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Well, I just caught my husband in his 3rd EA. This time it was with the woman from the last time over 5 years ago. He "claims" it was just for counseling since this woman is a drug/alcohol counselor. I'm not stupid...I know better. The only interaction I can track is phone calls about once a month. During these conversations at 1, 2 & 3 in the morning--I can tell pictures are being sent and received. This woman is not attractive--I know, I know--that doesn't necessarily matter... He says it is not sexual and he is not attracted to her. We both work at the same high school. My question is--what now? I, of course, kicked him out and he is now at his parents house. We have two children (12 & 4). We actually had a good weekend and he ended up talking me into staying the night at his parents since they were out of town. I am so hurt. Everything on this site says what I should do to meet his emotional needs...but what about me? I could just really use some friends. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
BW (me) 32
WH 32
Married 7,5 years; DD 4, DD 12
1st Dday - 10/99
2nd Dday - 5/03
This Dday - 5/24
years of an internet EA - A was supposedly ended whe it happened in 03???
This last EA is continuing with the same person the 2nd one did.
Starting marriage counseling 6/1/06
WH living with mom (after I kicked hin out) and attanding personal counseling.
Plan A since 5/31
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Give him tough love...which you did in kicking him out. If he sees no consequences, he won't change. He may not like it, but it is for the good of your marriage. Stand firm, but let him know your comittment as well. Then let him choose.
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STB...
Part of Plan A is EXPOSURE...EXPOSE this AFFAIR...Is the OW married? Call her husband...Do your husband's parents know? Make sure they do, explain your intentions of saving your marriage and ask them to encourage their son to do the right thing here...You expose this affair to everyone that could have influence on your husband to do the right thing...Exposure should be done in one fell swoop for maximum benefit...Yes, your husband will be mad, but your marriage can survive his anger but it cannot and will not survive an ongoing affair...Kill this affair by exposing it!
Mrs. W
FWW ~ 47 ~ MeFBH ~ 50 ~ MrWonderingDD ~ 17 Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered
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I feel so guilty exposing it to people. I also feel some shame.???? His parents know but they totally believe that the reason he choose to seek this person out was because I wasn't meeting his needs. Don't get me wrong...needs obviously weren't being met (his or mine) but we were actually doing fine. Why is it they get this excuse that their needs aren't being met? Mine weren't either but I didn't turn outside my marriage. He also doesn't believe that what he did was an "affair". He agreed to the term EA the last two times I think only to passify me. When do I know it is ok to let him come back home? Thanks for your help through this. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> [color:"pink"] [/color]
BW (me) 32
WH 32
Married 7,5 years; DD 4, DD 12
1st Dday - 10/99
2nd Dday - 5/03
This Dday - 5/24
years of an internet EA - A was supposedly ended whe it happened in 03???
This last EA is continuing with the same person the 2nd one did.
Starting marriage counseling 6/1/06
WH living with mom (after I kicked hin out) and attanding personal counseling.
Plan A since 5/31
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Sad, there is NO excuse EVER for having an affair. And after 3 affairs, it is pretty clear it has nothing to do with a marital problem. Rather, it is a way of life with him. And it will remain a way of life until he gets some help and decides to change.
If it were me, I would expose the affair and go into Plan B. Send him a Plan B letter with the condition that he not only stop his affair, but resolve his character issue that prevents him from being faithful.
There really need to be some consequences here to motivate him to change. Otherwise, you might as well accept infidelity as a way of life.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Give him tough love...which you did in kicking him out. 1woundedheart - please be very careful giving advice like this. It's rarely appropriate that kicking them to the curb is the wise thing to do.
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I feel so guilty exposing it to people. I also feel some shame.???? STB... Not exposing him in the past has enabled him to continue to do this to you...I very much agree with Melody that this has become a character issue for him... I understand that you feel shame, but you MUST understand and internalize that his having affairs are his issues...it has NOTHING to do with you...you did nothing at all to cause it or deserve it...Btw, I'm telling you this as a FWS, so I REALLY KNOW that his choices have nothing at all to do with you...please believe that... Again, STB, I implore you to expose this affair...Is the OW married??? Mrs. W
FWW ~ 47 ~ MeFBH ~ 50 ~ MrWonderingDD ~ 17 Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered
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Yes, the OW is married (and a counselor). lol
We are on "friendly" terms now mostly because I have not really voiced my hurt/anger.
I don't think he is at all "addicted" to this woman and I'm not sure she is a threat at all. Supposedly all contact is stopped. ??
Since he is still at his parent's house...I want to know what my course of action should be when he asks to come home again. I feel that if I give him a lot of marriage builders stuff to read that I will look like I'm trying to "teach" him.
I keep going back to "what about my needs"? Especially the need for trust/security.
Why must everything be about them?
BW (me) 32
WH 32
Married 7,5 years; DD 4, DD 12
1st Dday - 10/99
2nd Dday - 5/03
This Dday - 5/24
years of an internet EA - A was supposedly ended whe it happened in 03???
This last EA is continuing with the same person the 2nd one did.
Starting marriage counseling 6/1/06
WH living with mom (after I kicked hin out) and attanding personal counseling.
Plan A since 5/31
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I am confused. Why are you on "friendly terms" with a woman with whom he had an affair? Why would she not be a threat? The biggest problem you have right now is this affair, not your "needs." Your needs are not going to met unless and until they end all contact. That is your first step.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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STB...
Part of Plan A is EXPOSURE...EXPOSE this AFFAIR...Is the OW married? Call her husband...Do your husband's parents know? Make sure they do, explain your intentions of saving your marriage and ask them to encourage their son to do the right thing here...You expose this affair to everyone that could have influence on your husband to do the right thing...Exposure should be done in one fell swoop for maximum benefit...Yes, your husband will be mad, but your marriage can survive his anger but it cannot and will not survive an ongoing affair...Kill this affair by exposing it!
Mrs. W WADR to Mrs W...this is where the textbook answers here hold no weight to me. This is his 3rd affair (THAT HE WAS CAUGHT WITH....we aren't gonna count the numerous other one's he got away with.) This is likely not an addiction to an OW or "love fog"...Expose all you want, but I have a sneaking and SAD suscpicion that there is MUCH MUCH MORE than an ongoing affair with an unattractive drug and alcohol counselor as the central issue. I will leave it at that. Lem
Some people just don't get it, they don't get it that they don't get it.
I had the right to remain silent.......but I didn't have the ability.
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How do you know that all contact has stopped??? You do know how to tell if a WS is lying right? Their lips are moving! Don't take him at his word right now...And yes, why are you on friendly terms with someone who helped put a knife in your back? And STB, if you would have exposed to the OW's husband the first time your husband's affair would more than likely not have resumed...the OWH needs to know...
Mrs. W
P.S. And Yes Lem, I agree, which is why Melody and I have said that this IS a character issue that STB's husband needs to seek help for...still doesn't change exposure though...
FWW ~ 47 ~ MeFBH ~ 50 ~ MrWonderingDD ~ 17 Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered
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I'm not on friendly terms with her...I am on friendly terms with him.
I don't know how to contact the husband as their number is unlisted and I only have her cell phone. Any ideas?
By the way...just to add to the drama she is also counseling his sister and when this all came out is sister is VERY upset that she didn't reveal she knew her brother and is very close to filing a HIPPA claim because when I initially caught him he claimed he was talking to the woman discussing his sister. (A lie of course...but proves she told him she was counseling his sister--big NO NO!)
He claims that she was always very respectful of our marriage and seems to almost be protective of her.
Another thing...what's up with the pictures going back and forth? They only seem to talk once a month that I can tell from the phone bill--but almost every time there are data transfers (pictures) between their phone calls.
???
He started individual counseling yesterday and we have an apt with a pastor from a nearby church tomorrow.
BW (me) 32
WH 32
Married 7,5 years; DD 4, DD 12
1st Dday - 10/99
2nd Dday - 5/03
This Dday - 5/24
years of an internet EA - A was supposedly ended whe it happened in 03???
This last EA is continuing with the same person the 2nd one did.
Starting marriage counseling 6/1/06
WH living with mom (after I kicked hin out) and attanding personal counseling.
Plan A since 5/31
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stb - Go to this site - http://www.ussearch.com - and do a reverse lookup on the cell number. Costs you $15. You'll get and address. To which you can send correspondance. OR drop by. Let the experts advise you on which. Also you've got HUGE leverage to expose and ruin this party via SIL with the HIPPA claim! Does SIL know about the affair? As difficult as it as, try not to worry about what little Jr. High kind of games your husband is playing with his girlfriend. He's an alien. Possessed. Sick. Don't chase that rabbit - you'll only get talking catapillars and singing flowers. Not much use to you now. YOU are the mature adult in this. Your WH is a spoiled child. Hang in there.
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Dumb question...what is SIL?
Another dumb question...he has asked whether he should come home and it is me that said no because I want to wait until I can be assured this won't happen again. Is that the right move?
He seems to make up excuses to be home though. He is downstairs right now playing his playstation football league weekly game. He has pretty much hung around all night.
I do feel dumb though because it seems that when I'm around him and he initiates sex...no matter how hurt I am--I want to be needed so bad that I give in. Is this totally dumb?
Thanks for the replies and keeping me sane.
BW (me) 32
WH 32
Married 7,5 years; DD 4, DD 12
1st Dday - 10/99
2nd Dday - 5/03
This Dday - 5/24
years of an internet EA - A was supposedly ended whe it happened in 03???
This last EA is continuing with the same person the 2nd one did.
Starting marriage counseling 6/1/06
WH living with mom (after I kicked hin out) and attanding personal counseling.
Plan A since 5/31
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Posts: 347
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SIL is sister-in-law.
How do you know there is not a physical relationship????
Resolve NOW to expose this affair. I did not expose my wife's and I'm sorry I didn't because I lost a tremendous opportunity to ensure that she NEVER does this again. I've followed enough situations on this site to have learned that exposure is KEY. ESPECIALLY if your wayward husband (WH) is on his 3rd affair.
Let's see - what consequence is your WH having to face because of this A
- You kick him out so he can continue his affair with the other woman (OW) in peace
- You give him sex (SF) when he wants it, despite the fact that he's intimate with another woman
- You allow him to play video games in the home that he has dishonored with his infidelity
If I'm him this looks like a pretty good deal! Is it a good for you?
Time to work on you. Educate yourself. Have you read EVERY link on this site about infidelity?? If not, start now.
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One more thing...the other woman seems very concerned about her marriage. Don't you think that exposing her might push the two of them together? I'm sure she is already MAD as HE^% that my husband's lie might cost her her job. My sister in law has already met with her boss. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
BW (me) 32
WH 32
Married 7,5 years; DD 4, DD 12
1st Dday - 10/99
2nd Dday - 5/03
This Dday - 5/24
years of an internet EA - A was supposedly ended whe it happened in 03???
This last EA is continuing with the same person the 2nd one did.
Starting marriage counseling 6/1/06
WH living with mom (after I kicked hin out) and attanding personal counseling.
Plan A since 5/31
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Posts: 12
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I guess the only assurance I have that he has not been physical (other than the OW is not his "type") is that we work together and live together and are pretty much together ALL the time with few exceptions. The only time he would have a chance would be his monthly poker nights that I do know he attends (at least for a while).
I guess I'm stupidly trying not to love bust and trying to meet his emotional needs even though mine are toast. Sounds dumb huh?
I really appreciate how you are taking the time to post on this.
BW (me) 32
WH 32
Married 7,5 years; DD 4, DD 12
1st Dday - 10/99
2nd Dday - 5/03
This Dday - 5/24
years of an internet EA - A was supposedly ended whe it happened in 03???
This last EA is continuing with the same person the 2nd one did.
Starting marriage counseling 6/1/06
WH living with mom (after I kicked hin out) and attanding personal counseling.
Plan A since 5/31
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Posts: 6,316
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STB... The benefits of exposure far outweigh this very minimal risk. I think that you are looking for reasons not to expose out of fear...I'd like for you to read this post by star*fish on fear...someday I'm gonna get around to asking her for permission to post it...I think that it is just wonderful...I hope you gain from reading it... It is the fear that paralyzes you, sends blood rushing through your veins, sours your stomach, and interupts your sleep. It is the fear that gives away your power, your hope, and your forgiveness. It is fear that robs you of the active self and traps you in the role of patronizing enabler who will take them back at ANY cost...even if the price is too high. It is fear that keeps you from confronting and exposing. And fear that prevents you from enforcing your boundaries and having compassion for yourself.
Fear of abandonment.
Fear of rejection.
Fear of reaction....yours, theirs.
Fear of future...the unknown.
Fear of destitution and want.
Fear of failure.
Fear of losing.
Fear of loss.
Fear of solitude.
Fear of settling.
Fear of change.
Fear of lack of change.
Fear
Fear
Infidelity creates FEAR....and fear is crippling. Research shows us what we already know in our hearts....when we are fearful....we are unable to fire up the parts of our brains that "process" information on a logical, rational, spirtual level and create solutions that increase the odds for success in crises. When we are fearful....we don't use our neocortex....but instead, it is our limpic system which lights up our MRIs....our animal brains wired for "fight or flight".
There is no HOPE in our animal brains....because our indentity, our souls, our compassion....don't reside there. You are only capable of conflict or escape when you are there....so you must find a quiet place to deal with your fears so that you can confront, expose, do all the things that overcoming infidelity entails....all the things that happiness entails. You must value yourself as well as protect yourself, without fear of losing your WS or enforcing boundaries.....because if you don't....all your fears will be realized anyway.
MB is not designed to trap you in a marriage where your feelings are crushed and disrespected or the vows of marriage are meaningless. It's designed to help you overcome fear and give you hope that marriages CAN recover from infidelity....but you must be brave and be willing to risk losing your WS in order to regain trust, fidelity, security.
You must be willing to see beyond your pain and take logical and systematic steps to undermine the affair and increase the stability and security of your marriage. That takes courage above pain. It takes the peacefulness of knowing you are strong enough to lose a self indulgent and unrepentant spouse or recover with a flawed, but motivated one.
Don't let your fear take back a spouse who isn't ready to do the hard work recovery after infidelity entails. It is an invitation for misery.
If you don't believe you CAN survive without your WS....you cannot do what you must do to ensure success.
Stop being fearful of their threats...they are just excuses to leave or be selfish.
Stop being fearful of their reactions....their reactions arise from their guilt...not your boundaries.
Stop being fearful of taking a stand....it's the only way to gain respect or trust.
Stop being fearful of being alone.....until you can stand on your own and risk losing them, you will NEVER know if they remain with you by choice. And you will never know if you want them or you NEED them.
And if you need them....even if they return....you are in trouble there. Hang in there STB... Mrs. W
FWW ~ 47 ~ MeFBH ~ 50 ~ MrWonderingDD ~ 17 Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered
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She should be concerned about her marriage. She and WH are destroying it. Along with yours.
I asked EXACTLY the same question about exposure. The best response I got was - "How much FURTHER away could your WW get than she is now?? She's LEFT the marriage." All the talk and affection that your WH is giving you is fake. It's a trick. So that you ask exactly the question you're asking now. He's manipulating you. It's CLASSIC wayward behavior. Can you see that??
The anger from exposure is temporary. It lasts only as long as the wayward's luntic mind prevails. Exposure brings serious, adult consequences like losing a job. Helps the affair partners 'get it' real quick. Get that they've been living in a fantasy world and might better return to the real world, the adult world, before they lose everything.
STB - create a signature similar to mine so that those reading your thread have a little back ground on your situation. Helps to advise. Click on 'My Home' up above to set it up. Ok?
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I guess I'm stupidly trying not to love bust and trying to meet his emotional needs even though mine are toast. Sounds dumb huh? It's NOT dumb. I did it. There are LOADS of others on this board that have done/are doing it. Ask them if THEY are dumb. I dare you. YOU are the sane one. YOU are giving the marriage what it requires RIGHT NOW by being mature enough to continue to meet needs in the face of tremendous adversity. Now there's a fine line between meeting needs and being a doormat. By FAR the trickiest part of Plan A. You can meet needs without being a doormat. It took me about 3 weeks of Plan A to figure that out. Don't worry about that now though. Save your energy for exposure. Re-read Mrs. W's post. Again and again. You can do this. I believe in you.
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