AllsFair
Don't post that much but, there need's to be a few things said here that you have not considered.
First of all, most of us here are indeed older than you and somehow, feel that we have learned a few things about life and relationships that you have not come to grasps with yet.
It, for me, was an eye opener. Most of us muddle along through our life thinking things are just fine, and there is no crisis on the horizon. Just when you begin to feel comfortable with this, disator can strike. Ask the folks in New Orleans.
I congratulate you for posting on this forum. It would seem, at first hand, that you picked the wrong forum to post on, but, in retrospect, you have inadvertently choosen the perfect forun to post on. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />
There are many wonderful people who populate this forum, but many are like me, in that they are BS's and, like me, are having a really difficult time in getting over that.
Many have alluded to your very young age of 24 and have concluded that you do not really know how cruel life can be. I echo these setiments, but i also recognise your intelect.
In matters of the heart, however, you are indeed still a babe in the woods.
I'm sure you are convinced that your married OM is your soulmate. Let's consider, howerver, how committed he is to you. He tells you he cannot D yet because of business. I would have sold my business, my home, and my soul for the love of my life! Perhaps to my detriment, I might add, but nonetheless, I loved my w to a fault. He, however, doesn't seem to be there yet. are you willing to settle for soo much less than that?
If so, you sell yourself short.
I won't slam you with what so many others have alredy told you, with truth in their hearts. I would only say that you need to gaina NEW prospective to finally know the real truth.I wish you well in your journey.
All blessings,
Jerry

AllsFair,

You are on the wrong site. You have no marriage to save or rebuild. But instead are trying to destroy one. You are an OW in denial and this site does not support OW.

AF,

You didn't answer the question.

"Why" whether he lied to her or not.."why" would some other woman who thinks she has a better shot than you with this man..and takes her chance .."why" should she be killed or retaliated against in any way?

After all..is she not just looking after her own interests as you are?

Do the same rules not apply to you?

You said..in the same breath mind you..that his wife knows..and that she doesn't..then say..well no one has come knocking on my door so she must not care.

Do you SEE the breakdown of logic here?

If she knows and does not come after you with a shovel..could it not also mean that she is a woman who excercises restaint to a greater degree than yourself? That she does not believe that BEHAVIOR is acceptable whatever the trigger?

I'm not asserting that this is so..I'm outlining for you..that you are making an assumption about her..that is based on wishfull thinking..because this line of thinking grants you some degree of self permission to continue.

You have said..that you do not know her at all..so there is no way that you could dispute with a laundry list of her crimes or behaviors that contradict that possibility *without* also outing yourself as a liar.

Then you said that she knows about you..but not in truth.

What does that mean precisely?

Now you say..that the fact that he spends so much time with you..must mean that there is nothing to the marriage.

OR

He can temporarily hide from his life while with you and this feels better while he is doing it than facing his problems does.

When he is with you..he can disappear into a fantasy..not just sex..but easy companionship that has not been marred by years of ill marital health..mutual bad decisions..mutual resentments..and just reality.

Doing laundry together is fun..H and I used to enjoy all sorts of everyday chores while we were playing house...but when those things become expected..when they are simply added to the stress of adult lifestyles and relationships it has an added element..for example..doing the laundry is LESS fun when you have had 2 hours of sleep and children just threw up on the floor meanwhile you don't feel so hot yourself and most of the money you used to use for recreation is now tied up in the investments that a realistic future requires. This stage of life..is a necessary but difficult and often unpleasant stairstep on the ladder of maturity. Denial of gratification..or at least its delay for a greater good requires self control and much restraint. A lot of young marrieds hit this spot and run for the hills in short order. It isn't fun anymore and won't be for a good long time. The loss of freedom as you invest elsewhere is painfull..however..who would volunteer to be stranded in a teenage or early twentysomething stage of life forever? Choice and cost..always counterbalancing each other.

Add on top of that..when he goes home..reality sets back in. He is an unfaithfull man. Ask some of the former unfaithfull spouses here..to describe what living like that is like..and WHY they just couldn't seem to press their palm onto that nail accept the pain and work through it..nor could they remove it completely and move on to the *new* relationship.

What IS really revealing for YOU..is that his answer to these problems is to find an enjoyable distraction and invest his time there.

This is a habit..and THIS is what would cause him to continue to have affairs when the going gets rough [and it will, no one is exempt]..for whatever reason he does not have either the skill or the will to manage his life with integrity..and the lack of integrity will eventually destroy him..no one can live as half a man..who would want to?

You can't complete him for him..he needs to be whole and functional on his own..you can't fix him..you can't set up every event in your lives to be favorable and enjoyable for him and EVEN IF YOU COULD you would resent the parent child dynamic that such artificial structures require.

You say that you are taking a calculated risk..but your fugures are based on wishfull thinking.

You say that IF he doesn't see a future with you that he wants to WORK for..then he should let you know..but hasn't he *already* demonstrated that he is UNABLE to do that?

You would require from that he be honest, forthright, and act with integrity regardless of the consequences for himself..even while you are able to observe that he will seek pleasure and avoid pain at every turn. He will pacify you..so that you will contionue to provide whatever it is that he benefits from in your relationship..and he will continue to delay the divorce proceedings with her [if they exist at all..so far it looks like not] because even if he hated her..he isn't willing to lose skin in the deal.

He isn't willing to PAY for his choices..and so he isn't willing to really MAKE them.

You won't either.

You will not introduce him to your family..because as it now stands..this relationship is shamefull and you know it and you prefer to shroud and veil the realities until you can MAKE them appear to be what you would like them to be.

There are so many contradictions in your posts..that it seems you are flailing wildly from one stance to another..first reasoned and smooth..the next street talking and so inarticulate I have more than once questioned that it was the same person posting.

This affair is not what you wish it was..will never be what you wish it was..I'd suggest that rather than attempting to "win" you question the value of the game..but I can see that this is fruitless..any further interest is for me..purely academic..it really is like watching a car wreck in slow motion..and I truly must question my own mental status that I have some sort of gratification in watching anyway.

Alls Fair,
I know it is harsh to read all these postings, but they are right. We may be taking a little of our anger out on you, but the basic facts are still right. You are being naive and taken advantage of by an unfaithful husband. Bottom Line, get out while you are still young and don't waste your youth on him.

You are being USED and enjoying it; that is the behavior of a fool. And you will end up none the better for it. You and I both know he will dump you like a hot potato once his W finds out.

you ARE losing something

your values, self-respect, and honor

as well as the respect of your friends and eventually your family when they learn of this

is this really who you thought you'd be?

someone who sleeps with a married man?
someone who has no regard for the vows of marraige and would be willing to be with someone who doesn't either for ANY reason?

Is this really who you want to be?

Because that's who you are as long as you continue having an affair with this man.

Shine through, thanks for this. This was why I posted a thread. And I wasn't aware I posted in the wrong place.

I hear you. I don't know about "soul mate" as in one and only. I think WHOEVER I marry is my soul mate, because we would not have taken that step unless we intended to learn how to BE "soul mates".

I hear you with regard to leaving everything for one's soul mate though (businss, NOT family) but unfortunately he has made many financial sacrifices in the past and is nervous about doing it again.

But it's not a good enough reason for me. Not at ALL. I will bear that in mind (from a man's perspective as well) when speaking with him.

Eav - If only you knew! But, I won't go there.

Listen. As young and immature as you may all think I am, I do know this - life isn't black and white.

I'm 24! I AM young! No doubt. I am supposed to be. If I don't know or understand certain things it's because I've got years ahead to learn them.

Our choices have consequences. And I believe in doing what you feel is right FOR you as long as you can handle the consequences.

I don't see the risks the same way you guys do. You may feel I am losing "values, self respect, honour" But NOONE can take those things away from me! Not my SO, not you guys, not Melody, not the most vicious jury in the world.

I believe in my choice and I am making it for better or worse.

Allsfair, I would also add that this is a MARRIAGE BUILDING forum, not a marriage WRECKING forum.

MB will not help you destroy someone else's marriage. For support in that kind of putrid, immoral, sleazy behavior, you might consider slumming over at another board called TOW.

It is a real trip to the sewer, but somehow I suspect you would fit in just fine. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

This is doubtful. If you were as "sure" as you claim, you wouldn't hesitate to call the OMW today to discuss their so-called "delayed divorce" and verify everything else he has said.

But you and I both know you can't do that. You would be dropped like a hot potato if you did.

www.gloryb.com

check out the pink board


oh, wait you probably already post there

please go back

AF...
in response..to you won't go behind his back...then don't. Next time he is with you...simply say...hey, i need to come clean to your wife....gonna go call her right now..okay. and then call her. tell her who you are...and what you have been doing with her H. with him right there.

i didn't call OW behind my H back ....even though i had every right too. Nope...i called her him standing right beside me. shocked the sh*t out of him and he got mad. I asked her what she had been doing with my H. she lied and so did he. He then called her BEHIND my back to apologize for my call. You see...to cover up to her....to lie some more to her....

then he comes back to me...to lie to me some more about the A.

i know you want to trust this man, i know you don't want to hear the W's side....but whats right is right.

My son has been around OW....he's 4, just turned 4. One night he was sniffing in the bed...and said to me...Mommy...i didn't talk to that woman today...cause i wanted to make you happy....

even at 4 he knows wrong. he could sense it. He also was torn up over it too. My H didn't give him enough credit in thinking he would tell me...he then started saying our son was lying...

do you see...his DS, his baby, the child he adores...he sunk down low enough to call him a liar.

they will hurt anyone in their pathway just to get their fantasy...even the children.

AF...pray about this....call Mrs. Wondering...

Jaysmom

Jaysmom, she is not concerned about going behind his back. She knows if she calls the OMW, she will be dumped like a hot potato. She will find out the "delayed divorce" <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> is a lie along with everything else.

come on, let's not waste any more breath on this one. There are people here who need real help.

i don't believe your foolish choice has anything to do with your age or maturity

you have never been married so no matter what you say or think.....you can't imagine what it would feel like to have that kind of a bond with someone

even if you were cheated on by somone you dated, you could never imagine how it feels to have the person who vowed to be faithful to you forever, forsaking all others.....cheat on you, lie to you, and leave you with a broken heart

but....

it has to do with YOUR values, morals and beliefs

you are right.....it is your choice to be with this type of person and to be this type of person

you are also right....you will have to live with the consequences

"what a fool you are"

I think I will just let this one lie. My situation doesn't really apply here and the only thing more dangerous than a person who is wrong thinking they are right.. is a person who knows they are right.

I will add the obligatory "an intimate relationship built on lies requires sanitizing from the deception or it will collapse"

Noodle,

Thanks for your post. You took your time. I know no one would be posting if I hadn't hit a raw nerve. In a way I apologise ... but this is NOTHING to what I will probably get from people who may not realise their M is over. Noone EVER likes the 2nd wife or step mom (I know).

"You said..in the same breath mind you..that his wife knows..and that she doesn't..then say..well no one has come knocking on my door so she must not care."

- I said she knows "of" me. My name. She knows a female called AllsFair is in his life and is important to him. She has not been explicitly told that it is a relationship (for all it's worth because SO wants to end things as calmly as possible). Don't put words at my fingers. I didn't say she does not care - I've consistently said I don't know her.

I AGREE WITH ABOUT 80% OF YOUR POST!!!

Playing house is different from the real deal!

Loving someone after 10/15/20 years of LIFE is a different matter from when you've just loved for less than a year!

Yes! Yes! Yes! To MOST of what you said!

I am not living a fantasy ... well ... let me rephrase that - FALLING IN LOVE is a fantasy. It is a suspension of each others faults. A suspension of reality in many ways. This is the easiest time in a relationship, everyone is on their BEST behaviour!

I am no angel, I'm sure you'll concur. And neither is SO. He never fails to point out whenever I say I like something like a quirky smile or mannerism, that it is this VERY thing that will annoy the ****** out of me in a few years.

He went on about the age difference when he first realised like you wouldn't believe! All the complications when he's 70 and I'm still 56.

He IS a workaholic. I have to put up with that.

He has a DD that is and MUST (for my peace of mind in his value as a father) be a priority in his life.

I see the challenges. The falling in love stage is passing quickly. It is not going to be possible to suspend reality for much longer.

I have my life to get on with. So either it moves on with him or it moves on without him. He has till December, THOUGH I HAVEN"T TOLD HIM!

This is where you guys get it twisted. I'll NEVER tell him to D! Never! Because then it would be true when people like you say I ended his marriage.

But I take my honest belief of the situation and assess my needs and my position. And THAT I share with him.

It is true that if our relationship was the real thing he wouldn't let anything stand in the way.

"You say that IF he doesn't see a future with you that he wants to WORK for..then he should let you know..but hasn't he *already* demonstrated that he is UNABLE to do that?"

On this I disagree. Because we've only been together for 7 months. After 6 months a relationship generally gets more serious. For me, this 7 months was time for him AND me to discover if our relationship was worth fighting to build. I feel he's had enough time know to know if I am worth taking risks for (regarding his BUSINESS NOT M). So now, he has a chance to do that work with me.

Again, it's up to him to think about it and let me know. We're having an "Assessment Talk" which we've had through out the relationship. This one is to discuss the email and his thoughts on it.

Then for me it's Plan A (as much as I know y'all hate to hear that) till September and Plan B till December.

"You will not introduce him to your family..because as it now stands..this relationship is shamefull and you know it and you prefer to shroud and veil the realities until you can MAKE them appear to be what you would like them to be."

- Actually my family and friends ALL know about him and our situation. They think it's hard on both of us. They agree with my Plan A&B strategy. Not unanimously. But I've never kept it a secret.

I won't introduce him to my M and F because where I'm from that's something you only do with a fiance type person. And until he is fully available, he does not get the honour of being treated like a SIL by my family.

Don't feel guilty! Watch away LOL! I have a habit of watching things that happen in life in a way slightly separate from myself. I accept MY truths (as I don't actually believe in univeral ones), my lessons and blessings and keep striving to live as I feel is right for me.

I think if nothing else, it would be interesting to chart the progress of this particular relationship here, to see if it falls under the 95% category or indeed was something more meaningful.

I do pray. And I pray for his happiness and mine even if it's not together. I'm not do or die about our relationship surviving. If I'm do or die about anything it's my wellbeing through every decision I make in life. Lessons and blessings.

PS. I'm not saying the OW MUST DIE! LOL! I'm just talking about me and how I know I would respond. Noone has to like it and I'm not arguing whether or not it is right. It's just how I handle things.

Thanks for you lengthy post again. It was appreciated.

Did you look at the thread (link) I referenced way back on page 2? The one where an OW had been married to her affair partner for 19 years and then found out he was cheating? So, so, so much heartache there... and her guilt over the beginnings of her marriage... and the contributions of other posters, including myself, who put our stories out there... to warn... Did you hear the warning? Do you CARE?

I can't believe this thread is still going... so much harm and pain you cause(d) by posting this here.

I hope to God you aren't yanking our chain, here... I'm beginning to wonder, TRULY, what you want from us. (PS: I asked this before, also, and you said... what?... )

*EYEROLL*

Well since you talk about Plan A & B which I still stand by with what I said (it is for the BS, NOT OW),then you realize that in Plan A you need to "expose" this A to everyone <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />