imanotherone,logistically, how and where did you hide the recorder?

I'm thinking of putting it in WH's truck under the seat but I'm afraid it'll fall. Will duct tape do the job? And if it's under the seat, how is the sound quality?

Can't believe I've reached this point. In 10 years of marriage, I have never been a snoop.

Good question.

In my case, I put the recorder in our home office, b/c I knew he spent a lot of "alone" time in there, and that was the most likely place to hear something.

A good recorder might come with a mic, so you can tape the recorder somewhere, and place the mic closer up.

In my case, I put the recorder on the desk, under some papers. One issue---my recorder has a bright red led when in record mode. Needed to put some opaque tape over that, b/c it's really obvious when it gets dark.

I can just imagine your H seeing the LED under his seat in his vehicle--he'd probably shi+ bricks trying to get out, fearing you've placed some kind of explosive ordinance under his chair (closest to the testicles, right?).

Anyway, use some creativity. Is the car the place he is most likely to have his little chats? If not, can you put something somewhere in the big house? Does H retreat to a special room when he takes calls? These might all be good options for you, if the car doesn't work out.

BTW, I have two december babies! It's kind of a nice time to be pregnant.

I've heard of lots of folks who duct taped it under the seat. You get some background noise though.

I think I'll put a recorder in our home office and in his car. He travels a lot for work, and he uses a speakerphone so I'll be able to hear both sides of the conversation. Hopefully, I'll be able to hear the conversation even with the background noise.

Hello, I was reading your post and it brings tears to my eyes because I have been in a very similar situation. My H and I are now almost 4 months into recovery.

When I was 9 months pregnant my husband came home and said that he loved me but was not in love with me...He left and was gone for 4 months seeing OW. OW was also a co-worker. He was almost completely absent through the last weeks of my pregnancy and the first few months of our daughter’s life.

He said so many of the exact same things your H says, like not considering your feelings at all while you are thinking about it 24/7, and I went through the same feelings that you are questioning marriage and the morality of mankind.

I think you are doing the right thing moving back in. Some of the best advice I ever got at the time was that I owed it to our children to at least give my marriage everything I could. Then if they come and questioned my decision to divorce years later I could honestly say I did everything that I could.

It seemed at the time that my H and OW wanted nothing more than for me and my marriage to H to never have existed. But that is simply not the case. He is your husband and you have so much history with him. Your husband is being selfish and probably is in denial that his actions are causing you and your son such excruciating grief.

One other piece of advise I would offer you is that you should consider divorce counseling as something for people who are divorced or are sure that they are leaving there marriage. That is one mistake I made, I too initially took the divorce trail and found plenty of support for dealing with divorce. Once I decided that I did owe it to my marriage and my children to give it all I had, I sought out the support to do that instead and it helped tremendously.

My heart truly goes out to you because I do know that being pregnant and having to deal with this is especially difficult. A H will never fully know how especially hard this makes it.

But God makes woman strong for a reason, we are lucky enough to be granted the gift of life. Try to focus on the little one growing inside you know matter how hard, your H is the one missing out! Allow yourself to go ahead and get excited about this new little boy. Your H is his father no matter what and I hope he will come to his senses soon.

In a lot of ways I think my H and I's separation was a good thing because I backed off and gave him the space to see if this was really what he wanted. I think he figured out pretty quickly that he was with me for a reason and that over the years he had just taken that for granted. He was just in too deep at that point and couldn’t figure a way out. It seems that your H may be at that same point but he must distance himself from OW to get out of the fog.

You are obviously a very intelligent woman and though the road ahead of you is long there is light at the end of your tunnel with or without him.

Happy 4th of July everyone.

backroads, thank you for your words of encouragement. I haven't posted on these boards for a while because I've been doing a lot of thinking.

Before my H left for his trip, he told me that he would take this one day at a time. During his time away this weekend, we've just had small talk, and actually did a little flirting via text messages, but no serious R talks. I still don't know where his head is at. I am picking him up at the airport tonight. I'm not sure what to expect.

I have not moved back in the big house yet. I suppose I am waiting to see what he says to me. I do feel pathetic, like he is calling all of the shots.

I just want this hurt to end so much. If my H wants this marriage, I will do everything in my power to plan A and not LB. It is going to be very difficult for me, however, to swallow my pride, but with God's help, I know I can do it.

I've been reading my Bible every day reading what it has to say about forgiveness and compassion. Jesus says to love your enemies and forgive someone 70 x 7. I have to be the bigger person -- if only for the sake of my children.

Life is difficult, but I know God will only give me as much as I can handle.

backroads, how is recovery? I don't know your story, but how do you forgive?

Thanks to all for your thoughts and prayers. I will keep you posted.

Why is your WH deciding how "YOU" will spend the rest of your life? Don't you want in on the decision?

Yes, I do want to be in on the decision. Before WH left for his trip, I told him I wanted to work on our marriage. So I did make my decision. But it takes two. It's his turn to decide what he wants.

Hope,

I need to be brutally honest with you.

You say you want to work on your marriage, but yet all your actions dictate otherwise. You left the house. You are atttending a divorce support group. You retained an attorney to prepare for filing of legal separation. You did this even before you knew about the supposed PA. Also, you convinced yourself of a PA, from that text message. I did not interpret it that way.

On the other hand, what actions has your husband taken that he wants out of this marriage. Do not pay attention to what he says but rather what he does.

From an outsider looking in, it appears that it is you who does not want this marriage.

He has agreed to you moving back in and you will only do it on the condition that he says he wants to work on the marriage. I think you should be taking one step at a time. Move back in . Dont tell him to move out if he does not like the arrangement. Just let things take their normal course. Sometimes, less talk is more.

You say you will swallow your pride. You will swallow your pride, if you like what he says . Otherwise, you will not move back in. That is not swallowing your pride. Swallowing your pride is just moving back in .

I see so much hope from your husband. It is a good thing that you are picking him up from the airport and that you communicated whilst he was away.

Just move back in.

If this post offended you, please let me know and I will not post to you again.

Innocence

Hello, I was watching Dr. Phil the other day and heard him say something that may be helpful to you. He was speaking with a couple that where filing for divorce. They where considering giving there relationship another chance.

He told them that they shouldn’t do any thing-divorce or get back together, until they had dealt with all of their unfinished emotional business. He says you have to earn your way out of a marriage. The two of you have children so you are going to be co allies (another Phil term) in raising those children. So it is important that you work out this emotional business rather than just walk away.

You are angry and you have every right to be! Forgiveness in my experience comes with time and understanding, angry fades with time and so does the pain. Have you thought about marriage counseling, or have you already gone, cant remember?

I must tell you also that you shouldn’t let him decide what to do with the rest of your life. It does take two, HOWEVER one person can inspire change in the other person. You sound very independent and hard headed like myself <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> so I understand were you are coming from. But what do you really want? If its to give you M a good chance at making it you should go back as long as it is not an abusive situation. He has had his time to think and sounds like he may be as hard headed as you-you are both lawyers right- I could only imagine.

I personally take credit for taking the first steps to save my marriage when my H had an affair, and now my H is very thankful for that. I could give you another Phil term-"Your relationship needs a hero". You could be that hero and who knows maybe your H will be too.

Thanks innocence_lost and backroads for the tough love.

I picked up WH from the airport last night. While the evening didn't turn out the way I wanted (with him declaring his undying love for me, for example), he was wearing his wedding ring, and he did hold my hand and gave me a kiss. We didn't talk about our relationship and just kept things light.

He did get a text message and a phone call while we were together. With the call, I had left to go to the restroom, when I got back, I heard him say I'll call you back and quickly got off the phone. That seemed suspect to me, and it took everything I had not to ask him who called. That would have been a LB right?

He is helping me move my things back into the house tonight. That's a good sign.

Innocence, I am not offended by your remarks. I do value your input and perspective. That's why I'm on this board because I am so enmeshed in this horrible mess that I can't see the forest for the trees. Filing for legal separation is something that was pushed on me by well-meaning friends. You're right, I really thought my marriage was over, and I was acting that way.

I will take it one day at a time.

Hope,

There are very positive signs occurring there for your marriage. Your husband agreeing to you moving back in, helping you move, him wearing his wedding ring and you picking him up from the airport.

I would be very careful whom I listen to for advice. If well meaning friends have not experienced infidelity, then they are not qualified to advise. Most people before infidelity, myself included would say if my spouse cheated on me that would be it. It is only when you are in that predicament that you can truly assess what you would do. And be careful of listening to people who are divorced.

I hope by now , you have moved back in and are sleeping in the marital bed together. No talk of divorce. You are there to make your marriage work.

You have taken the right step.

Innocence

I've been back in the house for two days. We had a "talk" this morning, and it came out that he didn't think we were back together. We were just living in the same house and sharing the same bed.

He says he wants to take it slow this time around because the last time we reconciled, we got right back into our relationship and that ended in disaster. He said with our first reconciliation, he was refraining from going out with his friends and he was making a concerted effort to be with me. Well, that ended in disaster.

This time around, he wants to see if we can have a friendship first before moving on. I guess kinda like dating. But he basically wants to do his own thing while we're in this limboland. He wants to be able to go out with his friends whenever he wants, and he doesn't want me to complain about it.

For example, this afternoon, he's taking off from work to go golfing with the guys. They do this every Friday, and he wants to be able to hang out with him. These guys are not exactly paragons of virtue: one has cheated on his wife; one is currently separated from his wife due to an affair with his secretary; one is recently divorced and dating girls 20 years his junior; and one is single and is a player.

He told me that he wasn't going to change. He wanted to be able to life his "single" life and go out when he wants and go to the gym when he wants.

I really want a family man who puts his family first above his friends.

What do I do? Do I swallow my pride and capitulate to his demands? I feel it's unfair to me to be living in the same house as he and watching him doing his own thing.

Is this what Plan A is all about? Should I just try to be nice for now and see what happens?

I have not read your whole story, but no, the behavior you describe is not desirable husband behavior.

Plan A is not doormat time, but it is not demand time, either. Occasionally, express to him in a respectful way that it hurts you when he goes out with friends, and does not include you, and that it would be very good for your marriage if the two of you spent more time together, doing something you both enjoy. Tell him how much you like to be with him.

Add this to your list of boundaries for recovery, that he will need to devote his best time and energy to his family, and not have those pesky blocks of unaccounted-for time. That will be dealt with later, probably at the end of Plan B.

Just keep up your Plan A efforts, and don't assume the A is over. You'll get through this fine.

I am relitively new here and didn't find MB until d-day so I am not an expert by any means. What you are going through is just so very similiar to what I went through. Have you read the thread in general q's on passive aggresive WS? Very intersting.

Have the two of you been to marriage counceling? If he would agree to go it could help point him in the right direction. It sounds like he is very confused. My H and I attended befor the A was exposed and she really called him on his mumbo jumbo stuff. She really got him asking the right questions. It got the ball rolling in the right direction for him.

If he agrees to go you can usually get in the next day or so, then he dosent have much time to think about it.

Tomorrow, WH and I are going to his work party. OW will be there. I am getting anxious just thinking about it.

Normally, I wouldn't go because I don't really like these sorts of things, but I'm trying to be the "perfect" wife for Plan A purposes.

Any advice?

Hi Hope,

It is good to hear you are sleeping together in the marital bed. I hope you dont mind me asking, but is there any physical contact, that is hugging or kissing. Small steps.

It must be hard to hear your husband saying he wants to go out as he pleases. I believe he knows that what he is saying is wrong, but is saying it to bait you into an argument. My husband used to do that a lot during his affair. We would argue and it would give him justification to continue on with this affair.

You said that your husband said that things got worse when he stopped going out with his friends. How did things get worse and why.

Does your husband spend time with your 3 year old son. Why dont you plan family outings together. Keep your husband busy with your son, so that he has less time to go out with his friends,

As regards the work party, you should go. You should go to all his work parties regardless of whether you like them or
not. If your husband was having an ongoing affair with this OW, why would he bring you to the work party, especially since he knows you dont like them. It would be a perfect reason not to have you there. Perhaps, it has stopped???

I would go. Wear something which shows you are definitely pregnant. Get your hair done and wear something special. I would not speak to the OW, but I would be very friendly and speak to the other women there, office staff, secretaries, etc, other female solicitors. Do not discuss the OW or your personal marital problems with anyone. As far as the world is concerned, you are back together with your husband. If someone asks you about it, do not dwell on it. Answer vaguely, but the important thing is not to give any information about having any marital discord but rather it was just one of those things and change the subject.

At the work party, act lovingly towards your husband. Hold his hand, or walk arm in arm. Show you are a couple. I dont know if your husband prefers you to go and mingle independently or to stay together. Whenever, my husaband and I attend work funtions, we generally stay together.

Good Luck,

Small step, Innocence

Hi innocence,

We are sleeping in the same bed but there is NO physical contact. I tried to hug him yesterday, but he didn't reciprocate and just got up. This morning, he did give me a peck on the lips and got up. For three nights, he has basically stayed on his side of the bed.

As for going out, he went to play golf yesterday at 1 pm and didn't get home until 11 pm.

Things got worse when he didn't go out with his friends because he resented me for "making" him stay with me and DS.

Today, we are spending time together. In the PM, we are going to see a movie together and then going to the work party.

WH has told me that nothing is going on with OW but something has happened in the past (haven't gotten the whole story). Plus, people in his office think that something has been going on, so it will be awkward.

I will keep my head up high though and act like the loving wife. Will keep you posted.

Hi Hope,

How did the work party go.

Innocence

Well, OW did not show up. Not sure why. However, two other women who WH flirts with at the office were there. And true to form, WH did manage to make sexual comments/innuendos to these women in my presence. For example, WH, I, this woman (I'll call her P) and her H and another couple were sitting around talking when WH made a sexual comment to P. Her response was to whisper her reply to my H, and they had a good laugh. The other couple called her on this and said, why are you whispering? She didn't answer.

Now I find this to be downright rude in front of me and P's own husband. Some people are just so tactless -- including my H.

WH was not as attentive as I would have liked him to be given I did not know most of the people there. There were periods of time where he left me alone. Our 3-year old was with us, so I spent a lot of time just with our DS.

I must say though that of the people I did know from his office, they were very nice to me. Surprisingly, a lot of them didn't know I was pregnant. I made sure to look very cute with a top that definitely accentuated my burgeoning belly.

One of his coworkers went on and on about how cute I was pregnant, and that I just positively glowed. I suppose I am lucky that I have not gained weight anywhere but my belly (I am slender to begin with, but have lost weight due to this "infidelity diet").

After the party, WH told me that everyone said I looked so cute. That was nice.

Last night we again slept in the same bed but absolutely no effort on his part to touch me or kiss me. WH is usually very affectionate and cuddly in bed. His greatest EN is affection, so him withholding his affection from me hurts me to no end.

It makes me wonder his reason for holding back. He knows I want to be with him, so that can't be the reason. Is he perhaps feeling guilty if in fact he did have a PA? Or maybe he's conflicted and doesn't want to get physical with me because he's involved with someone else?