long story short, we finally got into counseling and I found out he was a sex addict and had control issues he needed to deal with. I finally told him not to contact me again after finding out he started cheating on me.
However, if he had been willing to follow Dr. Harley's program (addicts can't do that) things could have been great. But with all the things happening, my self esteem had dropped (along w/ my drive) just like it did w my h way back. If my needs had kept on being met (like they were in the beginning) and the issues had been worked on we'd be married today instead of split up.

There is something in the relationship that is holding her back if she enjoyed sex in the beginning. Maybe her view of herself has changed along with her needs. That happens sometimes - even Dr. Harley's material says that needs can change. He does not recommend bringing up the past, it just causes more problems I can testify to that. The trick is going to be in finding out what her needs are (cause she may not even know herself anymore) and meeting them on a consistant basis. And making sure that none of the love busters exist in the relationship (at least not more than an occasional slip). Until all of this happens she probably won't get her drive back. You said that for a little while things got better. Brainstorm back through those times and find what it was the two of you did. Even if you think it was something not worth making note of - do it anyway. (Maybe try asking her what she enjoyed most about those days - connect, find out what her thoughts and feelings about those days were) Something that didn't mean anything to you might have been just what it was that got things rolling from her perspective (even if she won't talk to you about it). Trial and error. And like I think it was peita said, women get bored sometimes unless things are changed up. They need that stimulation to get their brain going just like you have the testosterone that keeps yours going. Keep on trying.
(oh yea, the only thing that counseling about my sexual abuse did was help me allow myself to actually feel something down there for the first time, if she already has then she can again)