|
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,970
Member
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,970 |
IK,
How did the lunch meeting go with ILs?
~~
Happy...how are you doing today?
LA
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,128
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,128 |
By my calculations, you should now be free. Congratulations IK. MIL really did need to go. Now let's see what really happens.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,970
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,970 |
Traic,
Does this mean you're answering me on your thread?
:::looking eager:::
LA
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 39
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 39 |
I didn't go home for lunch but I had the chat with the ILs while I drove them to the airport. I told them that I wanted to tell them how I felt about what happened in the past 6 months and asked them not to interrupt me. I told them that I was not looking for an answer from them or anything. Just listen to me. So I started telling them how disappointed I was in my WW for what she did and still does. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> FIL still lives in denial. He doesn’t believe that the A is still going on. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />Anyways, I am not going to post the whole conversation but the main idea is that they believe that the ball is in my court and it’s only up to me to save this M. They started crying and asked me to think about DDs and fight for my M. Yeah, thanks for your support! I don’t want to talk about what my MIL told me… Only one thing. I mentioned that WW cried on another man's shoulder and ended up having SF instead of talking to me. MIL goes: "And you cried on the forum so everybody, inluding people from Romania can read about this." I couldn't beleive that she made such comparison... BTW, was that a comparison? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> I realized that in their eyes my WW was the victim. Period. I dropped off at the airport and drove back home. I said “Hi!” to my WW and that was pretty much it. Spent the time with DDs. What’s going to happen next? Tomorrow I will drop off DD2 to my parents and WW will drop off DD1 to day care. That’s pretty much it for tonight. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,128
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,128 |
MIL was an enabler - a wolf in the fold. It will just be that much harder for WW to continue the A now. This is all good. Get some rest.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 1,022
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 1,022 |
I mentioned that WW cried on another man's shoulder and ended up having SF instead of talking to me. MIL goes: "And you cried on the forum so everybody, inluding people from Romania can read about this." maybe you and Happy should place a newspaper ad in your hometowns in Romania about your cheating spouses... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> THAT'S exposure!!! iknow, just keep breathing...il's are gone...like Traic said.. tomorrow is another day...
Words have the power to both destroy and heal. When words are both true and kind, they can change our world.
~~Buddha
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,128
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 6,128 |
IK, don't worry. According to what you said in the other thread, infidelity is unacceptable in Romania so I doubt there will be anybody there with a need to look at this forum. MIL was just echoing what WW brainwashed her into believing. The BIL comment is far more interesting. If I remember correctly, he doesn't like you and still thinks sis should stay with you. Even so, don't bring him into your circle. Keep the family out of this as much as you can. They have been involved too long.
Get a good night's sleep.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,970
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,970 |
"I realized that in their eyes my WW was the victim. Period." Please don't choose this to be your perspective.
They never stopped seeing themselves as the victims.
They were talking about how they would be affected by others reading the forum.
They have never stopped putting themselves before their 3-year-old daughter.
That is how they are the wolves in the fold, hidden as sheep, helpless and full of denial...always relying on the crushed and innocent for protection.
I wanted this to take place with WW so that she could see you tell them this. That their daughter is worth fighting for, even wayward, for all the years she has had to parent her parents. They role modelled victimhood for her, taught her how to build resentment to entitlement, through denial and seeming self-sacrifice...and to create permission to destroy, as they have destroyed...and she's an adult and can know better. She's working out THEIR issues with you, IK.
Doesn't mean you did wrong...just know that speaking truth matters. Let go the response, please.
Toxic is toxic.
LA
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 39
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 39 |
Thank you all for your posts. I am going to bed now. Hopefully I get a good sleep. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 10
Junior Member
|
|
Junior Member
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 10 |
Hi guys,
thanks LA for thinking of me. I am not doing great these days - my allergies are back, my heartburns are back, maybe I am depressed too.
I wrote the email last night, long one,so I will just tell you a short version. I told him to choose: come back home orlets sell everything and go our ways and reduce the contact to minimum (he has to see the baby and we do not have anybody here....)I asked him not to tell me poetry anymore just straight answer. He did not answer to the point, told me he want's to finish his school (or if I want to he will drop it), he wants to keep the house. We agreed we will talk saturday because he said we should not make decisions under pressure and he is under a lots of pressure right now with school, work.....He also told me I should not think about him for a few weeks and just concentrate on me and the baby. I responded that I cry because I feel sorry for my self. These are all email conversations. When he called we talked about the baby and that's it.
I don't know what is going to happen, I am just very, very tired, I don't sleep that much either....
That's all from me for now. I tried to keep it short.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,970
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,970 |
Great to see you, Happy...thank you for sharing.
Okay...reality check, 'k? No judgment, just so you can see clearly...
You asked for an answer from him as to his choice...he didn't choose. That means, to enforce your boundary, you choose for you. You offered him first, and his choice was to not choose.
Still a choice.
He wants to finish school...his choice to drop out or not, not yours. Please do not allow him to continue his illusion of you choosing his life. If selling everything and parting interferes with his school, then that is his choice, correct?
You keep the house and don't sell it. What will it take for you to pay and maintain it?
You agreed with him to not make this decision, which you asked for, and you are smart and capable and knew what you were asking for...under his pressure.
He chose the A. He chose to move out and forsake his family. He chose those things, while under the same pressure of school and work. He was able to choose that but not how to terminate your marriage equitably, correct?
He is choosing not to return to the family and give up his AP (affair partner). That is what he is choosing by his presence being removed from the home. He has this choice and he is choosing not to...what he bargained for and you agreed to, is to thwart your boundary by coming over Saturday, with his presence before you, so that you will be making the decision about the separation/divorce influenced by him being back in the home while you talk.
Not playing fair, do you think? Then you will have the imagine of you making him leave the home...because he is present for the talk...instead of him already being out of the home, correct?
He tells you what to think or not think about?
Is this normal? That's abusive. Parental.
And you responded with an open and honest statement. You owned your sadness and tears and knew where they were coming from.
AWESOME!!!
Now, you don't know what's going to happen, or you don't know what you will choose for your life? There's a big difference.
You can be as long as you want, Happy.
Please know this is your choice...you have been betrayed. He is still in a fog and lying to himself.
Hope my dose of a not so objective third party helps and doesn't add to your pain. I am not pushing you to choose...yet you asked a legitimate, reasonable request of WH, and he didn't choose...which is choosing.
(((((Happy)))))
LA
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 10
Junior Member
|
|
Junior Member
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 10 |
LA, thanks for your words.
Everything you say is true.You have a way to say just a right thing, I wish I could have you somewhere in the backround and you would tell me what to say to him, would be funny.
SChool will be finished soon, in 2 weeks I think.
I cannot keep the house by myself.The house is big and costs are high. Will see what he has to say on saturday, I waited for so long now, I can wait a few more days. Keep me in your prayers.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 1,022
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 1,022 |
LA, what effect do you think it would have on Saturday if Happy's H arrived to see a big "For Sale" sign on their lawn.... boxes in the house, partially filled with some of Happy's things.... she wanted a DECISION.....a CHOICE to be made...as you pointed out, he chose not to choose and let her keep hanging on... so what if now, she makes HER own choices.....since he is UNABLE to... just a thought for you.... Happy...I am sending you huge hugs, girl...for you and your boy...my boy is now 10 years old... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> they grow so fast....and every moment is sooooo wonderful....remove yourself from the chaos so you can enjoy him growing up...
Words have the power to both destroy and heal. When words are both true and kind, they can change our world.
~~Buddha
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 1,022
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 1,022 |
and what about perhaps blocking him from e-mailing....
this contact is not healthy for you right now, Happy...I'm almost at the point where if he wants to come and see the baby, let him, and you, Happy, should be somewhere else...
he should not be able to come 'home' and play the happy family....he has given up that right at this time...
Words have the power to both destroy and heal. When words are both true and kind, they can change our world.
~~Buddha
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,970
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,970 |
I agree, Dylan...and I'll back Happy's choice, anyway. Happy, would you say that you and your H, in your marriage, have told each other what to think or not, to feel "Why, you shouldn't feel that way!" or not, what to believe or not? If so, I get the waiting...and that you own your own tiredness. You're choosing your life and you know it. You know your limits...you, afterall, made the appt with the attorney and brought home the papers. You don't lack in the action department...Dylan and I are asking about the follow-through...because if you both have been telling each other what is truly only your own, then you have this overlap going on...threats without enforcement stuff...whose choice is it to make this time stuff... Very normal. Still destructive. How about a compromise? Borrow a "For Sale" sign and have it in the front yard by Saturday? Can't hurt, right? Only be there while he's there...before they come hunting for it. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I don't normally subscribed to continued manipulation in a marriage, but your WH isn't choosing the marriage, and you're not in Plan A...so...use Dylan's marvelously creative mind and have some fun, will ya? LA
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 10
Junior Member
|
|
Junior Member
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 10 |
You guys are funny. I am just to tired to play games with him,but he would deserve it. Or I am to weak? I don't know. He knows I never manipulated him and that I am a good person (he told me one night that I am trying to be bad but I cannot because I am good)
LA, our marriage was based on talk, we would talk for hours and make all the decisions together. Everything was done by me (pay bills, find the lowest insurance, set up stuff - everything) but we would consult on stuff, even on work stuff.
Dylan, I cannot leave him alone with the baby, the baby has to hear my voice, he only feel safe if I am there, he only knows me. He started to smile at his father lately but still I have to be there.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 1,022
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 1,022 |
all's fair in love and war....
I love the idea of borrowing a sign...Happy...what do you think?
and really, no, I don't believe in manipulation....not even to save a marriage....
BUT....
in this case, I'd have to say it would be equal to a kick in the a$$...and he needs one right about now....
he has it all right there in front of him...baby and part-time family, lover and hotel rooms on the side....
but the pain on you Happy, is enormous...
no more...
I repeat...I do not normally believe this...ALL'S FAIR IN LOVE AND WAR...
this is, in reality a war for love...
think of it as sneaky shock treatment...
he is really onfused yet secure..time to remove the security blanket...
when your baby is old enough, you are going to remove the bottle, right, Happy?...and move him forward to a sippy cup or glass??...
time for your H's bottle to go....
Words have the power to both destroy and heal. When words are both true and kind, they can change our world.
~~Buddha
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 1,022
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 1,022 |
You guys are funny. I am just to tired to play games with him,but he would deserve it. .......
Dylan, I cannot leave him alone with the baby, the baby has to hear my voice, he only feel safe if I am there, he only knows me. He started to smile at his father lately but still I have to be there. Happy..it's not about him deserving it...this is no game...it is about him seeing some of the 'truths and consequences' that would actually happen.... If you go on to Divorce, do you understand you WOULD have to leave him alone with the baby?? that you would have to hand over your bundle of joy for whole weekends??? this is a truth....a fact... a consequence of divorce.... when I was a WW, my son was taken by his father...what he thught was 'best' considering my confused, 'fogged' state... 5 months, Happy.... 5 months without my child...visits, yes, but 5 months.... I slept in his bed, surrounded by his things, clothes that smelled of him....and cried for months...couldn't eat or sleep....I didn't get to see him in the mornings, I didn't get to tuck him in at night...I couldn't hold him or wipe away his tears... consequences .... one thing though.....your H will regret every moment he missed out on with his son....I guarantee you this fact.. he will regret it for the rest of his life.... no matter what else happens... I can't talk about this aspect anymore...it is 2 years later and I still can't talk about it....I'm sorry...I have to go....
Words have the power to both destroy and heal. When words are both true and kind, they can change our world.
~~Buddha
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,970
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,970 |
Happy, I hear what you're saying...about you both making decisions, talking all the time...and I hear you saying that manipulation is bad, or makes me a bad person.
Many marriages are manipulating...unspoken...if I give you hugs, you'll give me smiles...if I do this, you'll do that...we grew up with that exampled.
Didn't make us bad people. We didn't know we were manipulating...trading off...even just in our minds, not sharing it with our partners.
I'm talking about you hearing your WH define you...even for good, and you being okay with that...that's all.
You know who you are...one of the big betrayals when our WH's choose to leave is that they take their definitions of us with them...that chunk of us we told them they could own...and they leave it, forgetfully, in the driveway...we feel lost within ourselves. Not knowing what we should choose...
Just thinking out loud...with you in mind. No judgment, no attack...
And hugs for Dylan...(((((Dylan))))
See the love for you, Happy? We're here for you and for us...working through our own pain to help you with yours...isn't she lovely? Brave? True? I have tears in my eyes with you, Dylan.
I remember.
LA
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 39
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 39 |
I have received an email from my WW this morning. A very, very long one. I have no strength to translate it but in a nutshell she is blaming me again for everything (and didn’t mention anything about her A…) She read my thread and was very angry with what I posted and other people posted. At the end of her email she said that basically she wants to stay home for the girls but she doesn’t want me to spy on her or interfere with her private life!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am tired, tired, tired.<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/teary.gif" alt="" />
|
|
|
|
0 members (),
507
guests, and
55
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
|
